Please respect other members. Please do not post links or information about hacking/warez/cheats.
Read the rules of these forums as we rarely warn before banning. Lost or need RSS check the forum map.

Latest News

Quick Nav
Navigation
Diablo IncGamers
Diablo Wiki
Gallery
Donate/Subscribe
Follow us on Twitter
Diablo 3 Game Info
Basics
Classes
Items
Combat
Monsters
Interface
A-Z Index
Diablo 2 Game Info
Basics
Classes
Items
Runes
Monsters
A-Z Index
Strategies
Diablo I/Hellfire
Forums
Community
Trading
Strategy


Donate and get extra forum perks
Support diii.net

Go Back   Diablo 3 & Diablo 2 Forums > Diablo 3 Community Forums > Diablo 3 Suggestions and Wish List
Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read

Diablo 3 Suggestions and Wish List Request and argue potential features you'd like to see (or not) in Diablo 3.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-08-2008, 00:38   #1
ciphernemo
DiabloII.Net Member
 
ciphernemo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: State College, PA
Posts: 41
Noob-proof Skill Trees; Gameplay Balance

I want to share a little of my gaming style before I explain what I mean by "noob-proof" skill trees, skill allotment, etc.

I enjoy playing Diablo games without knowing what to expect. I like finding surprises (good ones, of course) in-game, discovering new combinations, and yes, even adventuring. Therefore I continually try to supress my urge to research these things. I've done well with this in respect to D1 and D2. I might not do this with D3, however, given the long wait for it.

Therefore, I'd really like to see noob-proof skill trees, where any player can dump points into any number of different skills and still have a fun, playable character. Give D3 some balance with respect to monster resistences, immunities, and of course, weaknesses. Each of these should be tweaked to allow characters with diverse point spreads to still function well. Of course I fully support certain combinations of skills that will function better overall so that players who like this sort of thing can still develop strategies and re-work characters (or restart them).

In other words, I really hate having nearly worthless skills thrown into a skill tree of chracters in D2. Those playing D3 for the first time will probably want to experiment a bit, trying out each skill. I don't want to see us get crippled characters as a result of that experimentation. Those experimenting have grown to accept that their character will not be as powerful as one focused on a specific combination or theme, but we do want our diverse characters to be playable.

So please, Blizzard, do not leak D3 specifics until Beta or a release candidate. Give us news of things that might be a little vague, but will keep us entertained while waiting for it. When the game is released, I hope that we'll be able to experiment without resulting in debuffed/neutered characters.

How does everyone else feel about this?
ciphernemo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-08-2008, 07:42   #2
Fleshvirus
DiabloII.Net Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Europe
Posts: 25
Re: Noob-proof Skill Trees; Gameplay Balance

All i want is that the skills dont have any syenergy to eachothers and that they do not tie to eachothers.

And i want there to be books that either teaches you new skill or gives you the abillity of using them.

And yes i dont want any skill to suck (every skill got to have their own use)
Remember Inferno? WHAT A JOKE.
Fleshvirus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-08-2008, 11:42   #3
Arbedark
DiabloII.Net Member
 
Arbedark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Keele / Sheffield
Posts: 4,417
Re: Noob-proof Skill Trees; Gameplay Balance

Making all skills balanced within a class does not equal noob proof skill trees.

A noob might put 2 points in every skill. Should they be able to kill anywhere near as fast as someone who has put 20 points into a main attacking skill? No, because if they do, why bother having skill ranks at all, when a level 2 skill can kill almost as fast as the same skill at level 20...
Arbedark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-08-2008, 12:17   #4
5zigen
DiabloII.Net Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Useast
Posts: 1,346
Re: Noob-proof Skill Trees; Gameplay Balance

WoW is an example of the only way to do "noob proof skill trees"

If you don't know, wow has no skill trees.
5zigen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-08-2008, 12:22   #5
NKlint
DiabloII.Net Member
 
NKlint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Sugarcreek, Ohio
Posts: 343
Re: Noob-proof Skill Trees; Gameplay Balance

WoW is also an example of how you can only have 3 variations of each class. I suppose that isn't a bad thing, but I hope that in order to survive in the competitive side of D3 we aren't forced to use cookie cutter builds.
NKlint is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-08-2008, 15:56   #6
nicro tower
DiabloII.Net Member
 
nicro tower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Wolfen Empire ~~~~~ Canada
Posts: 4,343
Re: Noob-proof Skill Trees; Gameplay Balance

How about each offensive skill is viable when maxed? Like for example, using d2 char skills, if you maxed thunder storm and put all the rest of your skill points in random stuff like warmth and es, your thunder storm will still be able to get you through hell. Maybe it gets more frequent the higher it's level is or something...
nicro tower is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
DIII.NET SPONSOR

Remove Forum Ads
Old 02-08-2008, 17:28   #7
sicilian
DiabloII.Net Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 379
Re: Noob-proof Skill Trees; Gameplay Balance

While I think they should strive to make every skill viable, either by having a powerful enough effect, or by including some utility effect, the idea that you should be able to throw points into whatever you want and be able to complete the game at the highest level is a little naive.

One of two things are going to happen. Either they balance the game around every build being viable, meaning the people who find the well-planned builds are going to cruise through all difficulties with no challenge. Or, they balance it around the really well-planned "cookie-cutter" builds, and people with creative builds can only complete Normal or Nightmare.

I think it has to be the latter. That way, you can play however you want and still complete the story to find out what happens, but if you want to beat the ultimate challenge you can't be careless with your character. It's the fairest way to do things.

Also makes it very satisfying when you beat Hell using an unconventional build
sicilian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-08-2008, 18:48   #8
5zigen
DiabloII.Net Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Useast
Posts: 1,346
Re: Noob-proof Skill Trees; Gameplay Balance

Quote:
Originally Posted by NKlint View Post
WoW is also an example of how you can only have 3 variations of each class. I suppose that isn't a bad thing, but I hope that in order to survive in the competitive side of D3 we aren't forced to use cookie cutter builds.
Well techincally WoW should have more than 3 viable builds. It should have something like 9, if it were balanced that is, vaible builds should be something like 41/20/0,41/0/20, 0/41/20, 20/41/0. 20/0/41, 0/20/41, 30/0/30, 0/30/30, 30/30/0....

But that wasn't so balanced because WoW is all about minimaxing in every sense of the word, and since respecs are so commonplace people can just easily gravitate toward the cookie cutters.

Anyhow if there's only 3 variations for each character that would be extremely boring, but really, in D2 the same was basically true.
5zigen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-08-2008, 18:50   #9
AlexanderM
DiabloII.Net Member
 
AlexanderM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Cup o' Noodles
Posts: 170
Re: Noob-proof Skill Trees; Gameplay Balance

Give the fact that we've heard (can't recall from where, eek!) that respecialization (respec-ing) will be part of D3 in some way, it's my bet that we'll likely see skills that simply aren't work a full investment, but the ability to shift points around will keep every character from getting neutered. This jives with the idea that blizzard built into the synergies, you don't need to save all your skill points and dump them into a few level 24 and 30 skills, spending them along the way is encouraged, but in the end called for an even more careful distribution in the end. Also encouraged placement of points in skills that otherwise would never have gotten them (my avenger has 10 skill points in the resist fire aura, in pre-1.10, that wouldn't have made any sense at all).
AlexanderM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-08-2008, 21:44   #10
Arbedark
DiabloII.Net Member
 
Arbedark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Keele / Sheffield
Posts: 4,417
Re: Noob-proof Skill Trees; Gameplay Balance

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexanderM View Post
Give the fact that we've heard (can't recall from where, eek!) that respecialization (respec-ing) will be part of D3 in some way, it's my bet that we'll likely see skills that simply aren't work a full investment, but the ability to shift points around will keep every character from getting neutered. This jives with the idea that blizzard built into the synergies, you don't need to save all your skill points and dump them into a few level 24 and 30 skills, spending them along the way is encouraged, but in the end called for an even more careful distribution in the end. Also encouraged placement of points in skills that otherwise would never have gotten them (my avenger has 10 skill points in the resist fire aura, in pre-1.10, that wouldn't have made any sense at all).
Pre-1.10 it wouldn't have mattered 1 jot since your avenger could also be a FoHer and a smiter or zealot and still have skill points left over..
Arbedark is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 00:41.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2009, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Advertisement System V2.5 By   Branden