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resource rune imbalance

Discussion in 'Diablo 3 Community Forum' started by Elfik, Feb 29, 2012. | Replies: 4 | Views: 1179

  1. Elfik

    Elfik IncGamers Member

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    resource rune imbalance

    Maybe I was wrong to complain about resource runes being underpowered. I'm talking specifically about the wizard runes for reducing AP cost of certain spells. I can't remember what the numbers were before but now I'm certain that resource runes are in fact overpowered with respect to damage-increasing runes, at least in the following two cases:

    Meteor: 250% damage + 100% damage over 3s
    -costs 60 AP

    "molten impact": 325% " + 130% "
    => a 30% increase

    "star pact" : costs 42 AP
    => this is a reduction of 18 AP cost, which is 30% of the original AP cost. However, this means star pact can be cast 1/(1-0.3) times as often, which equates to ~1.43 times as often. A 43% increase in usage.

    There's a similar thing with arcane orb

    Arcane Orb: 250% damage; 35 AP cost

    "obliteration": 325% damage
    =>30% increase

    "tap the source": 23 AP cost
    =>34% decrease in cost; 52% increase in usage

    Naturally, I believe Blizzard's internal build will not have these errors. Overkill makes the damage option even less enticing, so if anything, the damage increasing runes should be overpowered relative to th resource cost reduction runes.
  2. galzohar

    galzohar IncGamers Member

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    Re: resource rune imbalance

    1.43 times as often but also takes 1.43 times as much time in casting animation. This means that for each 1.3X molten impact meteor you can also cast 0.43 of a signature spell compared to what you would with the star pact.

    Just for the number-impaired, a simplified comparison:

    Assuming cast time of 1 second for the sake of simplicity:

    With no runes, you'd spend 100 seconds casting 100 meteors (and some more seconds in between casts of course).

    With "molten impact" they'd simply do 30% more damage, aka the damage of 130 meteors.

    With "star pact" you'd spend 143 seconds to do 43% more damage, and thus lose 43 seconds worth of signature spells (and that's not even counting possible AP regen from those signature spells).


    Eventually, to do a true comparison, we need to take a lot more stuff into account, mostly stuff we have no data for. But saying the AP cost reduction runes are overpowered is just silly to be honest. For damage spells, they almost have to have a stronger effect to be worth the extra casting time required (though overkill is also a factor, I would assume it is a relatively minor one).
  3. Elfik

    Elfik IncGamers Member

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    Re: resource rune imbalance

    Okay that is something I missed. I guess it's a good thing star pact is now only 42AP cost rather than the 48AP cost it used to be (can't remeber the old numbers for molten impact, tap the source, or obliteration). So extra time is there for molten impact users to do something useful with which I didn't account for. Assuming cast speeds are all the same, we could compare the 1.43 extra meteors to 1.3 molten pact damage + 0.43 signature spell damage. Say it's magic missile runed for damage. 1.43*0.43= 0.61. 1.3 +0.61 = 1.91 > 1.43. Of course, there are other advantages to using meteor more often, such as less overkill, more area of effect, and tactical reasons, having the option available when you need it (big clump of monsters) is more likely with a lower resource cost. But yeah, the numbers favor molten impact. Of course, magic missile, used in the example, doesn't do any aoe, so in reality the numbers are still quite similar.

    By the way, what other factors were you talking about besides the ones mentioned? You mean resistance, critical hit procs, other procs, other skill synergies, things like that? I think most other effects would rather have a lower resource costing meteor, seeing as it is an aoe and a dot, it's going to be good at proc fishing, and of other skills require lots of AP, it's better not to drain 60 with molten impact.


  4. galzohar

    galzohar IncGamers Member

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    Re: resource rune imbalance

    Signature spell effect, signature spell AOE vs meteor AOE, signature spell ability to hit vs meteor ability to hit, secondary effects and/or resource generation from signature spell, overkill, ability to frontload 2 meteors and run rather than have to generate AP in between 2 meteors (but then again with some +max AP you can frontload 2 meteors anyway turning it around again), and a bunch of things I didn't even think about yet.
  5. Elfik

    Elfik IncGamers Member

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    Re: resource rune imbalance

    Yeah the arcane dynamo passive would favor molten impact since it is the best way to use flashes of insight (I think it actually is the best, among all wizard skills). As to being able to frontload 2 molten impacts with +max AP, in that case you could frontload 3 star pacts (given a possible requirement of a small amount of passive regen). Also, having "power of the storm" storm armour rune which reduces AP costs by 3 would benefit star pact more, reducing the cost to 39AP, which means 46% more uses. Overkill was mentioned before but I think it will be the biggest factor versus random mobs. It will almost always be more efficient to use meteor, but meteor does so much damage, it's likely to be overkill when used on partially damaged monsters. Against bosses, depending on the other factors, molten impact is likely the best.

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