Barbarians with plate

[Typoko]

Hi!

This is just a small taught that i have been getting as most of the people seem to think barbarians = plate. Just to remind, this is not the truth.

In lore vise it would be more sane for the wizard to use plate than barbarians. Ok i addmit that shooting lightning whilst wearing metal CAN be hazardous... Still, hige barbardian most likely can wear a plate armor if he so desires. The thing is the way that barbarians fought and the lengths that they had to travel would make plate armor really bad choise. The fighthing is the most troublesome area. Jumping and whirling around with and 2-handed mace is already tiresome, try doing that in a plate! Instead, for example a wizard can stand still and cast spells. Wizard is the one that needs the armor as he is more fragile and doesen't need to move around so much while fighting.

Whats the point of this thread? Well i just wanted to remind everyone that in real life barbarians used leather armor. Assumptions that i see here are pretty much barbarians born in plate armors and they were taken from them before the journey and now they need to get it back.

As a side question i'd like to ask that what you think should armors have class restrictions? I know this has been talked about a bit but it has been stated that atm there are no restrictions on armors as there are on weapons. IMHO there will be soft restrictions as barbarians don't benefit from mana and such, but does this place mana users in a spot where they have larger variety of armors to choose from as i don't really think that person would gain faster fury gain or more max fury from items as things tend to scale way too well. What i mean is that there would be items that are bad for barbarian while it's good for a wizard and still the high vitality / survivability armors would be great for wizards too. Tho enhanced damage usually serves melee classes, but wizards could still use them but barbarians gain no benefit from mana.

[Echod16]

On the potential armor restriction topic...I think Wizards and Witch Doctors will be restricted from the highest plated armors because despite your above comments, there's a lot of movement that goes into a spell, and seeing 200 lbs. of mithril plate mail on a 110 lb. wizard lady doesn't quite seem feasible. I'm not saying they'll only be able to wear leather armor... but in D2 terms, I'd say Mage Plate is there last stop on the armor trail.

While lore-wise it looks odd for Barbarians to be wearing plated armor, keep in mind this is when a barbarian is among his tribesmen and armorless combat is considered a virtue (I assume). Likewise, the Barbarian shown in Diablo 3 is one which has been essentially away from his tribe for 20+ years, and throughout his travels has found that survival is really key, and in order to take advantage of his immense strength, chooses to equip heavy armor for the legions he'll be facing. He's no longer strapped down by concepts of virtue and honor, only the instinct to search out and kill evil and survive.

At least, that's my take on it.

[Typoko]

Hi!

What you say holds pretty much true, but no one can use 200 lbs armor and isin't mithril supposed to be light metal? :) One thing that is funny for me that most of the barbarians in D2 had pants, boots, belt and a helmet. Not like they didin't have the barbarian model where they could have taken the armors... but yes, in Diablo world barbarians pretty much live with the best blacksmiths and waited around at the Mount Doom for some evil to come.

[Runestar]

Why not just let wearing heavy armour be its own drawback? Like imposing a stiff movement/speed penalty? The barb is a melee fighter who will be in the thick of his enemies. It makes sense for him to want to wear the heaviest armour he can find that can afford the best protection. But probably at the expense of mobility. It seems counterintuitive that a class that needs AC the most should have the most problem boosting it, unless it has other features to compensate (like some sort of damage reduction).

In dnd, wizards had a so-called arcane spell failure to fail casting a spell in armour because it supposedly interfered with the intricate somatic gestures needed to cast a spell (though divine casters such as druids received no such limitation). I doubt that will change anytime soon.

Lore-wise, wizards have always had the stiffest armour limitations.

[lone_wolf]

considering the fact that real combat full plate armor weight betwwen 20-30 kilo the whole argumets in this thread is bad. More so the fact that even wizards in dnd could learn the right feat to cast spells in armor just fine:coffee:

[Runestar]

More so the fact that even wizards in dnd could learn the right feat to cast spells in armor just fine

Not without cost.

To be fair, they could even acquire armour that had 0% failure rate, or simulate that using the right combination of classes.

Will be interesting to see if wizards in D3 can simply slap on the heaviest armour they can find or not, or if there will be some mitigating factor that may discourage them from doing so. :)

[Typoko]

Hi!

I see some point in some disadvantages on heavy armors as there is no stat allocation and no stat requirements on armors(it has been said only level restrictions?). I mean, if the stats on magical armors are random but armor value is higher on plate, why would someone wear leather when he can wear plate if there are no restrictions or disadvantages?

Tho the mentioned speed reduction is too harsh. It is just something that you don't want to be in game. It slows down everything. Don't really know what could be the disadvantage. Maybe cloth has X bonuses while leather has X-1 and plate has X-2 or something.

[Runestar]

The speed reduction was just an example. Unlike in D1/D2, where you had to invest heavily in str to wear your heaviest armour (which represents a cost to some extent, since those were points that might have gone into vitality instead), this is missing in D3. It could be any other drawback (maybe it limits your resistances, or actually makes you more vulnerable in other aspects?)

But I don't mind seeing some feature that might give players incentive to actually want to stick to lighter armour, rather than automatically making a beeline for the thickest AC they can lay their hands on. Make wearing heavy armour a conscious choice, something they need to weigh the pros against the cons, rather than a no-brainer.

Anyways, heavier armour in D2 reduced your speed and increased the rate of stamina drain, IIRC.

[Echod16]

When I said DnD, I meant Baldur's Gate, sorry

And yes, Runestar is correct on the speed reduction with heavier armors in D2.

[SlechtWeerBeer]

Anyways, heavier armour in D2 reduced your speed and increased the rate of stamina drain, IIRC.

Correct. However, this penalty was too small to be noticable (esp. Stamina, since you basically can't run out in normal play after lv15 or so).

[stillman]

considering the fact that real combat full plate armor weight betwwen 20-30 kilo the whole argumets in this thread is bad. More so the fact that even wizards in dnd could learn the right feat to cast spells in armor just fine:coffee:

True. Not only was a suit of armor only about about 60 pounds, the weight was distributed over the entire body.

The barbarian in d3 has special looking armor very different than a suit of armor. It looks like it was made by barbs for barbs. There are spaces to allow more movement. Of course, the shoulder pads are too big so those would hinder movement, but w/e.

Overall, I think there should be a speed loss, and if you don't want to suffer that loss then you don't wear the heaviest armor. Simple.

[Funkopotamus]

On the potential armor restriction topic...I think Wizards and Witch Doctors will be restricted from the highest plated armors because despite your above comments, there's a lot of movement that goes into a spell, and seeing 200 lbs. of mithril plate mail on a 110 lb. wizard lady doesn't quite seem feasible. I'm not saying they'll only be able to wear leather armor... but in D2 terms, I'd say Mage Plate is there last stop on the armor trail.

That wizard lady would have to be wearing like 5 sets of mithril armor

[Echod16]

c'mon guys, I'm trying to get at the principal here...

yes, mithril is lightweight and strong, replace it with casted iron

[Funkopotamus]

For a scholarly wizard lady, that wizard lady made a poor choice of armor.

Armor is designed to keep the limitation of movement to a minimum.

[SEANBCOOL]

I don't feel like class restrictions on armor based on the item's weight fit well with Diablo.

I mean, come on... the Barbarian already has the most life and deals massive amounts of physical damage, and he gets to wear the best armor too? No.

Diablo is based around dealing and taking as much damage as possible, for every character. Don't try to make it D&D.

[SEANBCOOL]

Also, on the subject of keeping things kosher with the lore...

Yes, Barbarians are tough, muscled, and thick skinned. I'm sure they do just fine ripping their enemies to shreds in nothing but boots and a loin cloth -- if they're fighting other people!

You've got to think though, who in their right mind would descend into the depths of Hell to fight demons and other monstrosities without some thick armor?

[Daerius]

You know all those half-naked Barbarian corpses that litter the Bloody Foothills, as they valiantly tried to defend Harrogath in vain?

They decided to start wearing armor.

Larzuk found his calling as a blacksmith.

[Brother Laz]

What's the problem with everyone wearing plate? It'll look different on the character anyway and everyone already uses the highest damage weapon which is just fine.

They could do clever things to introduce variety like D&D's interlocking plate with defense that increases when standing still etc. but judging from the information so far, this level of cleverness is above them.

[redrach]

everyone already uses the highest damage weapon which is just fine.
It amuses me to no end that I knew exactly who you were on reading this without seeing your name. :rolf:

[stillman]

OP, I think you're in luck because d3 is shaping up to be the barbarian and his ragtag team of cloth loving noobs. No one is going to have an awesome looking set of armor except the barb and hopefully the 5th class.