Single player character builds TESTS

[phaolo]

Hello again people.
Before switching to LOD I'm trying all character classes just as I'm curios about their potential.
I'm looking for setups that can survive in hell and kill all types of monsters ALONE.
I'm usig a FAST illegit way (except for items), but it's only single player and I've already finished the game without cheats or something. So, if you want, let's discuss about character builds and not about other things :P


--------------------------------------------------------------------------


As a first choice I tried the sorceress, as I like ranged crowd-control spells.

LEVEL 99 SORCERESS:

str 90 (for a -20% 400 def mesh armor)
dex 75 (for item and AR+DR hit formula)
vit 280
ene 140

life ~720
mana ~400
stam ~470

res=about 30-40 all with 2H stave
(do sorcs have some default res?)

+2+1 skills
+2 fireball
+2 shiver armor
+1 fire wall (useless)

fire mastery------1
fire bolt---------5
warmth------------6
fire ball---------16 (normal attack)
charged bolt------1
telekinesis-------1
lightning---------1
lightn mastery----1
energy shield-----2
chain lightning---18 (weak attack)
teleport----------15
ice blast---------1
frozen armor------1
blizzard----------1
frost nova--------1
glacial spike-----1
cold mastery------1
ice bolt----------1
shiver armor------16
frozen orb--------20 (powerful main attack)

left
F2 frozen orb (main)
F3 fire ball
F4 chain lightning

right
F5 teleport
F6 shiver armor
F7 energy shield


The main problems are:
-dungeons are damn hard to clean.. if she's swarmed, she's dead
-can't use a gemmed shield as she needs a 2H stave for skills
-cannot obtain powerful spells in all 3 elements (lightning needs lots of points)
-no life\mana leech through attack spells (or not?)


Interesting char, but not what I hoped :sad2:
Do you have better ideas for more powerful lightning skills? Most Act4 fire-cold immunes are not killable


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Second try was a Barbarian. My dream was a 2H swords barb with frenzy + whirlwind. Unfortunately I noticed that I can't do both and that melee damage with swords is not enough (even if very fast). So I tried the polearm WW barbarian and...wow!! With a rare grim shythe 60-140 he kills everything in few hits. I also tried the Woestave.. perfect! Lol Diablo becomes a weak slug. :grin:

LEVEL 99 BARBARIAN:

str 160
dex 140 (for grim scythe)
vit 250
ene 40

life ~1210
mana ~140
stam ~410

res=about 72-75 all

+1 skills

howl-------------1
find potion------1
find item--------1
battle command---1
shout------------12
battle orders----18
incr stamina-----1
incr speed-------1
iron skin--------1
natural res------10
polearm mast-----20
leap-------------1
leap att---------1
bash-------------1
stun-------------1
concentrate------1
berserk----------18
whirlwind--------20

left
F1 leap attack
F2 concentrate
F3 stun
F4 berserk

right
F5 whirlwind (main)
F6 battle command
F7 battle orders
F8 shout


WW barbs seem the best! Only blocked by IM as they need berserk.
My Paladin, even if shielded and strong, compared is very sloooow on rushing. No match :undecided:
(ook hammers are powerful :rolleyes: )

[CdMagicFind]

WW Barb
~250 Str
Rest Vita
20 Mace Mastery (for a martel), 20 BO, 20 WW, 1 Berserk



Or



HDin
Lowest Str Possible
Rest Vita
20 BHammer, 20 BA, 20 Conc, 20 Vigor



Should work rather well. Look around, because honestly your builds are pretty horrible.

[FireMarshal]

huh? What is your intention with this thread?

"Before switching to LOD I'm trying all character classes just as I'm curios about their potential."

:scratch:

[Fists of War]

I've been testing classic builds for ages and ages, must have made 150-200+ over the last 6-12 months. I like to test melee builds that are common in LoD but are barely played in classic. For example:
- Concentrate Barb
- PvM charger
- PvM smiter
- Avenger pally
- Melee Sorc
- Poison Zon

etc. etc.

And I've actually "discovered" some pretty cool builds. Poison Zon with maxed LF and Valk is a menace in chaos sanctuary, kill speed is nothing on a hammerdin but can still solo quite easily. Avenger pally can get very nice res and life, with godly gear can solo Trav quick enough to call it a "run".
And the biggest surprise of all, a PvM charger absolutely rocks in hell trav! Get a big martel (or even a bonesnap) and just smack the normal monsters around. Even average gear can kill normal monsters in 2 hits, perfect gear in 1 hit. You are safe (life leech is quite effective), easy to play (mana leech is also good, you don't need godly res/life/defence to survive) and pretty cheap (only need a nice weapon).

Too bad I don't play Bnet anymore, or I could show off a bit - shock all the old-timers who think that the hdin/ww barb/cold sorc are the only builds worth anything!

[WarlockCC]

To the Original Poster :
Isn't half the fun leveling a build to see if it works ? It is after all the only way to see in what situations such a build shines and where it fails. And all the items you find on your way might inspire you for future builds.

Few builds can clear all of Hell solo. Even the 'mighty'(read:overpowered) hammerdin fails against the wailing beasts.

Confessing to be using such a cheat(character editor) is already a step over the line, since it can be taken as incitement. So be careful where you take this thread.

[phaolo]

:cry:

Reasons and intentions:
1- I managed to finish hell alone with my strange rare build; I wanted to discover others, find the best one and receive comments from other players
2- unfortunately I don't have time\patience to start again from 0 for each char (even if bnet is faster)
3- was curious about all the unused items I previously found
4- saw many guides, but they all seem for multiplayer (usually max 1 skill + synergies only)
5- barbarian power forced me to write this post (his guilt)

Liked to test these builds before continuing Act5 with original Pala in Lod. Oops, I always try cheats for a bit after I finish a game :neener:


-->WarlockCC
Sorry.. didn't think at all about a possible cheat incitement.. open bnet is already hacked and this game is seven years old! Dunno, delete this post if it's not allowed.
No problem :lipsrsealed: + :smiley:


-->CdMagicFind:
I'll try them, however I wrote what I've tested so far.
Questions: can your barb survive IM with 1 berserk? How can your hammerdin kill the magic immunes? (ex: unravelers)

-->Fist of War:
Yep, alternative powerful builds are good! Ook, better legit, etc..
Anyway, I'll try your Poison Zon ;)
Ah, can the charger survive IM or defeat PI? (that is the point) Or can he kill if he's circled? Isn't charge bug fatal also?


p.s: still wondering how to increase lightning damage for the sorc

[FireMarshal]

Well, the most versatile character I have ever played in my life is a WW barb...yeah. One point into Berserk and you are good to go. The only thing you cannot kill is a PI/MI Monster, and those are quite rare, I only see a couple a ladder season. Mana Burn monsters can give me fits at times too, but they are defeatable.

[phaolo]

Both PI\MI? Woa..never encountered such monsters! Wondering if I'd be able to kill those with my Paladin Holy Freeze weak aura :scratch:

Ah, I didn't see this!
Melee Sorc --> LOL that seems difficult\impossible :laugh:

[WarlockCC]

-->WarlockCC
Sorry.. didn't think at all about a possible cheat incitement.. open bnet is already hacked and this game is seven years old! Dunno, delete this post if it's not allowed.
No problem :lipsrsealed: + :smiley:

So if lots of people jump from a cliff, you'd do the same because it seems to be the norm ? You'd make a great lemming. ;)
Seriously though. If you don't level a char you've never played before, how will you know if it's the character that's weak or your knowledge of how to use that character effectively ?
It's like if you are used to driving a car and you suddonly descide to drive a motorcycle. Would it be a safe idea to start off driving a very fast racing cycle, or better to learn to drive such a vihicle on a 'low power' motorcycle ?


I have a picture somewhere of me and a hammerdin having some problems with a Wailing beast boss (PI on top of his normal MI)
Yes, those are rare. Or if I've seen them before, I didn't notice since I was hauling around some serious elemental damage. To take those down I would think you would need to bleed it. I vote to put wailing beast boss packs in CS.
Since it's PI, a normal hit won't affect it, but if your hit carries even the smallest bit of elemental damage, you can cause open wounds on a PI. Mind you, trying to bleed a boss can take a long time.

[phaolo]

Hihi, fun game Lemmings *sings music*

Anyway I meant: I doubt that people will be convinced to cheat from this post.. after 7 years they can imagine\know it elsewere. Besides, cheating in SP is useless for playing and open bnet is worthless nowadays (as many of you said).
So there's no point in it lol...well, except for a fast test of course :tongue:


Ok, surely this method is not the best.. but I don't think it's so wrong (apart from ethic). If I can "ride" properly in the hardest "tracks", I'm set. In this case there are no fatal endings hehe
1- I'm testing the chars in hell Steppes\River\CS plus act end Bosses if possible.
2- I've read all the skills charts and some guides too.
3- I know all the game monsters by now (except MI-PI :wink: )


If I'm (probably) wrong, experts can suggest better builds if they wish (but only for SP to kill all except those rare wailing beasts). Or give me a link to single player guides please hihi



-->FireMarshal:
I found hard to kill a "stone skin PI" boss with a 60-140 grim scythe and berserk 15.. I'm dubios about 1 point only with martel, but I'll try.
I put 140 dex on the barb as I don't want to rely on an unique item only (the woestave). Can you hit with base barb dex as CdMagicFind said?

[Kevin William Cox]

So... let me get this straight. You want advice on builds in classic which you can later on take to LOD, meanwhile you're useing an editor which is frowned on via the forum rules, you didn't list the gear you have or would like to use as end gear, said you couldn't find any guides for anything other than multi-player, even though we have a very active Single Player Forum with guides listed out the ying-yang.

Hmm...


1. First, most builds in classic don't do well in LOD. The gear set up is very different and when you add in charms, rebuilding is almost always recommended.

2. Take a LONG hard look at the stickies and threads in the SPF. No, it is not set up for Classic, but the ideas there are incredible. Use your head and make adjustments. Oh, and for God's sake, don't make a thread there saying you're useing an editor, no one will reply. I'm not saying that no one here in Classic has never used an editor in SP, some have, to test builds such as you are doing, but it is frowned upon here, and unexuseable in the SPF.

3. Best build? That is truely, a matter of opinion. The opinions will differ greatly in Classic and in LOD. It's really a matter of play style and what type of charectar you like more than anything else.

All in All... I say if you are gonna go LOD anyway, why even bother with Classic? The guides are completly different and not very compatible when converted. My advice, go over to the Community Forum and check out the guides there, they list gear and everything:thumbsup: All for Bnet, proven to work in hell, write ups on how they performed and even odd builds.




Kev

P.S. Melee Sorc? lol, Check this thread out: Immpossibe is nothing.

http://forums.diabloii.net/showthread.php?t=480035&highlight=SuperDave

[phaolo]

:cry: x2

1- No, I'm going to convert my original Paladin only (will have to find gear). This is just last curiosity for classic. Oh well, I could test all the chars in xpac too after game end, but.. no future LoD posts of this type, I swear lol

2- Just wanted to be clear but.. ok, I won't talk about those ways again :soapbox:

3- Classic for now! Well I'm open to opinions.. for example what's a good sorc SP build to kill all? I'll search in the guides..


Ah, the melee sorc.. again I meant classic
Thanks for the link though (he's mad)

[WarlockCC]

Since you're sp and basically never have to take /players 8 into account, you could try a dual tree or maybe even tri-element.
simple dual : max orb, 17 cold mastery(with items), 1 telekinesis, 1 teleport, 1 static,1 point lightning mastery, max nova, fill up lightning mastery after that.

[CdMagicFind]

-->CdMagicFind:
I'll try them, however I wrote what I've tested so far.
Questions: can your barb survive IM with 1 berserk? How can your hammerdin kill the magic immunes? (ex: unravelers)

Points in berserk only add more % damage. IM only affects you if you do melee damage, and berserk is considered magic.

Hammers ignore undead/demon magic immunities. For wailing beasts, hit them with your shield.. or something.

[Pfft]

3- Classic for now! Well I'm open to opinions.. for example what's a good sorc SP build to kill all? I'll search in the guides..

As long as you stay in Classic, Static Field will allow you to defeat the great majority of non-lightning immunes in a few seconds; not only does the skill not need to be maxed but you could save several skill points by cutting back on Chain Lightning. Lightning or Thunderstorm suffice for finishing off your severely weakened opponents.

[FireMarshal]

-->FireMarshal:
I found hard to kill a "stone skin PI" boss with a 60-140 grim scythe and berserk 15.. I'm dubios about 1 point only with martel, but I'll try.
I put 140 dex on the barb as I don't want to rely on an unique item only (the woestave). Can you hit with base barb dex as CdMagicFind said?

That depends. If I were to equip Angelic Ring+Amulet I could, but with base dex, I feel that I do not hit well enough. I have 100dex on my MF barb, last season I had 120 or so. If you can find items which add to AR, it helps immensely. A +100ar ring effectively adds 500ar to WW. Pretty impressive. Further note, I do not use Angelics, I'd rather use LL/ar/res rings. Sadly, these rings are hard to find, and I only have one resist between my 2 rings....LL and AR are important so you can keep alive with all the hits.

[CdMagicFind]

Dex is a poor way of adding AR anyway. Martels are generally the best now, since damage matters more than range.

Angelic's is good for AR. Rings, etc. PAmythest your weapon if you have the wealth?

[FireMarshal]

It is a poor way yes, in most cases, for me and my build, it works perfectly =) Any my weap needs to be pskull socketed.

[Fists of War]

When I mentioned a melee sorc as a good build I meant it is actually good, not just a "challenge". Use max Enchant, warmth and fire mastery. Max out shiver armour. Gettting some lightning skills i.e static, tp, maybe even ES as you don't really use mana much is good. Yolu could use a fast weapon like a cutlass, or the general's flail for slow. Swordback+twitch is probably the best combo, then get resists somewhere else. You can do nice damage (as much as a zealot ^_^) and can solo Hell travincial. The key is the fire mastery, you can get 1000+ enchant damage, then mastery works on it, and you do ~4000 a hit. You could even use high defence gear for 5000+ defence!

Anyway I really want someone to try my 'Zon build, so that's col that you're giving it a shot Phaolo ;)

Basicaly it's max Lightning Fury, max Plague Javelin, max Poison Javelin, around 5 points in Dodge/evade/avoid, max Valkyrie, then split points between pierce (for you) and critical strike/decoy (for the valk). Ideal gear is regular javs, twitch, high resists shield, deaths sash/gloves, +2 zon amulet, then you want godly resists on the rings, boots and helm. Can be very hard tog et the right gear, but it'll still clear up to maybe act 3 Hell relatively easy with mediocre gear....

[WarlockCC]

Hammers ignore undead/demon magic immunities. For wailing beasts, hit them with your shield.. or something.
Just to clarify to Phaolo, Wailing beasts are part of the third group of things that do not like you, monsters. So they are the only ones which are truely immune to the hammers magic damage.

[phaolo]

-->CdMagicFind
Alright, "WW mace barb" wins against "WW polearm barb". :thumbsup:
BUT not sure if you consider Woestave.. that weapon rocks

Is shield + hammer any good for WW? (can block while spinning?)

About Berserk, I need that +% damage to kill before I'm killed due to 0 defense. High skill is also vital against those bosses I mentioned before

Chances to hit with WW and 120 dexterity (139 mod), are 65-80% after river of flame (depends on monster). I have +220 AR from rings and weapon. I'm testing all builds at level 80



-->Pfft
That is the type of advice I wanted! Thanks, I will do it
Static Field has a 50% limit in hell LoD, right?



-->WarlockCC
Unfortunately, dual tree sorc can't defeat dual immunes (no?)

Blessed hammer ignores undead/demon magic immunities.. lol, more bugs
Anyway WW too is an overpowered skill.. it's like a superfast fanaticism with multiple hits. I repeat, Zealots are sloow :'(



-->Fists of War
I'll follow your advices and try your amazon. Just wait ;)
Wow again for the Melee sorc.

[CdMagicFind]

Woestave's okay for a unique weap. It gets the slow, prevent heal, open wounds, but 60 is really way too low for a max damage. Martels are stronger even without having ED. Plus Bonesnap, imo, is a lot better either way. CB pretty much beats every one of Woestave's mods.

You can block while WWing. Mace barbs actually get one of the best 1H solutions as well. So they compete with sword ones in that they can switch easily.

That might be because of your weapon. Zerking with a martel or hammer gives a pretty good DPS.

An angelic's ring or two helps a lot. PAmythest weapon, rings, etc.

Edit - And it's not a bug, it was made to ignore immunities of everything except the third type, thus wailing beasts.

Edit - WW is probably one of the best single skills in the game for Classic or pvp in LoD yeah. It doesn't need synergies either. =]

[WarlockCC]

To clarify some more, like CDmagicFind typed, it's not a bug. The damage is holy(blessed), so it affects undead and demons.

[phaolo]

-->WarlockCC
Bah, random rules.. some other Paladin auras are "holy", but they don't benefit from the same hammer privileges :rolleyes:
Joking, but here's an advice for Blizzard's diablo 3: balance the characters! Hihi :laugh:


-->CdMagicFind
For the Woestave you forgot that it also freezes, blinds and lowers monster defense by 50 per hit.. weapon low damage becomes irrelevant! WW Diablo with it and you'll know what I mean :starry: (ok, not good for normal melee)

I like the shield + hammer barb! Maybe because I'm originally a Paladin lol. I feel more safer and I can relocate some points from "natural resistance" to more interesting places. Also berserking becomes less dangerous. Nice!

Hammer and martel damages are enhanced above 80% and speed is increased.. dunno, maybe you have better strategies. Never mind about this skill

..what is this PAmythest?


-->Pfft
Static Field solution Works good. Too bad it is on right click only.
I realized also that both my lightning and fire trees are too weak for CS. I'll have to think to something else (if possible)..maybe orb+enchant+static.. dunno


-->Fists of War
I'm playing with the various amazon skills before testing your creation. I must say she's a strange character!

First-look comments:
-loving the Valkirie
-plague is interesting. Will see if I can kill poison+PI\poison+lightning\PI+lightning with the build
-I don't have very good rare bows or crossbows, but "multiple shots" seems weak on its own (strafe is nicer)
-freeze & exploding arrows are good, but they're mana hungry
-for throwing I have ony one Hurlbat and a Simbilan for now in my ATMA..
-lances are slow and their skills soso

I gambled great jewelery for almost all classes except for my Paladin (doh).
For the amazon I have an amulet with +1 skill +20 res all! Resistances are still bad though


Bye for now :grin:

[WarlockCC]

You could allways buy a 3 socket shield in act 1 or 2 normal(check the shops and refresh them by walking out of town and back again if they do not have it right away).
Then stick 3 perfect Diamonds into that shield. It'll give you 57 to all resists.
Having good resists is really nice for keeping your life.

You could make a powervalk, max valk and max decoy. Maxing decoy will give the valk 400% more life (380% technically, since you already have 1 point in htere as prereq).
A level 20 valk will also have 500 str or so, which is quite nice.

As for the holy bit, yeah, it is slightly unfair that for instance Holy Bolt can't kill demons. But that would make CS far too easy for my healers I guess. >:)

[Fists of War]

You could make a powervalk, max valk and max decoy. Maxing decoy will give the valk 400% more life (380% technically, since you already have 1 point in htere as prereq).
A level 20 valk will also have 500 str or so, which is quite nice.


A "powervalk" is pretty much how my zon build kills poison/lightning immunes not that theres many of them...) except that it's max valk, and only around 5 in critical strike, with 1-5 in decoy. Still survives in all but the most chaotic situations (3+ council members, CS boss packs).

A cool thing to do is make the ultimate valk, maxed, max decoy/critical/great dodges...then wield MF gear. You can run NM mephisto easily enough, just chuck on goblin toes and rattlecage and stab Mephisto with your dagger to deliver CB while the valk does the real damage.

I'm going to do a little bit more testing with my build today, figure out perfect stat/skill/gear...

[Kanif]

Isn't half the fun leveling a build to see if it works ? It is after all the only way to see in what situations such a build shines and where it fails. And all the items you find on your way might inspire you for future builds.

I agree with this completely. To me, AT LEAST half the fun of using rare builds is the process of actually -building them!-, to see how they work.
If you get to hell a4 just to see that is impossible... well, at least you had much fun taking the char to that point. And maybe collected some nice items in the process, so its not "wasted time".

[phaolo]

Not bad, not bad!! I tried this:

inner sight------1
slow missiles----1
avoid------------1
evade------------1
lightn bolt------1
penetrate--------2
dodge------------4
crit strike------4
pierce-----------5
decoy------------10
valkirie---------20
lightn fury------20
poison jav-------20
plague jav-------20


The valk can survive even against lots of monsters! One kind resisted well with Diablo too. Decoy is useful if she dies or if you get too much evil attention

I didn't find those double immunes. Anyway valk + fury is usually enough for poison ones

Questions:
-does IM harm the valkirie?
-are her items random? For example those with life leech stats
-how much str\dex\ene for the amazon?
-is the javelin damage relevant at all for this build? Simbilans are too few. I'm using the spears from the shops (80 each)


P.S: yes I have the gemmed shield :thumbsup:

[phaolo]

Ok, last builds tried:
-The hammerdin, surely powerful but.. boring.
-The necromancer, very fun and quite strong


About the necro there are some annoying things though:
-revive expiring timer should have been paused in town, otherwise you don't have a single moment to.. breathe
-you cannot take armies with you through acts! Doh
-some rare times a revived monster still fights against you, but you can't kill it.. :shocked:


LEVEL 99 NECRO
shield + wand

+2+2 skills

raise skel-------1
raise skel mage--1
summon resist----2
revive-----------6
skeleton mast----10
golem mastery----10
clay golem-------16
teeth------------1
bone armor-------1
bone spear-------1
poison explos----1
corpse explo-----8
bone spirit------16
poison dagger----16
poison nova------18
amplify damage---3


Surely won't be the best build, but it works fine
The necro is fun to play :grin:

Well, unless there aren't other comments or advices.. end of the tests :jig: