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  1. #31
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    Re: no more attributes

    Quote Originally Posted by konfeta View Post
    They are shutting doors that have been proven to be a nightmare to balance, and are adding ones that are easier to maintain. Now, I would rather that they figured out a way to fix the doors, but given the choice I understand the developers' concern.

    Besides, until we see what other doors have been open, we don't know how "limited" our characters are.




    Str for equip.
    Dex for equip.
    Energy base if you are twinked, or points until you find mana leach.
    Rest in vit.

    I am honestly not seeing how stats were "huge." Never felt that way, probably never will (in terms of Diablo 2).
    what was a nightmare to balance? And why do we need "balance"? Not like this is a PvP game. Sure balance is important, but I don't see what this is "fixing".



  2. #32
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    Re: no more attributes

    I made characters, played with them, and had fun with them long before I even knew what that "Battle.net" button was or that guides existed for the game. During that period stats were always secondary, an annoying limitation telling me what I could use and when.

    I stand by my point. Stats were an illusion of choice. I didn't feel "creative" when I saw an item my character wanted to use and started pumping points to equip it.
    Thanks for showing us you only played post 1.10 hammerdins, there are many many other possibilities people played for fun. Completely removing them because they are unable to balance items is a cheap way to go around it and as it stands now, I won't be wasting money on the game.
    Thanks for showing me that you know exactly how Diablo 3 will play (or what characters I used in D2) and how lacking in "customization" its characters will be. Would you mind me hiring you as a psychic?




  3. #33
    IncGamers Member GoHabsGo's Avatar
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    Re: no more attributes

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Cosby View Post
    well then you werent creative at all. you didnt have any fun with the game at all. you made cookie cutters and thats it, and even if you made an out there char, and still did +to str + to dex to wear, then all the rest vit, you cant venture out and try to do that anymore.

    Games like final fantasy wouldnt implement this because it would be weird because they NEVER had it. D1 had A version of it, d2 had a full version of it, now d3 has none. thats a lil different

    if you never feel that way doesnt mean others do konfeta.
    Of course you can judge if people had ''fun'' with a game or not.



  4. #34
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    Re: no more attributes

    Quote Originally Posted by Kiley View Post
    What this guy said...
    That was pretty epic how you squeezed so many baseless assumptions into one post.

    Personally for me, it was skill combinations and not attributes that diversified my characters. All I see this doing is pushing stat allocation onto items, therefore you choose what stats you want by what items you wear (which, of course will be restricted to what you can trade/find). If you want that best in slot ancient armour for your wizard, you may have to sacrifice those killer boots for something which boost your stats sufficiently (as well as being awesome ^^=); not forgetting also -% reduced requirements. The only real requirement is that the stats used to restrict gear access must be relevant for your character. It makes no sense to force a Witch doctor to stack some strength on his items if it didn't do something else meaningful for him, for example, allowing his pets inherit his stats.

    The benefits seem pretty clear with auto-stat allocation. Take for example Duriel, for hardcore characters that don't boost Vita early expect to be flattened by the slug. Even that has a limiting aspect in the fact that you then won't have the strength or dex to have the most current/protective gear available. Forcing players to do a bit of overleveling in most cases, to be certain to avoid death. I'd expect encounters to be much more evenly balanced than this. As I mentioned before item choices get an extra layer of meaning too.

    I can see why this would worry players from a d2 perspective, but as stated already in this thread, we can't make presumptions based on d2's item system yet. Until we get a better idea of how Blizzard intends to balance item availability, which we've had no information on yet.



  5. #35
    D2/3 Necromancer & Witch Doctor Moderator Mad Mantis's Avatar
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    Re: no more attributes

    So instead of going the other way and making the stats a much more interesting piece of gameplay, they decide to just axe them. Seriously, why even bother putting them in? Since I can't decide myself how I want to distribute the stats why should I be concerned about how high they are?

    This is the first really moronic move I've seen from the D3 team. In their zeal for keeping things "fast paced" they are forgetting that character customization is one of the few things that keeps people interested in the game. Not the mindless slaughter of monsters. More customization is better. Don't try to "streamline" is, make it something more interesting.




  6. #36
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    Re: no more attributes

    Dont like it, what if people want melee casters? of all the positive changes to the game, this one sucks.



  7. #37
    IncGamers Member visom's Avatar
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    Re: no more attributes

    Quote Originally Posted by Omikron8 View Post
    this change was beyond stupid

    instead of giving worthwhile secondary bonuses to stats such as spell damage for intelligence/energy (look at titan quest) they just remove stat customization entirely
    What is this "customization" you speak of? In D2 even though you can put your attributes in whatever you want, no serious player actually does that. It's always str/dex for items, little to no energy, and rest on vitality. Either way it'll boil down to all classes having the same stat build.

    Quote Originally Posted by Omikron8 View Post
    so essentially now

    1) Diablo 3 is more like WoW gameplay

    2) Diablo 3 is even more item focused than diablo 2
    Isn't D2 already item focused? A level 50 with godly items will have a decent chance of beating a level 99 with crap to decent items, that's already too much item based to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Omikron8 View Post
    3) Non-caster builds for casters/summoners won't exist because your str/dex/vit/life/whatever will be crap

    you want to have a melee witch doctor or wizard ? not going to happen now
    Well isn't the point of being a caster/summoner is to have low defense but greatly make up for it with their supportive skills and powerful spells? If you have a caster that can wear the same armor, you'll basically have a caster that can tank pretty well which eliminates the point of being a ranged attacker and requires absolutely no unique strategies to use.

    Btw why would you want a melee WD/wizard? Too much time to kill?

    Quote Originally Posted by Omikron8 View Post
    of all the things they could have removed or simplified in diablo 3 this was the last thing that came to mind, honestly in all my years of playing i never heard from anyone that all characters of a class should have the same stats

    an ARPG is about customization and with that move right there Jay took away a huge amount of customization
    D3 is still about customization, you can choose character genders, use runes to provide added effects to spells, have gems to change a weapon's abilities.



  8. #38
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    Re: no more attributes

    So instead of going the other way and making the stats a much more interesting piece of gameplay, they decide to just axe them. Seriously, why even bother putting them in? Since I can't decide myself how I want to distribute the stats why should I be concerned about how high they are?
    Because there could be items with +stats? Quests that gives +assignable stats? Elixirs? Etc.?

    Also, why the flying <expletive> do people scream "OMG NO MORE CUSTOMIZATION EVERY CHAR WILL BE THE SAME WTF BLIZZARD" because they changed, not removed, but changed one aspect of how you can do customization?




  9. #39
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    Re: no more attributes

    I don't really care either way but if the removal of player stat allocation makes for better balance and an overall better gameplay experience (could effect monster design as well) then so be it. There seems to be plenty of character customization already with the skill trees and the runes. I can't say I like the idea of Wizards wearing the same armor as barbs anyways.



  10. #40
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    Re: no more attributes

    Quote Originally Posted by Mad Mantis View Post
    So instead of going the other way and making the stats a much more interesting piece of gameplay, they decide to just axe them. Seriously, why even bother putting them in? Since I can't decide myself how I want to distribute the stats why should I be concerned about how high they are?

    This is the first really moronic move I've seen from the D3 team. In their zeal for keeping things "fast paced" they are forgetting that character customization is one of the few things that keeps people interested in the game. Not the mindless slaughter of monsters. More customization is better. Don't try to "streamline" is, make it something more interesting.
    QFT. It still may turn out to be an awesome game, but from what we know now, this is idiotic.

    Quote Originally Posted by konfeta View Post
    Because there could be items with +stats? Quests that gives +assignable stats? Elixirs? Etc.?

    Also, why the flying <expletive> do people scream "OMG NO MORE CUSTOMIZATION EVERY CHAR WILL BE THE SAME WTF BLIZZARD" because they changed, not removed, but changed one aspect of how you can do customization?
    Because you're wrong. Blizzard removed, not changed, but removed one aspect of how we can do customization. We can't customize our base stats anymore. The game does it for us automatically. That's called removal, not change.

    Also: can you explain to me what problem removing base stat customization fixes? because I still don't get it..



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