Fishy Help

[mii_the_people]

I am in late 30s or early fortys with 1 in curses and maxed rs. i plan to max mages, but dont know if i should max skele mast first or mages. your thoughts?

[ateonetoo]

I would max Skelly mastery and Corpse Explosion before mages, IMO mages are just icing, having tough skellies is the cake.

[factotum]

The traditional Fishymancer doesn't use mages at all, so if you're looking at using them then you're thinking of something slightly different (skelliemancer, mainly). Anyway, even with a skelliemancer you get more mileage by maxing Skeleton Mastery and Raise Skeleton before you look at pumping Mages--even maxed, mages are not as effective as tanks as skeletons are, and you don't really need the elemental damage until you hit Hell anyway (chances of finding an unbreakable Physical Immune in Nightmare are relatively low).

[Animation]

I like the idea of a Fishymancer, but I want mages *and* I want Dim vision. Since I play single player, I think level 87 is probably the highest I'd attain, so I'd have 98 skill points.

I expect to have +6 to all skills. I might have more, but I can't be sure.

So, if I didnt want to commit to the max CE Fishymancer, would I be viable? More specifically, is Dim Vision viable in Hell situationally (Gloams, etc) with 10 Base points plus 6 from skills?

I was thinking about SM 20, SMast 20, SMage 20, Revive 1, Summon Resist 1, Decrepify 1, CE 15, Dim Vision 10, Pre-reqs 8.

I mainly wonder if Dim Vision will really help with only 10 + 6 in Hell; and whether 15 CE is enough; and whether the Mages are necessary (but I WANT them for concept) and all that.

Help? :)

Thanks,

Lewis

[ateonetoo]

The best thing about the Fishy is that once you achieve the "core" skills of maxed RS SM and CE you still have a lot of points left over to customise the character as you see fit.

When it comes to curses I'm an advocate of 1 point in every curse as they all have great utility value, however having said that I don't see the point in putting more than a few points in any curse. With regards to Dim Vision, placing more than 1 pt in it only adds extra duration and radius, once a monster is cursed you can't make it any more Dim by adding skill points.

At Clvl 87 you can have max RS, SM, CE, RSM and 1pt in every curse and be highly effective.

But at the end of the day its up to you. If you really want 10 pts in Dim Vision then go ahead, but the majority of us would strongly advise against it.

Personally I never use Dim Vision and those that do would consider it only to be situational eg vs Souls/Gloams/Archers etc. When I come across those I use Confuse but thats just me.

Your build will be viable, just a fair bit slower than a cookie cutter summoner.

Hope this makes some sense.

[balkan]

I kinda disagre about Dim vision, it absolutely kicks *** at high levels. However it needs to be very high (20+, preferably in the 30's with +skills). So just 10 points would be kind of a waste as you wouldn't reach those ranged attackers who are more than a screen away which would be the point of spending points in the skill.

[lumpor]

Why do you need to be that overly catious? Just let your minions block the arrows.

[balkan]

Because i have usually have lousy gear and terrible resists, and hate dying. There are specific areas where i very often *need* it because my skellies have a hard time getting to the enemy, such as arcane sanctuary and the palace cellar where i spend my time running around taking a beating if i don't dim the bastards. Even with teleport (that's how bad my resists are).
The good thing about dim vision is that you can pretty much wear whatever you want and go completely nuts on +skills and MF.

[factotum]

Why do you need to be that overly catious? Just let your minions block the arrows.

Ranged attackers don't always use arrows...good luck blocking a Gloam lightning bolt with a minion. For that matter, some critters which DO use physical weapons have pierce (the Act 5 version of Hell Slingers, for instance), so you can't rely on your nice bony shield then either.

[Animation]

I guess what I will do for now is just make myself finish the core Fishy. Then, I'll simply see what I need. I know that since Dim Vision is quartered in Hell, it won't last long with 1 point base so I may skip it. Unlike the conventional wisdom, I'm probably only going to have 1 point in Amp Damage and Decrepify and the 2 pre-reqs. I'm not going to put points in the others on the left side of the curse tree because of the Hell durations (and short of Hell I dont need the skill at all).

Then again if I played to level 90 I could have 15 base CE and 15 base Dim Vision. :)

Ah heck, I dunno. I'm only level 25 right now so plenty of time to decide.

Thanks,

Lewis

[Animation]

Any advice on Merc Gear for a Fishy Might Merc?

Mine is level 47 and so he is a couple of levels away from being able to use a Crown of Thieves. He uses an Undead Crown currently. Is there a better end game option?

His armor is Spirit Forge with 2 perfect rubies in it. I'm thinking about giving him Shaftstop. he would lose some life but he would gain the damage reduction. Which armor is better? Is there some other armor I should shoot for? What about for the end game?

For his weapon I have an old Hwanin with an Amn in it ... not ideal, but hey. However, I have a Hone Sundan I just gave him. It has more damage and it has crushing blow. It has 3 sockets. I was thinking about an Amn and a Shael and something else. I havent slotted it yet. Any advice on what to slot it with?

For the endgame weapon, should I stick with Hone Sundan for him for the crushing blow? Or should I give him a Reaper's Toll at level 75? I wasnt sure if the Decrepify would be a problem in that it might over-ride my own Amp Damage, and therefore make some physical immunes, that i'd de-immuned with Amp Dam, become immune again if he lowered the damage resistance again with the lesser -dam resist that Decrepify has.

Suggestions?

I'm just trying the best "not uber" (single player farm hell meph only gear, no trades) layout for my Fishy that I personally have. Anything to keep an eye out for that I might reasonably get solo or doing MF runs?

Thanks,

Lewis

[NumtyDoo]

I found with skellies up he is pretty survivable, so shaft shouldn't be needed, as long as he has a little life leach somewhere. I try to focus his stuff on CB/high damage/resists.

[Animation]

Ok then. Sounds good. What about the Hone Sundan? I already threw an Amn and a Shael in it. What about the last slot? I was thinking maybe an Eth rune for the -25% defense. That would let my skeletons and such hit tough targets in higher difficulties where the level difference is high.

Is Eth a good idea for the 3rd Hone Slot?

If I later up the Hone Sundan, will the stuff in its slots remain or get wiped by the upgrade?

Also, more on topic, what kind of mana pool is needed for a Fishy with 28 or more in Corpse Explosion (with items)? Mine is 554 with 50 Base Energy and Bone runeword armor and Frostburn. It seems ok but my CE is only 11 (5 + skills). I'm wondering how rough it will be when I can use all my gear. I'll have 20 Base + 7 skills at the minimum, and if I ever find a Homunculus I'd have +9 skills. If I ever gamble a +2 amulet I'll have +10. So I'm wondering how rough a level 27-30 CE will be and what mana pool I'll need to sustain it.

Thanks,

Lewis

[Shizu]

On my merc I'm using Shaftstop, ethereal Stealskull (just because I found it, anything with some life leech would be ok), and Obedience in a tresher.

He does some really nice damage and survives in Hell very well. He dies only vs Iron Maiden and some nasty boss packs with stuff like fanaticism+extra strong+amp damage.

[lumpor]

THE summonancer mercenary weapon is infinity. High damage, crushing blow and a conviction aura which increases skele accuracy, ce damage and mage damage.

[NumtyDoo]

hone sudan is fine as an untwinked character, the customize-ability and lots of CB are nice, but there are better options out there.