Question Re: Bone/Summon Hybrid

[Kaleban]

Ok, for those who read and replied to my Poison/Summon hybrid thread, thanks.

I've been doing some thinking and may go with Bone instead, specifically Bone Spirit. I have of course, read all the guides, but they haven't been updated at all lately, so I'm looking for some up-to-date info and opinions.

I know the Marrowalk bug has been fixed, so thats a non-issue.

Similar to my other thread, I plan on this basic skill layout:

Curses:
1 pt in all

Summon:
20 SM
20 RS
1 pt in all others, 0 in FG

P&B:
1 pt in Teeth, CE and BA

At most, I can max two other skills, which would take me to around lvl 90 or so. In looking at the synergies for the Bone spells they're quite a bit more versatile than some other synergies of other classes.

I suppose the main question is which skills to max (duh, lol)? I'm thinking Bone Spirit spammage might be the best, because of its auto-target capability, but one of the hybrid guides mentions maxing both BSpirit and BSpear. From what I've seen most people tend to use one or the other, and with 30+ minions swarming around, it seems to me that the main concern is high single target damage, not lower "minion" bashing damage.

So if I go BSpirit, I end up at 81 skillpoints, with the above plus pre-req point in BSpear. As I play HC, would it be smarter to, say max out Bone Wall for the synergy bonus it provides to both armor AND BSpirit, or is the need for both Bone attacks really that great? Coming in at 100 to 101 points, I can't decide if I'd need Bone Spear as well, or have a nice synergy to both my BSpirit and BArmor, with any leftover points perhaps going into another synergy.

Your input is appreciated! ;)

[DH Amazon]

I went with whole ranged team with my bone/summon hydrid.
So I picked mages instead of skeletons, but skeletons are more safety.

I maxed bone spirit and bonewall. Faith merc so mages shot little faster. I have used Harmony bow with mages earlier and that works nicely too. And low resist curse helps a lot rogue using that bow.

No iron maiden problems, so merc stays alive.
All ranged attackers, so I could make bonewall and still all can shoot.
Poison mages stop monsters life regeration, so then even 'weak' bone spirit is effective. Threachery (venom) works too with Rogue if you go with skeletons.
Gumby tanks, so getting 1st corpse with Rogue merc is easy even with bad items.

And I choose bone spirit over spear, because getting 1-2 corpses is enough with corspe explosion. And its easy to aim and I had never used it before.

1-point to revives and attract give nice meat shield, so mages stay alive just fine. Only souls kills all your mages fast, but I think you want to avoid those areas anyway.

[Tarantella]

20/20/20/20 in SM,RS,BW and Bonespear makes for a solid build and doesnt waste a points in BP (marrowwalks for the occasional use?) or Bone spirit and it gets off the ground quicker by shopping for a +3 bonespear wand which can be later socketed. Bonespear works nicely in the Arcane sanctuary and Maggots lair and for sniping gloams that are holding back. For an experienced HC summoner who knows all the dangers its a strong build.

[Kaleban]

So then for a hybrid build such as this, its better to pick one of the attacks and not both?

I don't think its an issue of skill point availability, since I have plenty left over. Its more an issue of utility and long term power.

I already have the build at level 68, with maxed RS and SM, and points into the other skills as in my OP, with around 15 or so skillpoints saved. Still in NM, so I am pretty sure by the time I hit 85 or so, I can max out the two skills.

So the question is, which ones? It seems that Bone Prison might have more utility than Bone Wall, since you can encircle dangerous enemies like MSLEBs, and I like the idea of spamming BSpirit and its auto-targeting capability. Plus, the prereq points in BWall and BSpear are two more synergy points.

I guess I'm just wondering which combo has more utility in Hell diff, as my experience there is limited.

[edit] After thinking about it Tarantella, I guess you're right. About the only places I have problems is in those tight, confined areas where my minions can't attack efficiently. So piercing Bone Spear might be better in any case.

Although is it just as easy to max BSpirit, get that first corpse, and then start blowing things up? I think numerically, CE has the advantage on either Bone spell, and getting a corpse to drop faster with BSpirit might be more efficient than softening up multiple targets with BSpear...

I hate decisions like this! lol

[shuy]

Bone spear and bone spirit without synergies are useless. If you want support your minions use Trang Belt, Gloves and Cap. Fire bolt and fire wall have more damage then few pts in BS. CE is nice with 15 meters area, more is better but there is no big difference.
I've spent spare points in bone wall (bone armor synergy works better then points in bone armor) it save my life few times in Nilha temple when snakes hit me or I was in corpse explosion area. Explosion from Mephisto dolls is dangerous as well and few hundreds HP in armor is very helpfull. Dim Vision is very nice but I do not use it - lack of hot keys :D. I use only AD and LT courses (LT for healing merc only)

[Kaleban]

Yeah shuy you're definitely right.

Comparing my two necro summoners, the first with maxed CE and the other with BWall/BSpear, its really no contest. The Bone Spells are ineffective compared to the simple brutality of full screen CE, hands down.

Even in 8-player games, in terms of damage per time and mana consumption CE easily wins. The one limiting factor, corpses is generally a non issue thanks to the minions.

So looks like I'll be rebuilding my original Necro, and rejoice in exploding D2s various species for fun and profit! ;)