View Full Version : Question: Optimal Mf% for glitch meph loot?
psychocrabmeat
31-07-2007, 03:59
For those unfamiliar with glitch meph, it means you never finish meph quest, and join games made by a player who has, and so you cannot finish quest, but IT ALLOWS YOU TO GET "QUEST" LOOT, which has a higher number of rares/uniques/sets.
It has been suggested elsewhere on forums that zero mf% is ideal for glitch meph, and when i compare 50%mf to 400%mf, 50%mf has given me more high quality rares/uniques/sets than 400%mf, which gives me a lot of low quality sets. I wonder why this happens.
What are your thoughts?
Wait wait wait.. You saying, let's say, make a cheap fireball or blizzard sorc, level it to 75 in NM Baal runs, and use that for MFing mephisto with 0 MF?
If this truly is effective and works that way, I could have saved myself so much time building up my mf sorc :/
AnimeCraze
31-07-2007, 05:54
It has been suggested elsewhere on forums that zero mf% is ideal for glitch meph, and when i compare 50%mf to 400%mf, 50%mf has given me more high quality rares/uniques/sets than 400%mf, which gives me a lot of low quality sets. I wonder why this happens.You are still getting more set items with 400MF. MF does not influence what unique/set/rare items you get. It only merely increases the chance of getting a unique/set/rare.
psychocrabmeat
31-07-2007, 06:35
what i was thinking was that maybe first kill significantly increases chance of rares/uniques/sets, then the mf% causes some of the drops to become magical.
chesster
31-07-2007, 07:27
i think we need someone to confirm this first.
HeroXVII
31-07-2007, 08:19
This works. Make a MFer that doesn't get past Act 3. Join public Chaos/Baal runs or games where somebody who has done it is the host. Go in kill Andy/Meph and get t he Quest loot. Another way is join a game with somebody who hasn't done it. Get to Act 3, Durance 3 and party them up. Kill Mephy, get the Quest loot.
Will that work if they are not in the Act 3 when you kill? As in, they don't get the quest completed even though if they are in your party?
HeroXVII
31-07-2007, 10:02
Will that work if they are not in the Act 3 when you kill? As in, they don't get the quest completed even though if they are in your party?
I don't think it matters if they're up to Act 3 yet. That's why it's called a glitch. I don't know if it works or not, but one of my friends said it did.
psychocrabmeat
31-07-2007, 15:10
here's some guides about meph glitching:
http://forums.diabloii.net/showthread.php?t=557123
http://forums.diabloii.net/showthread.php?t=542893
Well what i was initially inquiring in the thread was, Could more mf% possibly be detrimental? observation does seem to imply to me that 400%mf (compared to 0%mf) causes an increase in blue/set drops, and since meph is allowed a set maximum number of drops, the number of rares/uniques suffers.
More MF% cannot be detrimental, unless there is yet another glitch. The game checks for Uniques>Sets>Rares>Magic, in that order. Thus more MF will always be beneficial, as the harder-to-find items (Uniques) will be checked first. In fact blues are technically a greater sign that your MF is working (The blues will be failed sets, as Quest Meph will drop only Rare+ otherwise). MF still operates by chance, no matter how much you have, so you may not see great improvement until more than a dozen runs. Regardless, the base mechanics are still working. In regards to maximum drops - IIRC Quest Meph has a set number of drops(7?). There is no roll for NoDrop and no roll for Blues, thus the number of rares/uniques cannot be affected.
chesster
31-07-2007, 19:18
does meph drops good uniques with that meph glitch? or only rares?
Yes, he drops very well. I would recommend reading the above-referenced threads on this, as the details of this should be in there. Off-hand I do not remember the chance of dropping for sets, but IIRC the chance of dropping a Unique is 10% for Quest Mephisto. Now remember, this number is rolled on each item that he drops. This makes the chances of at least one unique per run much higher.
A high MF pushes this number to almost-guaranteed uniques every run. If you can pull off an MF of 400% (As quoted somewhere above) your chances of getting a unique each time an item is rolled is boosted by 236% (due to diminishing returns). This boosts your overall chance of getting at least one unique from Mephisto from 52.2% to a whopping 94.3% (Assuming he drops 7 items).
The only reason people see less returns from 400% than from 50% is chance, and a bias towards positive gains. It is much easier to forget drops that you do not need, versus than the ones you do need. Lets say you are a Sorceress with 400% MF running Mephisto for an Occulus, and you pick up Blastbark, Skystrike, Iron Pelt, and Bloodmoon on your first 3 runs.
You then switch to 50% and get an Occulus on your fifth run. You are much more likely to think that your 50% MF was working for you, because you got the items you wanted. Even though the 400% got you More Uniques.
Arbedark
31-07-2007, 20:17
here's some guides about meph glitching:
http://forums.diabloii.net/showthread.php?t=557123
http://forums.diabloii.net/showthread.php?t=542893
Well what i was initially inquiring in the thread was, Could more mf% possibly be detrimental? observation does seem to imply to me that 400%mf (compared to 0%mf) causes an increase in blue/set drops, and since meph is allowed a set maximum number of drops, the number of rares/uniques suffers.
When I was doing it with my 200 MF sorc I was getting mostly blues with maybe 1 yellow, green or gold per run :(
http://forums.diabloii.net/showthread.php?t=502611
The thread I quoted here explains the same as what I have said, and how to set up the glitch. If you are running and are receiving many blues every run, and very few uniques/sets/rares, then you are not doing the glitch correctly. I will reiterate it:
Take your preferred character. Level him up to Hell Difficulty (to 75 at least, as unless you have very good gear and a good build it will be hard to kill Mephisto before then). Complete acts 1 and 2 But Not Act 3! Complete quest 5 (the High Council) by killing the council members in Travincal. Proceed to Durance of Hate level 2 by whatever means you like.
Now Do Not Kill Mephisto Any Game, Made by You or Anyone Else, If They Have Not Finished This Quest!. If you do, you will complete the last quest and that character can never get the quest drop from Mephisto again. You must find a game where Act 3 Quest 6 says "This quest cannot be completed in this game...". Kill Mephisto in that game to get the quest drop. How you find games like this (friends, joining random games, perming with own characters, using 2 cd-keys, etc.) is your own business.
Remember though:
Do Not Kill Mephisto Any Game, Made by You or Anyone Else, If They Have Not Finished This Quest!
chesster
01-08-2007, 00:16
zera i have a question.
does more mf increase the chance of finding GOOD uniques?
like shako, arach, ss.
thank you for ur help
Directly, no. If you are guaranteed a unique, your chance of finding a good one is just as finding a bad one.
Indirectly, however, it does. By increasing your chances of finding all uniques, you have more chances to find good ones. Thus if you have no MF, you may do 10 runs and find a Duskdeep. But if you had, say, done those runs with 150% MF instead, maybe you would have gotten a Duskdeep and a Skin of the Vipermagi as well.
Basically, always put on more MF if you can, without compromising how fast you kill. It's a thing that has been reiterated on these boards many times. If you can pack on another 100% MF and only increase your Meph run time by 3 seconds, go for it. You'll get more uniques - more bad ones, but more good ones too. Don't, however, add 100% MF if it means you cut your run time in half. That is one thing that isn't worth it.
chesster
01-08-2007, 06:34
i currently have a 360 mf sorc light/cold.
she wears talset but she kills fast.
would it worth it to remake a new sorc to mf with the mf glitch or just keep the one i have? what do you think?
thx
psychocrabmeat
01-08-2007, 06:41
probably keep yours since you are rich enough to get full tal set. but if you want to collect a large amount of uniques/sets for new chars, you might consider it since glitch meph drops these kinds of items more than anything else i know.
chesster
01-08-2007, 07:09
are u being sarcastic
I can see Chesster's point, having Tal set does not make you even remotely close to rich. It barely breaks you out of the dirt-poor stage. I am interested in his question as well though. Anyone else has expirience (not just numbers) as to how much better you gain items with this method over normal MF and if it's worth abandoning your current Andy/Meph MFer to make one to glitch meph?
By the way, I think the other method works too. If you join a game with a person who has not done a countess quest, that person goes outside Act 1 while partying with you, and you kill countess, you will still get the quest drop from the chest (I need to test this again to be sure).
If the same principle applies to the Mephisto quest, then you don't need to restart your current MFer for a glitch one to get the benefits. You just join games of people who just started act 1 hell, party up, and kill Mephisto. It's a slower method, true, but the quest drop should remain. Can work like a Charm if you have a friend to do this one with or two computers/CD-Keys.
It all really depends on how much you want to run Mephisto, and how much time you have on your hands. I all honesty, leveling a sorceress to a point where she can run Mephisto is not a long ordeal - You could pull it off in as little as 5 hours, especially if you have a friend helping. Thus, it is in most cases very much worth it to do this. The amount of uniques you get from this method is significantly more than without it (You get at least twice as many, if not even more).
Basically, if you plan to MF for at least twice as long as it takes you to run a sorceress to a level where you can run Meph, this glitch is worth it.
Do u have to kill trav every game for this to work?
I've followed this guide and lvled my sorc to hell act3-trav done, meph not finished, and I did join games where meph cant be completed. However, he still drops a many blues and not many uniques.
chesster
01-08-2007, 22:42
@ psycho,
tal set is better than shako/hoto for mfing.
if u dont trust me, i can link you a thread on this forum where a guy proves it.
I can afford well also. I have some goodies.
chesster
01-08-2007, 22:43
smacking, do you have any mf on that char?
ive heard its better to have 0% of mf to get uniques/rares.
More MF% cannot be detrimental, unless there is yet another glitch. The game checks for Uniques>Sets>Rares>Magic, in that order. Thus more MF will always be beneficial, as the harder-to-find items (Uniques) will be checked first. In fact blues are technically a greater sign that your MF is working (The blues will be failed sets, as Quest Meph will drop only Rare+ otherwise). MF still operates by chance, no matter how much you have, so you may not see great improvement until more than a dozen runs. Regardless, the base mechanics are still working. In regards to maximum drops - IIRC Quest Meph has a set number of drops(7?). There is no roll for NoDrop and no roll for Blues, thus the number of rares/uniques cannot be affected.
0% MF is not better. Again, more MF is never detrimental to finding uniques. To rares it can be, but seeing as the majority of items you need and want are Uniques, this is not a problem. Please, do not spread this rumor further.
AnimeCraze
02-08-2007, 00:32
I've followed this guide and lvled my sorc to hell act3-trav done, meph not finished, and I did join games where meph cant be completed. However, he still drops a many blues and not many uniques.Are you ever getting any junk like gold, arrows, and pots? If not, then you have glitched correctly.
Nope I havent gotten any gold, pots or arrows so far, guess it was just back luck.
Demongod
02-08-2007, 08:39
I can see Chesster's point, having Tal set does not make you even remotely close to rich. It barely breaks you out of the dirt-poor stage. I am interested in his question as well though. Anyone else has expirience (not just numbers) as to how much better you gain items with this method over normal MF and if it's worth abandoning your current Andy/Meph MFer to make one to glitch meph?
By the way, I think the other method works too. If you join a game with a person who has not done a countess quest, that person goes outside Act 1 while partying with you, and you kill countess, you will still get the quest drop from the chest (I need to test this again to be sure).
If the same principle applies to the Mephisto quest, then you don't need to restart your current MFer for a glitch one to get the benefits. You just join games of people who just started act 1 hell, party up, and kill Mephisto. It's a slower method, true, but the quest drop should remain. Can work like a Charm if you have a friend to do this one with or two computers/CD-Keys.
What?! Unless you're a single-tree sorc, IMO Tal's set is literally the best thing a sorc can wear if you're going to balance MF, survivability, and killing power. If you go skullders/occy/shako, you're going to get absolutely torn apart by elemental damage. If you're going to go shako/occy/CoH/arachs/sojs/magefists/spirit, you might be dropping things left and right but GL HF finding anything. Tal's set strikes a perfect balance and with the orb's resist dropper, you might be looking at a FAR higher degree of killing. For instance, say a monster has 95% elemental resistance. In order to do the damage of 1 "unresisted" blast, you'd have to hit them with 20 of them. Now that they're down to 80% resistance, you'll only have to hit with 5 to do that same damage. 400% increase in killing power? Quite nice.
AnimeCraze
02-08-2007, 10:10
Problem is, very few enemies has 95% resistance. Still, I would value -5% resist at least as high as +5% total damage unless you are using infinity. In short, I would value -5% resist over +1 skill for fire and lightning, and +5% damage over +1 skill for cold.
What?! Unless you're a single-tree sorc, IMO Tal's set is literally the best thing a sorc can wear if you're going to balance MF, survivability, and killing power. If you go skullders/occy/shako, you're going to get absolutely torn apart by elemental damage. If you're going to go shako/occy/CoH/arachs/sojs/magefists/spirit, you might be dropping things left and right but GL HF finding anything. Tal's set strikes a perfect balance and with the orb's resist dropper, you might be looking at a FAR higher degree of killing. For instance, say a monster has 95% elemental resistance. In order to do the damage of 1 "unresisted" blast, you'd have to hit them with 20 of them. Now that they're down to 80% resistance, you'll only have to hit with 5 to do that same damage. 400% increase in killing power? Quite nice.
The Tal Set also costs about 2 High Runes and an Ist to complete with other Mf gear which you will probably find yourself (namely Nagels, rare boots with MF which drop like flies, and Chancies). It may be very nice, but "rich" builds tot equpiment that costs enough high runes to go in the double digits.
psychocrabmeat
07-08-2007, 02:29
i forgot to bring this up for consideration, i haven't seen meph drop any super uber elite set items like tal's ammy, tal's armor, or ik armor, someone who knows more about meph's item level drops could better explain item levels of meph drops.
so if mf% makes it so Sets are more likely to drop than uniques, uniques more likely to drop than rares, and we take into consideration meph's max ilvl and the good set items' ilvls, might it be more profitable having a particular %mf?
AnimeCraze
07-08-2007, 04:51
Tal's ammy is not an elite drop. It can be dropped in even norm.
I believe he can't drop Tal's or IK armor though. Someone correct me if that is wrong.
Mephisto cannot drop many of the elite unique and set items. This includes Tals and IK armor. He can drop Tals ammy, although the chances for it are not so good.
TheOctane
07-08-2007, 17:50
For those unfamiliar with glitch meph, it means you never finish meph quest, and join games made by a player who has, and so you cannot finish quest, but IT ALLOWS YOU TO GET "QUEST" LOOT, which has a higher number of rares/uniques/sets.
It has been suggested elsewhere on forums that zero mf% is ideal for glitch meph, and when i compare 50%mf to 400%mf, 50%mf has given me more high quality rares/uniques/sets than 400%mf, which gives me a lot of low quality sets. I wonder why this happens.
What are your thoughts?
my thoughts?
1.numbers are numbers, high MF just increases your chances. It appears you are questioning a bad code in the software that lowers you chance with higher MF numbers? thats a very BOLD statement to make.
2. The glitch Meph (or any boss for that matter) run only makes it so no junk drops i.e. potions/arrows/gold . No direct effect on uniques and sets.
3. luck is luck is luck is luck...50% mf is NOT going to give you more good items than 400% mf, its statistical. YES you might see more on the first few drops...but others may not.
scottrick49
07-08-2007, 21:40
2. The glitch Meph (or any boss for that matter) run only makes it so no junk drops i.e. potions/arrows/gold . No direct effect on uniques and sets.
This musn't be true on normal difficulty, because i just rushed somebody yesturday and normal duriel didn't drop ANY magical items - let alone a unique, rare, set, etc.
This musn't be true on normal difficulty, because i just rushed somebody yesturday and normal duriel didn't drop ANY magical items - let alone a unique, rare, set, etc.
I think duriel is the abberation boss that has crap drops anyways. No matter the difficulty or the first/1xxxxxxxth time killing him.
AnimeCraze
08-08-2007, 01:33
1) Duriel always drop a TP.
2) The quest is finished for you, so you are not getting quest drop. As I understand it, you need a person who did not finish the quest to kill the boss in a game which the quest is already completed.
TheOctane
08-08-2007, 18:03
2) The quest is finished for you, so you are not getting quest drop. As I understand it, you need a person who did not finish the quest to kill the boss in a game which the quest is already completed.
you are correct
carnageeee
10-10-2007, 16:41
does glitched meph still work on LOD 1.11b? Just asking because I made a sorc (who is now lvl 49), and didn't want to continue to waste my time lvling her unless glitched meph does indeed still work. Sorry for being a nubcake.
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