Without AR, how do we overcome dodge and block in PvP? der=0>

[machinus]

Does this game have a hidden AR? Even with a dodge cap and PvP reduction, this means that dodge and block abilities do not have any interaction with offensive attributes - they are just like PDR. This doesn't seem balanced. Therefore, there should be some mlvl or olvl dependence of dodge and blocking percentages, right?

[Mag]

A similar situation was in D2, and dodge / block did not seem to me to be imbalanced.
A high percentage of dodging will mean that your character will cause less damage, or will have had other deficiencies in the statistics / skills.

[galzohar]

There is no miss and thus no chance to hit stat. Every damage reduction you obtain reduces damage period. It sort of makes sense that way, doesn't it?

Block % doesn't change with level, but higher level shields block more actual damage, making low-level shields useless at high levels regardless of their blocking chance.

Dodge % from dex is fixed for all levels, but I doubt it'll stay like that, as it makes dodge pretty useless at low levels and only sort of balanced (with a bit of an advantage for dex over other stats so a bit more defense for DHs/Monks who will have lots of it) at level 60. Dodge from dex is probably the only thing that needs to be level-dependent but instead uses a pretty stupid formula.

Stuff like armor and resistance definitely need to depend on opponent's level, because you get more and more as you level, and if they didn't scale the damage reduction would have either sucked at low levels or would reach silly numbers at high levels.

[machinus]

A similar situation was in D2, and dodge / block did not seem to me to be imbalanced.
A high percentage of dodging will mean that your character will cause less damage, or will have had other deficiencies in the statistics / skills.

Blocking and dodge both had DR dependence.

[Karpalo]

Maybe there are workarounds. For example i think frost nova could be one. Set up a burst and do your thing.

[jokewood]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like d2's blocking was much more powerful than d3's will be. It had both a higher chance and completely negated damage instead of just reducing it (making it really more like dodge in d3 than blocking in d3). Also, as far as I'm aware, there was no stat for getting past one's opponent's blocks; AR only increased one's hit chance with respect to their opponent's armor rating.

So, what makes d3's block problematic for pvp if d2's wasn't?

[Karth]

Blocking and dodge both had DR dependence.

Could you explain what you mean a bit better?

[Such Violent Storms]

Could you explain what you mean a bit better?

Sorceress with 75% block vs. Paladin with 75% block and holy shield

Defense/AR, block, and dodge were hurdles in D2. In D3, shields can only block x amount of damage, so no longer does blocking a melee attack mean 0 damage.

Dodge still means 0 damage when you dodge something, but unlike D2 all classes have access to dodge, so even though hitting a Monk may be hard, you'll dodge a little too. And the upper dodge ranges, even for a Monk, seems to not be too bad. Nothing over 60% for the most part.

[Karth]

But neither of them were DR dependent in D2? The statement still doesn't make any sense to me.

[galzohar]

Most of this discussion indeed makes little sense. There will be damage reduction that you can't circumvent except by attacking more and/or for more damage. Hopefully it will be balanced and reasonable, or else PvP will be broken. End of story?