Getting more serious - A speculation thread revisted and more indpeth than ever.

[commonhumans]

Welcome back. This thread is going to take one of my preexisting threads and go into a much deeper area of speculation. This thread will contain most of the original thread as well as additional input from other users on the diablo.incgamers.com forums and some more of my personal thoughts and research. You can find the original post here (http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=729831).


WARNING: THIS IS NOT A SHORT POST.


Disclaimers-

Number One: This is still speculation, obviously… but there are a lot of facts in here too.
Number Two: I realize that many of these things have been said before but I'm trying to cut through all of the forum garbage and trolls to compile a solid factually based guess about what will actually show up in Diablo 3.
Number Three: Have fun and please do share your thoughts.

With all of the above being said, we can move on to the purpose of the post - What do we know about Diablo 1 and Diablo 2 that we can use to find context clues and try to make a truly educated guess at the next 2 classes appearing in Diablo 3.

First we need to list what playable classes we have had and what we know we will have:

Diablo I: Rogue, Warrior, Sorcerer.
Diablo I Hellfire (unofficial): Monk, Bard, Barbarian.
Diablo II: Sorceress, Barbarian, Necromancer, Amazon, Paladin.
Diablo II LOD: Assassin, Druid.
Diablo III: Barbarian, Witchdoctor, Wizard.

...And now the non-playable classes from Diablo 2:

Act 1: Rogue
Act 2: Town Guard Spear/Pikeman
Act 3: Iron Wolves Clan Mage
Act 4: None
Act 5: Barbarian Soldier

So we have all of these characters, but where did they come from according to Diablo lore?

Diablo I:

Warrior - Khanduras
Rogue - All over
Sorcerer - Vizjerei (Caldeum)

Diablo I Hellfire:

No information and it wouldn’t count if there were any.

Diablo II:

Paladin - Westmarch
Sorceress - Vizjerei (Caldeum)
Barbarian - Mount Arreat
Necromancer - Jungles outside of Ureh
Amazon - Twin Seas Islands

Diablo II LOD:

Assassin - N/A
Druid - Scosglen

Diablo II Mercs:

Rogue - Khanduras/Entsteig
Town Guard - Lut Gholein
Iron Wolves - Kurast (May have originated else where)
Barbarian - Mount Arreat

Diablo III:

Barbarian - Mount Arreat, but are now Nomadic
Wizard - Xiansai/Caldeum
Witch Doctor - Torajan Jungles

Now that we have a list of all the characters, playable and non-playable, that have actually or will actually be appearing in the Diablo trilogy, as well as the areas of Sanctuary that they hail from, we can start form solid foundation to build from, but, before we do that though, let’s talk a little about what we expect from Blizzard.

From Blizzard we can expect simplicity. Simple = Fun. It’s that easy. We can also expect Originality (but not off-the-wall-itty) and when I say originality, I don't mean they are going to throw a robot in the world of Diablo, I simply mean they know how to take an old idea that has existed in the realm of fantasy and make it fresh, new, and completely their own (point and case - Witchdoctor). We also know that Blizzard has said the Barbarian is the only class that is returning from Diablo 2... at least until the expansion (or multiple expansions) of Diablo 3.

Now that we have a common ground on what we know and at least some of what we come to expect from our good friends at Blizzard we can actually start working on something. The first thing to do is to eliminate the classes we know wont show up, so say good bye to the following!

Sorcerer (Filled by Wizard)
Sorceress (Filled by Wizard)
Necromancer (Filled by Witch Doctor)
Amazon
Paladin
Assassin
Druid
A3 Mage (Filled be Wizard)
A5 Barbarian Soldier (Filled by Barbarian)

So long, farewell, auf wiedersehen, good-bye.

So now that we have eliminated the classes that we know for a fact will not show up in the core Diablo III game, we are left with the following characters:

Monk
Bard
Rogue
Warrior
A2 Town Guard

And here is a list of areas within sanctuary that have either been very loosely used or not used at all:

Bramwell
Duncraig
Viz-Jun
Gae Kul
Lut Gholein
Kurast
Ureh
Entsteig/Sharval Wilds
Kingsport

Moving forward, let’s talk about what type of character classes have been filled and what still needs to be filled. By character classes, I mean, type of charter, melee, magic, and ranged, that sort of business.

What has been filled:

Barbarian: Extreme full frontal melee class.
Witch Doctor: Summoner class.
Wizard: Extreme full frontal magic class.

Where did these classes come from:

Barbarian: Mount Arreat, but are now Nomadic
Witch Doctor: Torajan Jungles
Wizard: Xiansai/Caldeum

We know that Blizzard said there would be 5 classes. This leaves two open to major debating. So now we go down, deep down, into that abyss…

ALL OF THE ABOVE IS WHAT WE KNOW TO BE ACTUAL TRUTH.

From here on out we enter into that dangerous realm that is speculation. We all have opinions. These are some of my thoughts and a lot of yours, I will assume, especially since I've been pulling a lot of this out of other forum posts.

Before we get running full force into all this, there’s a little bit of background I need to cover. Are you familiar with the card game Magic the Gathering? For those of you that are not familiar with it, I will briefly explain the basics. Magic the Gathering consists of 5 different colors; Red, Green, White, Black, and Blue. Each color has a particular theme to it. Red is chaotic and brute. Green is nature and survival based. White is holy and support based. Black is power hungry and dark sided. Blue is controlling and magic heavy.

So you may be asking yourself “What does this have to do with Diablo 3?” Good question. Well possibly nothing and maybe everything. Like stated before, this is still speculation, but the color scheme from Magic the Gathering could prove to be a very valuable tool in predicting the next 2 classes appearing in Diablo 3.

If we take the character we already have and apply them too the Magic the Gathering wheel they each fit one color very well. I’ll list them.

Barbarian: Red. Brute force, no thinking, just swing and kill, ask questions when there is no one left to answer them.

Witch Doctor: Black. He summons zombies and uses curses. Yeah, black.

Wizard: Blue. She controls time and manipulates electricity magically. Solid blue.

Those colors are based on their skills. If we took a different route and added colors to the characters personality we would probably get different answers, but for the sake of not making this thread 3 pages longer, I will just stick to the colors based on the character skills. This leaves two colors open, White and Green. Remember these colors, they could prove useful in the latter part of this post.

Okay, so now that we have one speculation theory out in the open, here is a short list of class types that are considered classic fantasy game fare that could appear and have yet to be filled. They are as followed:

Holy
Ranged
Fast Melee
Sword & Board
Shape-Shifting
Wild Cards

Now I say classic fantasy game fare, and I say it for good reason. Blizzard isn't going to drop and alien into the world of Diablo (and yes I am WELL aware that the did it in World of Warcraft). Blizzard isn't going to drop a gun-slinging cowboy in here either. True fans wont like it and if true fans don't like it... true fans wont play it. So Blizzard knows whom they have to please and what they have to do, but to please the masses I have added a wild card section because there is always something that can break the mold and still fill a void.

Now I know that I did not cover every type of class that exists out there in the fantasy realm, that would be impossible, at least with my level of knowledge when dealing with fantasy stuffs, but what I did cover I am fairly positive will show up in Diablo 3 or the expansion(s) of Diablo 3. Blizzard has said there will be no solely support or healing class, so that would be why those two classes have been left out of the above list.

So again, moving forward, what characters will fill in these openings? I will name what others and I think will the best choices for the 6 class types I listed before. I will try to list at least three characters per possible class type. There will probably be repeats in here and most of these (if not all) choices have been pulled form other speculation posts on either the diablo.incgamers.com forums or www.battle.net forums. Lets begin.

Holy:
Knight, Crusader, Monk, Cleric, Seer.

Ranged:
Hunter, Ranger, Rogue, Bard, Warden.

Fast Melee:
Thief, Pirate, Bard, Rogue, Ninja, Monk.

Sword & Board:
Knight, Crusader, Soldier, Warrior, Guardian.

Shape-Shifting:
Changeling, Dryad, Shaman.

Wild Cards:
Demon Hunter, Mentalist, Geomancer.

I've been taking what I've seen the most on the forums and other stuff that I have found either lying around in fantasy books here or in search engines on the web. A lot of the new information in this reworked post comes from the replies on the original post. The wild card classes are the 3 classes I like the most that didn't quite fit in a spot that was listed... I don't really expect to see them in the game but hey it would be really awesome to have that twist in there.

Now regarding the areas of Sanctuary where the classes come from; it seems as if all the major warrior/melee classes tend to come from the Western regions while the magic heavy classes tend to come from the Eastern regions.

All right, now its time to take all this information and speculation and put it to use. I’m going to go over 4 characters. I will place them in the order of likelihood I think they will appear in Diablo 3. Please read everything about the character and leave your stereotypes at the door.

The top 3 most likely characters to appear in Diablo 3 are (2 Core, 1 Expansion):

THE BARD

Abandon what ever you think you know about your typical Bard and step into the world of the Diablo 3 Bard. I am still sticking to my guns on this and saying the Bard is the next class to show up in Diablo 3. I think that if done correctly the Bard has the potential to be one the best and most well rounded characters out there. With so many angles to approach from and capitalize on the Bard character can and will be awesome.

The Bard is a wanderer and explorer at heart. Living off of that land, the Bards survival skills are uncanny. Many of Bard’s tales and songs come from their own experiences and memories, though being persons with the gift of gab; their stories will always be embellished and exaggerated, but not always far off from the truth. After wandering the lands of Sanctuary for so long and seeing a change in all of those around, the Bard senses the need to learn and take up arms, for the darkness that has began to grip the land has not loosened. The Bard seeks to protect all that is close to heart and memory; the land of Sanctuary will be redeemed.

This character will take primarily the Ranged class spot. The Bard would possess quick skills that allow for cunning shots and dodge abilities, as well as songs to charm evil and convert them to do you bidding or boost your battle abilities. Extremely smart, the Bard will be able to use the environment to his advantage as well as identify threats and items before other characters even see them. Highly charismatic and manipulative, the Bard will walk a slightly different line and will challenge the player with many new and different ways to play a Diablo character.

Using our Magic the Gathering guide the Bard can easily fit the Green slot due to its survivability, ties to nature, and love of lore.

For a perfect interpretation of what the Bard class should be, I will direct you too the following thread. Please enjoy (http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=731051).

THE CALDEUM SOLDIER

Looking at the areas of the Sanctuary we can see where characters have come from and where they could possibly come from. The Barbarians from their beloved Mount Arreat up north, the Witch Doctors from the jungles below the port of Kurast, and the Wizards from Xiansai to the east. This is leaves a largely untapped area, the Lut Gholein and Caldeum desert areas.

A soldier hailing from the once proud city of Caldeum, the trade capital of the world, stands guard against forces unseen, it is not only the people and animals that are different but the land it self. Everything looks thirsty and tired, a thirst that seems unquenchable and a tired that only death could soothe. The soldier requests a move to Lut Gholien hoping that the world across the sea is better off than the current homestead, but when the soldier arrives at this new post, things only seem to be worse. Holding to honor the code of the Caldeum Army and protect the great city of Caldeum, the soldier takes a personal vow to rid the world of the evil that seem to be creeping ever steadily across the world of Sanctuary.

This character will fit the Sword & Board/Holy niche… with a twist. Rather than a sword the Caldeum Soldier will use spears and javelins as the weapon of choice. The soldier spear skills include powerful jabs, impaling, and even using the spear to slap the feet out from under the enemy rendering them immobilized. The soldier will have high defensive and blocking skills. The shield will serve as more than protection; it can push back monsters, bash them into the ground, and even be thrown. Being an honorable person, the soldier will harness the power of light; some skills will provide brief immunity to attacks and other skills will include strikes that are guided by hands from heaven.

Using our Magic the Gathering guide the Caldeum Soldier can easily fit the White slot due to its honorable nature and protective spirit.

I plan on taking this class idea and actually making a full-blown character. I will start work on it later this week.

THE PIRATE

Since there are no guns in the world of Sanctuary, this character will not be using guns… go figure. But, this class has a lot to offer and is unique in more ways than you probably ever thought. This class has been made many times before and the only things that makes it different now is that fact that it has to work in the realm of Diablo 3. Hear me out.

The Pirate... a sailor’s nightmare and a trader’s worst fear. The pirates of the Twin Seas have been a pain in the sides of Lut Gholien, Kingsport, and Kurast for years. Even then Amazons have had their run-ins with these less than savory members of society, being kidnapped by them and either sold off as slaves or worse. Things have begun change on the waters of the Twin Seas, many new and terrifying creatures seem to swarm up from no where and take entire ships down to the sea floor in a mater of minutes. Armed with this knowledge, the pirates know that the only way to possibly get things back to normal is too draw a truce with the cities of Sanctuary and defeat this new evil… but make no mistake, though for the moment they fight on the side of good, they are still motivated by that deadly sin of greed. They are after all… pirates.

The Pirate will take the fast melee spot that is waiting to be filled. The pirate will be skilled in dual wielding daggers and short swords. Double slash attacks and parrying abilities will be a major part of the pirate build. Since the pirate is greedy by nature they have the ability to locate items and loot them from bodies that other players may have overlooked and left behind. The pirate is also very fast and has can run past groups of monsters cutting and slicing them to the ground leaving a wake of blood. As well as great speed the pirate is great at getting out of bind by either laying traps or jumping and climbing out of bad situations.

Using our Magic the gathering guide, they Pirate isn’t so clear-cut on what color it falls under. I would have to say mainly red, but there is almost certainly black and green in there somewhere.

Yes, I also plan on elaborating on this character as well, let me do me Caldeum Soldier first.

GEOMANCER

This is my wild card pick. After reading more about this class, I like it, a lot. Now I do not think this character will show up in the core Diablo 3 game simply because right now its to close to what the wizard is, but I wouldn’t put it past Blizzard to introduce this character in the expansion(s). Here’s my spin on some Geomancer lore.

20 years ago the Worldstone was destroyed and the great Mount Arreat fell in a literal shell of its former self. A group of Wizards were sent on an expedition to examine the cratered remnants of Mount Arreat. When the Wizards arrived at the site, the earth felt different. They could feel the ground communicating with them. They began experimenting by holding shards of the worldstone in their hands and found much to their amazement they could move the earth, taking it a step further, the Wizards cut their selves open and inserted the worldstone fragments under their skin. Now permanently tied to the earth, they can bend it to their will… but this new power comes at a price, they also feel the pain of the earth. So after 20 years they are now finally leaving their camps at the Arreat Crater and intend on ridding the world of the evil creatures that plague it.

I know someone else is currently working on a Geomancer class so I am going to wait on describing what skills this class could possibly use. Whenever that post is made I will come back and make the necessary edits.

As far as the Magic the Gathering guide goes, I say the Geomancer falls into the Green slot.

All right. After all my forum crawling, lore surfing, fantasy researching, Blizzard know-about, and now the replies of fellow forum members... these are the NEW big picks, the big talked about, the bold and different, the original enough and fun... now all completely reworked and more form fitting. The trees and skills are debatable, but I leave that up to you, I just took from and added to particular classes and tried to round out the best possible combinations. Now I could be COMPLETELY wrong and Blizzard could come from left field on this one and god knows they have done it in the past... but I feel these are the solid choices to tie up the last two slots in Diablo 3.

So there, that’s what I have come up with. Love it. Hate it. Flame it. Troll it. Spread it. Post it. I leave my post to the mercy of the forum gods. Thanks for your time guys. I hope you enjoyed it.

Special Thanks:

Technomancer - for doing the research of where each character came from in Sanctuary, as well as the list of unused area. Also, your interpretation of the Bard was amazing; I would love to be able to play as that class.

Squid Knight - for coming up with the idea to use Magic the Gathering as a speculation tool. Top notch.

Ishtor - for placing the current classes into their places accord to the Magic the Gathering color wheel.

Brandonn - For renaming the Desert Mercenary/Pikeman to something much more appealing, Caldeum Warrior

Lazer - for your class clarification and well thought out responses on what class types will most likely appear in Diablo 3 as well as your thoughts on the Geomancer.

The Mighty Shoe - for changing my mind about the Pirate class.

Combat Shrine, Nase, Lunarleif, Peasant, Captain, and anyone else I missed - for reading and replying, sharing your opinions, and helping make the original post stay alive and keep evolving.

If it weren’t for you guys, this project would have been dead when I originally posted it a few weeks ago. Thanks for making me want to keep working on this. I hope you all enjoyed it… even though it is about 9 pages long.

Commonhumans’ out.

[Technomancer]

...My god, what have you done?! We've created a monster!! LOL!!

Wow, that's a wall of text! Kudos!

I'm working on another class that might fit into the Sword & Board and Wild Card catagories, but we'll see.

I'm thinking that the next Holy class is gonna be more magic based, but can still throw down too. My money's on some kind of Cleric that is rather offensively geared, magically and otherwise. It seems like there are more slots than can be filled in 2 classes, but that's what the xpac is for right? Heck, I think there'll eventually be *2* xpacs, based on what they've done on games since D2.

[lunarleif]

If you care, Lazer was the person who came up with geomancer. What about arcane warrior? Will there be detail skill descriptions for these classes?

[GuardianHadriel]

Well, I think The Pirate should be somewhat of a brawler who fights in pubs and stuff and he uses knuckles and fist weapons, not ordinary knuckles more with long spikes or almost like the assasins katars. But I do´nt think i want the Pirate to take up a spot of the Diablo III characters.

[lunarleif]

Then you would be better off with a monk Guardian Hatedrel. Anyway, Hadriel, the previous post of this is where you say what you don't like, this post is supposed to be constructive.

[stillman]

Additions to speculation logic:

1-AT LEAST ONE OF THE CLASSES SHOULD BE A HYBRID OF MAIN CLASS IDEAS. Why? Well look at all the classes that could be used: shapeshifter, stealth, archer, holy, shield class, fast melee, trapper, etc. There are only 2 spots left, so if they don't hybridize at least one of them, some fans are really going to miss out on playing thier favorite kind of build from d2. I could be wrong here because the pattern already seems to be purist builds (a pure nuker and pure melee so far). I'm just saying some fans will feel left behind if they don't get a shapeshifter for example, and Blizzard would want to appeal to all the fans for maximum profit.

2- The current pattern seems to be going for total unoriginality except for the WD. Let's face it; 'Wizard' is about as archtypical and broad as it gets. Furthermore, 'Barbarian' is about as extreme melee fighter as possible. Barbarian is pretty much 'fighter class' because he can never be anything besides a fighter. These are very popular, unoriginal classes that are found in D&D. Now, the WD is the origanal one. Some of you are anticipating a 'wildcard'--some very original and new, unexpected class that will be totally different from what we're used to. I'm saying this spot is already taken....by the WD. So since the original, 'wildcard' class is already presented as the WD, there is no room for another (there are a mere 5 spots to fill, not enough for two wildcard original classes imo). The next two classes will, according to the pattern, be very unoriginal archtypes. It would not surprise me at all if the archer class is actually called 'Archer' or we get a class called 'Shapeshifter' or even 'Theif'! Yes, look no further than D&D for the next two d3 classes!

3- Blizzard is using EXTREME classes. They are going comic book style on us. Nothing subtle will pass inspection for a d3 class. As mentioned, the barbarian is about the most violent, enraged, melee killing machine possible. It doesn't get any more extreme in terms of melee. Wizard--you can't get a more extreme nuker. WD--this is the extreme wierd, unusual class. We've got to admit if there's one thing the WD is good at, it's being a wierd class that kills things in unusual ways. So the next two classes should, according to the pattern, be EXTREME at what they do. So for example: pirate class, without a gun, may be too weak and redundant. Sure, he could have dual wield, but so does the barb, so he would just seem like a weaker version of the barb. The pirate is just another melee fighter who is nothing much compared to a bigger, stronger, more extreme barb. I don't see how Blizzard could make a pirate class up to par (i.e. extreme enough) unless they give him more defensive swordplay, but the barb can also be more defensive with armor and warcries. With only 5 calsses, Blizzard would seem strange to put in redundant characters that basically copy the barb or wizard too much. They could do a pirate, but it would require some form of extreme contortion to make him as godly as the barb and wizard.

4-I propose that Blizzard has too much pride and will not put in a character that is clearly an original creation of some other popular enterprise. So the spellbreaker or w/e seems like it's really a WoW creation, and people might accuse Blizzard of not being creative enough if they simply took something that is exclusively from another game. I can't think of many examples, but it would be like if Warhammer put in a Drow elf class when it is clearly a D&D class used only in D&D. The Drow is not borrowed from Earth culture or history; it is purely a D&D creation afaik. Elf on the other hand, is anyone's to take. So I think WoW based characters will not be the next d3 classes, unless they are archtypes that would appear in any rpg.

5- As I mentioned in the OP's previous thread, gender is an important issue. The name of the character class should sound good and androgenous at the same time. 'Knight' could very well be out of the question because it's quite a stretch of the imagination to picture a female knight. We all know knights in our history were all male, and this bit of knowlege could interfere with the gender issue in d3. Now, 'Archer' or especially 'Theif' would be ideal names for a d3 class because they are without a doubt gender neural. THE CURRENT THREE D3 CLASSES SOUND GREAT AND GENDER NEUTRAL. BARBARIANS, WITCHDOCTORS AND WIZARDS ALL COULD BE PICTURED AS MALE OR FEMALE. THIS PATTERN SUGGESTS BLIZZARD WILL BE VERY CHOOSEY ABOUT THE NAMES OF THE NEXT TWO CLASSES.

6- We must keep in mind the simple known rules: The characters cannot be overly evil. They must be human. They cannot have some major advantage as a healer class or be defined as a supporter class solely for boosting the party. They have to be DPS killers on their own, and they shoud have no problem beating the game solo. The next classes should have some reason for fighting for the forces of light against Diablo.

7- But there is yet another rule that few, if any, have mentioned. We've got 70 skills to fill or w/e it is. That's a lot of skills. The designers have to be able to come up with many skills that relate to the character. They can't be shrewed or akward sounding. For instance, Templar kinght may not be a good choice for Blizzard because they have to come up with some 70 skills that all scream templar. They would be hard pressed to do this. Some of the skills would not sound very templar knightish at all. This is because templar knights are from a specific period of Earth history, with specific codes of conduct. They're too specific. Barbarians on the other hand are from all over the globe and from different periods of Earth history, so Blizzard has the luxury of using themes from all kinds of different Earth barbarians. We have to consdier how plausable the skill trees will be when speculating future classes.

8- And let's not forget all the items in the game. The new classes cannot be left out from the wide selection of weapons and armors. Pikemen seems out of the question (and don't forget, 'Pikemen' is male and excludes females in its name alone!) Pikemen implies that spear class weapons are his only options. EACH CLASS MUST ALSO LOOK REASONABLE IN FULL PLATE ARMOR. Please consider a pirate in full plate armor, or any other class. What complicates things more is that there will be female armor as well for each build. So not only do we have to stretch out imaginations for a pirate to wear full plate, we must also picture a FEMALE pirate in female fullplate. Is this getting too strange? We must ask oursleves this when contemplating each new class. They cannot look ridiculous.

The best way I can explain number 8 is with the d2 amazon. Ask ourselves: Do amazons look reasonable in full plate? Yes. They are female warriors; armor is right up their alley. Do amazons look silly using daggers, axes or other non-java/spear/bow weapons? No. They are warrior women. They should be able to handle themselves picking up any weapon off the battlefield, even though it is not their best suited one.


Suammary:

Please consider this big important fact: THERE ARE ONLY 5 SPOTS. There can't be room for redundancy. I would even go as far as to say there can't be a specificly 'fast melee' or a 'shield class' (unless they are hybrids) because these are shadows of the barbarian. Why would Blizzard make a second melee master like a 'sheild calss' when they could add a totally different 'shapeshifter' class instead. The shapeshifter example instead of shield class would net more profit for Blizzard. Shapeshifter fans of d2 would get their favorite build to play, and paladin fans would at least have a barb with shield skills which plays essentially the same as a paladin (i.e. melee) anyway.

Logic tells us the 'wild card' spot is already taken by the WD and there is no room for another original wild card class. Acid fogs? Firebats? Enchanting your wierd pets? That looks 'wild' enough to me. He's even from the wild.

All of the 8 above must be considered for the new classes. The barbarian is a perfect choice because:

1-He has some shield skills in case there is no 'Shield class' so fans don't miss out on shield experts if that's their favorite style.
2-He is a huge archtype that everyone is familiar with. We all understand exactly what a barbarian does before we even click on him in character selection. Because he is an archtype, we can have all kinds of different fighting styles that don't stray form the notion of barbarians. His unoriginality as a class actually helps here for helping players recognize quickly what he is all about and for allowing many diverse palying styles.
3-He is EXTREME in appearance and concept, like what you would see in a comic book. There is no room for weaklings in Sanctuary, and Blizzard has to compete with other games that have their own extreme imagery.
4- Barbarian class does not belong to any particular game. It is not borrowed from anyone else's creation. It is Earth based with some fantasy elements added.
5-Barbarian is perfectly gender neutral.
6-Barbarians are human, non evil, and have very good reasons in the story for fighting against Diablo in d3.
7- There are endless ideas of skills that would look good on a barbarian and no one will wonder what they are doing in the tree.
8-The barb looks great in armor, makes sense using any weapon, and gosh, what more needs to be said.

Now, if you go through the list above with 'Wizard', you likewise eliminate any problems with him/her being in d3. Briefly: 1-can be considered hybrid if you want to play her as a melee sorc. 2-She is archtype, many many builds possible 3-She is extreme, comic book style killing machine. 4- She does not belong to anyone's game in particular. 5-Perfectly gender neutral 6-Human, non evil, has her own reasons for beating Diablo, even if it's just showing off. 7-Endless skill ideas make total sense with her. 8-All weapons make sense in her hand becase they can be used in conjunction with protective enchantments available to any sorc who wants to use weapons. Full plate armor makes sense on her because she dabbles in dangerous magics, and she should be rich enough with all that power to afford her own fancy mage style armor.

We do run into problems with the WD when going through my list. For instance, a WD in full plate is going to seem very bizarre and I have no idea on how Blizzard intends to handle this problem. But alas, the WD is the wierd and wacky 'wild card', so straying from the patterns I described is what he is all about anyway.

So, when thinking of the next class canidates, be sure to go through the list which is based on the patterns and styles Blizzard already gave us.

I will always be unconvinced of a bard's appearance in d3. Going through the list we must ask:

1-Is the bard a possible hybrid to include fans' favorite styles? Yes. Bigtime. Check.
2-Is the bard a big archtype class? No. He is clearly a wildcard. And we already have a wierd wildcard who has stragne, unconventional ways of killing things...the WD. There are only 5 classes; there can't be room for 2 strange characters. This would make the game too complex for first time players with only 3 straightforward class ideas that are obvious in their killing methods.
3-Is the bard extreme and godly enough like the wizard and barb? No. Well, I suppose they could try to pull it off. Imo, the bard is part artist, part killer. The barbarian is ALL killer. The wizard is ALL killer. So imo, the bard can't stand up to these godly extreme super killing machines. The barbarian is the strongest survivor of his tribe, the wizard is using too-powerful magic that even her kind disapproves of. These 2 classes just ooze godliness, and I'm not sure if a musician can ever match that.
4-Is the bard a creation made by some specific rpg? No. The bard is used by many rpg's. Check.
5-Does bard sound gender neutral enough? Yes. Check.
6-Is the bard human, non evil and would he have good reason to fight Diablo? Yes. Check. Should be easy to come up with reason to fight evil.
7-Is it easy to come up with recognizable bard skills that would fill 3 massive trees? Yes. It should be easy enough.
8-Does the bard look right and acceptable in full plate armor? No. not at all. Any musical instrument besides voice and maybe a simple drum cannot be played with gauntlets. If using voice, the helmet would have to be visor free. Someone singing or playing any music while wearing full plate armor just doesn't look right at all. When holding a weapon and covered in armor, how would we distinguish him from any soldier? If we try to correct some of these unsightly problems, the bard transforms into more soldier than bard.

So that's three problems which isn't too bad. But it would make more sense for Blizzard to make a Theif, Archer, or Shapeshifter class based on the patterns.

Side note: I'm not sure if 'where they come from' in Sanctuary is all that important when it comes to ruling anything out. Couldn't Blizzard just make up whatever lands they want? They could say "here is the new Monk class. They come from the hidden temples in the Gung-Lang mountains..."

[lunarleif]

Barbarian was Blizzard's own child in a sense. You can't talk about originality since it was from Diablo 2, so that removes all your complaints about barbarian. Wizard is true, except that they have destroyed most semblances of unoriginality. Dnd doesn't have time warping spheres, or I doubt any other game has a wizard doing that. I personally don't understand pirate, but change the name with something similar and it fits! :D here you are complaining about unoriginality etc and you suggest thief, archer, and shapeshifter? Those are the lowest class rpg names in existence, dnd games can use them, but they "invented" them. Assassin was the thief, druid the shape shifter, and amazon the archer.

[stillman]

:D here you are complaining about unoriginality etc and you suggest thief, archer, and shapeshifter? Those are the lowest class rpg names in existence, dnd games can use them, but they "invented" them. Assassin was the thief, druid the shape shifter, and amazon the archer.

No, I'm not complaining about it. I'm merely pointing out the obvious pattern. This is what Blizzard has handed us already. In fact I talked in length about how perfectly the class 'Barbarian' fits in, and how it's unoriginality is a benefit.

The names I suggested, theif, archer and shapeshifter seem like logical choices based on the patterns. They are indeed unoriginal, but that is the way Blizzard seems to be going.

As for your notion of the wizard being its own unique sort of class for d3, I'd prefer not to define her based on one or two skills like timestop. It's better for our purposes to consider her overall class in general. It is clearly a pure mage class no matter how some of her spells differ from the norm. The barbarian, likewise, is very heavily coated with d3 lore and culture making him special, but for rpg discussions, we know he is really your typical 'fighter' class with a splash of color.

Thanks for reading the long post, btw.

Special Update!!!

I found some more logic that can give us hints when eliminating classes likely to make it in d3. It's laughable, but give it a chance!

9- BLIZZARD LIKES MODESTLY LONG NAMES FOR THEIR CHARACTER CLASSES. Let's look at what we've seen so far:

d1 names:
warrior rogue sorcerer

d2 names:
necromancer barbarian amazon sorceress paladin assassin druid

At a quick glance, we see that the names are quite lengthy! That's 7.5 letters per name on average.

Now let's include d3 names so far:

wizard witchdoctor barbarian

This gives us 7.769 letters per class name on average. So a name like 'bard' would be really out there, as druid has 5 letters and is so far the shortest name in the series. Anyway, Witchdoctor should be a good hint that Blizzard really does love its big names!

[commonhumans]

Stillman.

I love that post you made. I really do. And you bring up a ton of good points. But I swear I will change your mind about the Bard yet.

Is the Bard a wildcard? Yes. It most certainly is. Do I think the Witchdoctor is as well? Yes I most certainly do. Are two wildcards out of the question? No way Jose.

The way the Witch Doctor kills things is no different than the necromancer, he has summon spell, curses, and poison/fire skills. the only thing that sets him different from the D2 necro is the fact that he does not only summon dead things and he has the added ability of fire. For the most part his play looks to be pretty much spot on to the Necro (when boiled down to its core fundamentally)

So I just don't understand you you think the Bard is some strange character. The bard will fit that Ranged spot, and that will be its place, i dont know whats else to say. He will have "song" abilities that and Mostly ranged abilitys. The Ranger is still a valid option do not get me wrong and i would be okay with play as a ranger, but i feel that Bard and Ranger would function alsomt the same, the only thing the Bard has different are its songs and love lore which makes for a more interesting character in my opinion.

Depending on where you look at it the Bard is an Archetype class, D&D? yes. Oblivion? Yes. Is it an archetype class in the world of Diablo? No! thats what makes it new and exciting! I see no reason with adding the Bard.

OKay, Is a druid an extreme killing class? This definition is taken dicrectly from dictionary.com when you search Druid:

Druid
Dru"id\, n. [L. Druides; of Celtic origin; cf. Ir. & Gael. draoi, druidh, magician, Druid, W. derwydd Druid.]

1. One of an order of priests which in ancient times existed among certain branches of the Celtic race, especially among the Gauls and Britons.

Note: The Druids superintended the affairs of religion and morality, and exercised judicial functions. They practiced divination and magic, and sacrificed human victims as a part of their worship. They consisted of three classes; the bards, the vates or prophets, and the Druids proper, or priests. Their most sacred rites were performed in the depths of oak forests or of caves.

Uhhh, I hope that makes the bards look a little bit more BAD@$$ to everyone. Point made for number 3.

A druid Didn't look right in full plate and neither did an Assassin for that matter. I find Point 8 to be irrelevant.

So if you ask me that's 7 of 7 man. The Bard has more going for itself that people want to admit, there's just the stereotyping stigma to overcome, people have to be willing to forget what they know about the Bard and move on with this new look.

[LaZeR]

Stillman, your post is wonderful. You actually convinced me. However, I must comment on a couple of things:

1. The WD is a wild card (well, he will be, for now he's a pretty basic Spellcaster), but that doesn't mean he's the only one. So don't strike out a 2nd Wild Card just yet.

2. The appearance in Heavy Armor is irrelavant. As done with D2, and I belive Blizz will improve in D3, Heavy Armors' appearance will be different from char to char. So even if the WD (and the Wiz) doesn't sound good in a Heavy Armor, the graphic for them will fit to their style- For exmaple, the WD will have some kind of Leaves Armor or the Wiz will have more armored Robes.

3. I agree. I REALLY can't see a Pirate in D3. Just not enough Lore and Skills ideas. I don't see why you're insisting on it.

4. Names are not a problem as well. You can make up names that suits both Female and Male for any type of char. For example. instead of naming the Spellcaster char the Sorcerer, they named it the Wizard- Which works both ways.

5. Concerning skills- I trust Blizzard will be able to make up 70 skills for every char type, even a Templer Knight (and especially a Templer Knight- That's actually a char with many skills possibilities). So that, too, isn't a real problem.

6. About the Calderum Soldier- I too see a problem with this char. I mean, a Lut Gholein, desert theme, Mercenery type char is great idea which as been brought up many times, but why restrict him to pikes and javelines? Make him a Desert Warrior of some sort, kinda like the one I've been discussing in my "Mystery Char" thread.

7. You kinda contradicts yourself. You say in point 1 that Blizz will make Hybrid chars, but in points 2 and on you elaborate on how D3 is going for a basic, unoriginal, "know-right-from-the -first-look-what-they're-like" chars. This is, however, where you convinced me- The next 2 classes WILL BE pure & extreme chars. So a Ranger will be a blown out Ranger and a Shape Shifter will be a really, fully Shape Shifter.
This doesn't say they're gonna be boring and unoriginal. Look at the Wiz- They added to his basic spells time warpping and melee skills. Look at the Barb- The remade him and added him a whole new mechanic- the Fury system. That is what I belive what they'll do, for exmaple, with the Ranger. It'll be an extreme physical range attack focused char, but new and exciting stuff that will make it interesting and new.

P.S
Oh yeah, concerning the OP. Great post, very nicely re-organized. And thanks for the credit, although, lunarleif, I can't really say I'm the guy who "came up with geomancer". It's a very popular and already brought up idea. And if I'm the guy who "is currently working on a Geomancer class so I am going to wait on describing what skills this class could possibly use"- Feel free to DO describe those skills, I could sure use some help and inspiration ^^

[lunarleif]

As Lazer said, a pirate would be hard pressed to exist. Also, a thief doesn't work since that's to evil off a character and they steal and don't just fight. So far, all of Blizzard's characters have presences. Wizard is better than everyone else, barbarian hacks anything in its way to death, and the witch doctor has a weird wild card presence.

[Technomancer]

Oww, my eyes! :D

@stillman: You know, in a way you ruled out adding any more classes! Since everything has to be extreme and there's already an extreme warrior, extreme caster, and extreme oddball, what could possibly be left?! You are right in that they want things to be big'n'bad, but the barb and wiz doesn't necessarily mean everything else is gonna be that extreme in direction. Maybe they were just getting those out of the way first. I don't think you could keep that up without going stupid. As to gender neutral names, I don't really view any of the names so far as that, especially the Witch Doctor. I have never in my life imagined a female WD until D3. I'm not saying it won't work, I think it's innovative, but what I'm saying is don't count too much out on that basis. Pikeman is about the only name I've heard that could be gender biased. I've imagined female Knights plenty. Plenty... </perv>

@commonhumans: You know I was thinking about polearm characters and the problem of their weapon choices being too narrow. Maybe it would be best if you just gave the Caldeum Warrior the innate ability to use any spears or polearms in one hand like the D2 Barb with swords. This would allow him still use a shield, keep his equipment options open, and still give him an easy go-to 'big-sticker'! :D If you were gonna have any 'pike' specific skills, keep them to a minimum and balance them with skills for non-pike weps too.

[stillman]

Good points, though I figgure if they fail to make the next two classes as extreme as the wizard and barb, people will not like them. Right away, people saw how lame the WD looked in comparison and many disapproved of the WD, whereas nearly no one disapproved of the barb and wizard. Just little minor issues with those 2.

I think they will indeed strive to 'go stupid', especially with the archer class. Right off the bat, we would think they have to at least match the amazon from d2. Matching her alone will be pretty extreme. She had multishot and strafe pumping arrows all over the screen. So with 24 arrows and 3 shots per second, that's a ridiculous amount of arrows on the screen. They've got to top that for d3. Why? Well, it looks like they've topped the barb in d2 and the sorceress. The barb for instance has way more area of effect going on compared to the d2 barb. The wizard can now manipulate time and whether unlike the pure elementalist sorceress of d2.

It just seems like they're trying to outdo d2 in a number of ways. More, death animations, more godly skills, etc.

commonhumans, just to prove I'm not totally closed minded about bards, I designed my own in such a way that I feel is the only possible way it could work in d3. Here it is:

http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7176541#post7176541

Yes, I think it would be good for the archer class as it makes sense that someone with fine fingers, dexterity for playing instruments, etc, would be a good bow user. This is a good option because a bard with a melee weapon, getting splattered with blood all over his fine clothes, just doesn't work for me. But at the same time, the archer class has got a ton of fans to please and being a bard might disappoint some of the old school bowazon fans.

Also, I agree about the assassin and druid looking very bad in heavy armor; that's why I didn't like the expansion characters. But in the old d2, the only class who looked silly in armor was the necro with his children's Halloween costume look. However, they could have made him look better and it would have made sense for a necro to wear full plate. He has underlings working for him, this shows power, and powerful people tend to have money and armor to proctect their pompous selves.

The sorc and necro make sense in armor because they are exploring crypts where they likely will find mage armor, and the whole power thing I talked about. People of power, or wealthy status, should have armor.

[lunarleif]

What you do about armor is not change the outer appearance.

[LaZeR]

[QUOTE=Technomancer;7176513]

@stillman: You know, in a way you ruled out adding any more classes! Since everything has to be extreme and there's already an extreme warrior, extreme caster, and extreme oddball, what could possibly be left?! QUOTE]

That's pretty easy. Extreme Ranger, extreme ShapeShifter, extreme Summoner, extreme defensive/buffs?
It's hard for me to rule out the extreme Fast Melee char though, even if it kinda resembles the Barb.

[Ishtor]

I really like the post i have read, and LOL Stillman when you make a post and you have to summerize.... that is fricken funny. Made alot of good valued points though.

Here is my food for thought. Some one maybe mentioned this in the last thread, but this is why i think Bard is going to be in this game for sure. Sierra, even though Hellfire was not official, was denied the ability to use the barb and bard, but for what reason. If it was the charecter did not fit, why would they use the barb in the next game. Blizzard is not dumb by far, and i think they now what they like and want and when they want to give it to us.

I bet Blizzard had future plans for both of those classes and wanted to make sure that they where not tainted,or messed up from how they w ould fit into lore. the Lore that backed up D2, gave a great oppurtunity to anounce the barbarion, but not yet the bard.

I am pretty sure Blizzard said this game would finish off the series, which to me is very sad, but this is the last time Blizzard will have to relase a charecter they want to release. If the Bard is not releases in the original 5 classes. i bet it will be atleast given to us in one of the expansion we get for the game.

some one said something about a thief, just because some one is a thief does not mean there evil, but having a thief type class in d3 would be funny as hell.... inmagine this.

thief walks into town and goes upto the blacksmith.

Blacksmith says "Oh, A thief, i will be keeping eye on you. If i see you try to take something i will cut off your head with one of my axes! oh! by the way my darter ran off in the woods, could you get for me?"

LOL

sorry i have my own since of humor. But i have to say i can not wait for Blizzcon so we can see what our ranged class is.

[sirroman]

You know... I thought "meh! when I read the bard thing. Then somebody poinetd out that the druidic "caste" (class? people?) had their own share of bards. And my head exploded with awesomeness. BOOM! ^^

And I read the "here's how a Bard COULD..." topic from stillman and I got some food for thought.

Here's what I figured out after all that:

The "HHaBCWiD3NtIWaBHOot5S" Bard (hehe, the Stillman's one) just can't exist: playing with your voice spells you make him a wizard, actually, worse then a wizard, because Wizards can use orbs and Staffs, Stillmans's bard couldn't use any weapon and would be far apart from the other classes.

So... like a pseudo-wizard, it's out. Like a weapon-less class, it's out.

----

But couldn't a bard get really cool and efficient if we meshed together the Barb singer experience and the Druidic-lore? I say YES!

The D3 Bard would be a nature's priest, one that uses his songs to harvest the nature's power to turn the tide of the battle, one that can touch the inner self of the beasts to ease their wrath, one that can mend the bones of the fallen to get them on their feet, and when it's their soul that is damaged, the D3 Bard is the one to restore their will to battle.

And also a nature's warrior, for the Wild is a place where "the survival of the fittest" is the only rule, and each and every animal is ready to try the Bards' power over them. The bard knows that as the defender of nature AND his culture, he must enforce to protect both of them... and himself.

SOOOOO... I really imagine the Bard more like a half-druid, a class that can both go ranged (hunting), melee (blunt-weapons, spears, shields) and spell-casting (song-based).

He can somewhat shapeshift, for he comes from the same culture of the Druid (D2-LoD), but his shapeshifting isn't "pure", he can't become a full wolf neither a full bear, but he can channel his knowledge to change bits of his human body, grow claws, wings, horns and even a hide... he becomes faster, tougher and stronger.

He could also have minor healing powers, like a ability that enhances the drop of red-dots for all the party, or some kind of holy bolt from close range (he can use herbs, right? ^^).

And then, we could even see him making songs with weapons! What if, when using a shield he taps it with his mace while chanelling a spell? What if he rotates his spear to get that eery song? With small spell, he could turn a bow into a Lyre, even a Harp!

Well... now I'm kind of out of ideas, or I'm just tired to recall them all. What do you guys think?

[Technomancer]

Hmm, actually Sirroman has me thinking now. If you did something of Druidic Bard like he's saying, that would get it fairly similar to a Ranger. So, what I'm thinking is what if you combined that Druidic Bard with a Ranger? Would have everything in a very consistent package: melee and missile skills, nature abilities, and musical related abilities tied into it all. I think it could work, it'd just be putting all the pieces together. I have no interest in putting those pieces together myself, I'm swamped and like my Bard better ;), but I think a class like this could please a lot more people.

Summary of skill types: melee, missile, stealth, buffs/debuffs, nature, and maybe shapeshifting. That's a lot of possibilities. I think that the WD may be the primary 'nature' character for D3, though, so there may be some overlap. You could maybe even add in a holy angle instead like Lazer was talking about on my bard thread.

[sirroman]

Hmm, actually Sirroman has me thinking now. If you did something of Druidic Bard like he's saying, that would get it fairly similar to a Ranger. So, what I'm thinking is what if you combined that Druidic Bard with a Ranger? Would have everything in a very consistent package: melee and missile skills, nature abilities, and musical related abilities tied into it all. I think it could work, it'd just be putting all the pieces together. I have no interest in putting those pieces together myself, I'm swamped and like my Bard better ;), but I think a class like this could please a lot more people.

Summary of skill types: melee, missile, stealth, buffs/debuffs, nature, and maybe shapeshifting. That's a lot of possibilities. I think that the WD may be the primary 'nature' character for D3, though, so there may be some overlap. You could maybe even add in a holy angle instead like Lazer was talking about on my bard thread.

Finally I give up! Please take a look at my new topic, "Druidic Bard: A whole new view!" (http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7178012#post7178012). I believe it's quite nice, it has a new "music mechanic" that I find very satisfying and... well... take a look.

Please, if you guys feel the urge, you can fill the blank spots, or just wait 'till I wake from my hibernation. xD

[Galabab]

Common people Bard sounds awfull...
I know, with enough insight and common sense one can be persuaded to find them cool too, BUT thats not the way free market works. They want the names to sound like BANG and immediatly pull the right strings, so kids who deside whether to buy the game do buy it.
Bard just sounds ghey. It was my first oppinion and im sure its the same for many many people.


Now im using Sherlock Holmes method to find 1 of the missing 2 classes!
We will rule out the impossible!
You guys made a good job at finding the 4 classes most likely to come:

1.bard
2.archer
3.summoner
4.shapeshifter

I just told why bard is out of the question. Marketing reasons. And lack of certanity.

1.archer
2.summoner
3.shapeshifter

So what seems pretty impossible to me is that they are gonna throw out one of major fun things from d2. They will try to preserve the good sides. So all 3 of these will be there. The only question is which will get a full character spot.

1.Archer:
Basicly an archer is just a ranged attacker so it is unlikely but possible that they dont appear at all as wizzard already does the job. Besides Id like to see tha Barbarian having a bow skill tree. Have you read Conan THE Barbarian? He was a great bowman and MANY barbarians in history used bows (obviosly its a primitive weapon).

2.Summoner.
The WD is a summoner. We havent even seen all of his skills yet. Im pretty sure he will have lots more of summons ready. If there is a class more adept at summoning whats the purpose of the WD?

3.Shapeshifter.
There we have the only 100% contender. Shapeshifting found a lot of friends in d2. Its a facinating concept. Its super cool and its immediatly cool.
One of the clases left will be a shapeshifter.

What kind of? With high certanity a totally new race. Its impossible to fruitfully speculate on this. It could be anybody.

[LaZeR]

Did you left out a Shield&Sword char on purpose?
Or a Fast Melee char?

And the Wizard doesn't fill the Archer type. Nor the Barb. The Wizard is a MAGICAL Ranger, not a physical one and the Barb doesn't have (for now) ANY skills that supports physical ranging- And for a good reason: It would screw up the whole Fury system).
So we DO need a char that can wield a Bow. For now, we have none.

[Galabab]

Did you left out a Shield&Sword char on purpose?
Or a Fast Melee char?

And the Wizard doesn't fill the Archer type. Nor the Barb. The Wizard is a MAGICAL Ranger, not a physical one and the Barb doesn't have (for now) ANY skills that supports physical ranging- And for a good reason: It would screw up the whole Fury system).
So we DO need a char that can wield a Bow. For now, we have none.

Shield/Sword kind of character is unlikely. If it will have auras it would be totally the paladin and thats not gonna happen. So what else can he do that barbs cannot?
The barbarian now even has the charge skill right?
Fast melee, slow melee, it doesnt matter much. I think barbs will be able to use fast weapons. I dont think those assassins (who were supposed to be fast melee) were any faster than barbs, just smaller..

The archer isnt really needed you see? You can still have that ranged attack fun with a mage. Think of all those fury amazons we have now? What are they else than a sorceress? Gameplay-wise.

But still arhcer remains a pretty possible choice.

[commonhumans]

The sword and board character is WAAAAAY more likley than a Shape Shifting class.

Point and Case -- The druid came out in the D2 xpac and it was a pseudo hybrid character... and if we are sticking to our "extremes theory" the Shape Shifter is not likely to show up in the core game.

It will be ranged. and it will be sword and board. both with a twist.

[stillman]

^Galabab, your first paragraph makes total sense. I believe the classes (being that there are only 5) cannot have much overlap at all. So if they go with a sword & shield class we have a problem: the barb already has this covered so we get redundancy, when we could have had a very different class for more variety. There would kind of be two shield pros and there's no room for two. 'This town (of five) isn't big enough for the two of us,' comes to mind.

So they would, imo, have to make a sword & shield class a hybrid of something else, like 'shapeshifer shield', 'stealth shield' or w/e. It can't just be shield class. That's if they go with a shield pro at all.

Zons...in d2 I believe the whole point was said in their description on the character selection screen, "versatile" being the key word. They emulated the sorc's chain lightning and glacial spike, the necro's bonespear (kind of) with magic arrow and pierce, and others. I'll have to think hard on whether Blizzard will try this sort of copy cat again in d3. It's something that really needs to be looked into. d2 allowed her to do all kinds of her own stunts in addition to being a copy cat if you so choose.

Edit: In earlier threads, I think almost everyone agreed there would be an archer type of class, there was just great suspense as to what they'd do with her/him exactly. They'd make a lot of players angry if there was no expert bow user. The big mystery will always be the fifth.

Actually, Galabab, what you said about the first impression of the name is of key importance. It has to instantly tell us the whole story of the character, just as the wizard, barbarian and WD effectively do. There is no confusion or guess work on behalf of us ADHD players. One look...and BAM! Barbarian = best melee choice. BAM!! Wizard = nuker, elements. BAM!! WD = craziness, figgure-stuff-out opaqueness. Another pattern emerges.

10- THE NAME SHOULD SAY IT ALL, WITH NO PLAYERS LEFT GUESSING OR WONDERING WHAT THE CLASS IS ALL ABOUT.

It's a get up and go game, and the class names must reflect this.

[commonhumans]

I mean not to play devils advocate (but i am) Amazon certainly does not reflect any certainty. I mean think about the word Amazon pre Diablo 2 -- Big tall Women that lived in the Jungle, you didn't assume that they would be bow and java users did you? Part of the fun figuring out a Zon was, was making one.

I still dont know 100% what coming out in the core... BUT I WANT A BARD! Bwahahaha.

[lunarleif]

What's wrong with making the bard a ranger, summoner, sword and shield? A jack of all trades who you can play different styles and combine them. Summon, fire arrows, and close in. What's wrong with that? Only functional if you can change your weapon arrangement like D2 expansion.

[Fackelare]

I still dont know 100% what coming out in the core... BUT I WANT A BARD! Bwahahaha.

What exactly is so great about being a bard. It seems to be me, but I have no desire to start singing to demons, nor playing my lute...

This might exactly be a good reason for blizzard not to include it in their (only) 5 characters. Since people will not know why you would want te serenade demons..?

[LaZeR]

Shield/Sword kind of character is unlikely. If it will have auras it would be totally the paladin and thats not gonna happen. So what else can he do that barbs cannot?
The barbarian now even has the charge skill right?
Fast melee, slow melee, it doesnt matter much. I think barbs will be able to use fast weapons. I dont think those assassins (who were supposed to be fast melee) were any faster than barbs, just smaller..

The archer isnt really needed you see? You can still have that ranged attack fun with a mage. Think of all those fury amazons we have now? What are they else than a sorceress? Gameplay-wise.

But still arhcer remains a pretty possible choice.

And I have to disagree.

Sword and Shield
I see why Sword&Shield char would be similar to the Barb, but it's whole playing style. The Barb is all about power- Fast moving, fast killing, from one battle to the next. The Fury system emphasized that BIG TIME. Out S&S char, however, will be a slower killer, with focuses the Barb doesn't have on Defense and Tactics.

Ranger
1. You can get the "fun" of range char with the Wiz, but it's not physical range attack, not does it consider as a "master" Range abilities.
2. More importantly- There is no char yet to justify the existance of Bows in the game. Barb, Wizard, WD- None of them have Physical Range encouraging skills. And we KNOW Bows will be in D3.
3. And last but not least- Archer/Ranger is the most popular basic type of D&D, and it fits perfectly with the whole "understand what the char does right from the first look".


P.S
Am I the only one can't imagine Shape-Shifting holding a WHOLE char?

[commonhumans]

@ Lunarleif -- The problem with making the Bard all of that is that it does indeed become a jack of all trades but... a master of none. It becomes entirly to watered down if you were to do that.

@ Fackelare -- Whats not so great? There is so much one could do with this new spin on a character. I believe that at heart the Bard to be a highly range focused character with the ability of magical songs to aid him. Just because hes a bard doesn't mean that hes going to sing monsters to death. That's not the point, he will be a ranged fighter that happens to have a deep love for the arts and music.

This is still speculation, and im just guessing and pulling for what id like to see, and ill admit it yes, in the back of my mind i know this character wont show up in the core, and thats fine, ill be happy with anything that dos show up, but that doesn't mean i still wont be pulling for it (in some form) to show up in an expansion.

I would almost bet my life on the fact that 4th & 5th characters appearing in the Diablo 3 core game will NOT be shape shifters... almost.

[Galabab]

You gotta be kidding me!
There will be a shape shifter among the 5!!!
I bet 3 diablo3 high runes!

[lunarleif]

Well, making him jack is generally not a good idea. Fine, but what's wrong with devoting a tree to each. One for songs, range, and fight.

[sirroman]

You gotta be kidding me!
There will be a shape shifter among the 5!!!
I bet 3 diablo3 high runes!

And I bet the shapeshifter will be... the Bard! =DDDD

[Technomancer]

Am I the only one can't imagine Shape-Shifting holding a WHOLE char?
Nope. You're not alone.

And I bet the shapeshifter will be... the Bard! =DDDD
I think you just blew everyone's mind!!

You know, I've been thinking, and I think everyone's right. The core 5 won't be bard nor shapeshifter. They will both be in the expansion! Both of them, that's right! I think the 5th class is gonna be a Zakarum Inquisitor, and the 4th is gonna some form of heavy ranger/sword'n'board type character. That's my call. I think those are the two more important roles that need to be filled right away: Holy caster with a bit of combat (NOT paladin), and a ranged character that can throw down up close and personal. That's my prediction.

[Galabab]

and the 4th is gonna some form of heavy ranger/sword'n'board type character. That's my call.

that does make sense to me.
A kind of soldier class. Good in shield rows and adept with the bow. That makes sense AND it would make an other melee character still deffer from the barb.

The Zakarum Inquisitor I also like (you know i created a thread about them) and Id love to see them but i just cant imagine they wont put in the shapeshifter.

[LaZeR]

Wait, isn't the Zakarum Inquisitor the Sword & Shield char?
What is he then?

[Galabab]

Nope, hes more of a caster, using thgings like blessd hammer, fist of heavens and maybe 1 melee tree.

[sirroman]

Nope. You're not alone.


I think you just blew everyone's mind!!

You know, I've been thinking, and I think everyone's right. The core 5 won't be bard nor shapeshifter. They will both be in the expansion! Both of them, that's right! I think the 5th class is gonna be a Zakarum Inquisitor, and the 4th is gonna some form of heavy ranger/sword'n'board type character. That's my call. I think those are the two more important roles that need to be filled right away: Holy caster with a bit of combat (NOT paladin), and a ranged character that can throw down up close and personal. That's my prediction.

Of course I blew everyone's mind! hehe!

Oh! If ANYBODY want's to look at my Shapeshifter Bard... don't look any further! go to Druidic Bard (http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=731443)!! =DDD

Ok, off the propaganda, on the discussion. I believe that since the Paladin was SO iconic and any holy melee (sword'n'board) would be a "paladin with a different art", if Blizz wants to surprise us, they will either give us (filling the Holy spot):


A Ranged/Melee Holy Character: [AKA "White" Cleric]
It could be a ranged cleric, blasting enemies with holy light. It could be the Zakarum Inquisitor, but I foresee a higher focus on ranged.
A Melee Nature Character: [AKA "Green" Cleric]
It could be a less of a "shapeshifter" Druid, and more of a "normal" druid that we picture.


Yeah... it seems that again I am making some more propaganda towards my Bard... :whistling: (which could easily fill that second dot).

Right now I believe the first is far far ahead, for we all love the feel of "CRUSADE", otherwise Blizz can play safe and go for "TEMPLARS!" creating a holy character that is closer to the paladin. ^^

Oh! I just recalled the wizard/sorceress class, which didn't changed THAT MUCH during the itterations of the game (D1, D2...). So maybe Blizz really like to play safe?

[LaZeR]

I think "A Ranged/Melee Holy Character" can be some kind of a Demon Hunter, too. With Holy vibe ofc.

[peasant]

If I remember right, the Zakarum was heavily corrupted by Mephisto. Therefore, here's a rough class idea based on this:

Inquisitor ~ A ranged character who uses plate armor whose purpose is to hunt down the corrupted Paladins. He has lost his faith in the Light. However, that does not mean the Light has given up on him. Hence, his abilities have a holy theme to them but he doesn't pray and the character is largely pessimistic.

[Demongod]

How about this:

NINJA!

Skill trees:
Blademaster (melee DPS)
Ninjutsu Master (mix of shadow magic and debuffs)
Assassin (poisons, ranged weapons, traps, stealth)

Let's go down that rubric:

1) Combination of classes: check. Combination of barbarian, wizard, and possibly WD.

2) Archetypical--Ninjas have been in video games since DAY ONE. Hello! Scorpion and Sub Zero? Ninja Gaiden on the NES?

3) Extreme--No other class uses subterfuge and a combination of melee, magic, and range to always win in any situation.

4) Ninjas are nobody's creation. They are a historical fact. Although historically they were merely spies that were psychologically invisible (EG nobody thought that the little peasant working on the Daimyo's garden was really a ninja plotting to kill him), the romanticizing of ninjas have made the only thing in common with everyone's imagination of them is some form of stealth. The rest can range from a relatively realistic ninja using smoke bombs, poison-coated weapons, rope, etc... to teleporting magic-casting super-fighters that could take down an army alone. Certainly, while there have been hundreds of ninja imaginings, there are very likely an infinite amount of ways to re-invent a ninja.

5) Gender--covered. We all know about male ninjas, and of course, female ninjas for when not only do you want to think that ninjas are so cool, but to see them as a sex icon as well. There is some truth to this that female ninjas were likely Geishas or had other roles which emphasized their sex appeal in an attempt to assassinate or extract information from their targets. Of course, in this case, said sex appeal need not be so relevant.

6) Reasons for fighting evil: ninjas use the powers of shadow and darkness, but remember, ninjas for the most part were extremely loyal people, and usually have an extreme "ends justify the means" methodology in that they'll use anything to fight evil. Ninjas can have all sorts of reasons. I mean come on...they're ninjas!

7) Skills: As I said, you can always make an original ninja.

8) Items: While it may be slightly awkward to see a ninja wielding a barbarian's sword, ninjas are highly trained individuals and can use any item they find. Furthermore, in terms of wearing full plate mail armor...well...if you've ever seen the show "Ninja Warrior" on G4, the point of the show is to compete through a massive obstacle course that makes even soldiers look like fools. The ideal contestant (EG champion Makoto Nagano) must have great speed, tremendous upper body strength, and great will. Certainly, if some decently-fed European bumpkin can have the strength to put on a suit of plate mail, then certainly a highly-trained, skills-honed shinobi would be able to wear that same equipment. Of course, the graphics might look very different. For instance, ninja plate mail might look like something out of mortal kombat, except made out of steel, and more armor around the arms. And frankly, if a delicate female wizard or Mr. frail African witch doctor can wear heavy plate, then certainly a strong ninja can.

[stillman]

Ninjas are the ultimate action figgures. They got stealth, martial arts, range attacks, even bows, jump attacks, weapons mastery, ninja magic (smoke bombs, posinon, etc). They've got everything. They're also the 'fast' melee. The only deterant is there's already an Asain, the Wizard, but hey, if they want to have a double Asain presence that's fine. Or they could do their own take and make it work with some other race, like the American Ninja movies. And ninjas could have Samurai looking armor, and there was some heavy looking laquored stuff iirc. Blizzard could just make up some story bit about some ninjas being battle lords who prefer more armor over stealth. It'd be cool to see them climbing walls using the physics in d3.

As for Inquisitor, it is an original idea, but maybe too original. No player would know what they're all about; we'd have to play them for a while to figgure it out and Blizzard wouldn't do that to us twice...that's what the WD is for. The only reason we'll all be able to quickly figgure out the WD's gameplay is because all of us fans know he emulates the necro in some ways (and some say he emulates the druid), but newcommers to the Diablo world won't know what the heck the WD is...is he an alternate mage to the wizard, a party helper w/ curses, or what? Would Blizzard confuse the new kids twice with 2 'figgure 'em out' classes? That leaves only 3 clear cut obvious classes. They want the game simple as possible, playable-with-a-mouse-alone simplicity.

Plus the Zakarum would confuse new players even more. No one ever heard of that unless they played d2.

[sirroman]

Well, ninjas would actually cover a "stealth" (or "rogue") slot that is open.

And... Yeah, a fiiine Kunoichi would be awesome to see in this game.

It would have to be from the same order (or close to) of the assassin, I suppose... Anyone could explain the background of the Assassin class from D2? I confess that I have NO IDEA where she came from...

Next "Style slots" I believe shall be on the Big 5:
1# Stealth
2# Holy

"Fighting slots" that *could/should appear":
1# Swoard'n'board
2# Ranged
3# Shapeshifting

Yeah, we could really see a "ninja-like" class filling the first style slot and the second fighting slot, I suppose?

But I would rather see a class like the inquisitor then the ninja, 'cause I find the Assassin pretty well designed (even if I didn't like to play that Class).

-----

@ Stillman: I don't believe that "fast melee" is a problem, take a look at D2, which class would you call the "fast melee"? And which would be the "slow melee"?

FAST MELEE
1# Barbarian: frenzy, double wield - FAST!
2# Paladin: Zeal, Fanaticism - FAST!
3# Assassin: Kicks and Ninja stars - FAST! (ninja star: fastest attack of the game!)
4# Amazon: jab, strafe - FAST!
5# Druid: Fury - FAST!

SLOW MELEE
1# Sorceress
2# Necromancer

See? every class that doesn't resolve around magic can attack really fast in one way or another.

[stillman]

That's true. Some people are counting the fast melee as a potential class type or an aspect of one, I guess that's why I bring it up.

[theeliminator]

What about Myrmidons, they can use a Sword and Board but can be the only class that can use a 2 handed spear/polearm with one hand with a shield or net in the other. This will make a medium ranged melee class wich would be very different from the current classes

This class could be ranged as well with throwing Javelins

The myrmidons would be very similar to the Amazions, but with a few tweeks

Another thought, why can't Diablo 3 have fire arms? It's 20 years later, maybe they just invented them. I know this might be a slightly un-diablo thought but just run with it a sec.

Demon Hunter, could be much like the Witch hunter from warhammer. (or something like Van Helsing) they use one handed sword in one hand and a wheellock pistol in the other. They could have a combo system like the Assassin did in D2. maybe even have traps like the Assassin did as well.

I don't think you can count out a caster with a shield aka the Iron Wolves Clan Mages from act 3. They could play very similar to Paladins.

Another option for a shield bearer could be a classical style cleric in D&D, he fights with only blunt weapons and has some holy spells.

I really don't think there will be a stealth class cause that goes against all that Blizz said they wanted for D3, that being a fast-pased game. Stealth will just slow the action down.

Although it would be very hard to pull off, I think a Shapshifter could work. Each tree would have to be a different shape, and each shape could have its own play style.

I would still like to see a monk class, who can use all kinds of cool weapons maybe use a combo system. the 3 trees for the monk could be meditation/melee/ medium ranged melee.

[LaZeR]

I REALLY like the Ninja idea. It's a class you know what's all about right from the first look, and Blizz drop the Stealth idea and focus more on Speed and Martial Arts, this could end up very well.
A bit re-make of the Assasian, but the Wizard is a re-make of the Sorceress and the Barb is a re-make of, well, the Barb.




FAST MELEE
1# Barbarian: frenzy, double wield - FAST!
2# Paladin: Zeal, Fanaticism - FAST!
3# Assassin: Kicks and Ninja stars - FAST! (ninja star: fastest attack of the game!)
4# Amazon: jab, strafe - FAST!
5# Druid: Fury - FAST!

SLOW MELEE
1# Sorceress
2# Necromancer

See? every class that doesn't resolve around magic can attack really fast in one way or another.

Meh, it's different. It's not the skills rather the feeling you get from the char.
The Barb did have (only) 2 fast skills, but his all vibe, and most of his skills, were in the idea of 1 powerful KO.
Same with the Paladin. Hes had 2-3 fast skills, but most of his skills and vibe were a Magical, Sword&Shield char.
The Amazon was fast, but it was more of a Range fast char, and we're looking for Melee fast char.
The Druid was fast in his Wolf form, not as a Melee Fighter.

To make a Fast Melee char you have to unable him to dual wield, and make most of his skills, and most importantly- his feel, Fast.
I must say none of the D2 REALLY had that. Only the Assa's Martial Arts had that..

[sirroman]

I REALLY
Meh, it's different. It's not the skills rather the feeling you get from the char.
The Barb did have (only) 2 fast skills, but his all vibe, and most of his skills, were in the idea of 1 powerful KO.
Same with the Paladin. Hes had 2-3 fast skills, but most of his skills and vibe were a Magical, Sword&Shield char.
The Amazon was fast, but it was more of a Range fast char, and we're looking for Melee fast char.
The Druid was fast in his Wolf form, not as a Melee Fighter.

To make a Fast Melee char you have to unable him to dual wield, and make most of his skills, and most importantly- his feel, Fast.
I must say none of the D2 REALLY had that. Only the Assa's Martial Arts had that..

That's the point! Every class *could* go fast melee (even the amazon with jab, she could even go slow with empale haha) it wasn't forced upon you!

Look, we can be sure that Blizz really wants to make Class in a way that let people play it the way they want. Can I play with a ranger (paladin with a bow)? yes you can! Can I play with a assassin that throws stars? Yes you can!.

Have you ever played with a Frenzy Barb? THAT was the crazyest Character Build I ever played! It had a so strong feel like "GRAAH! KILL! KILL! GO FORWARD! NEVER STOP! GO GO!" that it's just insane to play it hehe. Actually it didn't stop even when the mana ran out! You only needed to cast double strike (that's the name?) that refilled your mana pool with each attack and without mana steal! You only stopped to go forward for two things: Too many or too little enemies.

Yet you could go for whirlwind or concentration or berzerk.

And with a Fury Druid? it was amazing to see it claw through the enemies attacking without a blink and hurl itself against others.

yet you could go elemental, rabies, Werebear, Summon, etc...

You know? "Fast attack" isn't that groundbreaking (or interesting!) to make a character around it, neither to take a whole "character slot" on the big 5 (or little 2 - expansion classes). That's it seems to me anyway.

[Galabab]

I have to agree with Sirroman.
Its unlikely they want to make a WoW rogue if thats what you, Lazer, mean with a fast melee.
The whole concept of "being fast" is just a plain requirement for any good melee.
Playing a slow charecter is simply no fun at all.
So I too believe they will or should safe the slots for more extremly different guys.
(like shapeshifters :D )

[Technomancer]

What about Myrmidons, they can use a Sword and Board but can be the only class that can use a 2 handed spear/polearm with one hand with a shield or net in the other. This will make a medium ranged melee class wich would be very different from the current classes
That was actually the original name and some of the original idea I was using when I started developing my new Phase Knight (http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=731546). Oh yeah, I thought I'd plug that too ;). It's sort of my idea of the heavy ranged/shield class I was talking about earlier, plus quite a bit more. I think it fits better than my original Arcane Warrior would.

As to Ninjas, with the introduction of an Asian based location, the possibility is there. There wouldn't be a large focus on stealth, I don't think it would fit the play style, but there could be a real focus on fast melee. I think the point of that character would be to not be a one-hit killer, but to barrage one or many foes with a flood of attacks that would mount up to kill very quickly. I think that's something I was trying to go towards with the first tree on my Bard Class (http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=731051). Another plug, I wrote a huge new lore section for him.

Growing up with Nintendo, it seemed like every game had some kind of eastern ninja/samurai theme to it and I got really sick of it. I think if they did a Ninja class, they would probably try to go out of place with it and make it nontraditional. I hope they would, otherwise it'd feel cheap and hokey to me. Hmm, no one else has mentioned 'Samurai'... ;)

With the Shapeshifter idea, I can't really imagine a class having more than 1, maybe 2 trees devoted to shapeshifting. I think there will be some form of that somewhere, but I think it will piggyback onto another class, much like it did with the Druid. I'm not really sure it's such a high priority. I mean, in D2, only 1 out of 21 skill trees were devoted to that, and only in the add-in at that.

With the Cleric class, I was thinking about the D&D Cleric too, even the emphasis on blunt weapons. I think the focus would be taken away from healing, slightly backed off on combat, and more on offensive/defensive magics.

[LaZeR]

I have to agree with Sirroman.


I have to say: Me to.
Although I'd still miss the fast, swift, dual wielding, multiple hitting char, you made some real good point, and I have to agree-
A Fast Melee focused char doesn't seem likely.

[Demongod]

But here's the thing--the assassin isn't all that well designed. A ninja doesn't use claws. A ninja uses swords and stars. And certainly, the ninja doesn't take 3 seconds to get into a star throwing position. Nor does a ninja attack slower than a paladin or lose to a barbarian in a duel.

The assassin isn't all that well designed because the martial arts tree as a whole sucks. Literally, the only useful skill there is dragon talon and perhaps dragon flight for a one pointer. Considering that Chaos is created for a main PvP attack, there's something very wrong going on. The shadow tree is decent but mind blast is no blessed hammer, and the traps are like stationary sorc spells.

The ninja should be adaptable, and I'll assert that he or she should be the single best single-target killer in the game bar none. After all, the ninjas are supposed to be the ultimate assassin--and what do assassins theoretically excel at? Single target kills.

[theeliminator]

The Ninja will, most likely, not happen. They already have one "asian" looking class. (the Wiz) I am sure we wont see another. This is also why we won't get a Monk as well.

I can see a Rouge/Assasin mix being the most likely. They could use bows and daggers/hand weapons.

[lunarleif]

Ninja doesn't sound like Diablo. Assassin is a much better name for that type of class. Also, ninja would have what skills? Are those skills even Diablo 3?

[Demongod]

The ninja need not be Asian. It can very well be a McNinja, so to speak. Either way, so far, we have a massive strength class (barb), two spell classes (witchy/wiz), but no agility class.

The ninja is the idealized agility action hero. DPS, massive spells, etc...what's it missing?

[lunarleif]

I'd rather have a bard. Ninja is to new-school already existent for Diablo. Witch doctor is completely new, barbarian and wizard are as old as you can get. Ninja was a side class in DnD if at all, which helps denote how important it is. Ninjas also tent to use physical rather than magical, which also causes a variety of problems.

[paperkut]

In an earlier thread I proposed a class wrongfully named "The Ancient." (http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=729748) It was basically a Native American based class, more specifically the Apache tribe. These guys used ambush techniques as well as assassination techniques mixed in with some archery. They also used a lot of the weapons that we want to see better utilized in DIII. It's a different twist on the rogue/ranger that isn't seen in a lot of games but I think has a lot of potential to fill a lot of holes if done right. In my make of him I included some magic in a nature-based spirity way.

I got excited about the idea after I watched an episode of Deadliest Warrior (http://www.spike.com/full-episode/apache-vs-gladiator/31444) on SpikeTV. Check out some of the different episodes if your looking for any ideas about human history based characters...ninjas are in there too.

[TwoJP]

Going off the basis that speed/stealth probably isn't enough to make the cut, if there were to be a 2nd melee class(leaning towards that assassin/rogue genre), in my opinion it would have to emphasize/embody finesse, as a counterpoint to the barbarian's raw power. I must admit a good name escapes me. The best I can come up with would be a blademaster.

Maybe this has already been said, but I'll say it here. One thing I've noticed from looking at the initial skill trees is that for the ranged classes they both have ways of dealing with controlling range. The mage has time slow, teleport, lightning stuns and frost freezes to stay at range, or, if I'm not misreading can choose a more close in fighting style with the melee skills in the conjuring tree. The witch doctor has mass confusion, horrify, wall of zombies and the mongrels, the last two being able to act as tanks of sorts while the WD does his work.

Just sort of food for thought I guess, but I'd expect a physical ranged class would have to have a simliar level of mechanics, through skills/companion creatures whatever. I guess I could also see a physical range being the finesse melee as well.

[Ishtor]

all i got to say if one of the last 2 class is a stealthy type charcter that uses the energy system from WOW i am going to be so mad. I am hoping for a bard, atleast one can hope.

[Galabab]

TwoJP's idea of blademaster made me think of all the WC3 units and heroes O_o

Wizzard = those sorceress units
Barbarian = Tauren Chieftain
Witch Doctor= Troll Medic

2 come from orcs fraction but are human variants... hmmm..

Old classes too fit in the wc3 cheme:

druid = orc shaman
assassin = blademaster
paladin = paladin
necro = Necro units
amazon = archer or those riders from elves

This all makes it VERY likely the new classes too will match a WC3 unit.

like...
the dreaded BARD = KODO BEAST!

[lunarleif]

Wow fanatic, Galabab. At least that wasn't your 666 post.

[TheMightyShoe]

From the old thread . . . (I don't get to log in often)

You make a good point Shoe... I suppose that a Pirate is just as plausible (if not more) as my Bard theory... Both have stereotypes to over come and both could be really solid character types.

Thanks. I've started playing DII again, and I have found that pirates are already part of the lore. The official Amazon skill descriptions mention the 'Zons going to war against pirates from the south.

[TheMightyShoe]

And frankly, if a delicate female wizard or Mr. frail African witch doctor can wear heavy plate, then certainly a strong ninja can.

Wouldn't a ninja in heavy plate become more like a samurai warrior?

[TheMightyShoe]

The Ninja will, most likely, not happen. They already have one "asian" looking class. (the Wiz) I am sure we wont see another. This is also why we won't get a Monk as well.

I can see a Rouge/Assasin mix being the most likely. They could use bows and daggers/hand weapons.

Maybe, but the DII Druids and Barbs were related races . . .

[commonhumans]

Shameless self-bump? Maybe...

No, I have a point... A lot of good topics were born from this old horse of a thread and with Blizzcon 2009 fast approaching I just wanted to dust this bad-boy off and get the chatter gears grinding again.

[Technomancer]

To give the horse corpse another swift kick, I was just thinking about what all D&D classes have been looted by Diablo thus far and thought I'd make a list. One note though, I don't have much experience beyond 2nd Ed., but I know there's a Barb class and a new mage class without a spell-book. Beyond that, I may miss things:

Diablo: (* is counted loosely since Blizz didn't actually put out Hellfire)
Warrior - Fighter
Rogue - Thief
Sorcerer - Mage
*Bard - Bard
*Monk - Monk (1st Ed.)

Diablo II:
Barbarian - Barbarian (3rd Ed.)
Paladin - Paladin
Sorceress - Invoker or general Elementalist
Necromancer - Necromancer
Amazon - ... Fighter/Mage/Thief? :)
Assassin - Assassin (1st Ed.)
Druid - Druid

Diablo III:
Barbarian - Barbarian (3rd Ed.)
Wizard - Mage
Witch Doctor - ... Conjurer? Some sort of humanoid Shaman?

So, if you disregard the Hellfire characters, you're left with:
Ranger
Cleric
Bard
Monk
Psionicist

All of those could well be future classes. There are also Magical school specialists like:
Transmuter - Could fit for some sort of alchemist or magic/science based Shapeshifter.
Illusionist - I really don't see this. If it was REALLY pushed, could be made to work. <pause> Not!
Enchanter - Charming monsters and adding buffs isn't a Diablo class. ;)
Abjurer - Protection spells? That's a tree not a class.
Diviner - Nope.

Now I suppose there could be multi-class characters (like what I figure the Amazon must be ;) ), and that could go in a variety of directions. So without that, we're left with:
Ranger
Cleric
Bard
Monk
Psionicist/Mentalist
Alchemist
Shapeshifter

If you mix'n'match:
SS could easily go with any of the 3 before it or Ranger
Monk/Psionicist
Cleric/Monk
Ranger/Bard
Bard/Alchemist

Hmm, I guess there's still a lot of possibilities, and with the exception of the Monk, it's already stuff that everyone's been speculating. I guess I'm just re-checking everyone's, and my, answers ;).

[commonhumans]

E p i c f a i l !

[Technomancer]

Nay! I say nay, commonhumans! I called it, 3rd from the bottom of my last list! lol! I guess if you guess everything, you're bound to be right. Right? ;)

[Rash]

Well you should have known that the missing color WHITE is for the monk and the last color (GREEN) is for the Ranger.

You got confused with too much thoughts. The Magic the gathering category works. (Of course, its a great game :grin: ;) )

[LaZeR]

Can someone read the whole thread again now that the Monk is announce?
I bet it'd be hilarious ^^
Although we weren't all off. The Monk is definetly the "fast melee holy char" that I know at least I suggested once.

[Technomancer]

I can't bring myself to re-read the 10,000+ words that is this thread, but I know there's been a lot of "fast melee" talk over various threads, so it's not all silly! In the OP, "holy character" and "fast melee" were on the short list of slots to fill, it just wasn't a popular focus. I'm still convinced my ideas will be somewhat redeemed next year, but that a sucky long way to wait.

[commonhumans]

The OP is D3 speculationed out. :closed: hahaha.