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My name is Lostman, and I'm also addicted to the Rocknadoshards Windup Build

Discussion in 'Wizard' started by DickScotchfist, Nov 8, 2012. | Replies: 35 | Views: 9041

  1. DickScotchfist

    DickScotchfist <font color=#168A19>PoE Moderator</font>

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    UPDATE: Still my absolute favorite wizard build despite downsides. Added two quick examples of build's very high Effective dps output even with my pretty moderate sheet dps, one pseudo-awful example in teamplay with barb (so bad I even forgot half his dps buffs, the purpose for the vid) and one solo farming mp 10 "efficiently."

    Solo (w/ follower) example showing dps output and speed vs. relatively moderate gear: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EusltHjWVKM

    Team Effective DPS with Barb (forgot bone chill): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4Y1PYZqzYA&feature=plcp

    Note: I did not invent this variant of shocknado windup, that accolade goes to
    Aphraell


    UPDATE: The Final Verdict on Rocknado/Rocknadoshards Windup Variant

    This build is absolutely amazing... most of the time. After playing with this setup and tweaking it slightly over a few days, I can honestly say this is my new favorite wizard build out there currently. I've had as much fun as when I first learned about the unique windup build back in 1.03 and it brought enjoyment back to this game for me (by then we were all extremely tired of kiting original inferno difficulty setting).

    The Effective DPS output of this build is simply stunning and unmatched by everything I've tried or seen on most builds but definitely on any wizard build (In case those reading are new to diablo 3, despite all the hub-bub about that paper dps number, it truly represents very little about the effective damage output your guy contributes and should not be used for ANY comparisons unless you're comparing it to an IDENTICAL build/skilset. What you must at least understand is that comparing two numbers of two different CLASSES, as a lot of people do, is just downright illogical. The number doesn't take into account many things, like how many simultaneous offensive skills can the player routinely do, or, for example, can this number be directed in a single direction or cover the entire screen. Big difference). And as someone who appreciates nonselfish players, the fact that it has a CONSTANT Team DPS Buff of 25% along with your CC just seems like the best of both worlds. Everything one could hope for. If you want to farm items mp 10 (do you really though?) in the most "efficient" way possible whether solo or with a team, this is the build for you.

    If, however, you are currently into Key farming and Uber runs, go elsewhere. Because one of my two pet peeves with Rocknado/Rocknadoshards is it's complete ineffectiveness with that. Because:

    Worst. Uber-farmer. Evar.

    So one of the trade offs with having increased stunlocking effectiveness and a crazy effective dps increase is that the time required for your wizard to "wind up" is almost doubled. This is because of a multitude of reasons, none of which are quite "running out of APoC (kind of though)" Something continually asked of me this week, despite the question making no goddamned sense since wizards use arcane power and no spell spends "apoc."

    In short, despite what all our first impressions are, adding meteor, a huge AP spender, is hardly felt during normal play while wearing typical 18-20 arcane power on crit, even against single rares or left over champ bosses when your team's success does not require you to be successful on the first small, open window of time to avoid time-sink punishments (contrasting clearing the uber bosses, where victory is often about stunlocking at first opportunity and before any mayhem can ensue). This is because the AP required from Meteor is simply gained from all the extra crits from that stuff all over the floor.

    So, the meteors are using the AP you get from the meteors. It's a sort of catch 22 that you can handle 99% of the time without noticing and the biggest reason for our increased required time for winding up. Unfortunately the ubers and keywardens are part of that one percent. Does this break the build for me? No, because I'm not very focused anymore on getting hellfires, and when I do I simply revert back to shocknadoshards and do fine (albeit slower) when ubering and just grit my teeth at how annoyingly long it takes me to defeat A3 keywarden each run in relation to everythin else on the map. For those still farming keys and ubers mostly, however, this is probably a deal breaker for now. Which I totally get, but sucks and I hope you give it a fair shake eventually.

    It's still a truly great build to add to the growing list of awesome Windup Wizard variants. I intend to record some mp 10 solo farming and mp 10 group farming tomorrow, just so wizards who are still gearing can see it and people who have tried it and hate it can make sure it's not because our playstyles are simply different, and nothing wrong with the build itself.

    Until then!
    10November2012

    *************************************************************



    And wondering if the bug has bitten anyone else. It's simply a phenomenal windup wiz variant (by far the best imho). There are so many endless possiblities yet to be explored with it too (Do we even need evocation now? Couldn't we run Conflagration AND Cold Blooded now? What are the critical BPs to his now that we have a HUGE extra source of procs? Should we do away with some ias now? Should we get more? Or maybe just a simple paradigm shift placing emphasis on -5 AP cost To Meteor above other "skill affixes."

    MP 10 is only for co-op play amongst the super geared and their friends? Not anymore. MP 10 impossible to ITEM farm efficiently? Not anym.. well, yeah, it probably still is, but this build comes closest to disproving this idea.

    So far, only one thing is known for certain about the Rocknadoshards Windup Wizard Build... It's frigging amazing and unmatched if you can make it work with your gear.


    Me!: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/LostMan-1541/hero/14272321

    Edit: With this build, it is recommended that since we do not use 30 APoC, do not begin using meteor until fully/nearfully wound up, exception being an initial meteor for liquify on ground.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2012
  2. Tombat

    Tombat IncGamers Member

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    nice, ill give shards a try. Whats your APS?

    Tomb

    Edit: dont you miss teleport? Also, does not meteors animation interrupts too much your other skill atacks?
     
  3. DickScotchfist

    DickScotchfist <font color=#168A19>PoE Moderator</font>

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    Strangely it doesn't seem to anymore ( at least with liquify). And yes I miss teleport. I'm a HUGE fan of the secret powers of Fracture, but this is just that good. Good enough to make fracture's #1 fan unequip it from the hotbar.

    My Aps is 2.78 I believe... maybe 2.76 though. And try the build WITHOUT shards at first.
     
  4. Tombat

    Tombat IncGamers Member

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    KK, thanks.

    anyway i got to increase my APS from 2,53 to 2,73 first, but ill try
     
  5. DickScotchfist

    DickScotchfist <font color=#168A19>PoE Moderator</font>

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    Original post has been updated.
     
  6. magicrectangle

    magicrectangle IncGamers Member

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    Start by just spamming wicked wind for the first few seconds to get the lockdown (and apoc) going, then start adding in the liquefies.
     
  7. DickScotchfist

    DickScotchfist <font color=#168A19>PoE Moderator</font>

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    yes there is finesse to maximizing the build, but the increased time doesn't mean you can't spam the buttons still. but starting with a meteor from afar works better actually. I have the team video done, wanna make a solo too, and it shows all my techniques. I didn't outright mention all this because I don't want to imply the build REQUIRES careful orchestration of skills. This might turn people away before even trying it. Again, it's not simply "running out of ap" like we do in shocknado or vanilla windup. I mean it kind of is in a way, but also feels sorta different, a very sleight annoyance here. Only time it isn't sleight... is with ubers. Where the extra damage and procrate of meteor simply is not worth its cost vs. something free like magic weapon - venom, or magic weapon - force weapon. i do not, however, recommend any bubble for team ubers.

    Edit:
    First of two short example vids showing this build posted in original.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2012
  8. DickScotchfist

    DickScotchfist <font color=#168A19>PoE Moderator</font>

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    2 quick youtube videos added to original post to help better communicate the build and it's strengths vs weaknesses.
     
  9. Eric Xanthu

    Eric Xanthu IncGamers Member

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    Talk to me a little about the button mechanics on this one. I took her for a spin on mp7 and tried a few different button configurations. On a normal windup I just hold 1-3 and click away with mouse1. So my first effort was holding 1-4 and tapping away. Didn't like. I switched meteor to mouse2 and tried a few different button mashing techniques...tap both mouse buttons at the same time, alternate tap, and lastly (something I almost never do with standard windup) an actual timing technique: drop a meteor, drop some WW, drop some Meteors, etc.

    Do you have good luck with straight up mashing on this build, or do you have some timing you use?

    Build was interesting and effective, although my gear kinda sucks. Definitely missed my teleport several times.
     
  10. DickScotchfist

    DickScotchfist <font color=#168A19>PoE Moderator</font>

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    yeah, it's the greatest pitfall to moving to rocknado, extremely uncomfortable for the first hour or so. Having a mouse unable to right and left click at the sametime like you do (thank you mac), I hotkey'd meteor to 'f' ( I use a,s,d,f and space bar for stand still). It really sucked at first, not going to lie, since I could just hold down a,s,& d with shocknado and click away on mouse to activate everything. Now, with my left thumb on space back as it always has been to stand still, I still hold down a s d but now also click furiously on f with my left forefinger. It's a huge hassle at first, but now I wouldn't do it any other way. As I very much like to be a micromanager with meteor, especially before the fight.

    And yes, it pays to orchestrate each skill for specific opportune moments with this variation of windup. Especially meteor, which can be cast from afar to begin winding up before you've even landed your first blow (get that ground covered in the Liquify goodness ASAP!)

    Typically, an average Winding up for a mob goes like:

    1. see group and herd them close if needed
    2. run back while casting meteor. As it's falling, approach group quickly.
    3. Hold down S and D while left clicking (crystal shell begins endless loop + deepfreez/bonechill begins endless loop = still only twisters are the AP spenders from left click)
    4. After 1-1.5 seconds of Winding up, also click and keep down the A key (now explosive blast begins using AP too)
    5. After initial 3 burst from EB, furiously click F (meteor) while keeping a,s,d and space bar with thumb held down. Continue also left clicking furiously where needed.

    This is general, and very relative. Sometimes meteors there right away. Sometimes I don't think, just spam everything. Sometimes if I don't feel winding up will be an issue, will press A (explosive blast) while running up to mob so that it starts exploding upon arms reach with them.
     
  11. Eric Xanthu

    Eric Xanthu IncGamers Member

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    Heh. Reminds me of the D2 assassin. Arcade-y.

    I'm taking a break from higher MPs and lazerbeaming my way through mp0 for a while. I may return to this though...when it was working, it was really something else to see. You get a big enough group without the icky mods, and you can put a hammer down.
     
  12. DickScotchfist

    DickScotchfist <font color=#168A19>PoE Moderator</font>

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    I hope you do, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised by how "large mob-dependant" it actually is NOT. Single mobs are effectively stuttertunned (or stunlocked) and eliminated very quickly.

    There is no real troublesome AP shortage with Rocknado. I hardly ever notice a difference vs. Shocknadoshards or vanilla windup.
     
  13. Eric Xanthu

    Eric Xanthu IncGamers Member

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    I did find I was AP-short with this build more often, certainly not as good a lock as my windup. But my crit is a little low right now from getting together IAS, so maybe that's it. I've been shoe-stringing my gear for forever now and I definitely need to farm up gold and drops for some upgrades.
     
  14. DickScotchfist

    DickScotchfist <font color=#168A19>PoE Moderator</font>

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    I woud say that if your stunlocking better WITHOUT an extra source of cm procs, it's likely more to do with your wiz not meeting certain minimum thresholds to run the build.

    I don't know what those are though, which is why this doesn't have the [guide] label. I can assure you that at near 2.80 aps (2.73>), shocking aspect, around 49 unbuffed crit, and enough WINDUP-ehp to stand toe-to-toe and keep getting cm procs in all the elements without a crack in your diamond skin, the extra offensive ability of course strengthens my stunlocking effecitveness, which is only logical.

    But wouldn't really care if it didn't. I've personally preached on this forum before about the over-idolization of "perma-freezing" and the cost-effective/play-effective benefits to adopting a stutterstun focus + heavy windup-ehp instead. This is how I built my windup, and as I became more wealthy grew into or closer or however you wanna call it, the stunlock club. Frozen solid, or attacking like a parkinson's patient, it's always been the same for my windup. He's no glass cannon, so who really cared?

    But I'd double check your offensive stats/equiped skills to make sure you meet Shocknadoshards requirements first - the build this is a direct offshoot of.
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2012
  15. magicrectangle

    magicrectangle IncGamers Member

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    Extra is misleading. You will end up with fewer wicked winds if you are casting liquifies, so it isn't an extra source of procs, it is just a different source of procs.
     
  16. Eric Xanthu

    Eric Xanthu IncGamers Member

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    I don't need to look up a forum post to know if I "meet the requirements" to run Shocknadoshards. I run it. It works great. It's my build of choice. I just run it with lower end gear--2.21 aps, 40% crit, 19 apoc, very small life return. Since I represent a lower end of gear and you represent a higher end, together we roughly approximate what stats it will take to run your meteor build effectively.
     
  17. Tombat

    Tombat IncGamers Member

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    Hi all,

    spent this weekend messing around with rocknado in high MP. Im currently built around 2,53 APS, 19 APC, 600 AR, 4.2K armor, 45%cc, 700 LOH , 92k DPS. No buffs, using shocking aspect.

    The build is very interesting, killing speed when stunlocking is like x4 ( :) ). Really Awesome. Unfortunately , on one side my gear is not good enough yet, and in other side, there are some situations I do not see how this build can get through.

    -At the begining the buttons issue was a nightmare, I swiched stand still to space bar and then I was able to spam 4 buttons with my left hand while standing still. In my PC, when I hold down nova+shell+chainreac only nova keeps the endless loop, so I basically keep smashing keyboard with 4 fingers -any tip here will be appreciated. left mouse tornados, right mouse armor.

    -Sometimes I run out of AP, but mainly is due to little exp timing the atacks, no big issue here since I think will be fixed with more practise.

    -Teleport. The biggest issue, I miss teleport too much. Although I currently got zero faster run, and in the movie I see Dickscot runs with 24% -by now I cannot afford any-, even him moving faster would have serious troubles when facing wallers, arcane sentries or ice. Its simple unavoidable in my oppinion, no other chance than spam meteror from afar and kite-this is not the playstile I want with this build.

    For all the other situations the build worked fine for me. Damage output when conecting meteors is amazing. But shards is also great. Im gonna keep shards for my current shocknado build. It procs and increases killing speed quite a bit, I cannot see why since damage isnt that high (250%) and only once per time, but drops monsters life in very a noticiable amount everytime it triggers. Im not sure if it is working as it should, I mean deals more damage than expected for any unknown reason. I like it.

    So I want to thanks to Dick for the idea. I will keep saving gold, improving gear and trying to find ways to adapt my build to this. And also have an eye always on this tread.


    Tomb.
     
  18. CharDar

    CharDar IncGamers Member

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    I'm really enjoying this build, however, I can't use it on ubers (mainly because Magda swam requires a bubble), but I was wondering where I could improve.

    I know my Attack Speed could greatly improve (@ 2.09), but I feel that it will be very hard to do.

    I'd love some recommendations!

    http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Deathalus-1641/hero/7124926
     
  19. Silvist

    Silvist IncGamers Member

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    Heyo,

    I just wanted to say that since release I always wanted to get my wiz to 60. Since I was a huge fan of the sorc in d2. Though for some reason the AP gen skills were a HUGE turn off for me. They just felt like they were to small of range. So I started a variation of your build at lvl 45 ;p

    I had no way to generate AP, so I used a couple skills to fix that.

    http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/wizard#VhXSTY!bWX!YcabZY

    I also didn't have enough crit to refresh my skills fast enough, so this helped as well.

    Later once I hit about 20-30% crit, I ended up with this:

    http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/wizard#VhXSTY!gWX!YcabcY

    I have alot of gear upgrades to do, due to the fact I just hit 60 yesterday lol. Thanks to the power of MP lvling ;p

    I figure once I have actual AP on crit, I may move to your build. I realize my res, and crit dmg need a huge boost. I've tried all sorts of characters since release. Got a 60 DH, 60 barb, and 60 monk...and now wiz. Out of all of those characters, this is by far the funniest.

    I feel that with this build you have so much control over the fight that its not even funny. I did run into some glitches though, where I couldn't freeze the mob. I wasn't sure if it was caused by shielding, or what. Though I did try about 7 times, and finally on the 7th time I froze the mob. Normally my average latency is about 110, so I found it very odd.

    Once again thanks for the awesome build. I can't wait to finally add meteor into the mix ;p

    In case you want to suggest me anything, here is my profile:

    http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Silvist-1399/hero/3049857

    I realize my gems need huge upgrades lol.
     
  20. DickScotchfist

    DickScotchfist <font color=#168A19>PoE Moderator</font>

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    well this is all theory really until we can come up with guidlines for minimum stats. The main point I was trying to make was that at my stats stunlocking didn't SEEM to be a problem or any worse than without liquify.

    edit: been pretty busy this week. will look at other replies asap.
     

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