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Lightning Bolt deals 75% of weapon damage, which converts to lightning damage. My question is: How do critical strike and deadly strike affect lightning bolt damage? Do I get double damage if critical strike triggers?
PhatTrumpet
17-05-2007, 23:42
The skill description says it converts physical damage to lightning damage, much like Berserk, so I'd have to assume that Critical Strike and Deadly Strike apply just like they do to Berserk... although logical reasoning has gotten me into trouble before with this game.
Summerfun
21-05-2007, 01:58
Thats a really good question, i would like to know the answer to this one too.
The skill description says it converts physical damage to lightning damage, much like Berserk, so I'd have to assume that Critical Strike and Deadly Strike apply just like they do to Berserk... although logical reasoning has gotten me into trouble before with this game.
Like PhatTrumpet says, this is how it *SHOULD* work... but I've done no hard testing on the subject, so I cannot say for certain that this is how it *DOES* work.
well...i think it does what it says! critical strike doubles physical damage and if lightning bolt converts all damage to elemental than critical strike doesn't work with that! it's simple. but if i'm wrong, please correct me...:lipsrsealed:
PhatTrumpet
23-05-2007, 18:24
If it's simple then how would you explain why Critical and Deadly Strike work with Berserk?
well...i think it does what it says! critical strike doubles physical damage and if lightning bolt converts all damage to elemental than critical strike doesn't work with that! it's simple. but if i'm wrong, please correct me...:lipsrsealed:
It depends on when the conversion occurs. For instance, let's say the order of operations is Deadly Strike, *THEN* convert. In that case, by the time the DS triggers, the damage is still physical (so it gets doubled), and then after that it hits the conversion step and turns into elemental (this is how Berserk works). On the other hand, if the order is Convert, *THEN* Deadly Strike, then the damage is converted to lightning, then DS triggers, but since there's no physical damage left, DS does nothing (this is how Vengeance works- Deadly Strike does not increase the elemental damage, although it does increase the final physical component).
In the case of Lightning Bolt, the skill should be operating in the first manner (Deadly Strike, THEN Damage Conversion), although I have not tested the skill to verify that it is working as intended.
It depends on when the conversion occurs. For instance, let's say the order of operations is Deadly Strike, *THEN* convert. In that case, by the time the DS triggers, the damage is still physical (so it gets doubled), and then after that it hits the conversion step and turns into elemental (this is how Berserk works). On the other hand, if the order is Convert, *THEN* Deadly Strike, then the damage is converted to lightning, then DS triggers, but since there's no physical damage left, DS does nothing (this is how Vengeance works- Deadly Strike does not increase the elemental damage, although it does increase the final physical component).
In the case of Lightning Bolt, the skill should be operating in the first manner (Deadly Strike, THEN Damage Conversion), although I have not tested the skill to verify that it is working as intended.
:scratch: Yes , very good theory man, but...has anyone ever tested this? I never use lightning bolt very much, fury is better. Now i'm really curious if LB is doubled...i think i should go and test this right now somehow...:evil:
there, i have tested this on bosses, 8p game and i don't think i saw some changes in health dropping...
there, i have tested this on bosses, 8p game and i don't think i saw some changes in health dropping...
If you don't mind me asking, what were the parameters of your tests? What was your listed damage? What was your chance of DS/CS? What monster did you test against? What was that monster's base life? What was that monster's base lightning resistance? How many throws did you attempt? Did you attempt to judge the effectiveness of the throws by anything other than the monster's displayed life bar? Are you aware that the displayed life bar is somewhat bugged and only useful as a very rough approximation? How many throws did it take to kill this monster? Did you repeat the tests against identical monsters with a different value of DS/CS active? Did you even perform two different sets of tests (with two different DS/CS values?), or did you perform all tests with a single DS/CS value and just look for differences in the individual hits?
In order for a test to be conclusive, it must be conducted under rigorously controlled circumstances and repeated enough times to ensure verifiability. A good test for this, if you wanted to try it, would be to create an Amazon from scratch with 20+ unspent skill points. Put a point in Lightning Bolt and NOTHING ELSE (well, prereqs too, but not CS). Go find a reasonably tough monster (ideally one that takes 10+ hits to kill), throw Lightning Bolts at it, and record how many LBs it takes to die. Repeat the test against the same monster type 4 more times (making sure not to try against minions, because that will screw up your count). Then, invest 20 points into Critical Strike and repeat the tests 5 more times, again recording how many throws it takes to kill. If the number of throws required decreased, then Critical Strike was affecting your Lightning Bolt throws.
PhatTrumpet
24-05-2007, 21:37
I would've just said, "I'd hardly call that 'testing'," but I've been known to be somewhat impatient from time to time... :rolleyes:
hehe no really guys i did throw many lightning bolts...to test this... i had LB at level 11, after +skills. can't remember the damage but i only looked into this whean i killed mephisto, diablo and baal.(i'm not at home right now so i can't run diablo!) i'm not quite sure i saw changes in health drop. i know when CS/DS appears , it's well seen on monsters health bar, when double damage occurs... i'm not sure what bosse's lightning res was(i played on hell), but i'll stick with the theory, at least what i've found out, that LB does not work with CS/DS... if someone saw anything different ...
WrongdayJ
25-05-2007, 21:53
Hmm.
I think there may be a piece or two missing from the testing method there.
I would probably use an enemy with less HP's to test on than a p8 Baal or Diablo. Something a bit more common. Like maybe one of those slow moving Ice monsters in the Ice Caverns. They are fairly common and have a good amount of HP's without being overly dangerous to test on (like say a pack of Frenzytaurs would be). SSoG's idea about maybe something that took say 10 jav's to kill would be ideal.
Hmm.
I think there may be a piece or two missing from the testing method there.
I would probably use an enemy with less HP's to test on than a p8 Baal or Diablo. Something a bit more common. Like maybe one of those slow moving Ice monsters in the Ice Caverns. They are fairly common and have a good amount of HP's without being overly dangerous to test on (like say a pack of Frenzytaurs would be). SSoG's idea about maybe something that took say 10 jav's to kill would be ideal.
yes you're right about that, but now i lost my will for testing that anymore... have you noticed that this thread hasn't been answered yet...?:fortuneteller:
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