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need pvm barb advice (ww polearm)

Discussion in 'Barbarian' started by Xuhao, Jul 5, 2013. | Replies: 16 | Views: 1887

  1. Xuhao

    Xuhao IncGamers Member

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    hey all

    Ive been playing w 2 freinds for 4 ladders in total.
    One of my freind has always played a ww polearm barb, and has had a hard time doing so in our party. Weve pften been a bit undergeared, which of cause has made things harder for our barb, being the main tank and all..
    He´s quite insisting on a ww polearm barb, but the setups we have tried so far hasnt really done the trick..

    This ladder were trying again, but we would like some advice before we spend what wealth weve gathered ;)

    After googling and trying to get a grib on whats important to survive/kill mobs in a 3 player group on late hell/ubers weve come up w this setup:

    Gullis face
    highlords/maras/ ??
    raven
    dwarf star / whisp / bk ??
    draculs
    fortitude armor
    gores
    verdungo
    BOTD eth elite polearm

    - Any input will be much appreciated.
    The goal is to make our barb survivable in a 3 player party. And if possible keep him as a ww polearm barb.

    xuhao
  2. Erfel

    Erfel IncGamers Member

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    Any barb using ww and a BOTD eth elite polearm won't have any problem.

    If you play in a team and you have a char good for boss killing (soso, smiter, java) i wouldn't use gullis at all... arreat rules!!

    Dwarf star is not that useful, i'd go with bk, or another raven, if needed.

    Draculs? Depends on your team... if you have a necro it's not a good choice... steelrend would do much better... botd has suche a high life leech (together with bk, highlord and so on) that he won't need that much life tap.

    Consider strings of ear instead of dungo... and if you want, giving some boosts to resistances, you could also use enigma. Of course it's not meant for barb, but still nice in every pvm char :)
  3. Xuhao

    Xuhao IncGamers Member

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    thnks for the input :)

    - the party for this barb is a java and a trapsin/poisonmancer (the java gets swapped for smiter when doing ubers)

    the reason we thought of gullis, dracs and gores was to get as close to the 100% cb/ds/ow as possible. But mbe its not needed...
  4. Erfel

    Erfel IncGamers Member

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    I forgot that whirlwind makes useless "chance to cast", so the barb would never get life tap. Honestly, you should check if this works for cb/ds/ow
  5. Archone

    Archone IncGamers Member

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    Erfel is correct about the ctc spells with ww. The things like Draculs Lifetap proc or Atmas amp.dmg wont work with ww.

    Crushing blow, and open wounds works afaik. Getting Deadly strike however, isnt very good since it doesnt stack on top of your Weapon Mastery.
    It calculates the "double damage" separatly.


    Im actually building a WW barb right now. And hes setup is this one, slightly different but hes a "Titan/All dmg" barb.

    Grief x2 (Colossus Blades)
    Fortitude Sacred Armor
    Verdungo
    Gores
    Arreats
    Rare rings/amulet with max str/dex/ll/ml.

    and LoH!

    Never ever use steelrends unless you want the cb aswell! And unless you can get your hands on a decent pair with high ed/str aswell, LoH will do alot better.

    Because of the +350% dmg to demons, he will slay all bosses with ease. The cb from gores will only be a bonus.


    But Im using Grief.

    As you are using EBOTD, rings should aim for resistances if you need any. Or pure stats, like life/mana/dex/str. Lifesteal wont hurt, but you should already have enough.

    And do indeed use Arreats face. Its both cheap and gives you lifesteal/str/dex/resists.



    Peace and love
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2013
  6. zrk

    zrk IncGamers Member

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    Make sure to check out Rik's pvm whirlwind guide. it is a legendary piece of work on the forums. And has a fantastic overview of two handed weapon options, including polearms.
  7. Xuhao

    Xuhao IncGamers Member

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    Good sir, you did not exagerate!! By far the best guide ife seen so far!! Thnks a lot for that one!!

    Im gonna throw a link for others to c (WW guide by Razgriz a.k.a rikstaker of rpgforums.net)

    http://www.unc.edu/~jpurvis/whirl/

    @archone: Thnks a lot for your advice :) - Im a bit curious about what kind of swords you are using for your ww titan barb - (If you c this and have time to answer i think it would be wisest just to edit your reply, so the info is in one place ;) )

    @erfel: thnks again for your advice - appreciate it :)

    - Im pretty sure ill get any and all of my questions answered by using Riks guide - Now all i need is time to read ;D
  8. zrk

    zrk IncGamers Member

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    Well riks guide does have a few holes, like not mentioning ribcracker or key items like guillaume, laying of hand but aside from that yeah its great.
  9. Archone

    Archone IncGamers Member

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    Edited, Im using Colossus Blades!
  10. wixxkruppel

    wixxkruppel IncGamers Member

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    I've been planning to make a WW barb myself and have been testing stuff out in single player (p3-8). I just registered to give your friend some advice.



    --- 2x Grief Phase Blades ---

    These are better for pvm vs. dual zerkers simply because there is no repair cost, and you reach 2 FPA even with griefs that roll 30 IAS, this means you can buy low IAS + high dmg griefs instead of the more expensive 35 IAS + high dmg zerker griefs. Not to mention griefs don't have ED so that higher base damage on zerkers is negligible. There is also the matter of style, as zerkers are possibly the most ugly weapons in the game.

    Griefs also have ITD (ignores target's defense), which is HUGE for a ww barb, as AR is an issue for two-handed barbs. With ITD you don't lose dps / leech when whirling through huge packs. Griefs also have -25% defense against uniques / bosses just like BOTD.

    Griefs also have 20% deadly strike, and you want EVERY single piece of damage you can get your hands on for PvM WW barbs. Killing speed is their main issue, and more damage = more leech = more survivability.

    Griefs also have a very nice +dmg to demons, which goes with the above. DAMAGE! Keep in mind Venom Lords (massive HP) in Chaos Sanctuary are demons, as well as the three last waves of baal's minions, and baal himself.

    Griefs also have a fantastic damage range (you basically always deal max damage), unlike two-handed BOTD, and have easier time hitting things.

    Better suited for nigma build.



    --- eBOTD Great Poleaxe ---

    Only viable 2-hander. Only special attribute worth mentioning (besides hefty leech) is 200% ED against undead, somewhat handy in Chaos Sanctuary. Suffers from AR problems and makes Demon Limb almost mandatory on switch (for optimal dps), and as such is less suited for using nigma / solo PvM.



    --- Enigma / Fortitude ---

    Personally, I'd go with Enigma every time for solo PvM. Life, DR, skills, and tele is just too good to pass up. Enigma turns this build into a surgical tool that can tele around areas at high speeds (in those juicy dia-baal games) and waste elite packs efficiently while being extremely safe (unlike the javazon that gets stunlocked to death at the sight of a gloam, or an ES sorc that gets instagibbed by mana burn).

    HOWEVER

    If none of you have nigmas and you all want to run around, then fort is obviously the best choice, not to mention it gives resists, which are lacking with proper WW barb.



    --- Goblin Toes vs. Gore Riders ---

    If you're running with nigma, then I personally prefer Goblins, since they have higher CB and no FRW (more on this later). If you're running with fort, then Gores are the better choice. They're both great and you can really use either.

    Special mention for Gores with griefs as you reach ~90% chance to do double damage.



    --- Raven Frost ---

    Too good to pass up. AR, dex (phasers require 136), CBF, mana. Plain obvious.



    --- 2nd Ring ---

    You need a dual leech ring for griefs. If you're rich (or find a noob), preferable adds are +res & AR.

    If using BOTD, a second raven is the best choice. With such high cold absorb, you don't need to boost your cold res (as fire and lightning are boosted by LoH + Highlord's). You'll probably get dex over your gear needs, however, this adds directly to AR.



    --- Guillaume's Face ---

    No other choice here. Arreat's is total crap for WW barbs. 35% crushing blow alone makes this a no brainer, but it comes with deadly strike as well. Socket with Um for resists, or Ber if you're already covered. Remember, you want as high damage as possible for PvM WW barb!



    --- Highlord's Wrath ---

    No other choice here, deadly strike is too good to pass up, not to mention +1 skills and resists.



    --- Laying of Hands ---

    All other gloves are pure crap on PvM WW barb. These are mandatory. Massive fire res + 350% ED against 60% of all monsters... yes please.



    --- String of Ears ---

    No other choice here, you absolutely want to have that 15% DR from belt, and you also want to have that life leech, since your survivability depends on it. Leech is what keeps you alive.



    --- Switch ---

    Hoto + 35 FCR spirit monarch for 9 frame teleport and +5 prebuff if using Enigma (Demon Limb + Spirit for BOTD), otherwise your choice. Demon Limb will take care of your AR problems if two-handed (10k gold every 11 mins).

    Make sure at least one of you is using Harmony bow on switch for that sweet FRW boost.



    --- Griefs vs. BOTD ---

    - P5+ Solo PvM -> griefs
    - P3 Group PvM with nigma -> griefs
    - P3 Group PvM without nigma -> equal



    --- A2 Might Merc ---

    - Eth Shael'ed Reaper's Toll. This thing out-performs any other merc weapon for WW barb. Decrep gives your merc massive survivability due to insane leech, and gives YOU a huge damage boost. While pride might sound lucrative in theory, it's a horrible merc weapon in practice because of no ED / IAS. Your merc is only useful when he's alive, and he won't stay alive using pride.

    - eBugged Fortitude. Since we're a barbarian, our shout will give our merc insane defense, plus fort has resists, ED and everything else you might want.

    - eBugged Treachery. The IAS gained from this armor means your merc procs decrep more/faster, and thus will keep himself alive with his massive life leech. Fade will trigger quite easily, giving our merc %DR and stacked resists. My preferred choice.

    - For helm use Vamp Gaze socketed with 15 IAS jewel. Andariel's Visage socketed with 15 IAS / 30 fire res jewel is probably too expensive.

    Merc IAS breakpoints with Tresher are 22/44/75 for 3.8/4.1 /4.5 attacks per second respectively. Treachery is the only way to reach the fastest breakpoint.



    --- FRW ---

    Try to avoid too much FRW, it's hard to explain, but you will definitely lose damage in PvM. You want to WW through packs slowly. You really don't want to put any points into increased speed either.

    When you WW slow, your damage is more focused on the enemies around you, wheareas with high FRW your damage spreads out since you're going so fast WW doesn't have time to hit the same enemies multiple times.



    --- Res Charms [level 35 prefix]---


    These can actually end up being rather expensive (depends on seller). Best place to farm these is NM Cold Plains (Stony Fields adds unwanted prefixes). You can even roll a great suffix like gold find, FHR, FRW etc...

    Don't try to farm these at hell cow level etc... as you will eliminate ~20 possible prefixes, increasing your chance to find one tremendously. NM flayer jungle can drop skillers... but brings along ~15 unwanted prefixes in regards to all res.

    If you socket Guillaume's with Um, use Fortitude, and dump some leftover skill points into Natural Resists, you won't need resists charms at all if you get 20 all res from torch + anni.



    --- IN CLOSING ---


    Since we opt to go for maximum dmg & killing speed (so we are not gimped in higher player games), we lose some resists. These are best gained from charms and socketing Guillaume's with Um. Make no mistake, you want 75% res fire/lite. If using fort, this obviously makes things easier (at the cost of teleport and mobility).

    Just make sure you have maxed out fire/lite res, no matter whether you go nigma or not. It's better to get 10/20 barb torch instead of 20/10 for this build if you can't afford anni.

    It's a great idea to use ATMA + HeroEditor + item packs to try out different builds in SP for Battle.net, instead of wasting your wealth on something disappointing.
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2013
  11. Archone

    Archone IncGamers Member

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    Very good points there!

    However, using enigma gives you 45%frw, and is imo very frustrating.
    I agree with keeping a lower frw, with only boots as your frw source, dump "increased speed"!!

    A note, even though mobility is highly underrated, fortitude will give you 300ed. If you go high dex/life then forti will give you alot of dmg. Do try out eni/forti in sp, since theres a huge difference using them. Both dmg wise, and definitely a huge difference in playstyle!!

    Also note that the "weapon masteries" critical strike doesnt stack with the griefs critical strike.
    If you have alot of crit, 20grief/15guill/15gores/34*Highlords = 84 crit

    *At lvl 90

    With highlords + torch + anni, youll have a mastery of lvl 25. Then youll have 22crit from mastery.

    It calculates like this.
    (chance to crit% = %CriticalStrike + (1-%CS/100)*%2ndCritValue)
    Crit lands on just over 100%.

    That means that youll cap your crit chance with that setup!
  12. wixxkruppel

    wixxkruppel IncGamers Member

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    Although the extra damage from high STR is not multiplied by the %ED on Fortitude. A dedicated titan barb imo requires an inventory loaded with sharp charms of vita (since charms add to weapon damage).

    Dying in battle.net is expensive, as you can lose half a million in gold from your stash (unlike in single player).

    Taking Battle Orders into account, weapon mastery will be level 26 (or 28 with nigma, makes no difference), which in 1.13 gives 31% crit.

    31+(1-31/100)x85 = 89.65 = ~90%
  13. Archone

    Archone IncGamers Member

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    I dont understand what you mean there.

    Yes, but thats the same with your build.


    I dont know what I did there! :D
  14. wixxkruppel

    wixxkruppel IncGamers Member

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    I actually misread you. When you said dex/life I somehow read it as dex/str.

    IIRC if you go with nigma you need 2x shimmering grand charms. You can even use them plain with no suffix. Since you only need two (and without suffix), you have a realistic chance of farming them yourself (or rolling with pgems).

    Sharp small/grand charms of vita on the other hand are pretty expensive (if you want high life).
  15. zrk

    zrk IncGamers Member

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    Wixx, there is another belt choice though, arach-. and if you are doing something like cs runs that requqire a lot of teleing without switches then it is easily the best choice.. And same reasoning for fcr rings. search youtube for "perfect ww barb" i did a series of videos on this where i documented what the perfect gear would be.
  16. zrk

    zrk IncGamers Member

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    Remembr when barbar's weapon mastery ED used to multiply all other ED the barb had.. that used to be the day lol.. And CS and DS had a similar quadruple damage oddity a few versions ago didnt they
  17. Archone

    Archone IncGamers Member

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    I had actually no idea about that! ;)

    I did my first barb just a couple of ladders ago. It was all Sorc/Pala for me back in the day.



    Nice inputs! Ill try some different setups on my soon-to-be-finished barb!

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