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  1. #21
    IncGamers Member Speedster's Avatar
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    Re: Why removing the auctionhouse will probably keep me off D3EXP all together.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDestructor View Post
    With the AH the path of least resistance will always be buying your items, now without it, the best way to get items is by playing the game (because trading is a PITA for better or worse). I think this is a better alternative to our current situation. I think both options have their merits, but for the long run of the game, going without the AH is a better choice as it allows them to tweak drops to be more forgiving without the AH cutting the legs out from under the rewarding monster killing experience.
    I played self found with the AH -- meaning that I sold good items found for gold and accumulated gold to gradually buy other items I needed. It took a year to get to where I am now, so the idea that the GAH is some kind of instant shortcut is off the mark. The RMAH, yes, that pretty much defeated the purpose of playing the game -- but it wasn't all that different from the old D2 third party system (which also defeated the purpose of playing that game...)

    Again, you're placing total faith in RNG to turn up the items you need to build a powerful character over time.

  2. #22
    IncGamers Member HardRock's Avatar
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    Re: Why removing the auctionhouse will probably keep me off D3EXP all together.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfpaq777 View Post
    They better freaking quadruple our stash size now because gold is done as a meaningful currency.
    I agree about the stash size. We're gonna need a bigger boat.

    I'm not sure about the gold though. If they would give enough meaningful ways for gold to leave the economy permanently (like if costly mystic reroll would bind the items, more BoA crafted items, etc.) then I think gold could retain it's value even without the AH. In D2 this never happened, spent gold never left the economy as far as I can remember.

    Quote Originally Posted by jonw View Post
    you're placing total faith in RNG to turn up the items you need to build a powerful character over time.
    It can happen, it's just a matter of balance. If that's the devs' goal, even if they fail at first they'll get there eventually. D2 (and I'm sure many other ARPGs I don't know about) did things right in this regard, so they have at least one good example to look at. Allow us to clear the hardest difficulties of the game even with self-found gear that doesn't require hundreds of hours of play time to acquire and also allow traders to optimize their way to godhood. I personally don't want godly items at my fingertips in a matter of minutes, it's okay if traders have an easier time with that, but I do want to tackle the most difficult part of the game by myself without growing old in the process and thereby feeling forced into trading.
    Last edited by HardRock; 18-09-2013 at 21:33.

  3. #23
    IncGamers Member Mn_Swe2's Avatar
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    Re: Why removing the auctionhouse will probably keep me off D3EXP all together.

    I quoted you in my post at reddit. I think you describe in a perfect way what will happen in D3 long term. :(

    http://www.reddit.com/r/Diablo/comme...ed_in_poe_and/

  4. #24
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    Re: Why removing the auctionhouse will probably keep me off D3EXP all together.

    Gold was useless as a currency in D2 because one char could only hold like 3 million of it. Had we been able to store an infinite amount (or 1000 billion or smth), I'm sure some people would've amassed gold for gambling. Runes would likely still have been the major currency, but gold would've been worth something, too.


    I might be in the minority, but I actually enjoyed finding good trades in D2, buying low and selling high and getting rich gradually over time. The AH removed the human element from trading, and consequently all uncertainty. It exchanged adventure for lame busywork -- sitting there with a stop-watch, waiting to snipe items at the last second. Extending the trade timer by one minute after each bid would've fixed the sniping problem, but the real issue is the faceless, clinical nature of the AH. It's just not a fun way of trading for me. There's no haggling, no uncertainty of any kind (changing your mind at the last minute, getting a better offer from someone else, dc (yes I'm being serious), afk (serious again), not having the item you thought you had, etc...), and no feeling that you're trading with other humans.

    Code:
    D2:
    
    'hi' 
    
    'hi' 
    
    'got pcomb?' 
    
    'y 34 life' 
    
    'ber ok?' 
    
    'add ist' 
    
    'don't have... items?' 
    
    'show' ... 'hmm raven' 
    
    'it's high stats... worth lots more' 
    
    'hmm shako then' 
    
    'k shako+ber' 
    
    't4t' 
    
    'thx cu'
    Code:
    D3:
    
    1. Search 10 billion Manticores
    
    2. Find underpriced Manti, note the time remaining & set the alarm
    
    3. Alarm goes off, see if Manti is still available
    
    4. Manti is still there, wait until last second
    
    5. Bid an amount that makes you likely to get it but make a decent profit
    
    6. Get Manti 
    
    7. Search for Mantis again...
    Although #2 is vastly more efficient, I prefer #1 every time. As long as the AH exists, no one will use method #1 (except to avoid Blizzard taxes on really high-end stuff); as strange as it sounds, we must be forced to have fun...

    EDIT: W8 they're actually removing the AHs?! Only saw this news after I posted... Kinda obvious from the topic title but I thought it was just a rumor until now. This is great news imo. I do hope they make trading a bit more fluid - allow longer game names for one (named games *are* coming back, right?), and maybe add some sort of delayed trading system where both players don't have to be online at the same time. While afk did add an element of uncertainty, on second thought the frustration factor might be greater in that particular case.

    EDIT2: Stash size x 5 would be nice, too (I'd pay for it).
    Last edited by Greizer; 18-09-2013 at 19:30.

  5. #25
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    Re: Why removing the auctionhouse will probably keep me off D3EXP all together.

    not even reading the OP.

    RMAH ruined d3, completely.
    any AH in general basically ruins the game as you can always buy gold with $ somewhere
    losing the AH is the best thing to happen to this game and the only reason I may buy the xpac.

  6. #26
    IncGamers Member HardRock's Avatar
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    Re: Why removing the auctionhouse will probably keep me off D3EXP all together.

    Quote Originally Posted by Greizer View Post
    named games *are* coming back, right?
    They haven't said anything about that yet. We also don't know if the game's social aspects will change after the closure of the AH.

  7. #27
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    Re: Why removing the auctionhouse will probably keep me off D3EXP all together.

    Quote Originally Posted by JEB90 View Post
    First, thanks for telling me how I'd like to play. This whole attitude that "if you only have to grind more for sub-optimal gear things would be wonderful" might be great for you, but I'm not interested in spending more time to have worse gear. Diablo is and has always been a trading game. You may not have used the d2 trading forums here, on bnet, and on other very popular 3rd party sites, but to pretend they weren't important in the game shows a serious misunderstanding of it. How in the world do you think people got runewords? Furthermore, I play primarily one class--barbarians. I've done this since d2. Maybe that's a stupid way to play, but I like it. When I find good stuff for the other classes, I want to trade it for good stuff I can use. Making that harder and calling it progress is just stupid.

    Oh--by the way--you actually "need" very few things in life. Pretty much you need to breathe, eat, drink, sleep, and evacuate waste. Everything else is optional. Those of you who keep screaming about what the game "needs" would do well to remember that.
    Diablo hasn't always been a trading game, Diablo is a game of killing **** and becoming gradually stronger in the process. As Hardrock outlined, it was extremely satisfying to play self-found in D2 because it wasn't too hard to get decent uniques as you went through levels.

  8. #28
    IncGamers Member Punkonjunk's Avatar
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    Re: Why removing the auctionhouse will probably keep me off D3EXP all together.

    Quote Originally Posted by Silenkiller View Post
    not even reading the OP.

    RMAH ruined d3, completely.
    any AH in general basically ruins the game as you can always buy gold with $ somewhere
    losing the AH is the best thing to happen to this game and the only reason I may buy the xpac.
    Yeah, thanks. "I hate something so much, I can't possibly be bothered to consider it's advantages."

    Did you think about why you hate it, or how your hatred might be resolved by not using it?

    My big issue here is that a lot of people hate it. Hell, I hate the real money auction house, never bothered to use it besides posting a couple things for far too much and thinking "maybe I'll get a hundo, heh heh"

    And while I hate it, I don't think it falls into the same category of vitriol I have for microtransactions. While it's a small transaction, it's not blizzard printing money and selling it to you for dolla billz. It's folks finding gear and selling it to other folks. That's not evil.

    It's lazy, for sure, for one guy. For the other guy, it's profit.

    I think they have the right to that choice.

    I don't like the idea, at all, of removing choice to "fix" anything.

    I think too many women are bad voters. And you know, all the men in that really sexist club yell REALLY loudly and won't stop twitting at me. I guess we shouldn't let women vote anymore, that would probably fix the problem.

    I know it's a bit of a strawman but that's what this feels like. "Some folks don't like it! We count thousands on the forums! And you and I both know for every 1 folk yelling, it's thousands who aren't saying anything! TENS OF THOUSANDS! AT THIS POINT WE'RE LOSING SALES JUST BY NOT REMOVING THE AUCTION HOUSE! LOOK, LOOK THERE, I SWEAR IT JUST WINKED AT ME! IT'S THE DEVIL!"

    To be a fly on the wall during the meeting for that pitch....

    But I hope folks like you are happy, silenkiller. Too hasty to read my OP, likely too annoyed to read my reply...

    This change must make some folks happy, and I hope they considered who, and how valuable they are, because they are gonna want to make a whoooole lot of cash on those expansion sales with RMAH gone as a trickle value potential.


    That said, this has a lot of moving parts, and maybe the changes that come from this change will eventually bring things to a usable level....

    But why?

    We're talking about named games, here.

    NAMED GAMES.

    MY20RGEMS4MANTI


    Do you really want to sift through named games for the item you want?
    Wouldn't it be easier to uh.... type manticore into the search bawks in that old auction system and uh, buy one?


    I'm so completely mind-****ed on this. I swear I cannot comprehend the love of this decision, nor the reasoning behind it. My cognitive dissonance has it's own cognitive dissonance.

  9. #29
    IncGamers Member
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    Re: Why removing the auctionhouse will probably keep me off D3EXP all together.

    well, look, okay that was a nice reply. you seem intelligent. so here is my point: you had it your way when the game released and for the last year+. it didnt work, and in case no one has noticed, d3 has been terrible. now, give us our turn without the AH and see what happens okay? i promise you'll be surprised. the game is about gearing up, which is completely ruined when you can gear up in a few days via the AH. please trust me, just give it a try. please? <3

    ps. bring back charms and runes, i mean come on

  10. #30
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    Re: Why removing the auctionhouse will probably keep me off D3EXP all together.

    Quote Originally Posted by Punkonjunk View Post
    Do you really want to sift through named games for the item you want?
    Yes. To be fair I never thought I'd say this before I actually tried the AH. I was *stoked* for it before release. But it totally killed the joy of trading for me, and the more I thought about the reasons the more I realized that I didn't trade for profits but the fun I had in getting them. The things I mentioned in my previous post that D3 removed from the game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Punkonjunk View Post
    Wouldn't it be easier to uh.... type manticore into the search bawks in that old auction system and uh, buy one?
    Easier, yes. More fun, no. The total opposite. Easy/efficient != fun, a bitter lesson that D3 has thought me and one I'll never forget. (Mind you, I'm not saying inefficient = fun, either. There can be fun *and* efficient systems; but when it comes to Diablo and trading, it is exceedingly difficult to devise such a system because an efficient AH by definition removes the human element (as much as possible).)

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