DoT and Pet Scaling

[Neinball]

First off, all thanks go to Valkemen and his friend Astehnir for testing out this info.

Over on the monk boards the community was compiling info on the undocumented patch changes and we came across something weird. The DoT component of Exploding Palm was showing different figures then the talent calculator as well as different figures for different people. Upon some testing done by Valkemen and Astehnir they found that the DoT was scaling with weapon speed, the faster the weapon the more damage the DoT did.

Testing has found that the formula is relatively simple:

Weapon Dmg % x Weapon APS* = Actual Damage.

*Dual wielding gives the main hand weapon a bonus of 15% APS.

Example:

The Exploding Palm DoT does a base 65% weapon dmg per second, if a monk is using a 1.2 APS weapon the DoT will now deal 78% (65 x 1.2=78) wpn dmg per second. A dual wielding monk with a 1.2 APS main hand weapon will deal 89.7% (65 x (1.2 x 1.15)=89.7) wpn dmg per second.

After this was discovered for the Monks we decided to test out the only other class with a DoT within the beta, the WD and some strange things were discovered.

As excepted Firebats scales it's damage in the same exact way, it was 100% wpn dmg x APS = actual dmg per second. Surprisingly, the DoT component of Poison Dart did not scale at all with APS. Not being satisified with such a small sampling of abilities Valkeman and Astehnir decided to load up an emulator and check other abilities that may have scaled in a similar fashion.

They found the following abilities all scale their damage on APS in the same exact way:

Acid Cloud
Locust Swarm
Haunt
Grasp of the dead
Gargantuan
Fetish army

With this it would seem that certain pets also scale their damage on the APS of the caster. There are many other abilities/pets/summons from other classes that need to be tested out either in an emulator or the beta (Call of the Ancients, Companion, Sentry, etc) and many, many rune effects that will need to be tested once the game goes live.

Also not being in the beta I can't test it but would like to know if anyone has any experience with DoTs critting.

Summary:

DoT and Pet Damage Formula:

Single Weapon (1h or 2h)
Base Weapon Damage % x Weapon APS = Final Damage Total

Dual Wielding
Base Weapon Damage % x (Main Hand Weapon APS x 1.15) = Final Damage Total

[Grayson Carlyle]

Might this apply to all attacks with a static attack rate? Channeled DoTs as well; Disintegrate, Ray of Frost, etc...?

[Neinball]

I'd be willing to say yes given how it interacts with Firebats. I don't have a beta account so I can't say for certain.

[Astehnir]

Maybe I'll throw up some numbers for you to do the math. ;]

WIZARD

Disintegrate
APS DPS
1,02 138%
1,30 176%
1,39 188%
1,44 195%
1,50 203%

Explosive Blast
APS Damage
1,02 168%
1,30 214%
1,39 230%
1,44 238%
1,50 247%

Ray of Frost
APS DPS
1,02 275%
1,30 351%
1,39 376%
1,44 389%
1,50 405%

Arcane Torrent
APS DPS
1,02 204%
1,30 260%
1,39 278%
1,44 288%
1,50 300%

Ice Armor (!)
APS WD reflect/hit
1,02 10%
1,30 13%
1,39 14%
1,44 14%
1,50 15%

Familiar
APS Damage
1,02 15%
1,30 20%
1,39 21%
1,44 22%
1,50 22%
1,53 23%


DEMON HUNTER

Rain of Vengeance
APS DPS
1,34 178%
1,40 186%
1,43 190%
1,60 213%
1,84 245%

Companion
APS Damage
1,34 40%
1,40 42%
1,43 43%
1,60 48%
1,84 55%

All precentages here are the precentage of your weapon damage. Barbarian doesn't have any skills that scale with APS, Demon Hunter has only two. I'll leave the values of each monk skill to Valkemen, as it's his "guinea pig" to test on. :>

Cya around.

[Karpalo]

Maybe I'll throw up some numbers for you to do the math. ;]

WIZARD

Disintegrate
APS DPS
1,02 138%
1,30 176%
1,39 188%
1,44 195%
1,50 203%

Explosive Blast
APS Damage
1,02 168%
1,30 214%
1,39 230%
1,44 238%
1,50 247%

Ray of Frost
APS DPS
1,02 275%
1,30 351%
1,39 376%
1,44 389%
1,50 405%

Arcane Torrent
APS DPS
1,02 204%
1,30 260%
1,39 278%
1,44 288%
1,50 300%

Ice Armor (!)
APS WD reflect/hit
1,02 10%
1,30 13%
1,39 14%
1,44 14%
1,50 15%

Familiar
APS Damage
1,02 15%
1,30 20%
1,39 21%
1,44 22%
1,50 22%
1,53 23%


DEMON HUNTER

Rain of Vengeance
APS DPS
1,34 178%
1,40 186%
1,43 190%
1,60 213%
1,84 245%

Companion
APS Damage
1,34 40%
1,40 42%
1,43 43%
1,60 48%
1,84 55%

All precentages here are the precentage of your weapon damage. Barbarian doesn't have any skills that scale with APS, Demon Hunter has only two. I'll leave the values of each monk skill to Valkemen, as it's his "guinea pig" to test on. :>

Cya around.

Seems to be perfectly in line with that cycle system. Faster attack speed burns resources faster which leads into higher dps. If we want to compare which is actually better fast or slow APS it will get pretty complicated and it would hugely depend on the fight duration as well. Overall it would still look like that in ideal tank and spank scenario fast APS would lead into higher DPS overall.

[Neinball]

Seems to be perfectly in line with that cycle system. Faster attack speed burns resources faster which leads into higher dps. If we want to compare which is actually better fast or slow APS it will get pretty complicated and it would hugely depend on the fight duration as well. Overall it would still look like that in ideal tank and spank scenario fast APS would lead into higher DPS overall.

Higher APS will also scale very well for channeled skills in movement heavy fights, which I'm going to guess will be most boss fights (at least until we figure it out and gear appropriately to just stand there and take it.) That's one of the trickier things that is very difficult to model accurately.

[Superstate]

That's one of the trickier things that is very difficult to model accurately.

It isn't that difficult really, you'll want a faster burn rate than appears to be the best solution on paper (in terms of ap efficiency relative to damage). The faster you can spend your ap, the more efficient you become in these scenarios where avoiding stuff is paramount.

As for the modeling of it, I come from a spreadsheet perspective and all you need is breaks and intervals of breaks to simulate moving, and by letting the user edit the breaks/intervals themselves a consensus can be drawn for that particular build / weapon speed etc. For the sake of completion, it could easily be macroable to determine varying degrees of % time spent running for the same build. For example, if the user currently has 50% time spent running, the macro will determine the same value for for example 10% and 90% spent running in order to determine how effective it is in very varying degrees of downtime.

[Karpalo]

It isn't that difficult really, you'll want a faster burn rate than appears to be the best solution on paper (in terms of ap efficiency relative to damage). The faster you can spend your ap, the more efficient you become in these scenarios where avoiding stuff is paramount.

I disagree. It would hugely depend on the "profile" of the fight. Faster weapons makes resource overflowing less likely, but at the same time it makes resource starvation more likely. It would boil down to the fight when the question is which one is the more optimal choice.

If you know you have to move to avoid stuff then ideal situation is that you use that time to passively regen resources back, but this doesn't happen if your resources are capped to begin with. On the other hand when you get change to go balls deep damage out you wouldn't want to run into situation where your resource bar is depleted and you will be forced to use generators to get it back.

[Valkemen]

Two monk's skills work with APS - Exploding Palm and Lethal Decoy

numbers for Lethal Decoy

no wpn = 1 APS = 110%
1h wpn 1,40 APS = 154%
dual wpn 1,40 APS +15% bonus = 1,6 APS = 177%

[snurrfint]

To sum it up then.

DMG of DOTs, channeling and cool-down skills (Basically all skills where attack speed normally doesn't help you.) are calculated based on Weapon DPS.

DMG of skills without cool-down are calculated based on weapon dmg. Attacks speed based on weapon APS.

This is pretty good but they should change the skill tool-tips. Instead of "140% weapon dmg per second" use "140% weapon DPS per second". Although, that sounds pretty ridiculous.