Keyfinding Barb?

[tuxor]

Hey guys, I've pretty much finished my GF barb and now I'm moving on to a new character. I've decided on making a char that can MF and run Countess/Summoner/Nihlathak for keys.

I'm thinking about a Zerk barb like this:
20 Berserk
20 Mastery
20 Shout
20 BO
10 Howl
1 Pre-reqs, Warcries, BC, etc.

Helm: Arreat's
Armor: Enigma
Belt: Dungo's
Boots: Gore
Gloves: Undecided (LoH vs. Bloodfist)
Weapon 1: Undecided
Shield 1: Shael'd Stormshield
Weapon Switch: 2x WC Sticks/2x Wizspike(for tele)
Amulet: Undecided (Highlord's vs Angelic vs Metalgrid)
Rings: Undecided (Raven/Nature's Peace vs 2x Angelic vs Angelic/Raven)

So as you can see, I need some advice on equipment.

To be honest, I want to use an EBoTDCB for old school kicks. Sure, it's not as good as a zerk, but it looks better :thumbup: As for the gloves, I suppose it depends on the IAS I get from the other gear, and how much I need for a comfortable 10fps zerk. And jewelry is obvious, AR vs. DS vs. Res, etc. Any input would be great, thanks in advance.

[jel]

Why do you invest 20 points in shout and only 10 in howl? As shout does no good while zerking or running I don't think it will be of much value except as a synergy, where howl will be much needed in many situation.

[ZappaFan]

That build is going to find it very rough going trying to run Hell Nihlithak. The poison vipers have a bugged attack that will hurt you bad if you don't have a fairly substantial Damage Reduced by X items. I built an IK Conc barb just for that purpose that has 2 x Sol runes in the helm, Sol in the armor, and uses a pair of 11 PDR Nature's Peace rings (total of 43 PDR). He can run Hell Nihl pretty easily.

That same character runs all three keys with ease.

[vorpalbunny]

That build is going to find it very rough going trying to run Hell Nihlithak. The poison vipers have a bugged attack that will hurt you bad if you don't have a fairly substantial Damage Reduced by X items. I built an IK Conc barb just for that purpose that has 2 x Sol runes in the helm, Sol in the armor, and uses a pair of 11 PDR Nature's Peace rings (total of 43 PDR). He can run Hell Nihl pretty easily.

That same character runs all three keys with ease.

His build is actually very feasible primarily because of enigma and howl. He won't be moving through the poison because either a) he will be teleing or b) they will be howled away (provided you have a high enough howl).

As to commenting on what might make the build better, zerk gives a ton of +ar already and I can get decent ar with 2 ~200ar raven frosts and 2-3 100ar gcs (granted, my weapon gives 20% ar bonus). I also haven't maxed my mastery either (its currently at ~11 with +skills). This gives me about 10k ar (i think) and lets me hit nihl pretty easy (he is the only one where it might be hard). Furthermore, you'll get more damage from howl (excluding the criticals) than from your respective mastery.

As to the nihl actual run strategy, just tele to the wall behind him, use your howl and clear out most/all of the monsters. Next, start whacking on nihl. If he spawns another monster, howl it away, ignore it if you can, or war cry it if you put a point there.

My 2handed edeath axe with lotsa deadly strike takes ~10 hits on nihl in 8 player games. Summoner goes down in 1, and countess 1-2.

Also, 2handed big weapons are fun.

[ZappaFan]

His build is actually very feasible primarily because of enigma and howl. He won't be moving through the poison because either a) he will be teleing or b) they will be howled away (provided you have a high enough howl).

IMO it's risky to make a build that relied on the idea of not moving to be successful. The bugged serpents are all around Nihl as well as on the way to Nihl when they are present. I can see teleporting all the way to Nihl and then howling, but it won't take much for an unhowled Serpent to start taking your HPs down quickly. My IK Barb uses Howl a ton, and I know it's not always 100% effective on absolutely every monster in the area of effect even at a pretty high level. Of course I'm coming from a HC perspective where even 1 death is not acceptable. If this is a SC build then perhaps a death here and there isn't a big deal and that makes the build a lot more feasible.

[donshi]

Just one thing to add. You have 100 fcr with the spikes. You need 105 for the next breakpoint. Find a rare ring with fcr or something.

Might also want to consider getting 200 fcr, just because the summoner/countess/nihla go down pretty easily, you might be able to sacrifice kill speed for teleport speed for better overall speed. Of course, if you're doing 8player games or if you want to do other things with your barb, this wouldn't be the best choice.

[vorpalbunny]

IMO it's risky to make a build that relied on the idea of not moving to be successful. The bugged serpents are all around Nihl as well as on the way to Nihl when they are present. I can see teleporting all the way to Nihl and then howling, but it won't take much for an unhowled Serpent to start taking your HPs down quickly. My IK Barb uses Howl a ton, and I know it's not always 100% effective on absolutely every monster in the area of effect even at a pretty high level. Of course I'm coming from a HC perspective where even 1 death is not acceptable. If this is a SC build then perhaps a death here and there isn't a big deal and that makes the build a lot more feasible.

Addressing howl:
In my build, howl is maxed (i have lots of deadly strike and my ar is fine so howl >> mastery). My howl is slvl 29-35, depending upon switch, and is 100% effective on all monsters that can already be terrored (which is everything remotely dangerous). Furthermore, at such a high level, it pretty much hits everything on screen. If I have to move because nihl teles, I tele, then howl. In summation, if you're remotely on top of your howls, you will not get the vipers to poison you or get non life threatening damage dealt.

As to pdr:
However, this is slightly different with a shield as chars with shields do not get the same life as two handers. My life is ~4.2k with bo, while the Op's may be slightly-significantly less. However, with his current setup he has 50 %pdr which means 1/2 of the viper damage is cut (not as good as int pdr but better than my 8%pdr from enigma alone). Worst comes to worst, and he sockets arreat's with sol and uses soled gerekes with the possibility of natures peace.

As to sc/hc:
I play sc, so a death is an inconvenience, at most. I can attest to my death rate (a person who is not the most cautious). I believe I can count the number deaths (while key running) on one hand (if you include the null finger).


*edit Ok, now that i look at it howl doesn't work all the time, but it does do it the vast majority of the time.

[tuxor]

Yeah, at this point in time the vipers are the only thing I'm second guessing, but honestly worst case scenario is I change up my gear a bit and carry some antidotes. Also, hopefully my merc will be able to tank a hit or two in the time it takes me to howl again, but...we'll see. I'm currently just wondering what kind of weapon I should use. I'd rather use a one-hander with a shield, 'cause it's that much safer, but two-handers also have the damage advantage.

Few ideas:
eBoTD CB/Zerker/Champion Axe
Death Zerk/Champion Axe
I found a 4os eth scourge, so I might throw Oath in that.
A bunch of others. Runemaster, DCleaver, etc. but my main ideas are the top two.

Secondly, I'll probably just be using an A2 NM Def. Merc, unless of course I need more AR, and then I'll just get a BA merc.

[vorpalbunny]

Damric's guide (http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=553789) (which i followed when making mine) and Radu's guide (http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=180236) make a few suggestions for build and equip.

If you want 1 handed, grief phase blade is also a nice choice (so i've been told).

[tuxor]

Oooh, I just found an eth GPA. eBotDGPA anyone? But yeah, I don't want to use a grief PB, or a zerker for that matter, think I'm just going to find an eth CB and throw BotD in that for oldschool shenanigans.

[vorpalbunny]

Well, to sort of follow up, I've got an insight act 2 merc (w/o integer pdr), and it makes countess runs easier and i don't have to use mana pots. However, it seems to make viper more dangerous to me as it is a bit hard to babysit the merc and keep out of their poison.

I've died much more often with the merc on nihl (not enough to make me ditch him, but enough to note). Most of the time its odd because I'm not moving and I can't see the poison, but i'm still getting hit with tons of damage. Integer pdr on the merc wouldn't be a bad idea. Also, you might want to try running nihl alone for a little while before using your merc if you care about deaths.

Side note: What is GPA?

[ZappaFan]

My keyrunner's merc wears a Glad's Bane socketed with Sol & a Gaze also socketed with Sol and he stays alive pretty well.

Well, to sort of follow up, I've got an insight act 2 merc (w/o integer pdr), and it makes countess runs easier and i don't have to use mana pots. However, it seems to make viper more dangerous to me as it is a bit hard to babysit the merc and keep out of their poison.

I've died much more often with the merc on nihl (not enough to make me ditch him, but enough to note). Most of the time its odd because I'm not moving and I can't see the poison, but i'm still getting hit with tons of damage. Integer pdr on the merc wouldn't be a bad idea. Also, you might want to try running nihl alone for a little while before using your merc if you care about deaths.

Side note: What is GPA?

[jel]

Why do you invest 20 points in shout and only 10 in howl? As shout does no good while zerking or running I don't think it will be of much value except as a synergy, where howl will be much needed in many situation.

@Tuxor: You never really answered why you decided to do this, and I'd actually like to know, as for me it makes no sense, but it seems like no one else mentioned it, so I may be off here.