Least Attractive Skill?

[pcguy]

I am not talking about "attractive" in the sense of aesthetics, but more in the sense of utility.

What would you consider to be the least effective or least desirable Witch Doctor skill and why?

I would like to nominate Wrathful Protector.


The Gargantuan only lasts 20 seconds but is also more powerful. The Gargantuan's fists burn with fire, dealing 155% of your weapon damage as Fire and knocking enemies back with every hit.

We know nothing about how many hits this would provide.

What bothers me most about the skill is the long cooldown, the short duration, and the single-target damage. This skill would not synergize well with Zombie Handler or Fierce Loyalty. The short duration skill doesn't really gain any benefit from additional life or life regeneration.

That being said, the only benefit from this skill is that it could be used to bowl over a group of enemies and send them flying backwards away from you. Seems like a pretty hefty cost for such an effect, though. The fact that you can't really control the gargantuan while it's doing its thing also limits the effectiveness of this strategy.

Hm... I wonder if enemies can still attack while they are flying through the air ... ?

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List of Undesirable Skills

1) Gargantuan (Golden Runestone) Wrathful Protector
Reason: Long cooldown, limited utility
Possible Improvement: Shorten cooldown, increase damage bonus, introduce additional modifiers
Credit: pcguy

2) Horrify - Any Runestone
Reason: Availability of better sources of crowd control, does not deal damage, scatters enemies
Possible Improvement: Reverse effect to draw enemies to a location, fear spreads, add damage, make it ranged
Credit: PlatinumWarlock

3) Plague of Toads - Obsidian Runestone
Reason: Single target damage, low damage-per-second, enemy cannot take damage from other sources (unconfirmed)
Possible Improvement: Swallow more than one enemy at a time, allow swallowed enemy to take damage from other sources, allow boss monsters to be affected.
Credit: HuggaBear

3) Big Bad Voodoo - Any Runestone
Reason: Stationary area of effect limits usefulness
Possible Improvement: larger area of effect, area of effect follows WD
Credit: yovargas

[PlatinumWarlock]

I'm not a fan of Horrify.

In real life, such a skill would be massively useful--send the hordes of Hell fleeing away from you? Sounds cool.

In reality? I want to blow them up and take their loot. If they're clustered together for Horrify to work, I'd just as soon let loose a Firebomb or the like, and blow the hell out of them.

This is expounded by the inclusion of Mass Hallucination. I mean, why just scare the enemies, when I can actively have them beat the poop out of one another?! Much better use of my time and mana...

[Naja]

To play the devil's advocate, I always imagined Horrify as an "oh ****!" skill to be used when you do not have control of situation, and rapidly need to establish control in a split second. The horrify could be immediately followed up with a direct attack, summoning minions like Fetishes, Mongrels or a Gargantuan; or mind control like Mass Confusion.

This would differ from Mass Confusion, which I always saw as a skill to be used when you're not immediately in threat of dying, but want to turn a situation more to your advantage.

Although the devil's advocate to my devil's advocate is that Spirit Walk is inherently superior, since it's also a rapid response skill for panic situations, except you move faster, leave a decoy, and (depending on your rune) gain mana or health as you run away.

They really need to re-do the Horrify rune effects for it to be viable. Like increase monster damage for horrified monsters; or gain life or mana for every horrified monster, etc.

[Marloe]

Horrify seems to me to be a pvp-only skill (like Hex, actually) and I agree that the rune effects could be tweaked to make it stand better on its own.

Some ideas for new rune effects that would help it stand with the other skills:

1. Feared targets bleed for X% weapon damage per second
2. Feared targets spread the terror effect to monsters they encounter as they run
3. Feared targets hurt themselves and nearby monsters for x% weapon damage any time they are blocked (hit a wall, hit another monster, etc)
4. Feared targets take X% additional damage
5. Feared targets "herd" together (ai makes feared zombies run toward/with other zombies)

[Frantic]

How does horrify work now? In 2008 gameplay video it worked for about 5 seconds, fearing everything that came close to it. Now it seems to be instant and only monsters that are close get affected and that's it. Is that how it works?

[soldojo]

I used Horrify with the rune for extra armor after it goes off in a PVP-centric build. I believe it would be vastly superior to Mass Confusion, which probably will have almost no effect in PVP, only useful for the 80% damage increase, or the 5 second stun.

I didn't use the skill for damage, and fearing an enemy away from me I think will be more of a lifesaver than stunning one. It's an "OH SH*T" button, and the armor increase really solidifies it as a useful PVP addition, because it works with the idea that your enemy is a probably a melee, and may break out of the fear prematurely, putting you in a very tough position.

[HuggaBear]

I'd nominate giant frog. Takes one enemy (non boss/special) and digests them for relatively weak damage, while presumably removing them from other sources of damage. I can easily imagine you having to wait for the single enemy to be spat out again before you can kill it and in Diablo one normal enemy is rarely going to be worth the effort.

So yeah, I think it's a huge waste of time.

[Elgareth]

I'd nominate giant frog. Takes one enemy (non boss/special) and digests them for relatively weak damage, while presumably removing them from other sources of damage. I can easily imagine you having to wait for the single enemy to be spat out again before you can kill it and in Diablo one normal enemy is rarely going to be worth the effort.

So yeah, I think it's a huge waste of time.

What's making it worse: Random Targetting, so you can't even effectively take especially strong Mobs out of the Fight until they are alone, so yeah, that's be my vote as well, even though I also agree on the Gargantuan part with 20 Seconds Duration, immediately made me think "What? Who would want that, when he can have all those other Gargantuan runes?".

Same thing applies to Gargantuan - Crimson Rune.
Why would I want a short 200% Damage, 50% Attack Speed Buff on single targets for 15 Seconds every 120 Seconds, when I can have an always Cleaving with 210% on multiple Targets-Gargantuan?
The 50% Move Speed makes me think "PvP", since another Player will probably considered a "Boss"... but I don't think that Gargantuan will be of any good in serious PvP Sessions, 50% more move speed or not...

[yovargas]

Being able to take out a monster entirely out of play every 5 seconds while doing 450% weapon damage to it does not sound useless! Maybe not on big packs but in smaller packs of tough monsters that sounds extremely useful to me. (Ditto Hex.)

Horrify is the obvious winner of least useful skill IMO. Big Bad Voodoo seems awesome but since it's stationary and has a giant cooldown, I'm a bit skeptical of it's actually usefulness.

[xManiaCCCx]

I am only one who like horrify? :P..

Of course, it will pretty useless in lower difficulties but in hell and inferno.. well.. At least I made a spirit build around horrify which I can't wait to try.

[HuggaBear]

Horrify might work if the radius is big but iirc the yards don't actually add up to much, so the radius is pretty small which makes it meh worthy, plus it feels like a weak CC spell when you have mass confusion instead and with only 6 active skills at any time...

I dunno, it might work but I'm having a hard time justifying it in my head, maybe for a HC character you could just keep it there for general wandering incase of particularly dangerous mobs?

[pcguy]

It seems pretty unanimous that Horrify is currently the least attractive skill.

Does anybody have anything positive to say about the ability?

Phobia increases the duration of the skill to 12 seconds. 12 seconds makes it the longest-lasting Crowd Control ability for the WD. 12 seconds of not being attacked is pretty cool for WD's who use Damage over Time spells, right?

Face of Death increases the radius to 26 yards, making it the largest AoE crowd control in the game, and the third largest AoE in the WD's repertoire behind Conflagration and Acid Rain. That has to count for something...

Stalker and Frightening aspect buff your character for a limited time. Surely, some melee variations of the WD will have need of additional armor or walk/run speed. The WD doesn't have many other buffs, aside those from Soul Harvest and Big Bad Voodoo. Perhaps they will go well together. Example (http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/witch-doctor#egQYbT!YXa!ZYZabZZ)

[Jaago]

Comparing spell effects in absolute terms, Horrify does seem like the weakest skill in the Witch Doctor's arsenal. Its usefulness is mainly limited to being an "oh ****" button because, other than escaping, WD has little reason to instill fear on mobs in PvE. This is because fear effect works to disperse clustered groups of monsters, making you hit less with your AoE skills, which the WD has plenty.

So the skill doesn't really synergize well with the rest of the class's abilities. The few skills that benefit or might benefit from a more scattered set of mobs are Poison Dart (with non-Indigo runes), Toad of Hugeness, Leaping Spiders, and Flash Fire (Alabaster Firebomb). The benefit is that dispersion helps target selection. Spirit Barrage, Hex, and to some extent Haunt don't lose that much effectiveness with scattered mobs. But that's it; all other spells work better on concentrated groups.

None of the rune effects of Horrify fix this issue by increasing damage, somehow grouping fleeing monsters or some other way; they mostly make it a better escape skill.


Moreover, the WD has Mass Confusion. A crowd control skill that offers a grouping effect on monsters and can be used more proactively that helps avoiding ever even needing Horrify. It's basically everything what's right in a crowd control skill.

Spirit Walk, on the other hand, works as a similar escape ability that doesn't break the mobs apart and allows them to be nuked shortly after. It seems like the better alternative for an offensive character. However, it is less reliable as it only offers 3 seconds of run time, or even less as the effect ends when the dummy left behind sustains enough damage. Therefore, if someone is looking for a spell that allows you to escape reliably when swarmed, Horrify is the best skill to pick.

If some of the offensive abilities are left behind others in terms of effectiveness, I would see them as less attractive choices than Horrify, because at least Horrify does something better than other skills. Currently Zombie Charger and Corpse Spiders seem a little underwhelming compared to other attack skills (along with a few rune effects such as Toad of Hugeness), and if I were to extrapolate to Inferno difficulty, I would call them less attractive than Horrify because it seems I could pick something better in almost every case.


I also have an issue with Fetish Army and Big Bad Voodoo because they have long cooldowns compared to the length of the benefit they give. Particularly BBV's effect doesn't seem to justify the cooldown, because Wizards can get a much higher attack/cast speed boost with Alabaster Slow Time for a lower effect length/cooldown ratio.

[Marloe]

Only thing I can see as a positive for the skill is if you go dogless, either using horrify as an "oh ****" button or "maintaining it" will let you concentrate on a boss during a boss fight (which may or may not be desirable).

[tetracycloide]

Terror was hugely useful as a summoner in D2 so I don't know why horrify sounds awful to everyone. Maintaining it would be hugely useful to focus a boss down while the adds run around I think, at least that's how summoners in uber tristram got it done.

[kinundfir]

In terms of utility maybe firebats is the useless becouse is just a mana drain.
WD is a class who can't afford get out of mana and the abovementioned spell literally spend all your resource in 7 seconds or less.
Horrify affect to any enemy, if you increase its range with a rune would be very useful, mainly in cooperative. Nobody talk about mass confusion which isn't better than horrify because it affects only to some of the targets. IMO skills utility depends on your build.

[HardRock]

Nobody talk about mass confusion which isn't better than horrify because it affects only to some of the targets. IMO skills utility depends on your build.

It's true, that it doesn't affect all targets directly, but it does so indirectly. It gives more dummies for everyone to hit and based on previous gameplay videos it looks like enemies near the confused targets will start to attack them immediately.

Horrify's greatest limitation is that it only affects enemies around your character, while Mass Confusion can be targeted anywhere on your screen, but it has a long cooldown.

If you frequently find yourself in the thick of things, then Horrify is awesome. However, if your playstyle is similar to mine, meaning that you like to stay safely behind your pets, then Horrify becomes largely useless. Mass Confusion is better in these circumstances, since you can use it against especially nasty Elite packs from a safe distance. Hopefully we won't encounter those more often than 1 minute and so its cooldown won't be a big problem. Still, Horrify may turn out to be very handy against teleporting enemies. So to sum up, I think that in PvE both skills are good and in most cases it will depend on your playstyle which one you'll choose.

PvP is another matter completely. I have a feeling that Horrify will be much more useful against melee classes, since you can't rely on your pets to keep them away from you.

[Jaago]

Moreover, a Golden rune can greatly reduce the cooldown of Mass Confusion, down to 4 seconds at level 7. Overall, I personally greatly prefer Mass Confusion's tendency to cluster enemies together contrary to Horrify's tendency to spread them apart, as well as its proactive nature versus the reactive nature of the other. Though I have to agree that in PvP Horrify seems the better choice.

And I can't wait to be able to shred mobs apart with a Mass Confusion - Grasp of the Dead - kill kill kill everything with anything -combo. :badteeth:

Firebats' mana cost and damage is pretty much in line with the other skills I think, given curent information it's roughly as mana intensive as spamming Firebomb, for example, and with a Crimson rune it seems to even be the more efficient one. It might be that the skill encourages a more mana consuming playstyle, though.

[HardRock]

Moreover, a Golden rune can greatly reduce the cooldown of Mass Confusion, down to 4 seconds at level 7.

I took that into consideration, but MC's other rune effects are so awesome, that I will socket a Golden rune into it only when it'll be absolutely necessary.

[Jaago]

I took that into consideration, but MC's other rune effects are so awesome, that I will socket a Golden rune into it only when it'll be absolutely necessary.

Yeah, I guess it depends on the build. I usually play around with Mass Confusion in builds that don't have Mongrels as meat shields so the reduced cooldown becomes relatively more precious. With the Mongrels the other effects are probably better, though I usually plan on taking some other skill instead then.

[Marloe]

@Tetra. Terror curse was ranged. This functions more like Howl, which had far less utility. You have a point though.

[pcguy]

@Tetra. Terror curse was ranged. This functions more like Howl, which had far less utility. You have a point though.

Howl had a much greater radius than Terror did, making it easier to use. A single Howl could practically fear an entire screen's worth of enemies.

I think you may be thinking of Grim Ward, which if compared to either Terror or Howl, in my opinion, was the most limited, impractical, and redundant skill in the game.

[demasked]

A lot of the WD skills are kinda lame.

Toad of hugeness... kinda weird single hits will be odd when it comes to fighting bosses.

Rain of Toad or whatever it is... blizzard... all I can say and how it blizzard should make things a bit more original and make runes a bit more diverse. Rain of toads/blizzard/rain of corpses...

Why? Can't they come up with different ideas then that?

Maybe instead of rain of corpses have a giant zombie/skeletal monster come up from the ground as a summon except it can't regenerate life and when it loses life zombies/skeletons fall off to do some minor damage as well.

Instead of rain of toads / toad of hugeness, have something like fungal toads where there is a chance in which the enemy hit will grow a fungal parasite which makes it confused and it wanders off to die after a few seconds. For bosses/players it could be after 5 seconds it deals %damage in one fowl swoop.*

Maybe for another you could simply summon like 5 toads instead of 3 for more of a spread damage. Or maybe just one giant toad that has a larger explosion and more damage or something. A toad that defies gravity or swallows enemies unrealistically is, to me lame.

All my opinion :)

*Kinda from planet earth series in which there are fungal parasites that take over the effected creature (mostly insects) and after some disoriented time wander around lethargically it dies, turns into the fungus thing and after awhile more "pollen" pops out to do even more damage.