When does life steal outperform LoH?

[Spankalot]

Yeah forget onscreen dps, its more of an indicator of how overly powerful your character is. But if you take your highest weapon damage number and multiply it by your crit damage, str bonus and battle rage / insanity / brawler whatever and record the highest crits for bash / ww / nado, it actually works out as it says on the tooltip however. I have worked it out myself for nado and bash, ww is a bit harder to do. The numbers vary a lot with ww and nado because of their ticking nature, some numbers are not displayed at all, especially if you are attacking real fast etc. Same with archon disintegrate for example.

That's the thing, by nature the tooltips are wrong. If anything each tornado ticks for closer to my charsheet damage per second, but that's just coincidence. For sprint, as long as you have more than 1 tick a second, it will do vastly more than the tooltip damage.

It states 'each one doing 60% weapon damage' but with 6 ticks a second (18 ticks per nado) and each tick doing 20% weapon damage, it is in fact 360% weapon damage per tornado. The same reasoning goes for ww.

Edit: A vid by Moldran comparing the two briefly: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qBCI70iFHo

[aaronbrooks]

It would be about 100k dps by the time you break even using primary attack skills. If you fight multiple targets though life steal will overtake life on hit much earlier.

[lanceuppercut]

Gonna necro this thread a bit as I lost my DH but I still have the remaining gear that her replacement will use as she as I ding 60 but I couldn't find another similar one with LoH (had a low 150ish iirc) for a decent price.

So I ended up picking a xbow with 2.2 LS so it's a trivial amount again (as I use SP/gloom) but is that 2.2 going to be worse than the <150 LoH I has before (in inferno of course)

The only skills I use that cause damage are EF:CF, impale:overpenetration and Vault:ToC (with ShSh), from memory my paper doll dps was around 55-60k with full ShSh but I recall seeing 100k crits from impale and 50k or thereabouts with EF during normal battle without ShSh being maxed and was running with a 1.71 attack speed.

Gah I need to get back my DH to 60 ASAP!

[HardRock]

The formulas look like this:

Life Steal = ( ( Life Steal / 100 ) * ( Difficulty Modifier / 100 ) ) * ( DPS / Attack Speed ) * ( Skill Damage / 100 )
Life on Hit = Life on Hit * Skill Coefficient

With these you'll get your average life leech per target hit with either stats, so you can find out whether Life Steal is better for you.

Blizzard has a table with the Life Steal modifier for the difficulty levels on their official website: http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/game/guid...lty#life-steal

The skill coefficients can be easily seen by equipping some LoH gear (at least 100 LoH is preferable for precision) and then by starting to hit monsters with your chosen skills with the healing numbers enabled in the gameplay options. Divide the displayed heals with the LoH from your gear (visible on the detailed stat screen) and you'll get your skill coefficient.

If a made a mistake, feel free to point it out.

[Karth]

Life on Hit isn't affected by critical hits unless the skill has some special effect on a crit that might cause another 'hit'.

[HardRock]

Are you sure? I've heard that crits increase the heal amount. I guess it's time to actually do some testing.

EDIT: You're right, I updated my previous post.

[lanceuppercut]

Life Steal = ( ( Life Steal / 100 ) * ( Difficulty Modifier / 100 ) ) * ( DPS / Attack Speed ) * ( Skill Damage / 100 )

Can someone check my math assuming the following stats (in Inferno of course, I took ShSh off to get that DPS figure because I wanted a minimum LS value, not an artificial ShSh number, yes I'm aware of the irony right there but ToC likes ShSh!):

LS = 2.2%
DPS = 43714
ASpd = 1.69

( (0.022) * ( 0.8) ) * ( 25866 ) * ( 1.3 ) = 591 per EF:CF hit
( (0.022) * ( 0.8) ) * ( 25866 ) * ( 2.65) = 1206 per(?) Impale:overpenetration hit

Assuming I've not mangled my maths but if those numbers are right then my 2.2% LS weapon easily performs my old 1xx LoH amulet. To clarify my LS/LoH isn't to sustain me like in a barb/DW/frenzy build, rather just wanted to know if I came out on top or not when using LoH/LS to "top up" my health.

[Karth]

That sould be
.022 * .2 * 25866 * 1.3 = 147 per target
and
.022 * .2 * 25866 * 2.65 = 301 per target

Both of which still outperform a 100-200 LoH.

[lanceuppercut]

Cheers!

..I'll always find a way to mangle my maths

[HardRock]

Of course, if you can spam your abilities without a need to move, then calculating your life leech per second per target, instead of per hit is more useful. If you want to do this, then don't divide your DPS by your AS for Life Steal, but multiply the number you get for LoH with it.

Life on Hit isn't affected by critical hits unless the skill has some special effect on a crit that might cause another 'hit'.

For abilities like this, multiply the number you get for your life leech by your crit chance and you're good to go.