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  1. #21
    IncGamers Member Smash's Avatar
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    Re: Summoner and patch 1.03

    Quote Originally Posted by Mad Mantis View Post
    Most developers and other people working in the game industry are really really ****ty gamers from what I've seen. Most aren't up to gaming in the higher difficulty levels. Couple this with a desire to have as many people playing the game as possible and the end result is statements that promise everything but turn out to be false as soon as someone competent plays.
    Well Mantis, you do not need to be great gamer to see that smh is wrong with pets just not be blind.
    It is same problem like it was with Necro at beginning when Skeletons were ****.
    Just no one competent tested it or they knew about issue but had no time to fix.



  2. #22
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    Re: Summoner and patch 1.03

    I don't think they're ever going to make pets able to kill things. They said even before the game was out that the WD itself would be the damage dealer and pets mainly for tanking purposes.

    The only thing they could do with pets is to make them last longer, because at the moment they just go poof in one hit, unless you have ridiculous defense.

    I am still hoping for a real summoner, though.



  3. #23
    D2/3 Necromancer & Witch Doctor Moderator Mad Mantis's Avatar
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    Re: Summoner and patch 1.03

    Quote Originally Posted by Smash View Post
    It is same problem like it was with Necro at beginning when Skeletons were ****.
    How I miss the days of having an obscene amount of minions and only having them kill things because of Thorns.

    Pets being totally useless is something that shouldn't have occurred. They knew what influence their life and they knew the damage that monsters put out starting from Act II Norm. Scaling the pets to not be useless shouldn't have been hard. They managed to do it with the gargantuan.



    Witch Doctor = top half of a Flayer Shaman = cracked-out, grass-wearing, jungle hobo = bobbing clown who vomits leaves a.k.a. Bobo the clowning village idiot. And people thought Necromancers had an image problem.

  4. #24
    IncGamers Member Jary's Avatar
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    Re: Summoner and patch 1.03

    Quote Originally Posted by Mad Mantis View Post
    How I miss the days of having an obscene amount of minions and only having them kill things because of Thorns.

    Pets being totally useless is something that shouldn't have occurred. They knew what influence their life and they knew the damage that monsters put out starting from Act II Norm. Scaling the pets to not be useless shouldn't have been hard. They managed to do it with the gargantuan.

    Yeah, miss my Druid shock-summoner and Hunter builds too XD

    Although, I just beat the game in normal with Zombie Dogs, Gargantuan, splinters, Acid Cloud using Jungle/Magic Medicine/zombie haddler and honestly just rofl-stomped my way through, only died once (I took my time to make sure my gear was desc and did a few runs though too).

    So I'll be starting NM... my question is then, at what point is my build gonna start struggling, aka sucking badly??




  5. #25
    IncGamers Member Chaosmage's Avatar
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    Re: Summoner and patch 1.03

    Weren't the necros skeletons useless in earlier patches as well?

    And quite reasonable, fetishes are still useful they are rarely one-hitted even later inferno and are near invincible in act1.



  6. #26
    IncGamers Member Starving_Poet's Avatar
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    Re: Summoner and patch 1.03

    so I'll be starting NM... my question is then, at what point is my build gonna start struggling, aka sucking badly??
    depends on your gear - if you focus on armor + resist + regen - they're decent to A1 inferno. if you go dps (int + vit) they will become useless around a2/3 nm




  7. #27
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    Re: Summoner and patch 1.03

    im using a hybrid pet / CC / bear build and doing pretty well with my pets, granted it's only in act 1 inferno. Pets enjoy all proc on hit effects from the WD's armor. Im using zombie handler, jungle fort, and gruesome feast. (mana recovery to power bears) It's splinters, bears, soul harvest and our wonderful snare (though with health globe spawning instead of 80% snare). For pets its burning dogs and stinking garg. The proc effects proc off of the pet aura's, so for instance, a bad medicine build with poison dogs results in a lot less procs.

    Anyways... with fear from hat, stun from gloves, freeze form belt, immobilize from boots, and slow from pants all rolling in an aoe around each pet, most mobs get hit by at least one CC effect every few seconds. This works on bosses as well... i have chain CC'd the butcher with it. I basically let my pets engage champ packs and CC a couple of them. I move in and establish soul harvest if its not still up from previous packs and unload my mana bar with bears. This usually spawns a few health globes which replenish mana and heal the pets. Yes... pets die a lot, but the CC seems to keep them alive a lot longer in inferno than any level of armor or stats could. I've been able to keep the same set of dogs through multiple champ packs on occasion.

    I've seen builds that maximize this even further, using spider queen and effects on weapons. My hybrid compromise was working with a high DPS 2 hander and trying to at least power bears..... but im seeing very effective CC out of my pets, and ive been told that it can get even more extreme if the build is advanced to an all-in pet CC form.



  8. #28
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    Re: Summoner and patch 1.03

    I've been using pretty much what ashnar posted, except I was shown Rain of Toads. Each toad has a chance to impair and returns 50% of your life on hit/steal items. In act 3/4 hell and act 1 inferno I've been using Rain of Toads; Vision Quest; the passive where pets get 100% thorns/life regen; fetish syncophants; Horror with 2x armor bonus; burning dogs; big stinker; hex with the +damage run; and spirit walk with jaunt (not sure if I should use jaunt or life regen since it would heal pets).

    Rain of toads has a small AOE, can be cast anywhere on screen, and can follow enemies off screen for a certain distance. Depending on a lot of things, I can hit between 1 and 4 "normal" enemies at a time. Also, since rain of toads is 34 mana, I do require Vision Quest, but I don't have to be perfect and keep all 4 on cooldown like with bears. I can purposefully or accidentally save hex/horror for a few seconds without worrying.

    During continuous fights, I've seen 7 fetishes out.

    I haven't even tried act 2 inferno. But another has.

    This guy showed me rain of toads and the chance to cast build (he used bears sometimes in act2 inferno):
    http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/top...5857?page=4#72

    This is the thread with loads of good info:
    http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/5271499223

    From that thread's first post:
    Quote Originally Posted by 52703345593
    Did an experiment with a 100 life per hit weapon with various skills to see how much benefit each skill gets from the listed value, as a "hit" is a little ambiguous. WIP


    /tick - per tick, or each time the skill does damage for a Damage Over Time spell. The amount of ticks you get for the duration of the skill is dependent on weapon speed.
    /enemy - per enemy, for Area of Effect spells. Each enemy hit by the spell is counted.
    /cast - per cast, generally for multiple projectile spells. This is the total potential the spell can leech assuming every projectile hits something.
    STACKS - This skill will stack with itself for the DOT portion, thus your spells can overlap and you will get tons of hits. Some spells like poison dart poison damage stack with themselves, but the additional ticks don't count as hits for life gain, so this will only work on skills that count /tick.


    Primary Skills:


    Poison Dart - 200%
    Splinters - 33%/dart (100%/cast)
    Numbing Dart - 200%
    Spined Dart - 200%
    Flaming Dart - 100%
    Snake to the Face - 200%


    Corpse Spiders - 16% for each JAR hitting something. Individual spider hits do nothing. Also nothing if you miss with the jar. Unfortunately makes a mediocre spell even crappier... I originally started this because I thought per hit life leech would be great with spiders.
    Leaping Spiders - 16%
    Spider Queen - 30%/enemy/tick
    Widowmakers - 16%
    Medusa Spiders - 16%
    Blazing Spiders -


    Plague of Toads - 66%/toad (200%/cast)
    Explosive Toads - 66%/toad (200%/cast)
    Toad of Hugeness - 0%
    Rain of Toads - 50%/enemy/tick STACKS
    Addling Toads
    Toad Affinity


    Firebomb - 66%/enemy
    Flash Fire - 20%/bounce (140%/cast)
    Roll the Bones - 22%/enemy
    Fire Pit - 66%/enemy/tick STACKS
    Pyrogeist - 33%/projectile (this thing shoots out a lot of little fireballs, I didn't count them)
    Ghost Bomb


    Secondary Skills:


    Grasp of the Dead - 16.5%/enemy/tick
    Unbreakable Grasp - 16.5%/enemy/tick
    Groping Eels - 16.5%/enemy/tick
    Death Is Life - 16.5%/enemy/tick
    Desperate Grasp - 16.5%/enemy/tick (probably stacks, but you only get to overlap once, for 2 seconds)
    Rain of Corpses -


    Firebats - 16.5%/enemy/tick
    Dire Bats - 33%/enemy
    Vampire Bats - 25%/enemy/tick?
    Plague Bats - 33%+? This one is hard to test because I have very little mana. it does increase the longer you apply it.
    Hungry Bats - 33%/bat
    Cloud of Bats


    Haunt - 100% per target hit and none on the DOT. If it acquires another target after the first one dies, it will count as another hit.
    Same for all runes - Not confirmed, but very likely


    Locust Swarm - 33% per target, same as haunt. Each time it spreads it will hit, but no bonus from the DOT.
    Pestilence - 33%
    Devouring Swarm
    Cloud of Insects
    Diseased Swarm
    Searing Locusts - 33%


    Others:


    Zombie Charger - 50%/enemy
    Leperous Zombie - 50%/enemy/tick
    Undeath - 50%/enemy
    Wave of Zombies - 8%/zombie/enemy/hit - I'm not sure, but it seemed like these guys can hit the same enemy more than once
    Explosive Beast - 50%/enemy
    Zombie Bears


    Post by Elegy


    Spirit Barrage - 100%
    Spirit is Willing - 100%
    Well of Souls - 33% per soul (4 total)
    Phantasm - 25% per enemy per tick
    Phlebotomize - 100%
    Manitou


    Fetish Army - 0%
    Fetish Ambush - 40% on cast if it hits a mob (Unsure about this one!)


    Summon Zombie Dogs - 0%
    Rabid Dogs - 100% per enemy per tick of the DoT (With a single ZD attacking an enemy, I noticed a 200% tick right after every attack, which may mean the DoTs were overlapping.) STACKS
    Final Gift - 0%
    Life Link - 0%
    Burning Dogs - 100% per enemy per tick of the AoE aura (STACKS per dog)
    Leeching Beasts -


    Sacrifice - 33% (per enemy? These were tested on single targets.)
    Black Blood - 33% (per enemy?)
    Next of Kin - 33% (per enemy?)
    Pride - 50% (Glitch? per enemy?)
    For the Master - ?? (appears to be glitched and healing me for LESS than it should, should have healed for 3x 3154, but only got back 9260)
    Provoke the Pack


    Gargantuan - 0%
    Humongoid - 0%
    Restless Giant - 0%
    Wrathful Protector - 0%
    Big Stinker - 100% per enemy per tick of the AoE aura
    Bruiser - 0%


    Wall of Corpses - 16% per enemy per tick
    Barricade - 20% per tick
    Unrelenting grip - 16% and 33% per tick
    Creepers - saw 16% and 33% per tick on the wall, the adds provided no ticks.
    Pile on -
    Dead Rush -


    Acid Cloud - Very tricky and needs a lot more testing! I think the Acid Cloud and Acid Rain might be effected by distance from the center. Appears to be 166% near the middle, down to 16% at the edges
    Acid Rain - Most ticks around 280% near middle
    Lob Blob Bomb - Blob ticks around 33% but saw 16% and 50% as well.
    Slow Burn - Ticks of 16%, 33%, and 50%
    Kiss of Death - Ticks of 16%, 33%, and 50%
    Corpse Bomb

    On Sacrifice - I was getting 16% per enemy
    On Acid Rain - These numbers are all over the place, but they are always a multiple of 40% for me, so I'm just gonna say the base is 40% and it ticks A LOT faster than other spells.


    Non Damaging Skills (Soul Harvest, Horrify) - 0%. However, SH runed for damage does get 25% per target up to 5.


    Note on pets - Zombie dogs and gargantuan hits will not give any life. However, flaming zombie dogs aura is 100% per enemy per tick per dog!! I don't have big stinker yet but I imagine it is the same. Potentially huge, but good luck keeping them alive...


    vs Life Leech % - Leech % is pretty straight forward. The more damage skill does, the more you will leech. As you can see, some skills benefit much more than others from life per hit (flaming zombie dogs, flash fire), while others benefit more from leech % (spiders, locust swarm), so which to get really depends on your build and what skills you use.


    Fierce Loyalty - Life on hit does NOT benefit your pets. You will still get the life though


    Other on hit effects - Flaming Zombie Dogs and Big Stinker WILL proc on hit effects (fear, blind, ect) via their aura, but NOT on their attack. This is pretty awesome, if you manage to get some 10% combined stun/fear/freeze and have 5 aura pets surrounding something that isn't immune, it WILL be more or less permastunned.


    Quote Originally Posted by 52348252348
    actually, yes, I think they do. I have a 1.9% fear on hit helmet and rarely proc'd it until I changed builds using this thread. Now I trigger fear TONS of times, it's ridiculous. I'm going to start loading up on x% on hit enchants.


    Last edited by MCPWTB; 18-06-2012 at 18:15.

  9. #29
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    Re: Summoner and patch 1.03

    Here are the two things I saw someone quote and this person's responses, coincidentally my reactions are the same:
    Herald of Pestilence tentacle attack damage has been reduced



    Plagued, Arcane Enchanted, and Electrified monsters no longer have resistance to Poison, Arcane, and Lightning damage (respectively)


    Leaders of Invulnerable Minions packs have had their health pools reduced
    ( ゚ ヮ゚)




  10. #30
    IncGamers Member Starving_Poet's Avatar
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    Re: Summoner and patch 1.03

    1.0.3 Inferno Act 2 Running Hot Dogs and Stinky and they are not useless - they still die rather quick to champs, but so do I.

    Stats -
    950 int
    500 Vit
    5500 Armor
    520 Resist
    900 HP/s

    Pets can tank pretty much any white without a problem - some with the power attacks will still one-hit the puppies, but that happened in Act 1 - I don't have much CC left on my gear because I was playing without them for a while, but as I gear up to the point I can tank this damage (totally now possible) I'll start adding CC gear back on for my minions.




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