Eliminate NK?

[etslayer]

I expect many people to disagree with me on this, but I think there should be no more running for your body after you die. I think you should respawn with your corpse beside you. This would eliminate naked killing. There are going to be plenty of people who think NKing should be left in D3, however I would assume that it is only a tiny minority who want it to stay. This is the ONLY thing that I want them to change about the PvP system.

I wanted to make this a poll, but people might have other alternatives as to how to eliminate naked killing, so I want to leave it open to discussion.

[YSM]

I was disheartened to find out from the gameplay videos that there is HP in Diablo III; meaning, you can die. What the hell? What's with the old fashioned sensibilities, Blizz? You're going to have to become more progressive if you want my money. Death is tedious boring and unnecessary. It serves as a blockade for player creativity "LEEROY, JENKINS!" and character progress.

Get with it Blizz. It's 2008.

[prion]

I expect many people to disagree with me on this, but I think there should be no more running for your body after you die.nah i agree with you....after death you should be completely kicked out of the game and returned to a save point from the last time you dinged :D unless in a PvP arena.

(i have a feeling thats not what you wanted...)

[etslayer]

I was disheartened to find out from the gameplay videos that there is HP in Diablo III; meaning, you can die. What the hell? What's with the old fashioned sensibilities, Blizz? You're going to have to become more progressive if you want my money. Death is tedious boring and unnecessary. It serves as a blockade for player creativity "LEEROY, JENKINS!" and character progress.

Get with it Blizz. It's 2008.


Don't be rediculous, I never said you shouldn't DIE in the game. Please don't twist my words like that. All I am saying is that you should have access to your body when you respawn. If you take on more than you can handle in PvM, you should be able to say "geez, I am not strong enough to go there yet, I'll try a different area" and then go to that area, rather than having to search for your body.

In PvP I see no reason why you should be forced to run for your body with people killing you while you are naked. I think my solution is simple and doesn't deminish gameplay for anybody except NKers with nothing better to do.

[YSM]

Don't be rediculous, I never said you shouldn't DIE in the game. Please don't twist my words like that. All I am saying is that you should have access to your body when you respawn. If you take on more than you can handle in PvM, you should be able to say "geez, I am not strong enough to go there yet, I'll try a different area" and then go to that area, rather than having to search for your body.

In PvP I see no reason why you should be forced to run for your body with people killing you while you are naked. I think my solution is simple and doesn't deminish gameplay for anybody except NKers with nothing better to do.

I was just being silly.

[CdMagicFind]

I think they should separate PvM/PvP.. Would pretty much solve it (though eliminating PKing, whatever that means..). Plus, PvP arenas would make that more fun, imo. Established rules and that sort of thing.

[etslayer]

I was just being silly.


Sorry but that really came off as sarcasm :P

[mephiztophelez]

i wouldn't mind something like: if you die to another player, your bod appears in town. die to a monster, you gotta go find it.

just so long as there are no blasted hammerdins. or if there must be blasted hammerdins, make them balanced blasted hammerdins.

[Hcorp]

i wouldn't mind something like: if you die to another player, your bod appears in town. die to a monster, you gotta go find it.

I like this idea.

I was going to say "I don't feel it's much of an issue" but then I remembered I play HC, and the last time I retrieved my corpse was probably sometime in 2001.

[Tai.]

You can get your corpse back in D2?

[prion]

actually, most of the time, no. what happens instead is that the person in the party doing most of the work will clear it for the nooblet.

[Q33]

I really don't think they should change it. It was quite intentional in Diablo 2 that if you die, your body gets left there, and you have to struggle and fight your way back to get it. It was part of the spirit of Diablo. If they take it out, it won't be diablo.

Or in PvP, getting naked kills on another guy, quite intentional. I mean, if they didn't want it, they would have changed it. Everything in the game is used for its intended purpose.

SPIRIT OF DIABLO! Any changes in any way or form from Diablo 2 to Diablo 3, such as eliminating naked kills, would make the game not a Diablo game.

[YSM]

I really don't think they should change it. It was quite intentional in Diablo 2 that if you die, your body gets left there, and you have to struggle and fight your way back to get it. It was part of the spirit of Diablo. If they take it out, it won't be diablo.

Or in PvP, getting naked kills on another guy, quite intentional. I mean, if they didn't want it, they would have changed it. Everything in the game is used for its intended purpose.

SPIRIT OF DIABLO! Any changes in any way or form from Diablo 2 to Diablo 3, such as eliminating naked kills, would make the game not a Diablo game.

So, there was no intended purpose behind players dropping their corpse when they died, or dropping their items if they were killed by a NPC in the original Diablo? Isn't that called a death penalty?

Regardless, I don't care how badly you guys screw up your softcore system, by asking for lenient-to-nonexistent death penalties. I'll be playing Hardcore because I'm Hardcore. This Softcore crap makes me sick.

[Kiroptus]

Uhh guys... I dont think the get corpse mechanic is back.

Ragdolls can toss your body to unreachable places and monsters can gib you (the siege best eats the barb).

Certainly there will be some penality to death but I cant see the corpse mechanic back with those elements above.

[YSM]

Uhh guys... I dont think the get corpse mechanic is back.

Ragdolls can toss your body to unreachable places and monsters can gib you (the siege best eats the barb).

Certainly there will be some penality to death but I cant see the corpse mechanic back with those elements above.

Now that I think about it, you're right.

So, I guess players will respawn ala-Quake style, or something. Sounds boring.

I really hope there's a Hardcore mode.

[Hello Jim]

I agree, without fighting to bring back your corpe this ain't Diablo.
If you're having so muhc bad time NKing, just exit+come back in..Pretty simple

[YSM]

I agree, without fighting to bring back your corpe this ain't Diablo.
If you're having so muhc bad time NKing, just exit+come back in..Pretty simple

Exactly. Just rejoin the game, and if it fills up, then take it as a lesson that dying is bad, and go find another game.

lol @ softcore players

[CYBERPUNK]

well I haven't heard anyone mention this yet, but this is what I would like

when you die (regardless of being rendered into tiny bits), a party member can rez you (if they have said ability), otherwise it's game over

NOW HOLD UP CAREBEARS, this isn't HC I'm talking about, BUT CLOSE

when you die you can no longer play in that game, you have to exit and join a new game (because in the other game world your character was torn into bits/burned to cinders/etc and no one rezed you)

this way there is no constant re-spawning of dead players and the game world feels more "constant", and death is a real penalty to a group and Ressurrecting someone is a valuable skill

also this is kinda like HC-lite

I think this idea fits very well into the framework of existing D2 games as each game is a split dimension basically, and I would like it if each dimension had some kind of constant structure and rules like this (so when someone dies, it's like BAM, time to tell stories about them, not "hey get back in here")

anyways what do you guys think?

and btw @YSM, yeah you crack me up man =] (my only distaste for HC is lag, otherwise I'm all about perm death)

[DjSlayer]

Regardless, I don't care how badly you guys screw up your softcore system, by asking for lenient-to-nonexistent death penalties. I'll be playing Hardcore because I'm Hardcore. This Softcore crap makes me sick.

Hi, you should re-consider your statement about softcore, it sounds a bit trollish. And people has the freedom to play what ever mode they want on b.net. You shouldn't look down on people who play softcore, that's the impression i got from your post anyway.
(And it's not sure if they implement hardcore in D3).

- D.J.

[Uncle_Mike]

There's a new sub dedicated to hardcore so hopefully those futile discussions will cease to exist soon.

Hardcore/softcore, best pvp build etc. threads always go wrong :)

If you see a post that you consider inapropriate or offensive just use the report button :)

[Kiroptus]

I think this should corcern pvm as well.

I hate the idea of death zerging a boss. I think that everytime a player dies the boss should regenerate a % of its health(like 25%, 50%, 100% respectively on normal, nightmare and hell) so people get more tatical and less mindless.

[prion]

CYBERPUNK, i like it, but without res. :D
I don't want them res'd. I want them out of my game.
People who are so incompetent that they die need to be punished.
In fact if you die while saving Cain the message should read "You have died and failed to save Cain. Your incompetence has doomed humanity to unholy slavery"

[etslayer]

I think some people may have misunderstood my original idea of spawning with your body. I meant you spawn in TOWN with your body beside you, not spawn where you died. Just wanted to clear that up.

I will admit, after thinking about it a while maybe this isn't a very good solution. It would take away from some of the satisfaction of PKing. Making them run for their corpse is like an extra slap in the face and gives the PKer a better feeling of accomplishment. It accentuates the fact that there was a clear victor in the battle.

Nevertheless, I still think they should do something about BM dueling in general. Maybe reward good behavior rather than punish or prevent bad behavior. Like have honor points awarded to good duelers. Positive reinforcement is the way to go!

Also, another thing that really got on my nerves in D2 was pre-1.10 when I was a barb or pally and I really only wanted to engage in melee duels. But a zon or sorc would ALWAYS join the game and ruin my intended melee duel. I think that if the number of people in a game/instance is small like it was in D2, the player who creates the game should be able to put restrictions as to which character classes can join. Once again, I expect a lot of people to disagree. After all, it is discrimination.

[mephiztophelez]

I will admit, after thinking about it a while maybe this isn't a very good solution. It would take away from some of the satisfaction of PKing. Making them run for their corpse is like an extra slap in the face and gives the PKer a better feeling of accomplishment. It accentuates the fact that there was a clear victor in the battle.

the only "satisfaction" i get from NK'ing someone is to NK someone who has either A: previously NK'd me or B: is a hacking asstard. i certainly don't feel better about myself by nk'ing someone who i just had a good duel against. i feel better about myself if i let them get their bod, get ready and then beat them fair-and-square. mano-et-mano with a bit of honour about the whole debacle.

NK'ing is just being a twit and a bully. it doesn't "accentuate the fact that there was a clear victor in the battle" in any way shape or form. it's just an excuse for people to behave like complete asstards.

nk'ing is nothing to brag about or feel good about.

Nevertheless, I still think they should do something about BM dueling in general.
preventing naked-killing, doing away with elemental absorb, no rejuve pots and having balanced classes would go a long way to "solving" bm duelling.

[etslayer]

the only "satisfaction" i get from NK'ing someone is to NK someone who has either A: previously NK'd me or B: is a hacking asstard. i certainly don't feel better about myself by nk'ing someone who i just had a good duel against. i feel better about myself if i let them get their bod, get ready and then beat them fair-and-square. mano-et-mano with a bit of honour about the whole debacle.

NK'ing is just being a twit and a bully. it doesn't "accentuate the fact that there was a clear victor in the battle" in any way shape or form. it's just an excuse for people to behave like complete asstards.

nk'ing is nothing to brag about or feel good about.


preventing naked-killing, doing away with elemental absorb, no rejuve pots and having balanced classes would go a long way to "solving" bm duelling.


You misunderstood me. I never said that NKing is satisfying. But the mere fact that the person is dead and has to make that shameful naked treck to their body accentuates that there was a clear winner. Obviously I don't think NKing is good, that's why I started this thread...

[DjSlayer]

Hardcore/softcore, best pvp build etc. threads always go wrong :)


I agree mike, and I never participate in them. People should be able to play what ever character and mode they want without having other people looking down on them.

Regarding the nk issue, if they implement pvp/pk and some thing they should do IMO since this is one of the aspects witch made D2 so good too. They might have an arena for pvp and only mutual consent on dueling and that way disable grief play.

- D.J.

[JusticeInACan]

I was disheartened to find out from the gameplay videos that there is HP in Diablo III; meaning, you can die. What the hell? What's with the old fashioned sensibilities, Blizz? You're going to have to become more progressive if you want my money. Death is tedious boring and unnecessary. It serves as a blockade for player creativity "LEEROY, JENKINS!" and character progress.

Get with it Blizz. It's 2008.

The sarcasm, it burns. So much, in fact, that my monitor just caught on fire.

Anyway, why not just introduce death penalty, such as reduced HP and mana for a certain amount of time or until you enter a town, instead?

[Dimmu]

Someone said pvm should force you to find your body and you should respawn with it in PvP, i was gonna say that, but you beat me to it :/

Anyway, the ability to nk should available to turn off and on because some people actually BM duel on purpose, I don't but if that's their thing, it should be available.

[Arkardo]

The sarcasm, it burns. So much, in fact, that my monitor just caught on fire.

Anyway, why not just introduce death penalty, such as reduced HP and mana for a certain amount of time or until you enter a town, instead?

Good point. I just thought up some other idea's:


The quest where you were in automatically fails
Same as #1, but you can't solve any quests in this game at all. (To prevent too much strain on the server, it should probably combined with some mechanism where you can 'reset' the game where you're currently in.)
Remove the monsters around your corpse, making it easier to get it back but also denies you any drops
Depending on how team drops are handled, players who have died could be denied drops for a certain amount of time

[CYBERPUNK]

CYBERPUNK, i like it, but without res. :D
I don't want them res'd. I want them out of my game.
People who are so incompetent that they die need to be punished.
In fact if you die while saving Cain the message should read "You have died and failed to save Cain. Your incompetence has doomed humanity to unholy slavery"

yeah i just threw that Rez idea out there considering that's about the only way I could thematically think of bringing someone back into the game, otherwise, you're dead

I really think it would be a good system, because yeah you can always get into a different game but ones you've died in, you're dead, no respawning or any of that crap

and I like your Cain idea, not gonna happen obviously, but funny nonetheless =]

[yalthar]

I definitely wouldn't mind it if corpse-camping was removed.

[CYBERPUNK]

well I can say this, if there was a system like I suggest, there wouldn't be any corpse-camping, that's for sure

stick a fork in them, cause they're done, they ain't comin back