Cap on poison damage?

[Cheetohz]

Trying to ressurect an old build from many years ago. don't remember all the details, unfortunately. it is a poison javazon, just curious if there is a max pois/sec, or can I get some massive numbers?

[Cheetohz]

Okay, now i have a few things in order, though I do not know much of the game mechanics, or how it does its calculations. A few questions here, may have been better suited to a different thread, but i'm going to post here instead of cluttering these forums.

1. What equations is defence involved in? what role does it play? Does it reduce damage, or does it increase the chance of deflecting all damage, etc?

2. what equations are resistances involved in? same as above, does it reduce the damage recieved, etc...

3. How does poison work? what checks are in place to determine the final damage dealt by poison?


let's make an example here. If I were to have a few mods for poison damage. the first one would be 50 dmg/5sec. Does this produce a steady rate of damage of 10 dmg/sec? i know there are other modifiers, which will affect this, but what is the number of poison damage injected into the equations for the final damage dealt?

if i had another charm of 100 dmg/10sec. (another 10dmg/sec to keep it simple) will it apply 20 dmg/sec for the first 5sec and then the remaining go back to 10dmg?

Basically, to what extent do these mods stack, and how much of it is able to stack?

I have many questions, but to get rid of confusion, i'll not ask until i know a bit more about the basics.

[Black Lotus]

1. http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Defense_101

2. http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Resistances

3. there is a sticky poison thread on the forum which i'm too lazy to find, sorry for that.

Poisoned character loses hps over time (surprise). Poisoned characted would have 2 characteristics: rate at which he loses hps and remaining time (length), simply enough. Rate is something like hps/seconds or bits/frame (256bit=1hp and 25frames=1second, but im unsure about this). At rate 256 he will lose 1 hp each frame or 25hp every second.

Whenever character is going to become poisoned (is being hit for example), game checks its poison resist, decrease poison length equipment and if it was already poison too. If the rate of ongoing poison attack (with resistances calculated) is lower than of existing poisoning, it doesnt apply. If equal or higher, it reapplies.

You should probably learn to see poison sources as "X rate for Y seconds" instead of "total damage per seconds" because the overall length doesnt matter in most cases.

Rates of all poison sources is summed, duration is calculated in very complicated way.
If you have 50/5 and 100/10 charms, you will have something like 20dmg/sec poison output with unknown duration (7.5 seconds if you have only those 2 and no other poison sources).

[Cheetohz]

So, from what I see, AR/Def has no say on whether i will apply poison, or how much damage my poison will do.

http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Guide:Calculating_Poison_Damage_v1.10,_by_onderdui ker

Seems as if rate and frames are calculated separately, so i can cast something with a long duration, and then cast something with a high rate, and the rate will overwrite the low rate, and the duration will remain the same?

[Cheetohz]

Alright, so can any of these runewords be equipped to a javelin?

http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Breath_of_the_Dying
http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Call_to_Arms
http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Edge
http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Fortitude
Or just the usual
http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Titan%27s_Revenge

Also considering for the build.

Shield
http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Dragon

Gloves
http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Trang-Oul%27s_Claws

Armor
http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Bramble


I really need to lower enemy resistance though. what are my options?

[Black Lotus]

I have no idea, you better ask in Amazon forum. I havent played amazon since 1.09d and it was bow amazon.

[jiansonz]

Javelins have no sockets, so no runewords for them.

[ch1zra]

and for lowering resistances, go poison facets.

[worstnameever]

yea stay away from dragon/treachery for the venom, it sounds good but sets your poison durations to .4 seconds.

from http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Venom_%28skill%29

Venom caps the poisoning duration at 0.4 seconds, thus preventing long term poisoning. Consequently, all other items will only inflict poison damage for 0.4 seconds. Example: Though 700 damage over 10 seconds might seem impressive only 28 damage will be inflicted due to the 0.4 seconds cap.

[lumpor]

actually that's only for item-based poison. Venom goes very well with skill-based poison.

[ch1zra]

actually that's only for item-based poison. Venom goes very well with skill-based poison.

Would you care to elaborate that, or provide link with informations ?

[lumpor]

I'm too tired of finding a source (I'm pretty sure onderduiker has explained this alot). But item-based durations are averaged while skill-based durations are added to each other, and then averaged with the average item-based poison duration.

Venom eliminates the item-based durations, so all that's left is venom and poison javelin, 2 skill-based durations. They're added together, and this will be the duration of the poison, regardless of items. The poison duration is also poison javelin duration + 10 fames (venoms duration).

Venom's extremely high damage per frame will be added to poison javelin's long duration, making a very strong poison. Poison javelin is the skill capable of the most damage in the game, able to one-shot all monsters in the game except unbreakable poison immunes. Yes, it can one-shot uber diablo and uber baal, thanks to venom. Onderduiker wrote a whole article on the subject. Or was it SSOG?

[ch1zra]

now, THAT makes me want to build a poisonzon (and that sounds damn funny when you pronounce it)!!

[lumpor]

Well, it isn't as fun as it sounds (it includes switching weapons while the javelin is mid-air, not exactly something you can spam).

Found the article btw. SSOG is a diablo forum legend. http://forums.diabloii.net/showthread.php?t=510820&page=2

[ch1zra]

what kind of weapon switching are you talking about ?
any jav + Treachery would provide me with active Venom.
That would give venom clvl15 instead of 18, and I'd lack Bramble, but stills sounds nice to me.

[onderduiker]

So, from what I see, AR/Def has no say on whether i will apply poison, or how much damage my poison will do.

http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Guide:Calculating_Poison_Damage_v1.10,_by_onderdui ker

Seems as if rate and frames are calculated separately, so i can cast something with a long duration, and then cast something with a high rate, and the rate will overwrite the low rate, and the duration will remain the same?
When an equal or higher rate is applied to a poisoned target, that equal or higher rate is applied for the length associated with that rate, not the length of the previous poison. If you poisoned something with Poison Javelin (lower rate but longer length) and then Plague Javelin (higher rate but shorter length), Plague Javelin's rate would then be applied for Plague Javelin's length.


actually that's only for item-based poison. Venom goes very well with skill-based poison.
To elaborate, Venom adds its rate and length to those of Poison Dagger, and the javelins (but not the clouds) of Poison Javelin and Plague Javelin. I'd normally only consider combining Venom with Poison Dagger, though...


I'm too tired of finding a source (I'm pretty sure onderduiker has explained this alot). But item-based durations are averaged while skill-based durations are added to each other, and then averaged with the average item-based poison duration.

Just to clarify: when poison damage items are used with Poison Dagger and the javelins of Poison Javelin and Plague Javelin but without Venom, the rates of the items and skill are added together and applied for the sum of the item lengths and skill length, divided by the number of items. Consult the Skills and items (http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Guide:Calculating_Poison_Damage_v1.10,_by_onderdui ker#Skills_and_items) section of the Wiki's Calculating Poison Damage page for more detail.



Venom's extremely high damage per frame will be added to poison javelin's long duration, making a very strong poison. Poison javelin is the skill capable of the most damage in the game, able to one-shot all monsters in the game except unbreakable poison immunes. Yes, it can one-shot uber diablo and uber baal, thanks to venom. Onderduiker wrote a whole article on the subject. Or was it SSOG?
Aside from the links already posted, for Poison Dagger there's the Poison Skills Information (http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=712653) thread in the Necromancer forum, including how to assassinate Baal with a single stab (http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7028581&postcount=5) and The Scorpion's Tail: Perfecting Poison Dagger (http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7079838&postcount=9) (although a topic of the same name in the Amazon Basin's Necromancer Room contains a much more developed discussion).

SSoG also posted the "Poison Javelin the strongest attack in the game?" topic in the Amazon Basin's Javazon Room back in May 2006. Note that while you can get extremely high total damage by combining Poison Javelin with Venom, in practical terms it is much quicker, more efficient and convenient to just use Plague Javelin without Venom: after throwing the javelin, you can switch to a weapon and shield applying more +% Poison Skill Damage and -% Enemy Poison Resistance to increase the rate and length applied by the clouds (+% PSD is applied to javelin and clouds when they are created, -% EPR is applied whenever a target is poisoned).