It's the generator dominance over spenders. I dont really mind having to cast gen 10 times to use one spender but i would like it to be meaningful .
with two attacks per second (thats how much i had in beta) - 3 per generator and 4/s - means i generate 10hate per second if continously shooting.
If i shot bolta 10x it gives 1100%-1560% aoe damage ( i belive the lowest number will be most used as it doubles the aoe size). Generated during this time 50 hatered will let me fire one cluster arrow that does damage in similar area - runed 300%+100% granades - as the granades are random i would assume 330% reliable aoe damage
1100% from generator and 330% from spender... Thats not exciting spender - not at all!
its even worse for single target where hungering arrow is expected to do av 230% per shot ...
I know that you can get +3hate/s from bat (i would rather not use it) , DH get +hate/s on geear and at higher diff you will need more kiting so damage distribution will shift but im still worried.
EDIT: overally worried - that spenders will be underperforming, that without working your gen/s having spender among your skills will be a waste and will end up with hungering &bolta as dps abilities and rest being survival/ utility ones.
Yea but you are comparing 10 attacks using Bola Shot to using 1 Cluster Arrow. I just don't see that as a fair comparison. It will be a balancing act between hatred and discipline. I guess the discipline may be overlooked by SC players as surviving is overlooked when shooting for damage.
Yea but you are comparing 10 attacks using Bola Shot to 1 email@example.com using Cluster Arrow. I just don't see that as a fair comparison. It will be a balancing act between hatred and discipline. I guess the discipline may be overlooked by SC players as surviving is overlooked when shooting for damage.
its fair as its based on time and amount of gen shots needed to generate that 50 hatered. Obviously its case when you dont need to run away so you can say its "worst case", on the other hand however the faster attack speed you get the more spenders will be discriminated.
Originally Posted by DoxieVon
Rapid fire does INSANE single target DPS, and was arguably the strongest single target spender of any calss in the beta.
when measuring its dps take into account time needed to generate that hatered - for me it was 6s channel time and 12s+ to generate hatered back.
with two attacks per second it costs 20 hatered per second , 16 after generation . That makes 5 normal attacks. Hungering arrow 5 attacks make 1150% - highest RF you can get is 276% -> 552% (Asuming the granades will explode on impact if they have arm time then that rune is useless).
so its 1150% + 552% , the faster your attack is the worse the ratio is gonna get.
Personally? i found impale +stun rune better for boss as i can interrupt leoric abilities and this let me outperform the more damage that rapid fire gives.
Well, let's confirm the baseline assumptions here. If you don't take a hatred spender at all, then your damage will be worse. It doesn't matter if Hungering Arrow or Bola Shot would have done more damage over time while generating hatred for the attack, you still have to spend the hatred to garner any benefit from it (except for Hot Pursuit, which is a cool Passive, I'll admit) and to make the comparison meaningful. Cluster Arrow may not do enough extra damage to you, but it does do more than Bola Shot when you are using it. I felt it needed to be stated.
If you took two generators, Preparation, and three Discipline spenders, then I wouldn't call you a loony person, but it's hardly the only way to play. Having some extra damage to burst out is good. My spenders don't need to be my big damage workhorses for them to find places in my toolset. And if I take Grenadier, then the math works out a little better.
Etezo I wouldn´t be worried. Many of the spenders have a lot more utility(slow, stun and fear ect.) and higher dmg as well(mostly). I.e. impale can be used to stun(impact) or if you want pure dmg then use chemical burn or grievous wound which will actually do a huge amount of dmg:
250%*(1+50% base crit + 100%)=625% wd on critical hits.
However I do agree that bolashot seems pretty OP compared to some of the spenders (just like HA) especially acid strike which deals 390% wd which is pretty crazy for a generator hehe :d
250%*(1+50% base crit + 100%)=625% wd on critical hits.
Remember that that's base crit and that you can get crit damage on Jewellery. The other night I managed to get 214% crit damage in the Hero Builder just from gear, and I think I could have gotten it higher. Add your Passives etc. onto that and the numbers become... large.
wwe are looking at 10-20% more damage for using generator spam then spender over just generator spam. IS that really worth the skill slot?
We get 12% bonus from mark fo death for example and i belive its all source so lovely for group.
Looking at things honestly you need hungering arrow and bolta or your dps in given field is gonna suffer. Now you want spender you need to take out another 2 slots for 1 single target 1 aoe spender. thats leave you with just 2 slots for survival and utility - games gonna be v hard with such choices. Most is gonna skip single target spender or generator - for spender its fine for generator not so much .
Yes spenders got some special effects like fan of knives - this one is nice but on the other hand is more of defensive ability then spender.
Finally if DH would have a 15% more damage passive when full hate like barb rather then movement speed it would be a baibai spenders option...
You are forgetting about the ability to stock up on Hatred between fights. When you spot a new group of enemies, there's this initial phase where you have a full tank of Hatred and they haven't got close to you yet. Spenders are good for doing as much damage as possible in this crucial early phase.
More generally, you're supposed to use big spenders tactically, when they matter the most - even the most expensive ones can be fired with less than half a tank of Hatred, so you have some flexibility in firing them. Cluster Arrow is designed as a burst attack, not a steady source of DPS. If you want to be able to just stand there dealing steady damage and don't care when you do the damage, go for a cheaper spender.