Milestone reached

[Shagsbeard]

Personal one anyway... I play under the following ruleset:

1) Self-found, no AH, but characters are allowed to trade with each other. Bind on equip.
2) 10 characters, two of each class, one HC, one SC.
3) No character can activate an act that the other 9 cannot access other than getting the initial waypoint/quest.
4) Strictly solo play, no MP.

Today, about 9 weeks after launch (one week off for a cruise), I've made it through normal difficulty. Notables: Monk is really overpowered at this level. Lost my HC Demon Hunter to a zone-in "stair trap" in Whimsyshire (considered act IV). Wizzard is the hardest for me... really fragile.

I'm considering leaving the SC party behind... I mainly started them when I lost two HC characters at the beginning of Act II and wanted to explore the game a bit before commiting to HC, I'll decide that before starting act II.

The game is fun for me. Items drop and can be crafted that improve my characters regularly. Monsters are fun to kill and challenging to a comfortable level. Most of the complaints I hear stem from inferno, so that's a ways off. Looking forward to Nightmare difficulty.

[BaronScarpia]

Gratz!

If you don't mind to spend a while on act 3 hell, you can try to find a high DPS weapon before moving on into inferno. It isn't impossible to beat inferno untwinked, but it's wise to farm a lot due to enrage timers/gear checking.

When you hit a new difficulty level, run from new tristram until you complete the wretched queen quest, checking the dungeon that can spawn Sarkoth (Dank Cellar, the closest one from old tristram) for gear. A blue with damage, socket and loh or vitality can work well. I would do it especially on inferno, since it's easier to find lvl 63 gear on act 1 inferno instead of act 3/4 hell. The first elite monster is the wretched queen on old tristram, so it's a lot safer, since your HC tons won't run at the risk of being 1 hit ko-ed by elite packs.

Also, you'll be able to find tomes of secrets, to level up your blacksmith and craft on inferno. You just need to salvage everything form lvl 61 and up (rings and ammys from lvl 59 and up) to have exquisite essences. After that, the graveyard is a easier place to farm early on.

[SnickerSnack]

@shagsbeard:

I would do it especially on inferno, since it's easier to find lvl 63 gear on act 1 inferno instead of act 3/4 hell.

Ilvl 63 items don't drop at all before inferno. http://us.battle.net/d3/en/blog/6214196/ I guess that does technically make it easier.

You just need to salvage everything form lvl 61 and up (rings and ammys from lvl 59 and up) to have exquisite essences.

I think you're mixing ilvl with required level. I'm pretty sure the minimums for salvaging inferno materials is ilvl 61 for armor/weapons, ilvl 60 for rings/ammies/followerItems.

[Shagsbeard]

Thanks for the hints, but inferno is a long way off, and things will probably have changed by the time I get there. I probably wont be "running Inferno" anyway, but simply dabbling in it when ever the mood takes me. Finishing inferno isn't on my to-do list. Most of the complainers on the official forums simply ran to inferno and beat their heads against the wall. It will likely be 2013 before I get there.

[BaronScarpia]

^he's right Some rings have ilvl 60 req lvl 59, I was thinking on them. Maybe even those rings end up in hell crafting materials. I got a couple exalted swords/daggers recipes on AH for giggles. Turns out they will only be used for giggles. The crafting cost was something like 50k - 1 act run for 2 crafted swords. It's almost gamble in disguise.

Today I had a confirmation on the gear check theory. I took a break last month after playing the whole act 2 and being killed by enraged belial. 2-3 weeks later, I made a few changes on my gear and, instead playing like a conscious person with little playing skills, I just upgraded my buffed dps to 21k and only avoided the poison bombs (2 cycles), not moving on arm attacks. Belial died. I just needed to avoid the couple explosion cycles and beat the bob punch bag under 3 minutes.

Why this, why here? Twinked or not, I see inferno as:

- elite packs: skill, build, regular diablo gaming. Just learn how to reset enrage timers and/or skip some boss packs and you're good to go.

- boss fights: gear check-ish. Actually, is a balance of survivability/offense. Look around for the stats people had before entering the fight, like DPS, res, loh, etc. I'm not saying "follow teh build". You just need to have a panic button and use passives/skill bonuses to meet the "requirements". Ex.: I'm playing the cyclone monk. I swaped 2-3 gear pieces, ditched 100-120 AR, 1k life, 10% dodge and switched for the IAS mantra for extra DPS and better use of loh; to compensate the lower defenses. Playstyle was the same.

I'm playing this way because the last time I was killed by the clock I almost quitted, took a ~month break instead. It was very stressful to me. If I was on HC, I would probably quit after my first belial attempt.

The first boss fight was something like:

"- Wanna kill me. Ok. I'll give ya 3 min. "
(Belial waits three minutes)
- Ok, die. "

Edit: ninja'ed by shags.
@Shags: It would take a time under your ruleset, but it's doable imo. The only thing that can make it too hard is the bind on equip part, since you can use the same "very high DPS socketed sword with couple good mods" in almost every char. And they're a hard to find. Making everyone go crit and using the same 5-6 vit/ar/crit/something on every char can cut some serious farming time.

Hell is more doable, but you can have more trouble with wizard/DH, since they tend to work better with specific gear. WD does well with junk gear, Jungle Fortitute, "I don't die" passive I don't remember and Vision Quest, it takes patience (a lot). Barbarian can tank stuff. Monk can be smooth if you pack crit chance/damage rings that drop from time to time, to have 20 crit chance. Btw, crit is very useful to pump dps.

Also, a socketed helm with +vit w/ ruby can make the life a lot easier.

[Shagsbeard]

One thing you forget, Baron, is that under my playstyle, I play five times longer than you do. People who say that I'll not get enough gear are used to playing on a single character, rather than 5 at the same time. It will take me over 5 times as long, but I get 5 times the drops per act than you do. Most people consider time to be the variable to measure progress with. I don't.

[Shagsbeard]

Got my Monk through Act I in much shorter time than expected, leveling from 37 to 40. Almost died once... still gives me the shakes. I love HC play.

[BaronScarpia]

One thing you forget, Baron, is that under my playstyle, I play five times longer than you do. People who say that I'll not get enough gear are used to playing on a single character, rather than 5 at the same time. It will take me over 5 times as long, but I get 5 times the drops per act than you do. Most people consider time to be the variable to measure progress with. I don't.

I kinda didn't actually "played the game", I bought stuff on GAH and hit lvl 60 with each class, SC only, to see how the systems work (something like - what is a "zombie bear" and "how archon works"). Not having go mule and online only are kinda bad, imo. I'm not really sure how the things work drop-wise on NM/Hell for untwinked pass. I played "semi-untwinked" with DH and barbarian (little gold, using self-found gear), but my DH turned out to be "wrong" on inferno.

Ex.: I levelled my wizard fast just because I hate wizards, so I needed to reach lvl 60 using the infamous staircase trick before they limit the number of games created per IP. I mp-ed on public games to finish hell wirh my WD because, while my bears were able to demolish everything, my minions weren't durable enough... Etc. Not really a "playstyle".

I mentioned the blade and blade swap because I don't remember finding one 1h-weapon I liked for hell-inferno (maybe I found 1 monk claw, not sure). Only a couple 2-h stuff and my xbow. I found the rest of the gear pieces, even decent crit stuff, some survival gear for monks, etc. dropping around, even without MF. If you are willing to take your time and savour the game, it works well. It even makes more sense, btw, wait for the skill balancing patch before jumping into hell and inferno, that will result in more late game builds.

Right now I'm going to play d2 for a while, paired with some Monk farming. After the game gets more balanced, I plan to go untwinked again. To do so, I plan to use only items dropped by monsters (I won't use the leveled jeweler/blacksmith) and only one stash row. If I use my gold to buy stuff, it wont be untwinked, so the gold will be used only to repair stuff. The goal will be hit lvl 60 with all the female characters. It's kinda the same thing I did with D2. I played 1.06 and 1.09 to see the game (and I like d3 better, just to mention that) and started playing after LoD 1.10.

And congrats on the monk.

Another word: extra care playing with HC wizard from now on. Wizards kinda like to die easily.

[Shagsbeard]

I'm actually strongly of the opinion that the level 60 game is so poorly designed and tested that I'm going to ignore it for now. I'll probably get to level 60 early in Hell difficulty, rather than waiting until Act IV... I seem to be higher level than most people's reports. So I'll finish hell difficulty, but give inferno a miss. It's not my plan to "finish" this game by other people's value systems, especially when those people seem not to like the path they've chosen.

[Painman]

I'm actually strongly of the opinion that the level 60 game is so poorly designed and tested that I'm going to ignore it for now. I'll probably get to level 60 early in Hell difficulty, rather than waiting until Act IV... I seem to be higher level than most people's reports. So I'll finish hell difficulty, but give inferno a miss. It's not my plan to "finish" this game by other people's value systems, especially when those people seem not to like the path they've chosen.

Probably a good call on Inferno, at least for now. I'm one of the folks who find Norm -> Hell to be pretty well tuned while Inferno is whacked out in comparison. I do mess around with it, but pushing through is a bit like wading through progressively thicker molasses.

Hopefully it'll be much better tuned by the time you get there.

For now, grats on the milestone. Enjoy NM. Starts out pretty easy, but be ready for a noticeable difficulty bump around act 3.