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  1. #31
    Europe Trade Moderator krischan's Avatar
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    Re: American Homeless people

    I knew you couldn't dismiss my accusation of appearing racistic
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  2. #32
    IncGamers Member jmervyn's Avatar
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    Re: American Homeless people

    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    This whole post took me about 20 minutes of googling, reading and typing badly. Jmerv, Glurin and Peppercats would any of you like to adjust your thoughts on this?
    Sure. I think your shallow research skills just made you look quite silly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    That's simply not true, illegal immigrants can not receive food stamps.
    You're wrong (PDF), as usual, though it's probably not worth picking your nits to sort out specifics. Unless you're going to cling to the laughable claim that SNAP <> "food stamps"?

    Quote Originally Posted by USDA
    Although many non-citizens are now eligible for SNAP, SNAP participation has been historically low among eligible non-citizen households. In 2008, the participation rate for non-citizens was 51% and the rate for citizen children living with non-citizen adults was 55% as compared to the national participation rate of 67% among all eligible individuals and a national participation rate of 86% for all eligible children.
    As you admitted, the largest source of this is when illegal immigrants can use food stamps that "belong" to others, including those within the household. Considering the Obama Administration wants this expanded, it's not exactly a shocker.



    The kids don't need to be citizens either, incidentally; you're falling for the "anchor baby" part... since a "lawful resident" doesn't mean citizen, and a child would be under 18, there's every likelihood that they can get SNAP.

    P.S. both FactCheck and Politifact have been proven to have heavy Leftist biases. Politifact openly lied about illegals not being eligible for food stamps, and Soros' FactCheck uses the time-honored falsification method of comparing volume vs. velocity - Obama did not add as many before Gingrich's claim than Bush had in eight years (by the end of Obama's 2nd term, this will be more easily visible as being viciously hypocritical). So it's not like quoting them carries much weight; they're only mildly more credible than MSNBC which has nowhere near the "credibility" of Faux N00z. Even CRS isn't to be trusted; their vaunted credibility and non-partisanship is in name only (they're employed to back up Congressional desires).
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    When they grow up, they will pay taxes because they'll have social security numbers.
    Yeah, that's always a favourite canard y'all use. Thing is, it's still a bunch of horsecrap (below) when you examine it. First & foremost because even presuming you're specifying the group you incorrectly identified as future citizens will actually earn a living, their Social Security benefits drastically outweigh their contributions. That's not even considering the other part of the canard, where illegals contribute to Social Security using invalid SSID's.

    Total Annual Paid in Withholdings for family of 4 using a stolen Social Security Number: $2008.20

    The income above qualifies for a family of two U.S. born children and two legal-non-citizens qualifies them for $341 Mo. / $4092 Annual food stamps.

    Family of 4 with year end deductions of $2008.20 minus food stamps credit $4092 = a deficit of -$2083.38 from the tax base. Average annual education benefit is approximately $10,000 per child.


    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    I think you'd be surprised, those illegals would LOVE to be legal.
    Of course, <some> would. The ones who actually plan to stay here and participate in the society don't want to be worried about being caught in one of the very rare publicity "stings" that ICE performs. However, many don't want to, and that's not a bad thing since they're the backbone of our crop-picking industry and at the same time they're one of the primary Mexican income sources, but rather than use a work permit/"green card" they're deliberately dodging the law. The worst category, though, is a subset of this last group, and those people are not only deliberately participating in the black market but have no interest in "buy in" to U.S. laws and regulations. That group may not be quite as large as imagined, but they're nowhere near as small a population as you on the Left would pretend.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    All citizens get free schooling.
    Again, many Mexican children are brought from the border to attend American schools and get free breakfast & lunch when doing so.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    Later in the Article they say that it's not the illegals, but those on medicare that tend to over use the emergency room. Illegals tend to under use it (they avoid the hospital when they should go).
    Yeah, that's another anecdotal pile of crap. Illegals are pretty much the only people in the ER when I've had to go, and your claim is obviously falsified by including the potential of the "I've fallen and I can't get up" Medicare crowd who don't have immediate access to their primary care physician. Should I have taken Gramps to his Primary when he fell backwards down the stairs and was bleeding out on the floor? Sure. Thing is, his Primary isn't in the office at 2100hrs, so be glad that I drove him rather than calling an ambulance.

    Of course, the bottom line isn't that they're using the ER, but that they're using the ER with "free rider" intent. I don't know how you think that makes it better.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    As for free housing, Illegal immigrants are not eligible, but sometimes they live with a legal resident. If that's the case, you can't say we'e paying for the illegal, when really we're not.
    Sure we are; Obama's Auntie is the poster child. Just because ONE program only has 29,570 illegal-headed households doesn't mean it's representative of the whole problem, particularly since HUD lowers funding for multiple occupancy. Plus, you're not even considering the assistance they get within the $44 Billion they represent in the CRA sub-prime mortgage market. How the hell do you come up with your crap, aside from only taking one side's word on things?

  3. #33
    IncGamers Member Stevinator's Avatar
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    Re: American Homeless people

    Quote Originally Posted by jmervyn View Post
    Sure. I think your shallow research skills just made you look quite silly.
    You're wrong (PDF), as usual, though it's probably not worth picking your nits to sort out specifics. Unless you're going to cling to the laughable claim that SNAP <> "food stamps"?
    That would be the kids getting the food stamps. I won't dispute that an illegal would benefit from them, I'm saying they're providing them to the children.

    As you admitted, the largest source of this is when illegal immigrants can use food stamps that "belong" to others, including those within the household. Considering the Obama Administration wants this expanded, it's not exactly a shocker.
    If they live together you can't do anything about that. What are you going to do? Not let the kids, who were born here--just like you and I--that they can't get food stamps?

    The kids don't need to be citizens either, incidentally; you're falling for the "anchor baby" part... since a "lawful resident" doesn't mean citizen, and a child would be under 18, there's every likelihood that they can get SNAP.
    Hmm, so people we've officially granted asylum, people married to members of our armed forces, and victims of human trafficking. I'm not seeing mexicans who slid under a fence on the list. Actually I'm not seeing anything on there that bothers me.


    Yeah, that's always a favourite canard y'all use. Thing is, it's still a bunch of horsecrap (below) when you examine it. First & foremost because even presuming you're specifying the group you incorrectly identified as future citizens will actually earn a living, their Social Security benefits drastically outweigh their contributions. That's not even considering the other part of the canard, where illegals contribute to Social Security using invalid SSID's.
    They are legal citizens. Their status is no different than yours or mine.


    Total Annual Paid in Withholdings for family of 4 using a stolen Social Security Number: $2008.20

    The income above qualifies for a family of two U.S. born children and two legal-non-citizens qualifies them for $341 Mo. / $4092 Annual food stamps.

    Family of 4 with year end deductions of $2008.20 minus food stamps credit $4092 = a deficit of -$2083.38 from the tax base. Average annual education benefit is approximately $10,000 per child.
    Never even brought that up. But, I will affirm that it IS my position that we should educate US Citizens.

    Of course, <some> would. The ones who actually plan to stay here and participate in the society don't want to be worried about being caught in one of the very rare publicity "stings" that ICE performs. However, many don't want to, and that's not a bad thing since they're the backbone of our crop-picking industry and at the same time they're one of the primary Mexican income sources, but rather than use a work permit/"green card" they're deliberately dodging the law. The worst category, though, is a subset of this last group, and those people are not only deliberately participating in the black market but have no interest in "buy in" to U.S. laws and regulations. That group may not be quite as large as imagined, but they're nowhere near as small a population as you on the Left would pretend.
    Well, it would be a lot easier to chase out the bad seeds if those that wanted to buy in did. I think they should have a path to legal status. I also think a lot of people do what they do because they don't have an option. I think if they could become legal and get regular jobs, they wouldn't be as likely to dodge the system.

    Yeah, that's another anecdotal pile of crap. Illegals are pretty much the only people in the ER when I've had to go, and your claim is obviously falsified by including the potential of the "I've fallen and I can't get up" Medicare crowd who don't have immediate access to their primary care physician. Should I have taken Gramps to his Primary when he fell backwards down the stairs and was bleeding out on the floor? Sure. Thing is, his Primary isn't in the office at 2100hrs, so be glad that I drove him rather than calling an ambulance.
    LOL, i can just see you checking everyone's driver's license. How could you possibly know that? Were they all wearing soccer jerseys? I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt that it wasn't skin color, so I'm really wondering.

    Second, if you're "bleeding out on the floor" that's not a GP type thing. You either got hurt pretty bad, or you are on plavix or some blood thinner or something. My GP may have upgraded since I was last there, but I don't think he does blood transfusions. And you can't just "immediately falsify" things on anecdotal evidence after you just told me that the last 20 or so links I posted were all either biased or anecdotal.

    How about this. You feel, from the many times you have fallen and been unable to get up, that when your family rushed you to the emergency room, where while the doctors tried to fix you, you were busy asking people for green cards and driver's licenses, that not enough people proffered their papers upon demand to the ornery bleeding guy. Thusly, "almost" everyone in the emergency room must then be there in the emergency room because of injuries they sustained while sneaking into the country. :-)


    Of course, the bottom line isn't that they're using the ER, but that they're using the ER with "free rider" intent. I don't know how you think that makes it better.
    There is a difference between intent to pay (character), and ability to pay (capacity). Your link does not imply a problem with intent, but a problem with capacity. I'm actually rather impressed that almost 40% have health insurance. That must be hard to afford at under the table wages. Since Obamacare is requiring health insurance, if they implemented my plan, they'd have to shell out for it or be fined which means even more witholding. It might not solve the problem completely, but it would be better than the current situation.

  4. #34
    IncGamers Member jmervyn's Avatar
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    Re: American Homeless people

    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    That would be the kids getting the food stamps. I won't dispute that an illegal would benefit from them, I'm saying they're providing them to the children.
    However, the claim you pretended to shoot down is that the illegals aren't benefiting. Furthermore, I established that many illegals <DO> get SNAP directly, despite the official lie claim.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    If they live together you can't do anything about that. What are you going to do? Not let the kids, who were born here--just like you and I--that they can't get food stamps?
    It's one consideration. The entire "anchor baby" issue is based on extremely flawed logic that is a carryover from the Civil War Reconstruction era. There's no legitimate reason to simply bequeath citizenship to anyone happening to be born on U.S. ground ("jus soli"), and that's certainly not a universal practice amongst other countries.

    Incidentally, that link is one you really ought to read. It's one of the better-known, respected Conservative journals, and the article is quite condemnatory of the "anchor baby" hysteria.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    I'm not seeing mexicans who slid under a fence on the list. Actually I'm not seeing anything on there that bothers me.
    You're not reading it clearly. The "residents" part means long-term illegal aliens, and the "abuse" can pretty much include any woman and her child using a trumped-up claim.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    They are legal citizens. Their status is no different than yours or mine.
    No, I meant the illegals who benefit due to their pseudo-legitimate status. It's why the numbers specified fraudulent SSID's.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    Never even brought that up. But, I will affirm that it IS my position that we should educate US Citizens.
    Again, the reference was to fraudulent SSID's, meaning non-citizens.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    Well, it would be a lot easier to chase out the bad seeds if those that wanted to buy in did. I think they should have a path to legal status. I also think a lot of people do what they do because they don't have an option. I think if they could become legal and get regular jobs, they wouldn't be as likely to dodge the system.
    See, that's what boils my blood. There IS a path to legal status already. It's a pretty difficult path; people like Mark Steyn (and a friend of my wife, as well as an Infantry officer I corresponded with) have traveled it and remarked upon it. Thing is, the GODDAMNED FASCIST LEFT incessantly brings up "comprehensive immigration reform" as if the ONLY way to resolve the problem is to fix everything in one big confusing pile of horse-shyte, much as Obamacare did. The reason for this is that they really don't want the situation resolved at all - and there's enough craven, filthy Republicans that are eager to play ball just to get their lettuce picked and lawns mowed.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt that it wasn't skin color, so I'm really wondering.
    Well, white boy, I'll admit skin color was one of several factors. Not the least of which is that to live in the NYC environs at their level of income, you have to either be living in public housing or doing so on the sly. There's significant illegal population in NYC simply because this is where Leftists live, and many LIKE having the little brown people doing their chores. Cheaper, and keeps them in their place, you know?
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    And you can't just "immediately falsify" things on anecdotal evidence after you just told me that the last 20 or so links I posted were all either biased or anecdotal.
    Never falsely attribute a specific quote to me; it's one of the things that really pisses me off. What I was saying was that your Medicare claim included an obvious falsification, because old people are extremely likely not only to have ER-caliber accidents but require non-GP medical care in general. To rephrase, the claim was that Medicare recipients really used the ER incorrectly far more often than illegals, attributing wrong-mindedness to the old farts and sanctity to the illegals. That's what I called bullshyte, most specifically because the illegals will go to the ER for a nose-drip with the expectation of dodging the bill, while the farts will go to the ER because their neighbor had to call an ambulance and had no idea that the fart was simply sleeping soundly. In making too much of the technicality, the claim attempted to hide the underlying truth.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    I'm actually rather impressed that almost 40% have health insurance. That must be hard to afford at under the table wages. Since Obamacare is requiring health insurance, if they implemented my plan, they'd have to shell out for it or be fined which means even more witholding. It might not solve the problem completely, but it would be better than the current situation.
    I strongly suspect that the 40% doesn't hold up under scrutiny - not that the number's wrong, but as to who actually pays. It's all but certain not to be the illegal themselves in many cases, simply due to their desire to avoid tracking; if 40% of them are using fraudulent SSID's then that's a scandal in and of itself.

  5. #35
    IncGamers Member Stevinator's Avatar
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    Re: American Homeless people

    Quote Originally Posted by jmervyn View Post
    See, that's what boils my blood. There IS a path to legal status already. It's a pretty difficult path; people like Mark Steyn (and a friend of my wife, as well as an Infantry officer I corresponded with) have traveled it and remarked upon it. Thing is, the GODDAMNED FASCIST LEFT incessantly brings up "comprehensive immigration reform" as if the ONLY way to resolve the problem is to fix everything in one big confusing pile of horse-shyte, much as Obamacare did. The reason for this is that they really don't want the situation resolved at all - and there's enough craven, filthy Republicans that are eager to play ball just to get their lettuce picked and lawns mowed.
    That way often requires things that aren't feasible (like leaving the country for a period of time). IT doesn't work, hence the many many illegals. We need a way that gets those who want to work on the rolls and allows us to target the trouble makers effectively. You can't just say deport them all because we don't have the money.

    Well, white boy, I'll admit skin color was one of several factors.


    Never falsely attribute a specific quote to me; it's one of the things that really pisses me off.
    Sorry if i did. It irritates me too.

    What I was saying was that your Medicare claim included an obvious falsification, because old people are extremely likely not only to have ER-caliber accidents but require non-GP medical care in general. To rephrase, the claim was that Medicare recipients really used the ER incorrectly far more often than illegals, attributing wrong-mindedness to the old farts and sanctity to the illegals. That's what I called bullshyte, most specifically because the illegals will go to the ER for a nose-drip with the expectation of dodging the bill, while the farts will go to the ER because their neighbor had to call an ambulance and had no idea that the fart was simply sleeping soundly. In making too much of the technicality, the claim attempted to hide the underlying truth.
    I understand your point, but i also have to take the stat at face value until i hear otherwise. As for illegals planning on not paying the bill, I'm not sure that's true for all of them. mostly i think they're just people who are trying to do what's best for their families, and if they could pay, usually they would. i agree that the fake SSIDs is a problem though, if you have a fake identity, you're less likely to follow the rules/norms (like paying a bill that is more than the cost of a new fake SSID).

    I strongly suspect that the 40% doesn't hold up under scrutiny - not that the number's wrong, but as to who actually pays. It's all but certain not to be the illegal themselves in many cases, simply due to their desire to avoid tracking; if 40% of them are using fraudulent SSID's then that's a scandal in and of itself.
    Well it could be they all have fake SSIDs and are covered by insurance, or they're paying the bill in cash. They pay their other bills, electric, rent, cell phones, etc. And 60% is still not that many. It's very plausible. They don't all make $2 an hour. i suspect a lot of landscaper guys, make 10-15 and hour, and work a lot more hours--and don't pay taxes. Hell, here in IL, where there's an income tax, that's decent money.

  6. #36
    IncGamers Member jmervyn's Avatar
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    Re: American Homeless people

    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    You can't just say deport them all because we don't have the money.
    While that's not specifically true - and we're spending oodles of money on even less intelligent things at the moment - I've always considered the deportation belief downright silly. Particularly since they're deporting themselves so often. I'd reserve deportation to criminals, but since we apparently decide in most cases to incarcerate them at American expense, rather than risk their flight & subsequent return, it's not very applicable there either.

    You know what I WOULD support, even to the point of private contribution? U.S. Federally contracted jails in Mexico for the illegal alien hard-core criminals, with the Contract Enforcement Officer-in-charge being Joe Arpaio. That way, there's less chance of the Mexican gov't performing their own "catch and release" program while bilking the Yanquis. All the cost savings for keeping the vile scum suffering in desert sweatholes IN THEIR OWN COUNTRY rather than our high-cost prisons, and simultaneously greasing legitimate Mexican Policia palms, none of the ACLU-twisting-panties about prisoner rights.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    Self-satisfied much? It wasn't the only factor; my Spanish isn't shabby so I knew what they were talking about. But no, I didn't demand their green cards.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    Sorry if i did. It irritates me too.
    Yeah, it was "immediately falsify". I didn't say it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    I understand your point, but i also have to take the stat at face value until i hear otherwise.
    Where I don't, simply because it's trying to lead a conclusion. It's like Microsoft paying various evaluators to determine how great the Windoze OS is; you can't trust such "evidence".
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    i agree that the fake SSIDs is a problem though, if you have a fake identity, you're less likely to follow the rules/norms (like paying a bill that is more than the cost of a new fake SSID).
    Well, the bottom line is and always has been that they are... ILLEGAL. They're knowingly breaking the law. One of my childhood "nannies" was an illegal (I was latchkey before it was fashionable, and she was our neighbor); delightful woman, very hard working, I liked her a lot - made fantastic homemade tortillas with brown cinnamon sugar - but she knew she was breaking the law. The problem is that the obvious remedy is to both make the law easier to follow and make the penalty far more severe for real malfeasance (like companies deliberately using this as modern-day slavery). Neither is going to happen in sufficient ways to make progress, and that's primarily due to the political groups decision.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    i suspect a lot of landscaper guys, make 10-15 and hour, and work a lot more hours--and don't pay taxes. Hell, here in IL, where there's an income tax, that's decent money.
    Same here, and even more probable given they're likely to not be paying taxes in the main. Thing is, I bet the stat is flawed because it includes things like their making a co-pay when they actually don't have valid insurance. They're still paying - and more than some do - but there's a reason so many hospitals in the desert SouthWest went down the tubes over the last 2-3 decades. That's the reason.

  7. #37
    IncGamers Member Stevinator's Avatar
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    Re: American Homeless people

    Quote Originally Posted by jmervyn View Post
    While that's not specifically true - and we're spending oodles of money on even less intelligent things at the moment - I've always considered the deportation belief downright silly. Particularly since they're deporting themselves so often. I'd reserve deportation to criminals, but since we apparently decide in most cases to incarcerate them at American expense, rather than risk their flight & subsequent return, it's not very applicable there either.

    You know what I WOULD support, even to the point of private contribution? U.S. Federally contracted jails in Mexico for the illegal alien hard-core criminals, with the Contract Enforcement Officer-in-charge being Joe Arpaio. That way, there's less chance of the Mexican gov't performing their own "catch and release" program while bilking the Yanquis. All the cost savings for keeping the vile scum suffering in desert sweatholes IN THEIR OWN COUNTRY rather than our high-cost prisons, and simultaneously greasing legitimate Mexican Policia palms, none of the ACLU-twisting-panties about prisoner rights.
    The point of putting it in mexico is because it would be cheaper to run? Or to avoid making it "cushy" via american laws? Would it be run by americans or mexicans? Calderon is a big obama fan, maybe he'd even allow it.

    I don't really know what happens when someone is deported. do they just put them on a plane to their new country and let them out free? or do you send them to the other government to figure it out? I mean if they commit a crime here, mexico doesn't really care, so they are basically getting away with it. We need another australia. big ol' prisoner island with all kinds of nasty wildlife. Then it would be way cheaper to deal with the life sentences.

    You hate to see people commit crimes here and get away scot free.


    Self-satisfied much? It wasn't the only factor; my Spanish isn't shabby so I knew what they were talking about. But no, I didn't demand their green cards.
    It's the little things in life that keep me going.


    Yeah, it was "immediately falsify". I didn't say it.
    I apologize, it was a much tamer "obviously falsify" and i mistakenly attributed it to your story about he ER and not the the old people.


    Where I don't, simply because it's trying to lead a conclusion. It's like Microsoft paying various evaluators to determine how great the Windoze OS is; you can't trust such "evidence".
    Is there a nationwide study? I didn't see one when I was google fu-ing.

    Well, the bottom line is and always has been that they are... ILLEGAL. They're knowingly breaking the law. One of my childhood "nannies" was an illegal (I was latchkey before it was fashionable, and she was our neighbor); delightful woman, very hard working, I liked her a lot - made fantastic homemade tortillas with brown cinnamon sugar - but she knew she was breaking the law. The problem is that the obvious remedy is to both make the law easier to follow and make the penalty far more severe for real malfeasance (like companies deliberately using this as modern-day slavery). Neither is going to happen in sufficient ways to make progress, and that's primarily due to the political groups decision.
    Yes, but breaking that law doesn't mean that they're criminals in everything else they do. i would like to have a way for that nanny, who is obviously not a danger to society, working and supporting herself, to be able to be here without worrying about being deported or harassed, and to bring her salary out of the black market into the open. All the fences in the world won't stop someone from flying here on an airplane and not leaving. they will find a way in. What we need to do is find ways to prevent them from abusing the social services, be counted, pay taxes, and encourage them to contribute to society instead of stay on the edges. If there really is a huge problem with them coming here and having kids for our food stamps, then we should address that issue, and not get all wrapped up saying well they're criminals, and we should build a fence (or deport them). Since their kids will be citizens anyway, the GOP should really see the immigration problem as an opportunity to make changes to the food stamp and welfare systems, and court people who come from more socially conservative places. They're really shooting themselves in the foot by alienating aliens.

    Same here, and even more probable given they're likely to not be paying taxes in the main. Thing is, I bet the stat is flawed because it includes things like their making a co-pay when they actually don't have valid insurance. They're still paying - and more than some do - but there's a reason so many hospitals in the desert SouthWest went down the tubes over the last 2-3 decades. That's the reason.
    If they're paying for insurance through work with a fake SSN, then that's not fake insurance. that's insurance with a fake SSN. It's still valid to the hospital. the hospital gets paid. they're happy. the person with the emegency is happy, they get fixed up. the only problem here is we don't have an accurate tally for that person. Heck, that person is even paying taxes, and can't get any social services because the bad social would pop up. really, that guy is the one whose screwing himself. he's not going to be able to collect social security, unemployment or any of all that.

  8. #38
    IncGamers Member jmervyn's Avatar
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    Re: American Homeless people

    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    The point of putting it in mexico is because it would be cheaper to run? Or to avoid making it "cushy" via american laws?
    Yes, yes, and also because we're incarcerating foreign nationals at incredible taxpayer expense (partly because the Mexican gov't has bullcrap stances about extradition due to the U.S. death penalty.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    Would it be run by americans or mexicans? Calderon is a big obama fan, maybe he'd even allow it.
    Mexicans, as contractors, meaning that while the U.S. is still footing the bill we'd be taking advantage of both economies of scale and repeatedly kicking the ACLU in their shriveled little gonads because they can't complain. Mexican prisons aren't garden spots, but Amnesty International couldn't have much to say either because U.S. oversight would actually improve prisoner conditions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    I don't really know what happens when someone is deported. do they just put them on a plane to their new country and let them out free? or do you send them to the other government to figure it out?
    I believe it's case-by-case, though most often the foreign embassy is contacted during the process - particularly if it's "and stay out!"
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    I mean if they commit a crime here, mexico doesn't really care, so they are basically getting away with it.
    Mexico currently has no downside with exporting good, willing laborers; for what reason would they keep non-willing or unstable ones?
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    I apologize, it was a much tamer "obviously falsify" and i mistakenly attributed it to your story about he ER and not the the old people.
    Still wrong, actually, so's you know - "obviously falsified". Use of quotations implies accurate text, which is why you see the {sic} to imply that invalid grammar or spelling is part of the original quotation.

    There's one subcategory I may be incorrectly using - when pretending to quote or attributing to unknown, I've sometimes used single quotations rather than double, as in 'quotation' - but I don't see rules about that in a casual glance at that citation. Maybe a foreign thing I picked up in childhood?
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    Is there a nationwide study? I didn't see one when I was google fu-ing.
    About Microsoft? The claim is made during a conference, and there's apparently a chart, but your supposition that the 40% that have insurance actually pay for it isn't made explicitly either:
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    Yes, but breaking that law doesn't mean that they're criminals in everything else they do. i would like to have a way for that nanny, who is obviously not a danger to society, working and supporting herself, to be able to be here without worrying about being deported or harassed, and to bring her salary out of the black market into the open.
    I was facetious calling her a nanny; she was an unemployed spouse of an illegal day laborer, yet they lived in the trailer next to ours. So they legally "owned" a "home", yet she was still living off taxpayer support. Their son was the 'anchor baby'.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    If there really is a huge problem with them coming here and having kids for our food stamps, then we should address that issue, and not get all wrapped up saying well they're criminals, and we should build a fence (or deport them).
    Concur. Thing is, as I stated, this isn't happening because the Left (and some filth on the 'Right') don't really want the problem solved.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    They're really shooting themselves in the foot by alienating aliens.
    That claim is being made, but you have to understand the larger picture to recognize that it's on a false premise. It's really NOT just the illegals, but also the green carders & visa holders, and atop that it's the low-skilled legal immigrants - all of them are purposefully being imported and exploited by the Left, because of the implicit promise of "gifts" (see, there's a quotation of Romney) in exchange for fealty and permanent Democrat majority. Here's the issue in a nutshell, even as applies to non-immigrants:


    Quote Originally Posted by Stevinator View Post
    If they're paying for insurance through work with a fake SSN, then that's not fake insurance. that's insurance with a fake SSN. It's still valid to the hospital. the hospital gets paid. they're happy.
    Right, which is what I think comprises a portion of that 40% number (though how much is unclear). Also, that's probably a factor in the Obama administration interest in extending Social Security & SNAP to Mexicans; we know that many of them are on welfare anyways so why not just take another step down the road to MexAmeriCanada?

  9. #39
    IncGamers Member jmervyn's Avatar
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    Re: American Homeless people

    Figure this is a good thread to post the latest fun fact:
    Welfare recipients take out cash at strip clubs, liquor stores and X-rated shops


  10. #40
    IncGamers Member LozHinge the Unhinged's Avatar
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    Re: American Homeless people

    Yeah but I bet they squandered the rest of their cash. Hmph.

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