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  1. #11
    IncGamers Member Dogbert's Avatar
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    Re: Monk 1 week ago, 236k unbuffed WD today and lovin' it

    Not everyone is interested in playing on a high mp setting or interested in using bears, a gimmick skill imo that puts you in melee range as a caster.
    Some people me included prefer to play on a low mp and just blow things up. It's proven to be the most effective both for loot and xp anyway.
    These are just some things you have to take into consideration. Everyone plays the game they way they like.

    The same can be said about soj if you mean the legendary ring for 20% weapon damage vs elites. It's a matter of what you prefer. I don't like it because i lose a lot of vit, resists, life on hit, and basically every other good stat that can be had.

    It's a catch 22. On a low mp setting you don't need it. Packs die so fast anyway so it's a waste. On a high mp setting you will want to maintain a good killing speed vs normal monsters to not slow you down so again it's not wanted.

  2. #12
    IncGamers Member aerial's Avatar
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    Re: Monk 1 week ago, 236k unbuffed WD today and lovin' it

    Soj has 6% elemental damage, up to 30% damage vs elites, 100+ mana and skill bonus.
    Elites are main factor that slows you down, both on low and high mp.
    Soj is much better than even decent trifecta rare or legendary ring, for all kinds of builds. You can buy perfect wd soj for under 10 million gold, and it gives you significantly more real damage than rare or legendary trifecta ring worth 2 billion gold. It won't give you character profile dps though.

    Mana efficiency comes to play even at low mp, which I'm running myself a lot. Acid Rain is like ghost bomb, except it hits for 115% weapon damage to huge area, and ghost bomb only 8 yards (rest is 30% weak aoe). If you have gear that allows you to spam acid rain, you can clear mp0/1 much faster than with ghost bomb, that require multiple hits to kill same amount of trash enemies.
    It isn't just matter of using bears or not. Which btw even at mp1 with 200k dps unbuffed range are best way to kill elites, because they roll elitepack in 1-2 seconds, while other skills just take few seconds longer.
    Forums is for discussing optimal builds, sure anyone can play how they want, just sharing my thoughts about the builds, after getting nearly to paragon level 100 on wd and testing all kinds of builds.

  3. #13
    IncGamers Member SWalker's Avatar
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    Re: Monk 1 week ago, 236k unbuffed WD today and lovin' it

    Dogbert gets it
    Quote Originally Posted by aerial View Post
    Still no reason to not use soj.
    And this strategy doesn't work at higher monster power. By not using bears you are gimping your damage output by a lot (which I admit is flaw of wd skill design, it is too powerful compared to other skills).
    Let me put it this way. I've played all MP levels with a variety of characters and for loot/xp everything above MP3 sucks A LOT. Ask any decent player that has put a fair amount of hours into the game and they'll confirm - high mp is for keys and ubers. And keys and ubers are for? You guessed it - crappy hellfire rings (unless you're one of the few guys that got 'jackpot' rolls on it).

    For low MP - I just:
    1. Run to a pack of random monsters (95%ms jaunt+stalker)
    2. Blow them up with Soul Harvest, pretty much resetting cooldowns on SW and Stalker
    3. Repeat 1&2 until I find an elite pack, which I blow up with Fetish Ambush (+Soul Harvest if necessary)
    With tougher elites I might need a couple bats after #3, but it's still a lot faster than the clunky slow bears.
    Don't really die a lot either... occasional close call with spirit vessel on some 'reflects' elites and that's it.

    For high MP I switch grave injustice to jungle fortitude, and take the armor rune for horrify... it's fine. Rezzing paragon 80 Barbs on mp8 like a boss Don't even need zombie dogs, tbh.

  4. #14
    IncGamers Member aerial's Avatar
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    Re: Monk 1 week ago, 236k unbuffed WD today and lovin' it

    I'm with you on farming low mp, this is correct.
    Just saying attack speed doesn't synergize with everything here. For example fetish ambush, ias has no effect on this skill.

    From my experience fast farming build like this, spam acid rain which is 115% damage size of ghost bomb (and leaves dot for additional damage to finish off some targets if they survive). To compare, ghost bomb is 110% 8 yards, and 28 yards only 30%. With your gear, 1 cast of this spell is enough to kill mp1 trash. If few survives to non crits, dot will burn them. Spell costs tons of mana so without solid regen it isn't viable.
    Bears can kill pack instantly just like fetishes. And you have them up all the time, no cooldown. From my experience 2min cd skills don't reset every single elitepack more every 2 packs.
    Good way to kill elites with bears: spirit walk into elitepack (they don't see you, don't move), cast mass confusion rune with stun. Some elites get charmed, some stunned, charmed ones attack stunned, pack is not moving for next 4 seconds. And you sit in the middle of them, cast bears, pack dies in 2 seconds. Of course bears are not fun vs elites that run away, but if you charm/stun them, they are pretty much dead.

    Oh and don't get me wrong, with your level of gear you kill fast anyway. I'm talking here about relatively small differences in farming speed. They would become more noticable once you could increase mp slightly. When you are at point of dps where for example turning mp by 1 doesn't change your run speed at all, then it is worth it.

  5. #15
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    Re: Monk 1 week ago, 236k unbuffed WD today and lovin' it

    Quote Originally Posted by SWalker View Post
    Dire bats just kick zombie bears' ***, much quicker and less cumbersome to use, hate the pathing on bears.
    This made me chuckle.

  6. #16
    IncGamers Member SWalker's Avatar
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    Re: Monk 1 week ago, 236k unbuffed WD today and lovin' it

    Having to rely on acid rain and ZB is simply unnecessary, requires more expensive items and it can still be argued if it's faster.

    I kill most stuff with soul harvest, which is awesome because it's instant and does not require your hero to stop to cast it. Just zoom through the groups of monsters and don't even bother with the 2-3 that are out of its radius. If there are more in the same place, just finish the rest of by spamming firebomb which is really fast with my attack speed and even the ones in the outer area of impact die easily.

    Fetish Ambush is also instant and packs a huge punch which can be used to one-shot stuff while SW is still up, so you don't have as much trouble with reflect packs. Its cooldown can be reset fairly easy if you're farming dense maps, which you should be anyway.

    I've tried bears, acid rain and mass confusion in various combinations and none flow as nice and fast for me.

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