Dirty TPs

[MoUsE_WiZ]

Added element of suspense and danger when grouping with people you don't know, annoying griefing tool for 12 year olds that should be done away with if Blizzard can find a solution, or a good way to drop people who've pissed you off but won't duel?

With D2 in it's current state they aren't really an issue... if you play with people you don't know long enough you're going to get TPPK'd before you take a dirty portal, but that wasn't always the case, and perhaps they're going to be back again in D3, so what are your opinions?

Personally I like them, one more hazard to watch out for.
Plus one time in S3 someone scammed my forge in a rush. Then I said "it's cool, it was only an Io, if you need ****ty runes badly enough to steal I guess you really need this rush too, so I'll finish it for you". Then he stayed in the game and died in CS. It made me giggle.

I'm sure the current Blizzard staff would think I'm a terrible griefer though ~_~

[5zigen]

Personally I like them, one more hazard to watch out for.
Plus one time in S3 someone scammed my forge in a rush. Then I said "it's cool, it was only an Io, if you need ****ty runes badly enough to steal I guess you really need this rush too, so I'll finish it for you". Then he stayed in the game and died in CS. It made me giggle.

I'm sure the current Blizzard staff would think I'm a terrible griefer though ~_~

Actually, from Blizz track record with WoW they would have probably refunded you the rune particularly if you entered into the contract for it. If someone says they'll give you something in wow (eg: a transmute) and they take your item instead of finishing the transaction, the GM's will return the item to you (had them do it for me in WoW)

That said, I dont like dirty TP's for the same reason I dont like TPPK. It's a way to kill people in which (a) they cant really fight back against (b) presents no risk to the offender and (c) it encourages the same antisocial behavior as TPPK (that is, not partying with other people, only playing with people you already know from non diablo 2 venues).

[MoUsE_WiZ]

Actually, from Blizz track record with WoW they would have probably refunded you the rune
This is true.
Aside from hacks though, I like the idea of leaving justice in the players' hands... makes for a less whiney community. Or at least, the WoW community has so many more players whining right now about so many more things than D2 has ever had, total, in it's ~8 years.


That said, I dont like dirty TP's for the same reason I dont like TPPK. It's a way to kill people in which (a) they cant really fight back against (b) presents no risk to the offender and (c) it encourages the same antisocial behavior as TPPK (that is, not partying with other people, only playing with people you already know from non diablo 2 venues).
A) They can do a much better job of fighting back than in the case of TPPK... at least there (hopefully) won't be chickin on target/hostile/etc.
B) There's often a risk to the offender, herding isn't risk free. It's less of a risk, but it's definitely there.
C) Nah, it encourages slightly more antisocial behavior for sure, but avoiding portals from people you don't know is kind of a few giant steps away from avoiding being in a game with people you don't know.

[5zigen]

This is true.
Aside from hacks though, I like the idea of leaving justice in the players' hands... makes for a less whiney community. Or at least, the WoW community has so many more players whining right now about so many more things than D2 has ever had, total, in it's ~8 years.


Well WoW had a lot more players. Plus there was a lot of complaining about D2, it was just spread out, the B.net forums sucked in most ways compared to the WoW forums which are much more usable.



A) They can do a much better job of fighting back than in the case of TPPK... at least there (hopefully) won't be chickin on target/hostile/etc.
B) There's often a risk to the offender, herding isn't risk free. It's less of a risk, but it's definitely there.
C) Nah, it encourages slightly more antisocial behavior for sure, but avoiding portals from people you don't know is kind of a few giant steps away from avoiding being in a game with people you don't know.

As for
a) Chickenhack would probably drop them from the game when they first got hit unless they got hit at literally the same time by all the enemies. Chickenhack prevents both ways of pk equally. People do have a little bit better chance to fight back, but that depends more on their ping, the monsters that are lured to the portal and the number of monsters. A good Heph pack would kill anyone, esp with a fanat heph, for example.

b) herding isn't any more risky than playing the game normally though, particularly for characters that have ways of slowing down enemies and or teleporting. Sure the risk isn't zero, but you could make the same argument for TPPKers (kind of) because a tppk always runs the risk that someone will tppk them.

c) yeah I suppose so, but it depends on how they work the waypoint system, which I think they've stated will be different.

It may be slightly different in terms of magnitude but the core issue of all the same points is the same.

Honestly I really dont care as I hate 70% of people on bnet (and WoW, for that matter) so playing in a public game is a trial of my patience and I mostly play in private games myself.

[entranced]

Dirty TPs are a side-effect of the D2 TP system, and i have no problem with them as such. Avoiding them is easy for a cautious player - just ask for a fresh TP or use waypoints if they refuse to, etc.

[AgentMarth]

I don't see how they could even do it.

The added risk of your own TP in a solo game being hot can add a thrill when popping back in. If they had a rule like no monsters can be around the TP, I see it being abused.

Really, if your character is built right, you shouldn't die to a dirty TP that easily, if at all, unless you lag going into it. Max block, Tele, DR, Res, etc should help out long enough to flux, or get free. Unless they are fully charged up Frenzytaurs sporting Might/Fana/Amp/Etc you should be fine.

Hell, I know recently, I was asking for dirty TP's for the challenge of seeing how well I could survive them! Gave a fun thrill to the Baal runs.

[entranced]

should help out long enough to flux


OT: What is "flux"? 2nd time i've seen it used in this forum. From context my guess is ESC > Save And Exit Game but not sure. If it is, how did this term come about?

[grenadesnham]

An easy fix would be to make the town portals see through like a window. Hover over the tp to see where it goes like hovering over a link preview in a web browser like opera (or the firefox ext) with a set view distance of course. At least you'd know it was a clusterfoke or not.

[popodomo]

An easy fix would be to make the town portals see through like a window. Hover over the tp to see where it goes like hovering over a link preview in a web browser like opera (or the firefox ext) with a set view distance of course. At least you'd know it was a clusterfoke or not.

A wonderful idea and it its technically feasible, should be something they implement. I have a friend who had a shout barb designed specifically to herd monsters around a tp to gank ppl with. He herded the Baal room monsters (specifically the Frenzy mobs) so that they stunlocked you as you got out of the tp, very dirty.

Its not something I want in D3.

[5zigen]

I don't see how they could even do it.

The added risk of your own TP in a solo game being hot can add a thrill when popping back in. If they had a rule like no monsters can be around the TP, I see it being abused.

Really, if your character is built right, you shouldn't die to a dirty TP that easily, if at all, unless you lag going into it. Max block, Tele, DR, Res, etc should help out long enough to flux, or get free. Unless they are fully charged up Frenzytaurs sporting Might/Fana/Amp/Etc you should be fine.

Hell, I know recently, I was asking for dirty TP's for the challenge of seeing how well I could survive them! Gave a fun thrill to the Baal runs.

If they combined a "protection radius" for a town portal with a 5 second cast time (ala the instant s&e thread) I Think it would be perfectly viable and pretty hard to abuse.

It is so easy, particularly for a singer to trap portals, but also for a shockwave barb or a hf pala.

[nicro tower]

Worldstone Chamber tp :D
Leave a tp in there for a while and go in. Massive amounts of tentacles there...

[MoUsE_WiZ]

An easy fix would be to make the town portals see through like a window. Hover over the tp to see where it goes like hovering over a link preview in a web browser like opera (or the firefox ext) with a set view distance of course. At least you'd know it was a clusterfoke or not.

That'd be a good way I think.

[AgentMarth]

OT: What is "flux"? 2nd time i've seen it used in this forum. From context my guess is ESC > Save And Exit Game but not sure. If it is, how did this term come about?

Correct. How it came about though, no idea.

I like the preview image idea, that in the center, you can see the opposite end, thats pretty cool actually.

[entranced]

I like the preview image idea, that in the center, you can see the opposite end, thats pretty cool actually.


Heh reminds me a bit of the mage portals in WoW. Make a group port to Ironforge or w/e and you can see IF in the portal.

[Elyxthaxzus]

Really, if your character is built right, you shouldn't die to a dirty TP that easily, if at all, unless you lag going into it. Max block, Tele, DR, Res, etc should help out long enough to flux, or get free. Unless they are fully charged up Frenzytaurs sporting Might/Fana/Amp/Etc you should be fine.

Hell, I know recently, I was asking for dirty TP's for the challenge of seeing how well I could survive them! Gave a fun thrill to the Baal runs.

I think the issue with peeps being frustrated with D-TP's is not the equal level 'lets have fun' thing...its the lvl 85 necromancer who lures the lvl 21 toon into a mess of cows...if its my lvl 85 trapsin of course it isnt an issue :P unless im running in naked

woof

[MoUsE_WiZ]

Heh reminds me a bit of the mage portals in WoW. Make a group port to Ironforge or w/e and you can see IF in the portal.
And yet, some idiot will always end up in Thunder Bluff.

Thank god people cant see through my summoning portals... summons are free, underwater breathing will cost you }:-)

ts the lvl 85 necromancer who lures the lvl 21 toon into a mess of cows
Natural selection. Can't have it too easy for the lowbies to catch power levels.

[Elyxthaxzus]

lolz@ mousewiz

hmm good point tho...i need to lvl a chanter so i can powerlvl myself...

[mince pies]

I think a good way to stop TPPK is that when you click on the TP it should show you what's on the other side before you go through. Although I've never had a problem with TPPK :P

I have a friend who had a shout barb designed specifically to herd monsters around a tp to gank ppl with. He herded the Baal room monsters (specifically the Frenzy mobs) so that they stunlocked you as you got out of the tp, very dirty.


Lmao, that actually sounds kind of hilarious. Combine that with the window TP idea and you could just sit in town and watch people get owned upon entering the TP :D

[entranced]

I think a good way to stop TPPK is that when you click on the TP it should show you what's on the other side before you go through. Although I've never had a problem with TPPK :P



TPPK is not the same thing as Dirty TPs. TPPK is being out in the field, someone launches a projectile towards you, TPs to town and hostiles you (usually with a script and your immediate death).

[Full_Circle]

... how soft do you want hardcore to be, people?

If you can't survive whatever might be down there, maybe you shouldn't take the portal to begin with.

[5zigen]

... how soft do you want hardcore to be, people?

If you can't survive whatever might be down there, maybe you shouldn't take the portal to begin with.

That argument doesn't make sense.

Removing ways that players grief other players doesn't make the game significantly "softer"

[Full_Circle]

That argument doesn't make sense.

Removing ways that players grief other players doesn't make the game significantly "softer"

People are responsible for keeping their own characters alive. Sugar coating every aspect of the game to keep unprepared players alive sounds "softer" to me.

[5zigen]

People are responsible for keeping their own characters alive. Sugar coating every aspect of the game to keep unprepared players alive sounds "softer" to me.

I guess they should just do away with the hostility timer too then? Wouldn't want to sugar coat it too much. God forbid in a public game you could be safe from the other players.

There's nothing that can "prepare" you for a well trapped tp.

[Full_Circle]

I guess they should just do away with the hostility timer too then? Wouldn't want to sugar coat it too much. God forbid in a public game you could be safe from the other players.

There's nothing that can "prepare" you for a well trapped tp.

Are you serious?

It's not even that hard to have a character who can survive anything in the game for 2 seconds, which is more than enough time to save and exit if the TP is trapped.

And "Safe from other players?" You are absolutely safe from a trapped TP. Until you step through. Trapped TPs are only dangerous if you're one of those people looking for a free ride.

[Spero]

I guess they should just do away with the hostility timer too then? Wouldn't want to sugar coat it too much. God forbid in a public game you could be safe from the other players.

There's nothing that can "prepare" you for a well trapped tp.

I don't like a hostility timer. It makes the game too soft. I hope they don't have it in D3. I want to be ready to exit or tp to town NOW and FAST! Otherwise I'm really too relaxed and the game isn't as fun.

I like things in the game such as trapped tps. It really gets you to pay attention, build characters with good blocking, etc.

[MoUsE_WiZ]

I was browsing through my old webspace as I'm going back to school in september so my account's been reactivated... here's why I like dirty portals (early s3 if anyone's curious) ~_~

http://ucalgary.ca/~cdhoehn/mouseisevil.jpg

[Baranor]

naughty... but so much fun.... *giggles*


to get back on the subject: if someone in our group yelled "TP", we'd expect him to come out guns blazing, because we made the TP, no matter WHAT, or WHERE, at the instant he yelled TP. If he got lucky he got a TP from the back of the line, but more often than not he got a TP right in the front line of scrummage, so to speak, and if he was really lucky he got a TP in the front line at the same time someone yelled "UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURN!" and popped half a dozen ESEF frenzytaurs on the group. Or, in one case, just when Listor spawned in Hell, right in the middle of the group... they got me down to 300 life (from 4000) before I was done loading :D

safe TP's are for the weak.

[AgentMarth]

The funniest thing about Mouse's SS, is the whisper from PhatTrumpet.

But yeah, I look at it like PK vs TPPK, ones ok, the other is not. Purposely building a trapped TP to someone who trusts you to give a clean one is screwed (Some prick though who totally deserves it though is another issue). However, always wanting a safe TP is weak, and there should be a chance its not super safe. If you character can take it, you probably shouldn't be there.