SP Barbarian

[SpeedySlicer]

I just started a single player barbarian and not sure if I'm gonna be able to make it untwinked very well.

so which would work better a double swinger or a berserker?

Also I havn't decided on which weapon yet. Which is best for single player? because as i can see most good ones are gonna be hell to find.

[asdfgah]

You could check out this guide:
http://forums.diabloii.net/showthread.php?t=126634
It is intended for Version 1.10 final, hardcore, singleplayer and untwinked play.
Sorry I can't help you much more since I don't play barbs a lot :embarassed:

[Aldeth the Foppish Idiot]

so which would work better a double swinger or a berserker

First of all, I would say the choice should be between a frenzy or a berserker barb. While it's probably possible to make a double swing barb, you'll be much better off continuing further down the double swing tree and going with frenzy for the better damage and speed. You'll still want to invest in double swing as a synergy, and even use it until frenzy becomes available, but I wouldn't max out double swing. Check out Ash's frenzy guide in the sticky for a good setup.

Having said that, the two builds are very, very different. The one general piece of advice I will give you is that a berserker will kill faster, but generally will also get hit a lot more than a frenzier due to having no defense while attacking. Because of the no defense, many berserkers go with a shield, an option that is obviously not open to a double swing/frenzy barb.

[SpeedySlicer]

Yeah I like frenzy and all but unfortunatelly I had one in 1.09 and I moved so fast with a few hits that I had ran a mile in the next second lol. Dunno if I can control it at high level. Hmm Berserks no leech presents an issue I didn't think of.

Any ideas on how to counter these problems?

[Aldeth the Foppish Idiot]

For Frenzy, put double swing on left click and frenzy on right click. If you hold down the right click, you can just move the cursor from one monster to the next instead of clicking on them individually. Then switch back to left clicking for double swing - that should help you get more control.

For berserkers, it also is useful to have another attack keyed in so that you can alternate between physical and non-physical attacks. For example, you could alternate between berserk and concentrate, or berserk and whirlwind, so that you can hit for big damage for a while, and then switch to a secondary attack to leech mana back before going back to berserking.

Another possibility, if you don't want to invest in two attack skills is to get an item that gives % damage goes to mana, such as the shield rune word "ancient's pledge". As a berserker, you're going to get hit, and so by having an item that converts a % of the damage you take to mana for you, you should be able to keep a steady supply of mana for your character.

[stephan]

I think Nightfish makes an excellent point about a 1 handed zerker though. He'd most likely do less damage than a 2 handed Concentrater and probablly be less safe as well.

Zerkers stay safe with their warcries (War Cry, Howl and Battle Orders).

[SpeedySlicer]

Wouldn't it be better for a frenzy build to max bash as double swings synergy because the 10% to double swings damage would be more then the 8% to frenzies damage?

That is if your running both.

and would double swing be slower then frenzy alone? Because I read somewhere that double swings strikes are capped at 5 frames per attack.

[Aldeth the Foppish Idiot]

The only way you would fully synergize double swing would be if it would be your most used attack. I was assuming that Speedy would be using Frenzy primarily, and double swing would only be a backup against mana burners, or any other time he runs out of mana. From the time I played a frenzy barb, I really only used double swing with any regularity until I got Frenzy. After that it was all Frenzy, and Double Swing was only there for when I was out of mana.

The other problem is with skill points. The traditional frenzy build maxes frenzy and battle orders at a minimum, and also you need to dump at least 10 points or so into taunt, double swing, and warcry. Unless you have a way of dealing with PIs, you also are going to have to pick up berserk and all of its prerequisities. And that doesn't even count the prequisites for the other skills I listed. Simply put, unless you're going for an exclusive double swing build there aren't enough skill points to fully synergize double swing.

Finally, even though bash gives a bigger bonus to double swing the double swing gives to frenzy, the hard skill points spent on frenzy increase frenzy's damage way beyond what double swing could every acheive. That means that even if you tried to fully synergize double swing, I still think if you had 20 in frenzy that frenzy would still be doing more damage.