LF javazon mana problems

[NaliWarCow]

I'm having a lot of problems with mana using LF. I just got my first mana steal item at level 67 (I had been using lots and lots and lots of mana pots), and I'm still not able to leach as much as I use. I have a 7% manald heal ring, and a titans revenge, so I should be doing a good bit of physical damage on each throw.

Yet I can still run completely out of mana in about 10 seconds when I hit with every spear, and if I miss I'm out in a few seconds. Do I need 15+% mana steal, more damage, or is there some trick like using the penetrate skill which lets you hit 3 monsters and mana leach off each of them?

Thanks.

[zallus]

well the rest of ur gear is important because we dont know what shield u are using. but one suggestion is use a spirit monarch which will give u around 100 more mana or the other is use a phoenix monarch which will give u unlimited mana.

[NaliWarCow]

Duriel's Shell
Eye of Etlitch
rockstopper
string of ears
tearhaunch
sigons gloves/shield
ravenfrost
titans revenge
manald heal

heh, if you can tell me a way to get 2 vexs, a lo, and ber besides buying them I'd be happy to try to farm them. But I thought runes were just completely random drops unaffected by mf, so getting those is going to be rather tough. And the people who have runes are 90% duped so they disappear after I trade for them, and its hard enough to trade for them since runewords are all better than the best things I could try to get mf'ing meph or whatnot.

I guess I'll make a spirit and see how well the extra mana helps out, thanks.

[Aiglos]

meh...skip the spirit, and opt out for Storm Shield or Moser's with two pdiamonds.

Just give your merc an Insight stick with level 15 or higher Meditation and that will solve all of your issues up through NM. However, once you get to Hell this will have to change. Still, by that time it won't be as much an issue, because your LF will be so damaging that you'll be able to be more prudent about where and when you cast it.

Honestly, without an Infinity wielding merc, I think you'll find Hell long and tedious -- doable, but tedious all the same. There will certainly still be monsters whose immunities you can't break, but with Infinity they will prove to be few and far between.

But Insight is what really makes this build sing up through NM.

I think a cheaper alternative (gear-wise) to ease your struggles would be as follows:

Titan's
Skin of the Viper Magi (+1 and all res is too good -- Lionheart works here, as well, better than Duriel's Shell, in my opinion)
Rockstopper
Sandstorm Treks
Cat's Eye (since you'll have an Insight merc, well, mana just isn't an issue)
Ravenfrost (or even Bul-Kathos, if you can swing a cheap one)
Dwarf Star (for the Fire absorb mainly)
Laying of Hands
TGods Vigor
Moser's with X2 pdiamonds

This is barely more expensive than the rig you run now, and it will eat NM. Switch out Cat's Eye and find yourself a good +1 rare ammy with all res and mana and you'll be good...you'll have to run a lot from Lit Immunes, but keep a Demon's Arch and Tiamat's Rebuke on switch and you'll be ok...just slow.

MERC GEAR:

Insight stick (in NM damage won't be an issue for the merc)
Duriel's Shell
Vamp Gaze or Tal's Mask

I think you could probably swing this gear setup, some of which you already have, for less than 60 pgems for certain.

About your pierce question -- yes -- it is important. Razor Tail will help you here. So it's up to you whether or not you want to sacrifice the safety of TGods for the killing speed of Razor Tail. Pierce is a BIG deal for an LF zon. As to whether or not each bolt pierces -- I'm not certain. And it's a good question. I would assume so, but I can't say with 100% certainty. I'm certain it's detailed in one of the guides on site, however.

And I think it will make your life much easier.

[WrongdayJ]

Items that give "+XX to mana after each kill" are VERY good for mana problems if your killing speed is good.

Also, try to increase the size of the Blue Bubble itself with items that give + to mana. More mana to draw from is always a good thing. Mana leech is good, too, if you are hitting fairly hard. . .which it sounds like you are.

I found out (with my Frostmaidens, which also plow through mana like no one's business) that the Cresent Moon Unique Amulet works wonders. Try to get one if you can.

'% of damage taken goes to mana' is also a good thing as you get close to Hell. You can almost count on this mod ALONE keeping your bubble full. . .as almost everything in hell hits so dang hard.

Hope this helps. . .

[NaliWarCow]

Again with the high level rune words. How am I supposed to get these?

I had a level 85 sorc a few months back (didn't play and she got deleted) with tons of mf. I must have done literally hundreds of mf runs and found some very nice gear, tal's full set, HoZ, and 1-2 of just about every exceptional set/unique with more of the common ones. After dozens of hours of gameplay doing nothing but mfing, I netted about 4-5 hrs I believe. 2 disappeared.

So should I just stop playing this game now since the only way to do hell is to already have 4+ hrs and I don't really feel like paying these annoying spammers money for items?

[crawlingdeadman]

stormshield on a ranged pvm character is a waste. <--period

spirit shield ftw!

you dont need hrs to complete this game or mf in hell. you can complete this game using pgem items or found items you picked up on the way.

[Dacar92]

stormshield on a ranged pvm character is a waste. <--period

Plus the strength req is high.

Spirit is the way to go until you get the mana pool you need. Tal, thul, ort, amn. Four cheap runes and a 4 os shield and you've got an extra 89-112 mana, + skills, and good resists.

[Aiglos]

meh...people always say that, but it isn't true. Stormshield has saved my *** more times than I can count. And, yeah, yap, yap, yap, say all you want about me not being able to play this game. I've been doing just fine for more than six years now.

Everyone makes a mistake. Everyone ends up in a crowd they don't want to be in...usually once a game or more, unless you're being uber careful and ALL you do is party to Baal run.

That 35% DR has saved me NUMEROUS times. And I wouldn't have it any other way. There are easier ways to alleviate your problems than giving up the DR% just to get some Vit and Mana off a Spirit Shield. Yeah, the +2 skills are nice (Spirit is a GREAT runeword), but I would rather have the damage reduction anyway since I will NEVER run a max block zon. Stormshield pretty much alleviates the need to have a dex investment -- enough to equip Titan's.

Again, it's all personal opinion...

In Nightmare, sure, go for it. You'll be fine.

In Hell, no thanks.

You know, we tell people all the time that you can *complete* the game with 'cracked javelins' and 'stuff you'll find for just a few pgems' -- and that's true. But that isn't what MOST people are referring to when they talk about the game. They're talking about a build that will allow them to kill with the least amount of worry and frustration possible. The average gamer can't be bothered with pouring over the game to devise a plan to tackle Hell difficulty...naked. Yes, the game can be completed...with care, more than a bit of tedium, and some monotony. I think what the poster is REALLY looking for is a build that will allow him to kill efficiently, effectively, and cheaply.

Spirit is a GREAT runeword. I prefer Stormshield. That's just me. Why does everyone on this forum feel some kind of need to assert their intellectual superiority at EVERY turn? It's a matter of opinion. I would pit my LF zon against a Spirit wielder any ole' day.

[Aiglos]

And to the OP on this thread:

just to reiterate...at NO point did I suggest that you would need any uber runewords to BEAT the game. You can complete the game without INFINITY (which is the only high end runeword that I mentioned), but it makes life...infinitely...easier -- in Hell.

And I think that's what you're looking for -- ease of play. But you don't have to have it. You just have to find some way of deal dual elemental damage. That will help you immensely. You'll be a slow killer...but.

And to answer your final question: the quickest way to build wealth on the ladder is, in my OPINION, to use a character with NO MF to run the pits. Take all the good socketables and ethereals you retrieve and bring them here to trade them on the forums. That was how I started, and I know it's worked for countless other players.

[stephan]

Plus the strength req is high.

Spirit is the way to go until you get the mana pool you need. Tal, thul, ort, amn. Four cheap runes and a 4 os shield and you've got an extra 89-112 mana, + skills, and good resists.
That's funny because the 4 os shield (non-pally) with the lowest strength requirement needs 156 str. Now let me look up Stormshield... ;-)

@OP: if you want a lightning immune solution that is not Infinity make a hybrid with Freezing Arrow, the synergies to LF are less than mediocre anyway. Single element builds are either expensive or frustrating. An Insight polearm on your merc will take care of your mana problems and this way it is easy to take it with you in hell. Also, don't spam LF.

[zallus]

I would pit my LF zon against a Spirit wielder any ole' day.


I would take that challenge but this isnt about that...for him having mana problems spirit is the best and cheapest way for him to go.

[NaliWarCow]

ok, just traded for a 4os monarch. Now I just need about 30 more levels to get the str to wear it.

Then 15 more to get my dex back up to 75% block since the shield has much lower block than my current :).

Thanks for all the help guys.

[Aiglos]

Like I said, SS or Monarch...makes no difference, as both require 156 STR -- but what would I know, right?

Yes, Spirit will solve your mana problem...but it's a temporary solution and, in my opinion, makes you ultimately less survivable.

Go with the suggestion that TWO of us have given you already. Keep a shield that offers you better protection and get your merc a nice ethereal INSIGHT.

Insight really makes this build sing well into Hell. I didn't make Infinity until I was well into ACT2 and I was getting along fine -- slowly -- but fine.

I just think that INSIGHT is a better overall investment.

AND AGAIN: Much cheaper than tracking down a 4os monarch, and worse yet, having to worry about whether or not you end up with an FCR that will allow you to move the SPIRIT to a caster at a later date. I just say hold out and make an INSIGHT...it's a much better, much cheaper, much more well integrated solution. You survive better and your merc gets a potential boost to his damage, a nice aura, and a ton of nice mods to boot.

With a Spirit you're just sort of overlaying the situation by adding some additional mana. You still won't be able to spam LF.

But, again, it's just one man's opinion.

[awilhelmscream]

Simply put my opinion to the OP is:

Get a spirit shield. It'll solve your current problem, it will allow you to progress through the rest of the game and when you are starting a new build it can be transfered to them!

[Dacar92]

That's funny because the 4 os shield (non-pally) with the lowest strength requirement needs 156 str. Now let me look up Stormshield... ;-)

Doh! I guess I typed faster than my brain worked that time. Good catch...

[awilhelmscream]

Doh! I guess I typed faster than my brain worked that time. Good catch...

I bet you didn't even type it that fast :hide:

[crawlingdeadman]

Go with the suggestion that TWO of us have given you already.
i only see you saying stormshield i see...three people saying spirit.

Insight really makes this build sing well into Hell. I didn't make Infinity until I was well into ACT2 and I was getting along fine -- slowly -- but fine.

I just think that INSIGHT is a better overall investment.
why not make both? is spirit suddenly mutually exclusive to insight on a merc? not to mention that an eth 4os poll isnt cheap.

AND AGAIN: Much cheaper than tracking down a 4os monarch,
i trade white monarchs for 3 pgems. i've given some away.

and worse yet, having to worry about whether or not you end up with an FCR that will allow you to move the SPIRIT to a caster at a later date. I just say hold out and make an INSIGHT...it's a much better, much cheaper, much more well integrated solution. You survive better and your merc gets a potential boost to his damage, a nice aura, and a ton of nice mods to boot.

With a Spirit you're just sort of overlaying the situation by adding some additional mana. You still won't be able to spam LF.

But, again, it's just one man's opinion.
who cares about casters :grin:

let's not make this a spirit vs stormshield debeate. there are several issues to the original question (mana issues). i think jay hit all the high points. increase total amount of mana, leech, and the best for a java imo, mana per kill then of course you can always pot :laugh:

[AgentMarth]

Then 15 more to get my dex back up to 75% block since the shield has much lower block than my current :)

I don't think anyone caught this, but do not go max block with a spirit shield, its not worth the investment of dex IMO. If you did go Stormshield, then yeah, go max block if you want, but if you use spirit, the 42%(?) block will make you put way to much in dex unless you are sporting twitch/GAngel and a safety amulet.

Anyways, I've used both Spirit and Stormshield, but then found i liked Phoenix better for the Redemption aura and %ED for jabbing immunes. Also, the %ED helps do more physical damage for leech, so you can be good with upped Titans and ~5 mana leech I believe, meaning you don't need insight either.

Honestly, getting HR's nowadays isn't to hard. Phoenix is Vex Vex Lo Jah, so that is 4, but on just about each realm i think a HR goes for ~40 pgems. I believe on West atm, then can go for 15-20, its been a while though since i checked the SC prices since moving to HC. Or nice socketables work too.

Or, maybe try Lidless. Plus one skill, 58 str, plus mana after kill, 10 to energy, and plus 10% to max mana.

Also, jabbing light immunes ain't to hard for me, so there ain't a need for me to have an infinity (still have used in SC though), I just use inner sight to help my chance to hit, then jab away.

[Master Q]

I've made a Javazon without even touching the Arrow Tree a single time and it works just great. She's now at clvl 92 and clears entire WSK rooms with a single LF hit, with LS on my left click. 3k-4k phi dmg & 6k-7k (can't remember exact numbers for the skills but that's the range) delivered each hit haven't ever made me miss a cold attack (and consider CS for Boss runs, 7k x 11 bolts with an Infinity merc make Baal endure no more than 10 secs in worst cases). But I do understand your problem with mana: I got the final solution with a Phoenix Aegis (had a Monarch, but they're not that hard to find as I think I read... or I'm luckier, dunno). From the moment I had that toy on, my belt (life potions included) is only for emergency situations & I can keep leech limited to life for survival in the mass fighting (Redemption takes a couple seconds activating). But aside from that, I'm always with Mana & Life maxed out in a few moments. Phoenix man, that's the way to go.