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What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

Discussion in 'Wizard' started by melianor, Apr 6, 2012. | Replies: 13 | Views: 2638

  1. melianor

    melianor D3 Wizard Moderator

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    What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

    What i have been wondering about for quite some time is, how build progression will work out, until you can actually utilize your complete build. Keep in mind that until your wizard reaches level 60 your build will be hampered and lack some of its features. So what will you do about it. I feel the the new skill progression presentation on the official site will help along that.

    Is there an optimal choice for each level that you should choose to follow until the wizard reaches level 60?
    Is there a pattern we can follow until our desired builds pan out and can be used to their full extent?

    In the beta i already found, that i would simply choose to leave out some new skills and skill runes i learned, since i found them less powerful at that stage, than others, mostly aiming for the maximum damage i would be able to achieve, since at these lower levels protection is not something to worry about.

    For example in Diablo II there is basically a pattern that you can follow until your build becomes worth using, like go melee in the beginning until you mana pool rises, use leaf runeword as soon as it becomes available and so forth.

    So what would imagine based on our current knowledge, how this progression would pan out?
     
  2. stillman

    stillman IncGamers Member

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    Re: What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

    I'm rather fussy, so I will put up with grinding gear a little longer to only use skills I want rather than using temp ones that may be technically better at the time.
     
  3. kar

    kar IncGamers Member

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    Re: What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

    Messing around with the build calculator, it seems pretty easy to come up with well-rounded builds as the game progresses. It's the themed builds that tend to suffer since they might feel lacking without one particular rune or passive that doesn't unlock until the later levels. Personally I plan to experiment with just about everything while leveling 1-60.

    I suppose one exception would be a hc character who always must consider the "theme" of survival.

    Edit: Another exception would be pvp if they have some kind of level-restricted arena play
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2012
  4. Elfik

    Elfik IncGamers Member

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    Re: What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

    Yeah I think some skill-runes will be essential at certain levels for optimal play, and I think they could have handled skill progression better than this preset linear progression, which harkens back to skill trees in some ways.

    With fewer possibilities in the lower levels, certain skill-runes or builds will be preferred, and certain skill-runes will be shunned. Once level 25 or so, there is pretty good variety, so I'm just looking forward to that and I'll use whatever skills are most efficient until then.

    At least all the signatures unlock fairly early, so there will be a lot of variety for that skill slot.
     
  5. xSixCHeeSY

    xSixCHeeSY IncGamers Member

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    Re: What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

    Obviously since most of the content is unknown, I've neglected defensive skills. I will only switch those in as needed, otherwise, this is my tentative progression:


    1. Magic Missile
    2. Add Ray of Frost
    3. Same
    4. Add Frost Nova
    5. Change Frost Nova to Arcane Orb
    6. Add Charged Blast Rune (Magic Missile)
    7. Add Numb Rune (Ray of Frost)
    8. Same
    9. Add Wave of Force
    10. Add Power Hungry
    11. Add Obliteration Rune (Arcane Orb)
    12. Same
    13. Same
    14. Add Frost Nova + Shatter Rune (Frost Nova)
    15. Change Magic Missile to Electrocute, Add Snow Blast Rune (Ray of Frost), Add Impactful Wave Rune (Wave of Force)
    16. Same
    17. Change Frost Nova to Storm Armor
    18. Same
    19. Add Explosive Blast
    20. Add Prodigy, Change Storm Armor to Magic Weapon (Diamond Skin + Prism Rune) available for bosses)
    21. Same
    22. Add Force Affinity Rune (Wave of Force), Add Chain Lightning Rune (Electrocute)
    23. Same
    24. Add Unleashed Rune (Explosive Blast), Change Prodigy to Astral Presence, Change Electrocute to Diamond Skin + Prism Rune
    25. Same
    26. Same
    27. Add Electrify Rune (Magic Weapon)
    28. Same
    29. Time Warp Rune (Slow Time) Available for Boss
    30. Add Glass Cannon, Switch Wave of Force with Familiar + Sparkflint Rune (Familiar), Archon available, Cold Blooded available for bosses
    31. Wormhole Rune (Teleport) Available
    32. Add Arcane Nova Rune (Arcane Orb)
    33. Same
    34. Same
    35. Add Force Weapon Rune (Magic Weapon)
    36. Same
    37. Same
    38. Same
    39. Same
    40. Same
    41. Same
    42. Magic Missile with Attunement Rune Available
    55.Add Celestial Orb Rune (Arcane Orb)
    60.Improved Archon Available (Archon)
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2012
  6. Elfik

    Elfik IncGamers Member

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    Re: What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

    xsixCheesy, your final build is force weapon, celestial orb, deep freeze, chain lightning, unleashed, sparkflint?

    It's an interesting progression and it kind of proves my point. I think a lot of people will do a very similar progression up to about lvl 15. For example, I don't think the optimal choice is to pick storm armour over frost nova, but it might be viable or even optimal for all I know. But up to lvl ~15, builds will be eerily similar.
     
  7. xSixCHeeSY

    xSixCHeeSY IncGamers Member

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    Re: What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

    Well that all depends, right. If the environment is too hard, I'll have to grab something defensive. My plan absent having to get defensive skills is to rotate in Ray of Frost + Snow Blast and Slow Time + Time Warp for Frost Nova/Explosive Blast for bosses.
     
  8. Elfik

    Elfik IncGamers Member

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    Re: What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

    Well frost nova might be quite useful for bosses in inferno even with stuns being less effective. A small stun on a boss is still one attack, and if all else fails you can use that to whittle down the boss's HP. A small stun on a mob may be less useful because the stun won't hit the whole mob, so other monsters will still move towards you at full speed or attack with ranged attacks.
     
  9. melianor

    melianor D3 Wizard Moderator

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    Re: What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

    Slowing and freezing effects are still some of the most useful effect in crowd control and attack delay on opponents.

    I like the progression you posted xSixCHeeSY. Until a certain level the build will potentially look identical. When we have more knowledge about the game will be available we might even see a general leveling pattern, though this kind of leveling we saw in Diablo II might not be something we do often anymore since we can modify our characters skills at any time in the game.
     
  10. jamesL

    jamesL IncGamers Member

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    Re: What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

    I started a similar thread awhile back

    http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?825624-how-detailed-is-the-planning-of-your-build
    most of the replies said they're only planning their level 60 build and that they plan on trying all skills and runes as they get them
     
  11. Elfik

    Elfik IncGamers Member

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    Re: What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

    deleted, was a double post
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2012
  12. Elfik

    Elfik IncGamers Member

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    Re: What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

    Yes but trying new skills is different from using those new skills on a regular basis. I think people will gravitate towards the more optimal builds, and in the lower levels, there will be a select few different optimal builds. I guess it's unavoidable since there's so few skills available, and the environments and monster AIs will also be more limited.


     
  13. Lokiftw

    Lokiftw IncGamers Member

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    Re: What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

    With so many unknowns at this point (mob scaling and effects on AP, gear affixes boosting x skill, mob AI and survivability etc), it's hard for me to draw too many lines as far as progression building goes. I did break the skills up into groups...damage boosters, AP related, group synergistic skill and then by type (conj/def/mast/1/2/force)- Am i correct to assume you get one of each type (1 force, 1 def etc...)? If so, I've gotten comfortable with ear-marking the def, conj, mast and 1 slots as follows:
    DEF: interplay nova/slowtime-timewarp (20% mob dam taken-esp appealing for coop)...CONJ:, magic weapon-mighty seems solid(ofc flintspark > until mighty rune unlocked...but again im looking at skill type end points...the minor shuffle through leveling isn't for me worth noting out so much, and will be done based on need at the time., MAST: archon, Primary: cute-surge(ap regen possibility)...atm I have the force slot and the 2ndary slot unselected b/c I didn't see any standouts last I looked, and I think it will allow me to focus on the 4 commited slots staying good, while allowing versitility to accomodate game scaling and defense vs offense adjustments. Note: late game maybe E-armor-pinpoint over magic weap (5%crit vs 15% damage - eh idk)
    Ofc I believe gear affix, esp later game, will make some skills far superior than their baseline so thats a possible factor. I plan to run the highest content coop if I can, so Im a bit confident a core dps with time warp debuff and some CC will hold up decently.

    In summary, earmarking cute-surge/magicweap-mighty/ST-timewarp/archon is, to me, a solid damage base(warp=mob debuff of sorts), with ap regen and some CC. Leaving Force and Secondary open for w/e needs to go there. The idea is for this build to run coop in highest difficulties. (Number one rule of safety...send the other guys in first)

    So yeah, that's about how Ill roll the wiz...faceroll w/e is fun, while working in the 4 listed above and see what shakes out.

    ?...Will mighty apply to archon abilities? How will +% to archon abilities and % from mighty interact?
     
  14. melianor

    melianor D3 Wizard Moderator

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    Re: What about skill/build progression, until you can actually fully use your builds?

    Will we ever reroll the same character class?

    Cooldown after new skill choice has been reduced to 5 seconds.
    Possibly we will be tied up in Inferno, trying to make progress.

    Would rolling a new character of the same class make any sense?
     

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