Bowazon...gear dependent??

[Romanov77]

Hi guys....I never considered before to start an amazon and I have no experience with bows and ranged weapons in this game...


So I was wondering if the Bowazon build needs a high-end bow to be effective on Hell difficulty.

Basically I'm asking for an Amazon build that can solo Hell fast, without godly gear if possible...

[Mimeaphone]

Well no character can really solo hell quickly unless they have good gear but I'd say an amazon needs more gear than a sorc/ necro but less than the other classes. The most critical piece of gear that you really need to be effective is a decent bow and you can get one for a pretty cheap price (I'm thinking Buriza/ WWS). I prolly wouldn't make a amazon to start off the ladder season but after you get your 1st mf character up, amazon can be a quick, easy and fun 2nd character.

[sevencreature]

You don't need 'godly' gear - at least if you are playing solo (i.e. /players 1). I would say that you can get WWS (Witchwild String) cheap, upgrade it (Pul + Lum - again, relatively cheap), socket Shael and other rune (Shael, Nef,...) or jewel and you are pretty much set.

Other gear should be selected with emphasis on IAS (to reach suitable AS breakpoints - if you are playing physical bowazon) or to support your elemental attack of choice. And of course, to have 75% lightning resists.

[Romanov77]

Could you link me a good pvm build for bowazon??

[TopHatCat64]

I've taken 2 strafers through hell with an upgraded WWS. The bow is the major piece as previous posters have said. Once you have that, Hell diff is definitely beatable.

[Romanov77]

I've taken 2 strafers through hell with an upgraded WWS. The bow is the major piece as previous posters have said. Once you have that, Hell diff is definitely beatable.

Thanks, but I still dont know which is the best build for me....


Could you suggest me??

[TopHatCat64]

Thanks, but I still dont know which is the best build for me....


Could you suggest me??

I went with a pretty standard build:

20 Strafe
20 Frozen Arrow
20 Cold Arrow (FA synergy)
20 Valk
5 Penetrate
5 Pierce
1 CS
Pre-reqs

Check out Chipmc's WWS Strafer guide (http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=240912)

[Romanov77]

I went with a pretty standard build:

20 Strafe
20 Frozen Arrow
20 Cold Arrow (FA synergy)
20 Valk
5 Penetrate
5 Pierce
1 CS
Pre-reqs

Check out Chipmc's WWS Strafer guide (http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=240912)

And with this build she can solo hell at decent speed???
What about frost immunies??

[TopHatCat64]

And with this build she can solo hell at decent speed???
What about frost immunies??

Yep, I went through Hell diff at players 1 (the bnet equivalent of just you in a game) at a pretty good clip. Of course, I play on singleplayer, your definition of decent speed might be different then mine.

Strafe (and the merc) deals with cold immunes, Frozen Arrow deals with physical immunes.

[Dacar92]

It is a very fun and capable build. Get a halfway decent bow, like WWS. Let us know how you do.

[Romanov77]

I went with a pretty standard build:

20 Strafe
20 Frozen Arrow
20 Cold Arrow (FA synergy)
20 Valk
5 Penetrate
5 Pierce
1 CS
Pre-reqs




This build looks good on paper...how much damage do you deal with strafe and magic arrow??

I ask because I have a tesladin that deals 5000 damage per swing and he's really in trouble when fighting act4 monsters in Hell...

[sevencreature]

Romanov77: Act 4 is breeze with WWS Strafer - in fact, I am doing MF runs there quite often :-)

Well the "breeze" definition may vary - I think I kill fast enough, have no issues with PIs, it feels safe (as long as you have 75% lightning resist, knockback and fast Strafe, and are using Decoy strategically - to avoid surprising 'walls of lightning') and generally it is enjoyable experience (meh, I got Templar's Might in the last visit though - terrible drop, as I soon realized :-)

So it's not 'breeze' as in enter, kill every denizen of map in 1 minute, rinse and repeat :-))

Oh, and I have zero problems with PIs on /players 1 (on /players 5 to 8 it is generally slow) and I am pure strafer (i.e. no points in elemental skill except for one point wonder in Freezing Arrow). The innate 20 Magic Arrow of WWS is enough to deal with the most stubborn PIs. Add to it Amplify Damage or Decrepify from merc's Reaper's Toll and you are done.

Strafe dmg shown on LCS is around 1200-2000 (IIRC - take it with a cup of salt). I have around 300 MF, and enough IAS to reach decent Strafe breakpoint.

[Romanov77]

Romanov77: Act 4 is breeze with WWS Strafer - in fact, I am doing MF runs there quite often :-)

Well the "breeze" definition may vary - I think I kill fast enough, have no issues with PIs, it feels safe (as long as you have 75% lightning resist, knockback and fast Strafe, and are using Decoy strategically - to avoid surprising 'walls of lightning') and generally it is enjoyable experience (meh, I got Templar's Might in the last visit though - terrible drop, as I soon realized :-)

So it's not 'breeze' as in enter, kill every denizen of map in 1 minute, rinse and repeat :-))

Oh, and I have zero problems with PIs on /players 1 (on /players 5 to 8 it is generally slow) and I am pure strafer (i.e. no points in elemental skill except for one point wonder in Freezing Arrow). The innate 20 Magic Arrow of WWS is enough to deal with the most stubborn PIs. Add to it Amplify Damage or Decrepify from merc's Reaper's Toll and you are done.

Strafe dmg shown on LCS is around 1200-2000 (IIRC - take it with a cup of salt). I have around 300 MF, and enough IAS to reach decent Strafe breakpoint.

What is your build??

[sevencreature]

As I said - pure strafer - which means (at least according to me) - major emphasis on physical damage, Strafe skill, of course, and elemental skills are not used primarily for killing.

Mine last one is not specifically tailored towards particular equipment (not untwinked, but at the same time open to new 'opportunities' in gear) - so some STR investment, some VIT investment, most of the stat points into DEX.

Skills: MAX Strafe, MAX Penetrate, MAX Pierce, MAX Valkyrie, 1 pt Freezing Arrow (mainly to help Merc and Valkyrie when situation gets critical), ~5-8 pts into Critical Strike, remaining points go to Decoy.

Since I am using WWS, investment into Critical Strike is not exactly useful, but I wanted to try different bows and not to be limited by particular one. When using only WWS, the better investment is definitely Decoy. When one encounters a bosspack of Increased Strength, Increased Speed and possibly other upleasant mod (Might...) Frenzytaurs in tight spaces, every second Valkyrie is be able to delay them can be the difference between life and death.

You can find Strafer details (breakpoints), equipment choices discussion in Chipmc's WWS Strafer guide and Shanksies v1.10 Pit Strafer Guide among others...

[sevencreature]

Correction (just got home and checked the char): Strafe dmg displayed on LCS is ~1000-1300. And I have 105% IAS overall surprisingly (I've tried less, but it wasn't as comfortable I think, 105% is really nice). Resists 75/37/75/8. And I have no knockback atm (sacrificed to speed -> or rather sacrificed to MF).

Clad in purple, wearing blue - Tal's Armor (PTopaz) & Tal's Helm (12 res all/ias jewel) and WWS, surprisingly matching in color :-P

[Mimeaphone]

@sevencreature: I thought that I made a mistake placing points in penetrate as others have told me not to but your post gives me more confidence in my build :). I have to ask, where do you get your IAS from? Oh and I'm assuming your hitting the 9/3 breakpoint going on 9/2? I'm trying to decide between double shael in WWS or shael nef and don't know whether the extra 20 ias from shael will be needed.

[sevencreature]

At the moment I have Highlord's Wrath (20%), LoH (20%), Nosferatu's Coil (10%), 15% from jewel in helm, 40% from 2xShael in WWS. Difference between 105% and less (95%, 85%) is visually (and aurally) noticeable - but that could be outward interpretation, I am not sure about inner mechanics of the game...

As a pure Strafer, there wasn't many options where to invest points anyway :-) But Penetrate definitely comes handy - you need ~12 000+ AR to have sufficient CTH in Hell. There are of course other options how to improve AR, but I wanted high res and decent MF (and dmg from charms).

[Romanov77]

Thanks sevecreature...do you think that I could get away using your build even without that unique bow??

[sevencreature]

Well, that's not "my" build :-) But you sure can get away without WWS - you have to customize your gear around the bow you will choose anyway. Just remember that strafer needs sufficient physical damage - you should consider using Atma's Scarab amulet for example.

[Romanov77]

I dont know...Im still hesitant....Im still afraid that damage wont be enough for Hell...


I made some calculus, and found out that freezing arrow, even when maxed and synergized (the 12% one) wont even scratch Hell monsters. 600-700 cold damage is way too low....so I think that this hybrid build is not viable.


With my necro I often find rare elite bows with nice damage (100+)...will that be enough??
Maxed strafe adds +100% damage (3/4 weapon damage) and that to me looks so...meager.
My tesladin deals 1500- 5000 per swing and he swing helluva fast...yet his damage sucks in Hell act4...

[TopHatCat64]

I dont know...Im still hesitant....Im still afraid that damage wont be enough for Hell...

I made some calculus, and found out that freezing arrow, even when maxed and synergized (the 12% one) wont even scratch Hell monsters. 600-700 cold damage is way too low....so I think that this hybrid build is not viable.


Check your calculations, using one of the online skill planners, a fully synergized Frozen Arrow does 1054-1088. That's enough damage for a single arrow striking one monster but that's not where the power of FA lies. FA, combined with Pierce, absolutely destroys clumps of monsters. FA's splash damage fires off everytime it pierces, meaning you can hit a monster 2 or 3 times with the same arrow. Once frozen, you can repeat the process indefinitely and monsters will never reach you.

Really, just try it. As I said before, I was able to beat Hell by myself on singleplayer with a FA/Strafe build with 2 different zons and had no trouble at all. Believe me, it's perfectly viable. Heck, once I beat Baal, I started leveling in the Pits at players 8 and still had no problems with killing speed.

My gear wasn't exactly godly either, we're talking LoH, war travs, treachery, a handful of random +max dmg charms.

[Romanov77]

Check your calculations, using one of the online skill planners, a fully synergized Frozen Arrow does 1054-1088. That's enough damage for a single arrow striking one monster but that's not where the power of FA lies. FA, combined with Pierce, absolutely destroys clumps of monsters. FA's splash damage fires off everytime it pierces, meaning you can hit a monster 2 or 3 times with the same arrow. Once frozen, you can repeat the process indefinitely and monsters will never reach you.

Really, just try it. As I said before, I was able to beat Hell by myself on singleplayer with a FA/Strafe build with 2 different zons and had no trouble at all. Believe me, it's perfectly viable. Heck, once I beat Baal, I started leveling in the Pits at players 8 and still had no problems with killing speed.

My gear wasn't exactly godly either, we're talking LoH, war travs, treachery, a handful of random +max dmg charms.


This was the build you posted before:

20 Strafe
20 Frozen Arrow
20 Cold Arrow (FA synergy)
20 Valk
5 Penetrate
5 Pierce
1 CS

Your FA wasnt full synergized, right??


Well, I think I'll try this build....looks more varied than the pure strafezon.


Also...dextery:
In most character builds, dextery is just there for max block...with bowazon it raises bow damage, right??
However, strenght also increase melee damage, yet no melee build suggest more than equipment requirements...

This makes me think that dextey gives a great benefit to bow damage, right??

As final note....which would be the best skill progression??

Thank you guys, you are all very helpful:nod:

[Dacar92]

It is a great build. The skill lineup you show here:

20 Strafe
20 Frozen Arrow
20 Cold Arrow (FA synergy)
20 Valk
5 Penetrate
5 Pierce
1 CS

is great except that you only need 17 in valk. She gets her last good upgrade at 17. There are other upgrades but you have to spend too many points to get them so this is really the last affordable gear upgrade.

If you don't have a Razortail belt you'll want more in pierce. Get it is high as you can. Razortail nets you 33% so it is worth looking for one.

The higher dex you can get the better you bow damage will be. You'll need somewhere between about 500 to 800 in life, wherever you feel comfortable. The strength is only used to carry you're gear. The rest can go in vitality and dex.

Use cold damage charms to lengthen the freeze length in hell. As for skill progression, save up a bunch of points until you can get strafe. Then place a point in it every level until you get to level 30. Then get valk and Freezing arrow. Place a point or two in valk and then spend the rest of them in both strafe and freezing arrow each level every level until you run out of points.

The build is mana hungry until about level 40, when your mana pool finally starts to build. Don't spend any points in energy. Get some mana leech and it is even easier after 40. When you run out of mana from FA then strafe until your bulb is full again, then spam FA again.

Max out FA and strafe then work on valk and pierce.

Hope that helps and good luck!

[Romanov77]

Are you saying that I mustn't invest any points until I get to lv24 (strafe) or can I put something in cold arrow while getting there?

[Dacar92]

No, go ahead and spend some points so you can kill at an efficient rate. I am just saying to save as many as you can so you can begin to spend two or three (FA and strafe) at each level up after level 30. As I said, place a couple in Valk too (at level 30 and 31), if you're going to use her. Depending on whether she starts dying you may skip a strafe point or FA point here and there and put in valk so she can live through the harder hitting critters in NM and hell. Strike a balance between your own killing speed and her dying speed, so to speak. You can always recast her, but it can become annoying if she keeps dying.

[Romanov77]

Ok, I started it....looks fun, its a totally different experience playing a ranged character...I'll update in this thread as soon as something relevant happens.

Thanks you guys! :)

[YogiRat]

I suggest you put points into decoy early (about 5) and learn how to use her as well. She is a great scouting tool/ meat shield. Also, a level1 valk with 5 into deek has the same life as a level5 valk with only 1 point into decoy, your valk will live much longer at lower levels.

[Romanov77]

Act 2 level 19

I'm using a rare xbow with lv4 cold arrow (the freezing arrow synergy) and a rare trident as backup....this build is certainly fun!

Now...how should I assign stat points? Which criteria should I follow?? For now, I've spread things between life dex and str. but I have many unassigned ones.

Also, I noticed that Inner sight skill, a prerequisite to Valkyrie....looks very good even at lv1...-40% enemy defense is good, regardless of difficulty level...do you guys use it even at late-game??

[caucasion]

i have a level 54 paladin on US east and because of this guide im probably flipping over to a zon. just for fun :)

[Dacar92]

Just because of this thread? Cool. Maybe I should add it to the build guide. I wonder how Romanov77 is coming along....

[Romanov77]

Just because of this thread? Cool. Maybe I should add it to the build guide. I wonder how Romanov77 is coming along....

Act2, level 21 about entering tal rasha tomb


I would like your opinions on Inner sight (do you use it late-game??) and some tips on stat progression:yes:

By the way, my necro just found the Set bramble mits gloves (350% damage o daemons , +25% attack speed and +50 fire resistance....would they be any good for my bowazon??

[sevencreature]

Yes, LoH are great choice. Basically every mod is very useful - I would say especially the fire resist (last but not least if you plan to experiment with Andariel's mask).

[Dacar92]

Act2, level 21 about entering tal rasha tomb


I would like your opinions on Inner sight (do you use it late-game??) and some tips on stat progression:yes:

By the way, my necro just found the Set bramble mits gloves (350% damage o daemons , +25% attack speed and +50 fire resistance....would they be any good for my bowazon??

Those gloves you found are THE bowazon gloves. Wear them and never take them off.

Inner sight? Never used it about level 30 or so. The effect of the defense reduction just isn't enough in NM and hell to make it worth it. But that's just me. Others may find it useful.

Stat progression is pretty straightforward. There is no real secret other than what I wrote above. Most points go into life and dex early in he game. Some into strength to wear the gear you find. I always keep some points handy, 30 or 35 or so, in case I find a nice piece of equipment, later in the game, or in case I feel I need a few more in vitality after getting into hell. But once I have my gear the points are usually spent.

[Romanov77]

Hehehe, I cant belive it...my MF Necro summoner striked again...and found me a WITCHWILD STRING!!!

Will this bow go well with this Freezing arrow/strafe hybrid?? Or are there better picks??

[Dacar92]

That bow will be great, unless you can make a Faith or get a Windforce. Best second (third) choice bow. The amp will help tremendously and socket it with one or two shaels and you'll hit the fastest breakpoint. Calculate what you need first and then decide on your socket choice.

[Romanov77]

I hope that to finish Hell effectively I wont have to upgrade it, because there' no way I could get hands on a put/lum runes.....

By the way...I dont understand well the strafe mechanincs:
I have it at level2...when there are many enemies, it fires many arrows...when the enemy is alone, it fires just 2 arrows...

[CrimsonDuckling]

Hi guys,

I was lucky enough to find a perfect Windforce and a near perfect ethereal Reaper's Toll during Ancient Tunnel runs with my sorc. This practically begs me to make a nice bowazon.

Question: since it will probably take quite a long while before I can use a Faith merc, will my windforce zon be fast/strong enough for hell?

What build do you suggest? My previous zon (with full M'avina set) pretty much went all strafe previous ladder. I never used the frozen arrow. What about multishot?

[Dacar92]

Hi guys,

I was lucky enough to find a perfect Windforce and a near perfect ethereal Reaper's Toll during Ancient Tunnel runs with my sorc. This practically begs me to make a nice bowazon.

Question: since it will probably take quite a long while before I can use a Faith merc, will my windforce zon be fast/strong enough for hell?

Yes. You cen certainly finish the game with WF. No problems.

What build do you suggest? My previous zon (with full M'avina set) pretty much went all strafe previous ladder. I never used the frozen arrow. What about multishot?

Frozen Arrow/Strafe hybrid. Sounds like you have most of the gear planned. Let us know if you need a little help with that too. In the meantime, look at this thread then add 20 points in strafe. It will be a fun build.
http://diablo.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=673582

[CrimsonDuckling]

Thanks. =)

I don't have most of the gear planned yet. I just have a WF and a nice Reaper's Toll for the might merc. I'll use whatever gear I can find.

[sevencreature]

Hmm, maybe I should try some heavy FA based build sometimes (just out of curiosity).

What's the biggest advantage? IIRC cold immunity is the biggest problem in Hell (I've seen a lot of Blizzard sorces crying as they teleported through the whole acts unable to kill most of the monsters), isn't it?

I was always using FA only as a lifesaver in dangerous situations (dangerous archer packs especially), or as a merc/Valk support but even then I've mixed a Strafe volleys inbetween each FA.

I have to say the thing I like about Strafe the most is its dispersed crowd control and especially the fact it is usable off-screen during those despicable lag spikes (the most dangerous enemy of the whole Diablo :-) ).

[BlasphemousMusic]

After reading all of this I am making this build. Currently at 60 and done with strafe and valk. But my question is terms.

I see Cold, Ice, Freezing arrow. Which are which in this build?


FA, called frozen by most, I figure is freezing arrow.

[ruke]

I'm not playing with Strafe but with Multi instead as physical attack and FA as my other main attack. Freezing Arrow is for me mostly the better type of attack due to its higher damage and ability to do AOE damage eventhough to its single target nature. When the FA hits its target it does splash damage that damages nearby enemies as well. If you have now to enemies behind eachother and you hit the first with a FA and this FA pierces also through the 2nd you'll see a significantly damage increase. Another advantage is the freezing effect - you'll make your merc and valk much safer + you can be sure your enemy stays where he should all the time (except cold immune - CI - ofc).

Multi I used for big spread groups or just CI. I've to admit tho that I've great problems in killing bosses in hell - as a matter of fact I cant even kill Andariel with my current xbow, which is Buriza. But apart from that like Countess runs, Pindle/Eldritch, Runequest I can handle most of it very well (too many ranged wie crappy auras still can kill me tho).
What sucks however is when you encounter PI/CI immune monsters - you either wait 5minutes until its dead or you just run by.

[BlasphemousMusic]

I'm not playing with Strafe but with Multi instead as physical attack and FA as my other main attack. Freezing Arrow is for me mostly the better type of attack due to its higher damage and ability to do AOE damage eventhough to its single target nature. When the FA hits its target it does splash damage that damages nearby enemies as well. If you have now to enemies behind eachother and you hit the first with a FA and this FA pierces also through the 2nd you'll see a significantly damage increase. Another advantage is the freezing effect - you'll make your merc and valk much safer + you can be sure your enemy stays where he should all the time (except cold immune - CI - ofc).

Multi I used for big spread groups or just CI. I've to admit tho that I've great problems in killing bosses in hell - as a matter of fact I cant even kill Andariel with my current xbow, which is Buriza. But apart from that like Countess runs, Pindle/Eldritch, Runequest I can handle most of it very well (too many ranged wie crappy auras still can kill me tho).
What sucks however is when you encounter PI/CI immune monsters - you either wait 5minutes until its dead or you just run by.

pretty goo one the tactics, I am doin ok cept for the riphook doing crap dmg. But still have yet to have my questin 2 above this post answered.

Cold
Ice
Freezing is what I see not frozen arrow or whats talked about above.

[CarloC]

You actually think we're NOT talking about freezing arrow when we say frozen arrow? O.o

[BlasphemousMusic]

You actually think we're NOT talking about freezing arrow when we say frozen arrow? O.o

Gotta remember, some of us were away from d2 for a while. Terms have changed since I was last on and I didn't ever make a build with any of the elemental arrows.