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  1. #1
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    Discuss & Debate Goldfinding skellynec guide, v1.0.

    Note: this is the first draft, please feel free to add some comments. please try to be constructive.
    cheers
    mephiztophelez.
    - - - -
    After reading many of the "how do i build a goldfinding barb" threads in the barb forums, i thought i'd share my thoughts on a goldfinding necro.

    Why Goldfind?
    well, if you've ever been faced with 1.5million gold repair costs for a runeword armour, the ability to rake in a huge wodge of gold quickly becomes attractive (especially if, like me, you prefer to use your Ral/Ort runes for crafting purposes).

    another path to take in e-wealth creation (beyond countless meph/andy/etc runs) involves Gambling for items. one NPC in each act (to whit: Gheed, Elzix, Alkor, Jamella, Nihlathak or Anya) offers the choice of being able to gamble an item. gambling allows you to select the base-item you wish to gamble and there is always a chance of gambling a Rare or Unique version of that base item. for example, that Coronet you gamble on Ladder might just turn out to be a Griffons Eye. Popular items to gamble are basically any item type for which a rare can be the most "omfgodly" item in it's class. Amulets, Rings, Circlets and assassin claws (blade talons especially) all fit this catagory. Boots and Gloves might also be possible.

    Why a Necro?
    Summon necs are essentially completely gear-independent, meaning pretty much every gear-slot can be devoted to piling on as much +goldfind gear as possible. incidently, most of the nice goldfind gear also packs some significant %MF in with it too.

    Its also a great character to start your D2 playing (or start a new ladder season with). they are gear independent. you can run anywhere you like, naked if you like. so for cheap, cheerful and effective PvM play, it really doesn't get much better than a skelly'nec. you can happily start put with simply gear you find along the way and slowly trade-up (or simply find yourself) some of the better goldfinding kit available.

    not to start a flamewar with the goldfind barb-lovers amongst us, i rekon a necro can clear out the primo goldfind area of Hell Travincal faster than any high GF barb can, meaning we can do more runs in less time, imho: finding more gold and generating more MF boosted drop chances along the way. bottom line is: both a necro and a barb can do goldfinding duties quite happily. i just happen to prefer my neccy to a barb for this purpose.

    so, whats the build?
    It's basically you standard Fishymancer build, kitted out with lots of +% Goldfind gear.

    skills:
    max: raise skeleton, skelly mastery, Corpse explosion.
    One point to all curses, one point to the golem of your choice, golem mastery, bone armour, bone wall and revive.

    you should wind up with a basic army of ~9 skelly's, a Golem and a Merc. this is plenty to be able to kill everything in hell (with the possible exception of those rare monsters with unbreakable physical immunity)

    this leaves a lot of points left over for you to customise your necro to your own tastes. some will choose to max out mages, some will choose to max out revive, some will choose to max out Dim Vision. any of these variations will work just fine.

    one note: some might like to max out Golem Mastery with a view to making either an Insight or Infinity Iron golem. while i havn't done this myself, it can work just spiffingly. however you lose the ability to recast your golem in an advantageous position. if you go down this route, i suggest dopeing up HEAVILY on as much +summoning skills gear as you can get your hands on prior to actually turning that Insight or Infiinity stick into a golem. after summoning your mana/conviction golem, make sure you have no GOlem summons hotkeyed lest you inadvertantly summon some other golem and lose you runeword polearm (ethereal preferably). Also do not be afraid to TP back to town if he's getting low on health. beware of Iron Maiden.

    stats:
    the basic 1.10 stats spend guide is the reccomended one here:
    str & dex: enough for gear
    energy: base
    vit: as much as possible.

    personally, i don't feel i need maxblock on my neccy, if you choose, you may get max-block if you wish.

    gear: we're looking for +% Goldfind first. summon necs are lucky in that they don't need huge amounts of +skills gear to be effective. +skills is nice, +goldfind is better. here are some cheap options to get you started. you can upgrade later, most of my gear has arrived via being gambled.

    helm: a Crown of Theives will get you going with from 80-100% goldfind on it. ideal is some sort of helm with the Of Wealth suffix and two sockets (80% goldfind). this is what I use.

    Amulet: again, look for something with the Of Wealth suffix. if you can get teleport charges AND the Of Wealth suffix on a rare, your golden. in the short term, basically any ammy with res or skills can be used. another option could be a Rising Sun amulet, which turns council Hydra into healing fountains.

    Belt: A goldwrap is the simple solution, with 50-80% goldfind on it. also viable, and potentially better, is a rare with the Of Wealth suffix and useful other mods.

    rings: #1 choice is Dwarfstars!!! 100% goldfind each and some handy Fire absorb which takes the sting out of council Hydra's. rare/magic rings can get from 25-40% goldfind and potentially come with other nice mods. however, dwarfstars are cheap.

    weapon: a Blade of Ali Baba with 2x Lem runes in the sockets is pretty hard to go past, it also gives some nice MF boost. it's a lot cheaper than a 6-Lem crystal sword which is the other (much more expensive) option.

    Armour: Wealth (Lem + Ko + Tir) gives us a mighty 300% extra gold! make it in a low-reqs armour is the preffered choice. if you can't scrape this up, just go with whatever armour you can find until you can afford to make it, a 4 p-topaz Dusk Shroud is perfectly serviceable (and very cheap).

    shield: i use a Lem'd Homonculus myself, the stats on it are pretty hard to go past. Rhyme (Shael + Eth) in a nice neccy head could also serve well. i do NOT reccomend things like 4x Lem monarchs (more on these and 6 x Lem swords later).

    Gloves: Chanceguards are the pick of the bunch, 200% goldfind, yes please. they also pack some incidental %MF. Rare gloves can only get up to 80% goldfind, but if you have those and don't have chancies, go for it.

    boots: Infernostride uniques are nice, coming with from 40-70% goldfind and 20 FRW. they also have +10% max fire res which can be great OF you have the overall resists to take advantage of it. Rares can get up to 80% goldfind and are potentially the best boots you can get for this purpose. if you have neither, look for FRW and resists.

    switch weapon/shield: if you lack teleport charges from anywhere else (circlet/amulet), a staff with tele charges should go here (Naj Puzzler set staff is easy to get and has tele charges). a CtA is nice if you have a spare one, but is totally superfluous. if you use a CtA, pair it with a Sigons Shield, Lidless Wall or Splendor shield for an extra +1 to Battle Orders (you shouldn't have the 156 strength needed for a spirit)

    charms:
    we can get up to 40% goldfind on Grand Charms, 10% on Small Charms and 22% on Large Charms. hopefully these charms will have a useful prefix like: +summon skills (GC's), or +resistances (any size). A Gheeds unique grand charm can get up from 80-160% goldfind and should be high on our wish-list. if you can get a necro torch cheaply enough, by all means use it, it doesn't need to be perfect by any stretch of the imagination (mine is 10/11 from memory). if your rich and have a spare anni, go wild.

    How much %Goldfind is "enough"?
    or
    Why not 6x Lem Swords and 4x Lem shields?

    the main advantage of this build is that it's CHEAP. personally, i don't see the point in spending up big on a character that's supposed to generate e-wealth. my build has a total of 6x Lem in it (2 in helm, one in armour, 2 in weapon, 1 in shield). Another reason is the nature of how +%goldfind works.

    lets say a monster drops a base of 100 gold. if I have 2000% goldfind, thats suddenly 2100 gold falling out of it. if i have 2500% goldfind, thats 2600 gold falling out of it. an extra 500% goldfind starts to not look so good when we already have oodles of it.

    as a "nice-round-number", shoot for somewhere in the realm of ~1500% goldfind, at this point you can start looking for extra survival mods.

    thoughts on resistances, %DR and survival mods:
    there have been numerous credible accounts of summon necro's soloing their way to Guardian status, naked. between our meat-shield of skeletons and judicious use of various curses (Amp, Attract and Dim Vision being the main ones) we should be pretty safe with even very low resists. that said, if you can get your resists positive, thats always nice. given that the most profligate droppers of gold are Hydra casting Council Members (as found in Travincal, on Durance 3 by Meph and Wave 3 of Baals minons), having at least positive Fire resists should be a priority. Champion monsters (of any type) can drop similar quantities of gold to council members, but they don't always spawn in the same place.

    in short, get some res if possible, if they are all negative it merely requires you to be a little more careful in your gameplay. the longer you play this build, the more likely you are to happen across nice goldfind gear that also includes resists.

    Your Mercenary:
    love thy merc. he does most of the initial corpse providing, giving you ammunition to start up a Corpse Explosion chain reaction that clears out areas in very short order.

    I suggest an Act 2 NM Might mercenary. for gear we want him to have some life-leech (to stay alive), a hard hitting weapon (to kill things) and the Cannot Be Frozen mod (so he doesn't slow down from cold damage). if you can swing some iDR/mDR or %DR for him, so much the better. there's no need to dope him up on Goldfind gear, seeing as he doesn't really do a lot of the killing beyond the first couple of corpses.

    the only thing i really advise against here is Cold Damage. Cold Damage should be avoided if possible as it shatters the occasional corpse, denying you ammunition for your Corpse Explosion. some people don't mind a little cold damage on their skelly'necs merc, personally i hate it.

    here are some suggestions for gear:
    helm: Tal Hat, Crown of Theives (it has life leech on it), Andy's Face (if your rich) or some rare with life leech.
    armour: Duriels Shell or Gladiators Bane both provide the CBF mod. G-Bane also comes with some nice iDR/mDR turning your merc into a tank.
    weapon: an e-Insight elite polearm is my choice, but basically any hard hitting weapon will suffice here. if your making a habit of Boss-Walking with your neccy, then perhaps you might like to keep some kind of Crushing Blow weapon handy for him (an e-obedience would be super and i'd use one all the time if not for the cursed cold damage).

    playstyle:
    there is nowhere in Hell mode this character cannot go safely. but here are some tips.
    Dim Vision: this curse shuts down ranged attackers a treat (especially Slingers by Shenk and Souls in the Worldstone Keep)
    Attract: causes other monsters to attack the one tagged with the curse, very useful little spell and one i encourage you to practice with.
    Amp Damage: Corpse Explosion is 1/2 physical and 1/2 fire damage, so Amp boosts our CE damage nicely. It also boots the overall damage output of our army and our merc, giving us that first corpse quicker, meaning we get the CE howitzer working sooner, meaning we clear out a given area faster. good stuff, use liberally.
    Decrepify: if your off to wallop Baal, i suggest a point here. tagging Baal with decrep stops him from teleporting all over the place and also stops him from summoning his double. nice.
    Lifetap: can be useful to occasionally tag Mephisto with this curse to help keep your Merc alive.

    the Pindlegarden:
    once you rescue Anya, she opens a portal to Nihlathak's temple. the area outside the temple is littered with corpses when you first enter. after a few seconds, they wake up and start caning on you. a little secret is that you can summon a skeleton out of these corpses BEFORE they wake up, meaning a quick visit to the pindlegarden is where i choose to start my runs. once i've cleared that out, it only makes sense to wallop Pindleskin (who can drop almost any item in the game) while your there. in order to keep this portal open in games created by your necro, DO NOT tag the Halls of Pain Waypoint. you're welcome to go thump Nihlathak if you like, but killing Nihl AND tagging the waypoint causes the portal to close. not good.

    Areas to Run:
    my basic run is Pindle/Eldritch/Shenk/Travincal. i've also been known to walk through Durance 2 to Mephisto (picking up a tidy amount of gold along the way), The Pits in act 1 and clearing out the River of Flame. a walkthrough of the WSK is also very profitable. this is the secret to making this build work for you. it's not a boss-runner, its an AREA clearer. it's not a mad 105fcr tele to Meph/andy, rinse & repeat type of character to play. its more of a sedate pace, killing everything and picking up oodles of gold while you're about it.

    FHR/FCR/IAS etc:
    no need to worry overly about any of these stats in my opinion. some extra FCR is nice for throwing Curses about, some FHR is nice if you get hit, but overall, surplus to requirements imho.




  2. #2
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    Re: Goldfinding skellynec guide, v1.0.

    Very nice, I was about to post something about gf nec and i saw ur post lol!

    Anyway, so your saying barb and nec gf are both perfectly fine? So no "which is better" thing?

    Which is faster btw?



  3. #3
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    Re: Goldfinding skellynec guide, v1.0.

    I would imagine a nec is faster because of CE. Do a couple CE's and everything on screen is dead.



  4. #4
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    Re: Goldfinding skellynec guide, v1.0.

    but its only trav right? if its only trav, then council are hard to kill and it doesnt make a huge difference.

    Some people have gfed with gf barb and they say its totally fine



  5. #5
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    Re: Goldfinding skellynec guide, v1.0.

    according to his post it isn't only trav, he lists 5 places and some of those are area clears.



  6. #6
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    Re: Goldfinding skellynec guide, v1.0.

    Quote Originally Posted by iLoveSoccer View Post
    Anyway, so your saying barb and nec gf are both perfectly fine? So no "which is better" thing?
    personally, i think a nec is better (and much cheaper to outfit). however, barbs can certainly get the job done. i'm not going to argue on that score.

    Quote Originally Posted by iLoveSoccer View Post
    Which is faster btw?
    a nec will clear trav much faster than any barb. the downside is they can't carry the amount of GF a barb can (barbs can dual-wield 2x lem/lem ali baba's) and nec's don't get two bites at the cherry (find item).

    overall, and i haven't ever held a race to prove it one way or the other, i rekon they could both probably pull in similar amounts of gold in a similar amount of time. the major difference is that a nec would do more runs in a given period of time than a barb.

    the major advantage I see in useing a necro for this purpose is that it's seriously cheap to put together. GF barbs kind of need some high-end'ish kit to really get cracking, a CE neccy just need a halfway decent merc.

    Quote Originally Posted by NumtyDoo
    according to his post it isn't only trav, he lists 5 places and some of those are area clears.
    herein is the major advantage of a nec. it can go anywhere it damn well likes. sure, trav is the obvious place to hit in a rinse & repeat cycle for muchos gold. however, i have been known to pull in over 300k gold from a walk through Durance 2. thrown in another ~100k+ gold from the council members on Durance 3 and the potential of something swish from Mephisto...

    as for the River of Flame, it's a level 85 area, so champ packs have the potential to drop nigh-on anything in the game. Hephasto himself tends to drop a goodly amount of gold and shares the "best" (still exceedingly slim) high-rune drop rates with Nihlathak.

    the purpose of the exercise is to build e-wealth. no amount of %MF is going to guarantee a sweet drop from anything. but gold is the one thing we CAN induce b/net to give us in consistently large amounts.

    as for gambling, well, I look at it this way: i get to choose what base item i want. a lvl 94 character gambling a circlet (for example) is essentially the same calculation as hell Diabo dropping one. however, instead of going through the IM infested Chaos sanctuary and hoping that diablo chooses "circlet" in his drop calculation, we simply refresh the gamble screen a few times until we see a circlet. we buy said circlet and voila, hell diablo has essentially dropped us a circlet.

    Quote Originally Posted by iLoveSoccer View Post
    but its only trav right? if its only trav, then council are hard to kill and it doesnt make a huge difference.
    no, its not "only trav". as i've said, you can go anywhere you like with this build and clear it impressively fast. thats the trick, it's an AREA runner, not a BOSS runner. personally, i find my little goldfind neccy to be some of the best PvM fun i have in D2 these days. the rest of the time, i tend to go duelling.

    fyi: i get an average of ~300k from a run with 2k goldfind on my nec. a run can take <2 minutes (pindle/eldritch/shenk/trav)

    Quote Originally Posted by iLoveSoccer View Post
    Some people have gfed with gf barb and they say its totally fine
    yes, goldfinding with a barb works just fine. never tried it myself, but i've heard from many, many others that it works. this is a just a different approach to achieve the same ends (massive amounts of gold in the shortest possible time).

    the other benefit of this build is that you can start with NOTHING and build a nec. as you get some e-wealth you can re-invest it into better goldfind gear. with a barb build, you kinda need some kit to get you started.



    Last edited by mephiztophelez; 08-02-2008 at 17:41.

  7. #7
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    Re: Goldfinding skellynec guide, v1.0.

    First of all, nice guide I agree that in the end, Barb and necro are 2 great chars to GF

    I don't agree that it has to be expensive for GF barb (see example guide here :http://forums.diabloii.net/showthread.php?t=606766). All my initial gears for GF barb are all pgem-able (except wealth armor, of course --need lem , ko). Even barb torch is cheap (only need a crappy one, so, it is pgem-able).

    The other advantage for barb (other than dual-baba, and horking) is that his BO/BC/Shout/Wcry/Leap make the run pretty safe (huge life and def for merc without using CTA).

    Chien




  8. #8
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    Re: Goldfinding skellynec guide, v1.0.

    The main advantage of barbs is the item find skill and the chance to score double drops on corpses. I haven't checked the time but I'm quite sure that my barb does hell travincal in about 2-3 mins as well and the usual amount of gold would be around 500k, ranging from 150k (bad run) to 700k+ (good run). I am sure I could find more gold but I don't mind a bit of mf as well so I use lem lem ali-babas and an enigma for added mobility (yes, I decided not to use wealth). Merc's weapon isn't socketed yet so there's room for one more lem in my setup.

    My build is far from perfect as it was built ages ago as a welfare goldfinder. Goldfinders are damn cheap as well, and you can always run nm travincal for koinz if you can't face hell council. Gear will be pgems worth then.

    A friend of mine used a psn nec for hell travi runs and he did very well. I guess goldfind necs are a non cookie cutter version of gf barb and a viable alternative to those who refuse to just run one tiny area the travincal council site is :laugh:

    How do you run travi? do you start with just golem and merc and summon on the way to the council? or is it just CE all the way?




  9. #9
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    Re: Goldfinding skellynec guide, v1.0.

    Great guide, it's perfect for people who don't feel the need to build new characters for specific purposes. Or for lazy people like me who are really bad at playing melee or minionless classes.

    I guess it's fairly obvious, but it might be good to mention that the Edge runeword can be incredibly useful for any gambler. Also, and this is just a pointless side comment, I think it' s hilarious how the best GF items somehow coincidentally carry plenty of Fire Resist/Absorb as well. It's like the game's screaming for you to run the Council for gold.




  10. #10
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    Re: Goldfinding skellynec guide, v1.0.

    My guess is that it would be easier to summon the army in Pindle garden Fast and easy. BTW, you don't need enigma if you only run trav. You can in and out of level one and your merc will be right there. However, it surely be more controllable if using nigma (but lost 300% GF for the price :P).

    Chien




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