View Full Version : pure Bone Necro in PVM?
Hi
I always loved the Bone Necro but never build one^^ Saw the people shooting cool things but the damage not looked that good:P
but something happened last night... i was in a Diablo run game in hell with hlvl20-60 ppl tring to beat the fisrt monster after the river WP and hopeing for a hammerdin join and help us:D
than a necro joined...
ok nice a summon necro:thumbsup: slower but safer run
wait i dont see a single skeleton! WHAT? 2 bone spear and the urdar pack was done:badteeth:
if bone necros are that good why i see soo few in PVM?
i think i start one now:) i love the fact that i can make my ultimate weapon in normal act 2:D
here is the build
key skills
20 spear
20 spirit
20 wall
20 prison
1 corpse explosion
1 clay golem+mastery
1 summon resist
1 revive vs ubers:thumbsup: rest go here
curses up to decrepify
It's not a good build for pvm. That necro probably used corpse explosion
It's not a good build for pvm. That necro probably used corpse explosion
but after the urdar incident he cleared the whole chaos sanctuary:p
but after the urdar incident he cleared the whole chaos sanctuary:p
With corpse explosion? :azn: Only takes one corpse for a chain of death
than a necro joined...
ok nice a summon necro:thumbsup: slower but safer run
wait i dont see a single skeleton! WHAT? 2 bone spear and the urdar pack was done:badteeth:
impossible. dunno what u saw but for all i can tell it was not hell difficultie.
at lvl 50 bone spear with all sinergies maxed does arround 6K dmg
urdar at hell player1 got 8346-13600life, multiply that by number of players and u got preatty big number of spears...
an CE wount help much eighter on players 8 its got very low dmg.
also if u go for it.. get revive on wand.. and make white wand runeword
ideal would be +3spear, +3revive, +3 decrepify
but anyway i realy cant believe that P&B necro killed players 8 CS 98% of people who got boner got it to kill fellow players...
FYI I got PvP necro and i tryied CS run at players1 it was playeble, but took so long, I could not imagine that at players8.
It must have been corpse explosion. Most endgame bonemancers will get 4-6k damage bone spear. 6k if they have low fcr or mana. Like OsTo said, urdars have 8-14k life on single player. How many people were in your game?
Bone necros aren't believed to be able to kill the ubers either.
The last possibility is that this guy had some sort of elite hacks.
an CE wount help much eighter on players 8 its got very low dmg.
how is that true when the damage scales with the amount of players in the game?
FrankWest
21-05-2007, 10:06
how is that true when the damage scales with the amount of players in the game?
Quoted For Truth. CE is very useful, especially in eight player games. I don't see how anyone can say it doesn't do that much damage... it reflects the corpse's life back at the other monsters. QED - A monster has more life, its corpse - when exploded - will mirror that life in damage (1/2 fire, 1/2 physical) at the other monsters in the range of its effect.
no, CE doesn't scale up with the monster hp. it behaves as if you're still in players 1, even if there are 8 players in game
no, CE doesn't scale up with the monster hp. it behaves as if you're still in players 1, even if there are 8 players in game
if that were the case then monsters will have the same hp as a 1p game as they do in 8p. which isnt right...
ce damages through a % of the original monsters hp, so if a monster is killed in an 8p game where it has 8x more hp, ce will do more damage as it would in a 1p game :undecided:
pls dont argue about CE dmg on players 8 unless you tryed it.
logic says CE should be same on any players, any difficultie...
true is far far away...
Mad Mantis
21-05-2007, 23:27
if that were the case then monsters will have the same hp as a 1p game as they do in 8p. which isnt right...
ce damages through a % of the original monsters hp, so if a monster is killed in an 8p game where it has 8x more hp, ce will do more damage as it would in a 1p game :undecided:
That is not true. A monster has a base life in a players 1 game. When you get to a players 8 game this base life gets boosted by a percentage. A rather large percentage. When you do a CE in a players 8 game, the life used in the equation is the monsters base life. The bonus the monster got from being in a players 8 game is not factored in. So you are doing less damage than you thought.
bonewallx
21-05-2007, 23:58
You just said the monsters base life gets boosted in players 8. And since CE does damage based on monsters base life, how are you losing damage. Unless you mean players 1 base life is what CE uses and the bonus to life in players 8 is a bonus not a new base life, in which case CE becomes less affective.
You just said the monsters base life gets boosted in players 8. And since CE does damage based on monsters base life, how are you losing damage. Unless you mean players 1 base life is what CE uses and the bonus to life in players 8 is a bonus not a new base life, in which case CE becomes less affective.
what he is trying to say is that every monster has a base life, and as more players scale up there is a multiplier applied to that base life; the base life itself isn't changed or modified.
when the game calculates the CE damage from a particular corpse it looks at the monster's base HP, not the current HP (which would be a multiplier applied to the base amount).
this was done to prevent CE from being too powerful, although it's already awesome as it is.
Mad Mantis
22-05-2007, 18:28
this was done to prevent CE from being too powerful, although it's already awesome as it is.
Back in a few of the old patches it did scale. That was cool.
If it did scale, people wouldn't need infinity and amp to boost its damage.
Logic says otherwise, OsTo.
If it did scale, people wouldn't need infinity and amp to boost its damage.
Logic says otherwise, OsTo.
read my post again...
So is the bone necromancer a viable character for PVM?
The only thing I can see that I don't like about his skills are that they just shoot one monster at a time(pierce with bone spear!), but he's also got minion magnet!(bone wall). And then there's the big mana problem...
No, it's not very good for PVM. But, it is fun.
It's very good for PVP.
viable in the sense that it can be done...as long as we keep in mind that a lot of builds can be pulled off, but i wouldn't say its one of the more effective builds for pvm
viable in the sense that it can be done...as long as we keep in mind that a lot of builds can be pulled off, but i wouldn't say its one of the more effective builds for pvm
I disagree here i have a bone nec in sp that i built from scratch not muled items that is very effective.But i built him my way max bone spirte bone spear teeth and dim vison rest in bone wall.You dim vison more then the whole screen then merc clay golem tank boss of pack kill it then take yopur time killing rest of screen safe and easyUp to players 3 to 5 games.Woulndt advise higher then p5 it takes too much time.and i have onloy 4 to skills right now in act 4 hell and still going strong.This is hc hence i chose to max dim vison for safety.
I have a pvm Bone nec and he kills in hell fine, I have a point into confuse, with +skills it has a nice radius, cast it, spam spear until a couple have died then spam ce, it works fast for me.
Amplify Damage + CE with +skills will kill faster.
GUARDIAN KELEMVOR
19-01-2009, 20:29
Hi guys.
I play a bone necro that can do hell dificuly easy. Ill give the build and gear in a sec but I can't remember the stat distribution.
Build
20 teeth
20 spear
20 spirit
20 bone armor
20 wall
1 CE
1 amp
Use teeth in norm cuz it wrecks and spear for pvm, spirit for pvp.
Everything here is for synergys but I left out pre-reqs. Put extra points in various curses and maybe bp. Anyway I have all stats lev 16+ and all bone stats 37+ its an amazing build I came up with in study hall lol.
Gear
134 shako with ptopaz for mf
DS nigma
210 homonculus
Trangs gloves (you could probably find better...)
Bone runeword
1nec skilz ammy with res and 10% fcr
Bk ring and res/10% fcr ring
Arachs belt
Infernostride boots (I wasn't sure what to use for boots but it works great)
15/18 necro torch
Mid/high gheeds
3 pnb gcs
Merc
act 2 merc of your choice
MUST have 16+ med insight (I have near infinate mana with my lev 18 insight and infinate telly)
125 shako with ptopaz (I suggest an um rune)
I don't have anything good for armor right now (vipermagi skin :/) but get sumthing with high res and def.
G2g im not sure if im done this but ill come back and tweek gl guys
billking
20-01-2009, 06:34
Here's my thoughts on the topic:
1. No matter what your original intention is or was, a bonemancer is not a PvM build. It will, at some point, be a PvP build. You might start off wanting to Dim Vision monsters and Spear them to death, but at some point you might develop a taste for PvP... and why bother leveling yet another bonemancer for dueling purposes? Just stick to the PvP build.
2. A bonemancer is not an item find build. There are other builds more suited to that purpose, and since your build isn't a "natural" for PvM you're not going to have spare gear spots to dedicate to magic find. In other words, a bonemancer is not good "naked" for PvM. Those bonuses to skill points are important. The purpose of PvM for this character is to gain levels for later PvP dominance, and maybe have some fun while you're doing it.
3. Do NOT put EVEN ONE skill point out of position "for PvM purposes." You want your bonemancer to have maximum PvP viability. The primary purpose of PvM for a bonemancer, as stated earlier, is to gain levels as quick as possible. This means: to put skill points where you need them for PvP, as quick as possible. Assuming nothing in the Summoning tree (which is actually wrong, Clay is good in PvP, but just go with me here), you'll want 102 skills in the P&B tab as soon as possible. That means you'll want to get to clvl91 ASAP. Even a single point out of place means you'll have to PvM from clvl91 to clvl92 to replace that point. If you've never done that before, let me just say that is a LOT of work.
4. So if you can't put dedicate points to PvM skills, what do you do instead? The correct answer is: get the skills through staffmods. Between a wand and a head, you can gain access to up to 6 skills you haven't sunk a point into, and you can bypass prerequisites this way too. If you want to have Decrepify, Attract, Revives with Skeletal Mastery, and Amplify Damage, that's perfectly possible with the right equipment. Dim Vision is available too. Pay attention to the shops and wait until you find a Venomous wand with the appropriate skills. Just stash your PvP gear and use your "crappy" PvM gear while you level. If you haven't built your bonemancer yet, pay attention to "crap" heads gotten while leveling through Act 1 Normal, as they could end up being very good even in Hell for a bonemancer by granting access to low-level skills like Amplify Damage and Skeletal Mastery.
5. +skills (especially +P&B skills tab) items are important because you want your one hard point in Corpse Explosion to have roughly the same boom as the maxed CE of a dedicated skellimancer. You won't have minions, but you'll have skillers and all that other PvP bonemancer gear. Might as well use it productively in PvM. Even if you have a Harlequin Crest, you might want to give serious thought to keeping a good +3 P&B skills circlet, for example, especially if it has other juicy mods like FCR.
6. Since you're spamming not just Teeth/Spear/Spirit but also CE, you're going to have mana issues. Since you're going with a rather tight PvP build, dedicating points to energy is strictly verboten, and potions slow down leveling. For this reason you'll REALLY want an Insight polearm on your merc. Even if Hell monsters have so much life that you can't kill them quickly, you should have fast cast and almost unlimited mana; just spam until they one drops, then CE the rest of the mob into oblivion. Insight means spamming endlessly without the annoyance of worrying about refilling your mana globe.
Hi guys.
I play a bone necro that can do hell dificuly easy. Ill give the build and gear in a sec but I can't remember the stat distribution.
Build
20 teeth
20 spear
20 spirit
20 bone armor
20 wall
1 CE
1 amp
Use teeth in norm cuz it wrecks and spear for pvm, spirit for pvp.
Everything here is for synergys but I left out pre-reqs. Put extra points in various curses and maybe bp. Anyway I have all stats lev 16+ and all bone stats 37+ its an amazing build I came up with in study hall lol.
You'd actually get both better damage from synergies AND better absorption on your Bone Armor if you take 19 points out of Bone Armor and put them in Bone Prison.
Grumpy Old Wizard
20-01-2009, 15:43
Some say Bone Necros are just for PvP but I enjoy bone necros for PvM. The bone walls/prisons make for excellent crowd control. Although when you are playing multiplayer you have to take into consideration how your walls are going to affect your teammates. You don't want to trap another character with your walls.
When starting a new bonemancer I do not pump teeth. I put a single point there and get a wand with teeth staff mods and use it and corpse explosion for a while or mele until I pick up the Spear skill.
The first skills I max are bone spear, bone wall, and bone prison. This gets you a strong bone wall more quickly. After that bone spirit and leftovers in teeth. I get a hard point in amplify damage. I don't mind shopping wands at normal act2 drogan to get a good bone wand with a curse. Also shoping for a teleport staff is necessary in case you get traped in your walls.
Aside from amplify damage, you may want a hard point in dim vision. It is very useful for shutting down gloams and archers. Depending on how "pure" you want to be you can also pick up a clay golem and a point in revives.
Oh yeah, as somebody else said, don't point but one point in bone armor. It will be quite strong from all the synergies with only one point there.
Here's my thoughts on the topic:
1. No matter what your original intention is or was, a bonemancer is not a PvM build.
Bone necro is the best key hunter. It is best caster as well. I know that hammer does more damage, but necro can choose target. Hammer with his dizzzy, drunken spell reqires weird playing skills.
IMO PvM are characters which attack more then 1 monster at once. Bone spear has 100% piercing attack - very usefull in PvM.
CE is one of the most useful skill in D2 but it is not necessery pump there more then 1 pt. With stuff you should have about 15 skill lvl - enough to kill magic immune Horadrims.
Revieves are necessery to hold bosses not moving or attacking you, when you shoot them. This is most comfortable - no other characters can do it (druid summons die very fast when revieves are immortal). Anyway best revieves source is "white" wand.
Not P&B usefull skills - AD works well with CE, LT helps when your merc is in danger, CGolem and GMastery not very usefull, but looks nice ;)
Last and only disadvantage - bone necro cannot kill ubers (only UIzual and sometimes UDuriel)
HanShotFirst
23-01-2009, 05:47
I can’t imagine why people are saying that a bone necro is not a good PvM character. I have made a number of hardcore untwinked (even single pass) bone necros and walked to and through Hell with no problems. What you get:
1. More than 1K magic damage (even with miserable gear)
2. At least 620 recastable hit points (with just one point in bone armor)
3. A recastable minion (one point in clay golem, golem mastery, and summon resist works great)
4. An area of effect weapon that deals physical damage (and you don’t even have to go out of your way to get CE)
5. Any curse you want (I would only suggest amp, but confuse is helpful with magic immunes . . . but then so is CE)
6. Mission adaptable minions (I’ve used revives to kill Pandemonium Diablo, more than once)
7. Bone wall, bone prison (saying “crowd control” hardly does these skills justice)
My first character after the last ladder reset was a bone necro (I wanted a character that could handle anything this side of uber tristram), more than a hundred Hell Baal walks later (most solo) he’s still going strong. I would definitely recommend this build to you and anyone else who is looking for a versatile, durable, and item independent character.
NovemberSnow
25-01-2009, 13:46
While Bonenecro can survive really well, he does not have great killing power like Hammerdin and Sorc. He is more demanding on gears to be effective, making it difficult to fit in MF gears without significantly reducing the killing speed. Bone spear is good in some places, but I find it kill slow if monsters are scattered around.
GUARDIAN KELEMVOR
25-01-2009, 18:24
Hi guys.
I play a bone necro that can do hell dificuly easy. Ill give the build and gear in a sec but I can't remember the stat distribution.
Build
20 teeth
20 spear
20 spirit
20 bone armor
20 wall
1 CE
1 amp
Use teeth in norm cuz it wrecks and spear for pvm, spirit for pvp.
Everything here is for synergys but I left out pre-reqs. Put extra points in various curses and maybe bp. Anyway I have all stats lev 16+ and all bone stats 37+ its an amazing build I came up with in study hall lol.
Gear
134 shako with ptopaz for mf
DS nigma
210 homonculus
Trangs gloves (you could probably find better...)
Bone runeword
1nec skilz ammy with res and 10% fcr
Bk ring and res/10% fcr ring
Arachs belt
Infernostride boots (I wasn't sure what to use for boots but it works great)
15/18 necro torch
Mid/high gheeds
3 pnb gcs
Merc
act 2 merc of your choice
MUST have 16+ med insight (I have near infinate mana with my lev 18 insight and infinate telly)
125 shako with ptopaz (I suggest an um rune)
I don't have anything good for armor right now (vipermagi skin :/) but get sumthing with high res and def.
G2g im not sure if im done this but ill come back and tweek gl guys
Correction on the runeword it is actualy "white" not bone idk what I was thinking
Also got 2 more pnb gcs :)
Im only planning on putting 1pt in prison for pvp cuz 1ce their in it they shold b dead with 3-4spears or spirits :)
Plz rate my build, you may have trouble untill higher levs and it is probably a good idea to get most if not all the gear I mentioned (gl with getting 2 sojs :))
My d2xlod bnet account is lawlessone. If any1 has any questions or would like to talk about ... stuff lol... add me.
Im normaly on at 6-8pm (eastern time?) in usa maine
Grumpy Old Wizard
26-01-2009, 06:17
Im only planning on putting 1pt in prison for pvp cuz 1ce their in it they shold b dead with 3-4spears or spirits :)
Your bonemancer is nice but I don't know why you are putting 20 in bone armor. 1 is sufficient. I would put those other points into prison instead of BA. As a bonemancer you shouldn't be getting hit much and bone armor is quite strong with only 1 point and is easily recastable. Use your walls and prisons to control the battlefield. I love walls and prisons. :)
For the poor, you don't have to have the ultimate in all gear to play a bonemancer through hell. You can buy a teleport staff in act 3 normal and use it in case you get trapped in your walls. Enigma is nice, but not required for PvM. And the White runeword is quite easy to make even in single player games.
I use a defiance merc with insight but I know some use a rogue and still do well.
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