View Full Version : Barbarian AoE,Multiple Hits
ManBearPig
01-12-2008, 01:57
I am all for skills that give the barbarian the opportunity to attack more than one enemy at a time.To me, this is what made the barbarian kinda boring in the past. Barbarians were forced to constantly WW because it was the only way to hit multiple enemies at once. So yay for barbarian skills with AoE and Multiple hits :thumbup:
ww wasn't actually aoe, just had a large number of single target attacks. Initially I got the impression most standard melee attacks would have an arc capable of hitting 2-3 close small enemies, which seems appropriate and adds arc width as an interesting melee weapon property, generally more so than D2's range.
Barbs using a 2 handed weapon will probably get a decent few genuinely aoe skills. I never was that interested in perusing the preliminary skill trees very closely, but it seems a logical counterpoint to decreased attack speed and reduce defense.
I think what you saw was the Cleave skill.
Although I imagine that the multi-strike rune would add some cleavage to most single-target barb skills.
teh_Thrasher
01-12-2008, 19:18
haha u said cleavage.
meh i really liked my concentrate barbarian in d2 he owned everything and he was hardly ever hit AND he used IK maul which is surprisingly good in just PVM. (dual shaels for max IAS) of course i did use WW on occasion when their were crazy large mobs of low hp monsters.
but uh yeah i agree that mutli target single swing hits will be great :) PLUS ww looks super nerfed. mad low dmg for the skill unless u pump the **** out of its passives.
ManBearPig
01-12-2008, 22:38
ww wasn't actually aoe, just had a large number of single target attacks. Initially I got the impression most standard melee attacks would have an arc capable of hitting 2-3 close small enemies, which seems appropriate and adds arc width as an interesting melee weapon property, generally more so than D2's range.
Barbs using a 2 handed weapon will probably get a decent few genuinely aoe skills. I never was that interested in perusing the preliminary skill trees very closely, but it seems a logical counterpoint to decreased attack speed and reduce defense.
And that stresses my point even more. The barbarian had literally NO skills that let him hit more than 1 enemy at a time besides war cry. So far it seems like blizzard has addressed this issue with Seismic Slam,Revenge,Furious Charge,Cleave,Slashing Strike,new leap attack, and probably some others I'm not mentioning. Almost anyone would pick a Sorc over a barb in d2 for PvM and if this is going to be a mostly PvM game (god I hope not) like they're saying, then I sure hope he can keep up with the wizard and the other characters. In my opinion, this is a great step forward for the barbarian so far.
Stop whining, Leap knocked back multiple monsters n00b.
hehe, just kidding... but give a shout if you think Leap was the worst skill ever (I know it's meant as a connector to leaap attack..)
I wonder if using a Multiple Strike rune with an AoE ability will result in multiple AoE damage to every unit in the area (like the Amazon's Freezing Arrow + Pierce combo).
Teleportftw
03-12-2008, 00:26
I think what you saw was the Cleave skill.
Although I imagine that the multi-strike rune would add some cleavage to most single-target barb skills.
every barbarian skill in the gameplay video besides the basic attack as far as I could tell did area damage, including leap attack, cleave, whirlwind. its possible the giant hammer thing didn't, but I bet it does.
Athanasios
03-12-2008, 16:10
every barbarian skill in the gameplay video besides the basic attack as far as I could tell did area damage, including leap attack, cleave, whirlwind. its possible the giant hammer thing didn't, but I bet it does.
what he said...
the barbarians lack of an effective AoE attack was always problem in my opinion. it looks(from the gameplay videos at least) that blizz has seen the issue and fixed it. : )
even whirlwind looks more intense, not to mention that "giant hammer thing"!
Barbs were totally dominating PvM in pre-LOD. WW was just perfect :) I hope it will be nice in D3 too!
Barbs were totally dominating PvM in pre-LOD. WW was just perfect :) I hope it will be nice in D3 too!
So far, I'm not really digging the 3d animation of WW in D3. It just seems 10x slower than it's D2 counterpart (yes, even though the D2 was just 4 sprites interchanging fast)
That's really my only critique though, just make it faster
Maxadrenaline
17-12-2008, 17:01
So far, I'm not really digging the 3d animation of WW in D3. It just seems 10x slower than it's D2 counterpart (yes, even though the D2 was just 4 sprites interchanging fast)
That's really my only critique though, just make it faster
I am really digging the new 3d animation, even though I agree it looks slower. Probably runes can help out on the speed of the skill?
Lack of AoE skills for the Barb were really irritating in D2, very glad to see that's (probably) fixed.
Concerning the multiple hits, Multistrike runes should cover this. I'm thinking for example Ground Stomp could trigger 2 or 3 times in quick succession.
Silverkill
13-01-2009, 10:57
I wonder if there will be any advantages of WW to Seismic Slam...
Seismic Slam is the same line AoE, but u don't need to be inside the crowd of monsters...
Any ideas?
Knight_Wolf
13-01-2009, 12:15
I wonder if there will be any advantages of WW to Seismic Slam...
Seismic Slam is the same line AoE, but u don't need to be inside the crowd of monsters...
Any ideas?
Seismic Slam has you stationary and lunching Linear AoE attacks, WW on the other hand gives you the ability to move around while damaging everyone surrounding you ( Circular AoE ).
One use for WW is cutting your way through a horde of enemies to reach a Health globe or something ... while SS could be used to hurt a mini-boss or unique who is hiding behind tons of powerful minions for example.
Silverkill
13-01-2009, 13:02
Seismic Slam has you stationary and lunching Linear AoE attacks, WW on the other hand gives you the ability to move around while damaging everyone surrounding you ( Circular AoE ).
One use for WW is cutting your way through a horde of enemies to reach a Health globe or something ... while SS could be used to hurt a mini-boss or unique who is hiding behind tons of powerful minions for example.
That's the reason, mate... if you need to reach a globe you use leap. If you use SS you can be striked only by very fast or ranged monsters. I'm a big fan of WW, but as i saw in a gameplay trailer it's much more safer to use SS from a pretty big distance, and not go inside horde of enemies with ww. Besides as i understand there won't be such a thing as Lifeleech.
It will also all depend on the damage output these skills end up with in the final game build. It may be that SS is much safer because you aren't neck deep in demons but WW may just be much more damaging to make up for the danger.
Silverkill
15-01-2009, 07:56
It will also all depend on the damage output these skills end up with in the final game build. It may be that SS is much safer because you aren't neck deep in demons but WW may just be much more damaging to make up for the danger.
Aggreed with this point... As i think SS damage will depend on your str... and ww will depend on your str + weap dmg.
Something like that.
Seismic Slam will probably require a lot of Fury. And with you staying back from the monsters to snipe at them, you'll probably lose it fast.
WW on the other hand should keep your Fury bulb full all the time.
We can already see how the two builds will differ a lot. :)
ww wasn't actually aoe, just had a large number of single target attacks. Initially I got the impression most standard melee attacks would have an arc capable of hitting 2-3 close small enemies, which seems appropriate and adds arc width as an interesting melee weapon property, generally more so than D2's range.
That's exactly how it worked in the demo
Whirlwind will probably actually do less damage in one second than shockwave. It has the following natural advantages:
1. It feeds into the Barbarian's Fury system.
2. It deals it's damage over a longer period of time, meaning it can catch more monsters over it's duration.
3. Mobility.
Perhaps SS will got a cooldown or something like that to prevent you for spam it too much. Or massive fury cost.
With WW, perhaps you make a bit less damage per hit and you can receive hits, but also you could hit multiple times the targets (plus criticals, which look very important in D3) and also put a mob of monsters "hit/impact recovery".
We don't know how good or bad these skills will be yet, only can speculate.
One added problem for SS would be to hit the monsters if they are too fast for you. If they can move out of lateral range, or something like that. The bigger difference, in my opnion, is WW is "redirectionable" like you were "driving" your barb in any direction you want, moving as the same time you hit the enemies, while SS is stacionary.
I think both will be very good skills, each with his advantages or disadvantages.
I remember my old barb in hardcore mode; I usually bo the monsters to stunt them, and then ww them with very safety. Then, driving my barb via WW in the middle, and stun them all again, and again WW, or just WW accross a minions to concentrate the main boss, pausing each time to stun the minions, and life leech them with WW before face the boss again.
leech probably won't be in D3, then we need other utilities for WW, and I suppose Blizzard know that one of the powerful advantages of WW was the ll, then I'm sure they thought about it and balanced WW in any way (more hits, more damage per second globally than SS, more passives which add damage to WW or things like that).
Bladewind
01-02-2009, 10:06
WW still better than SS.
Why ?
Because the barbs spin.:crazyeyes:
Seriously, the main advantage of WW is that you can control where you are going, which is a huge advantage and many multiple hits per target will more than compensate a single heavy strike, that is why skills like Zeal and WW are more popular than say Vengence or Concentrate which only deal incredible single hit damage.
Of course SS is straight line AoE and looks useful for causing rock slides or stuff to collapse of course.
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