Regarding "dumbed down" and "lack of customization".

[mrpinsky]

Listen, if you feel like it makes it a more fun game to have to re-level a character whenever you want to change your skills, you are absolutely free to do so. If you use the "no, its only fun when the game forces me to" excuse, then you're just making up stuff because you feel like complaining..

So you are one of those who want to have Hardcore mode removed, then, right? After all, they can just delete their character whenever they die. Problem solved. Right...?

[FireIceTalon]

I agree, and I've been saying it repeatedly: There is absolutely zero character development left in D3. You can be everything at all times, there is nothing special about your character as opposed to others.

Completely disagree. You will find no two players in the end game with the same exact build (meaning the same 6 active and 3 passive skills and skill runes)...There is plenty of char development, its just done with items now rather than skills.

[droppin]

Idk, maybe it's something I've grown out of. I used to be almost rper in rpg games and had a strong connection with my characters. I still do sometimes and yes in D3 it feels slightly foreign, but there's still a connection to be had. You have to make that connection even if it doesn't feel like it.

Lately my rp has been more of a meta game with myself than connectiong to rp characters. Take Left for Dead 2 as an example. You are in control of a character, but you know how extremely limited that rp can get when all your character does it catch phrases and whanot. What I do is put myself into the game instead of the game creating a character for me.

I would suggest you guys not focus on creating a sperate identity and just put yourself into games. I did that for the beta and it felt really good. Just like if I was doing the whole attribute super connection stuff.

[beingmused]

So you are one of those who want to have Hardcore mode removed, then, right? After all, they can just delete their character whenever they die. Problem solved. Right...?

Surviving in hardcore offers proof to others that you have survived. To get to high levels in hardcore is an accomplishment.

Having an inflexible build in softcore proves to people....that you have picked skills? So the hell what? That's not an accomplishment.

[FireIceTalon]

The skill issue is all fine...how about beating last two difficulties? A fair estimate is that you will reach lvl 60 by the end of the second difficulty level...how the heck are we gonna beat inferno?And...is the entire game as linear as the beta? I hope not. Felt bottlenecked.

You will NOT be lvl 60 by the end of Nightmare.....not until the end of Hell difficulty. Estimated char lvl at the end of Nightmare is between 45-50.

[Raesene]

You act as if *how* you play the game isn't special or important at all, when that is the most important thing. I have no idea what you think makes a character "special", if how you play and what you do with your character doesn't distinguish you.

I agree. I don't really understand this "everyone's character is the same" argument. The major defining factor for any character is the player sitting behind the keyboard.

When I played my enhancement shaman in WoW, I definitely felt an identity with that character because I was ****ing awesome. I was not a cog that could be replaced by any other shaman, even though they had access to the exact same talents and skills that I did. This is in a game that has effectively zero customization because for any role there was only 1-3 valid ways to spec.

[droppin]

What Raesene said. Put yourself into games, don't pretend to be someone else :P. Game is what you make it.

[mrpinsky]

There is plenty of char development, its just done with items now rather than skills.

Is it so hard to see that there is a difference between who you are and what you wear?

[FireIceTalon]

Char development in terms of skill will progress too as you face tougher foes in each difficulty, and as you progress from difficulty to difficulty. As the monsters get tougher, you will have to play smarter and use your skills more wisely. Normal will start out easy, as you can just pretty much pure brute force at the start to take down your enemies. But as you progress into Nightmare, you will start having to use brains as well as brawn - and the former will become more important in each difficulty I bet.

I would guess that Inferno difficulty will be similar to Hell Difficulty on Diablo 1, if not harder. On Diablo 1, even a skilled, fully geared lvl 50 char died from time to time in hell on Hell mode. As most people know, Diablo 1 was much harder on hell difficulty than Diablo 2 was, for anyone who has played both.

[Silverbanshee]

The way I see it is that there is a scale from "most experimentation, least permanency" to "least experimentation, most permanency". Basically, D2 was way all the way at "most permanency", while D3 is the exact opposite, i.e. "most experimentation". Both have advantages and disadvantages, obviously, but it is quite clear that experimentation appeals to a more casual, arcade gamer crowd, while "permanency" appeals to dedicated RPG players who value shaping their own character and replayability.

I just don't understand why Blizzard didn't go for something in between.

The way I see it, the "most experimentation" spectrum includes "most permanency", but it shifts the burden of ensuring that permanency to the player - the RPG portion of the game - if you will.

I also disagree that the experimenters are a casual crowd. wander through the Theorycrafting form for a bit - these are the hard core people looking for ways top optimize builds in general, or a particular flavor of build to fit their RPG ideal for a character or class.

personally, I'll take the customizability offered by D3 as a way to generate replayability and challenge over things like " naked sorc runs" to generate the spark of challenge needed in D2 after 10 years.

The point for me is that Diablo 3 gives me freedom to choose my character, and the responsibility to make those choices meaningful for myself. To me, that is role playing and makes my character special because I made all the choices that got him there. I define the character and will continue to define and evolve that character as new challenges/difficulties arise.