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This is how end game works....

Discussion in 'Diablo 3 General Discussion' started by cozmiccc, May 3, 2012. | Replies: 58 | Views: 5033

  1. cozmiccc

    cozmiccc IncGamers Member

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    This is how end game works....

    Finally, I think I got how Inferno is going to play out. This quote below is from Jay Wilson interview in Australia.

    http://www.atomicmpc.com.au/Feature...-hardcore-the-no-lan-issue-and-much-more.aspx


    So we created a fourth difficulty that we call Inferno that is ALL max-level. Max-level for a player is level 60, and so all the monsters at the start of Inferno are level 61, in Act Two they are level 62, in Three and Four they're level 63. And there are items that ONLY drop at level 61, at level 62 and so on; and they're not small number! There's a whole tier of armour in each one.


    So, looking at the current item guide such as helm tier:
    http://us.battle.net/d3/en/item/helm/#type=common

    The last three helms (Tier 14-16) are all requiring level 60 to wear, and Tier 13 is level 59. As Jay said that there are items that ONLY drop at level 61 and so on, I think we can assume that at the end of Hell difficulty only a MAXIMUM of Tier 13 item will drop, then as follows:

    Inferno Act 1 : Tier 14
    Inferno Act 2 : Tier 15
    Inferno Act 3 & 4: Tier 16

    So, we won't ever get the chance to even see Tier 16 item before completing Act 2 Inferno. I like this to be honest, that's mean that farming for gears will be an important part of going through Inferno and people can't expect themselves to be able to clear it quickly straight after launch without doing a decent amount of farming.

    Looking at the helm example above. The best helm you can get from Hell (Tier 13) will have at best 322 armor, while tier 15 helm from Act 2 Inferno can have a maximum of 397 armor, that's a 23% increase in armor.

    I'll leave that up to you to think whether a 23% increase in armor a significant buff or not :p
    Last edited: May 3, 2012
  2. beingmused

    beingmused IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    Yes, each item type has a version at item level 60, 61, 62, and 63. What we don't know (or if someone does, I don't know) is exactly what monster levels can drop what item levels. Can only mlevel 63 drop Tier 16 items with an ilevel of 63, or is there a small chance of that happening from mlevel 61/62?
  3. cozmiccc

    cozmiccc IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    Well Jay had said that there are items with ilevel 63 (tier 16 most likely), that can ONLY drop from a level 63 monsters. So I think there is no chance for i63 to drop before Act 3 Inferno....


  4. konfeta

    konfeta IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    If champions/rares/bosses/whatever have +1 or +2 mlvl/ilvl modifiers, you might still see them drop earlier.
  5. Boudica

    Boudica IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    This is greate news if its gonna be like that, i rly liked that :)


  6. Raesene

    Raesene IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    I just hope there isn't some drastic leap between the tiers of loot (similar to how it is in WoW). I don't want the start of every act to feel like a gear check.
  7. unmoses

    unmoses IncGamers Member

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    Sounds to me like it will be, which of course is their entire philosophy for endgame and inferno action. "you will grind in hell before you can survive in act 1 inferno" I'm sure leads to "you will grind in act 1 inferno before you can survive in act 2" etc etc

    Sent from my ADR6425LVW using Tapatalk 2


  8. Gurby

    Gurby IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    I think the real end game gear are the lv60 class sets. So I dont care about tiers. Just need to know where the pieces can drop.
  9. cozmiccc

    cozmiccc IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    there is a stat range, for example tier 13 helm has a possible armor range of 285-322, while a tier 14 is 322-358 armor.

    Almost no overlap there, but of course the attributes and other stats we don't know yet...


    Uhm... These are all level 60 class sets, basically class sets = tiers, they are the same thing you know :p And as above tier 14 will drop in Act 1 Inferno, tier 15 in Act 2, and so on.... There is no loot table like in WoW if that's what you meant. So a legendary swords can drop off a broken urn or a random zombie, not just from the end boss.


  10. Eeryck

    Eeryck IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    I think that is a function of perspective. Of course it is a gear check, they have raised the mlvl but your clvl is the same. The only way to overcome that hurdle completely is gear.

    But on top of the gear check there is most likely a monster AI tweek, perhaps they let out a few more of the lethal affix combos, etc. that will require skill increase in addition to gear.

    What else can you really do to keep difficulty level up?


  11. beingmused

    beingmused IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    I think he means the "strongest" set available to each class, analogous to the "Tal Rasha's Wrappings" and whatnot from D2.


  12. Hideo

    Hideo Banned

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    The concept of dozens of "armor tiers" is straight from WoW. There was no such thing in D2. IMO, there should be one "tier" per difficulty, like in D2.

    There are many ideas borrowed from WoW in D3. For ex. monster level is very important. In D2, you never cared for monster level. In D3 you will. In D2 you didn't care for DPS. In D3 you will, etc. etc. etc.
  13. cozmiccc

    cozmiccc IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    IMO these concepts are things that going to make D3 fun to play though... more details for you to care about, I think this is what hardcore players actually want?

    and D2 is not one tier per difficulty. The appearances recycle, but the item progression remained. In fact the whole item class of Normal, Exceptional, Elite (which doesn't even exist pre-LOD) are used just as an excuse because Blizz recycle the appearances and art of Normal items.

    I really can't see why it's a bad thing with D3 system, unless you just hate changes and anything that might resemble WoW in your mind :S Actually WoW only call the item 'tiers' for their end game armor sets.


  14. Taerix

    Taerix IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    I love this idea. That it's actually going to be hard to get the best gear, instead of just getting lucky on any run. Now it's both.

    I think this will make the replay-ability of D3 really high.
  15. cozmiccc

    cozmiccc IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    well the strongest will of course be tier 16 from Act 3 & 4 Inferno :p

    If you mean the set items... I'm not really sure, but I recalled sometime ago that Blizzard said the set item will function differently than it was in D2...


  16. Hideo

    Hideo Banned

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    Well, I guess it depends what you prefer: WoW or D2. In terms of pure gameplay I prefer D2 strongly. In WoW I enjoyed only the social features and the ability to meet with folks in Stromwind, guilds etc. I STRONGLY prefer D2 gameplay systems to WoW systems. Nonetheless, many ideas in D3 are from WoW while most of D2 systems have been scrapped.



  17. xploziv

    xploziv IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    Yes you did... Why do you did MF runs in Meph, pindle, baal, DI, etc...? or MF'ing the Pits?
    And don't forget that WoW itself borrowed various concepts from D2, so it's really a cycle...



  18. Hideo

    Hideo Banned

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    You did MF runs depending on AREA level. For ex The Pit is level 85 IIRC. You didn't care at all about monsters levels. It's not that you typed "/consider" before attacking a mob. XD While you "consider" a mob in WoW and you will in D3, to certain extent.



  19. beingmused

    beingmused IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    Two points on this:

    1. People tend to get caught up on terms and don't actually think about what they mean in specific contexts. Yes the term "armor tiers" appears in WoW, but they don't behave at all the same way in D3. There isn't any real difference in how item base level + affix quality works in D3 vs. D2....the term "tier" is mainly being used here to describe how they are doing the art for different armor types.

    2. This is yet another in a string of countless examples of someone saying "x is different from Diablo 2, and being different is bad" with no argument given for why that change is wrong (even if there is no change at all).

    /spittake What?!?

    /anotherspittake WHaaaaat?? (I don't know why I took another sip)


    edit:
    Area level modified things, but mlevel was also a factor, and those two were different. D3 seems simpler: Act3 and 4 both have an "area level" of 63. I have no idea what you mean by having to "consider" things...I don't think you've "considered" this line of argument through very well.


  20. Raesene

    Raesene IncGamers Member

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    Re: This is how end game works....

    The problem with too strong of a gear check at each tier is that it will heavily reduce the number of viable drops you will see at any given tier. If fighting level 62 monsters requires you to effectively have a full (or near-full) set of level 61 items, then you can break down the drops that come from level 62 monsters into "drops that are level 62" and "drops that are not level 62".

    I think this harms the slot-machine feel of looting because you essentially have removed the stream of minor victories you could achieve on your way to the "big score". It has the danger of becoming "anything that is not a max level drop is worthless."

    Now, I'm not saying it *will* be like this.

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