hello all,
i've been reading up on bvc's and i am quite interested in making one. i have one quick question though.
if i want to use dracs, is it viable to use a arach's and 2x fcr rings to hit my 40fcr bp? granted, i would lose the cbf from raven, but if i cham my arreats, would that be a viable alternative?
but that aside, do most people just use a 20fcr glove+arachs and forget about it? if thats the case, do they use dual ravens or ravens/bk or ravens/something else (for general purpose, not for sorb/special scenarios).
also, is it very important to have 40fcr over 20? ty.
edit: also wanted to ask a couple more questions
1.) highlords or maras?
2.) dracs or rends?
3.) gores or treks?
4.) in sorb gear, is it ok to forget about fcr?
if it isn't too much trouble, instead of answering all those questions.. could someone just list all the optimal gear/stash gear for a bvc? price is not an issue, i can afford pretty much anything i could possibly want. (you can leave out charms, i already know the deal with which charms to use)
also, which fhr bp should i go for, 4 or 5 frames?
AlmostInfinity
09-05-2007, 13:25
if i want to use dracs, is it viable to use a arach's and 2x fcr rings to hit my 40fcr bp? granted, i would lose the cbf from raven, but if i cham my arreats, would that be a viable alternative?
-It's ok to be frozen so don't worry about chaming the arreat. But yes, 2x fcr rings would work.
but that aside, do most people just use a 20fcr glove+arachs and forget about it? if thats the case, do they use dual ravens or ravens/bk or ravens/something else (for general purpose, not for sorb/special scenarios).
-Yes, trangs gloves + arachs is the most common way to achieve 40 fcr. Either use dual ravens or duel fcr rings. Don't mix them.
also, is it very important to have 40fcr over 20? ty.
-Not really, the 40 fcr helps against very fast casters such 200 fcr sorcs and bone necros. 20 should be fine for most duels. Hell, 0 fcr seems to be all right for pub duels.
1.) highlords or maras?
Highlords - deadly strike is key, LR is nice too
2.) dracs or rends?
Dracs by far
3.) gores or treks?
Gores, best melee boots you can ask for. Also look into some rare boots with frw and tri resists.
4.) in sorb gear, is it ok to forget about fcr?
Depends on who you are dueling. If you over stack / sorb and lose a lot of fcr you won't be able to catch your opponent. I run hsarus combo against pallies so I get 0 fcr. Then again pallies don't really require a lot of teleing. I try to maintain 20 against casters. 40 if I am having trouble catching them.
if it isn't too much trouble, instead of answering all those questions.. could someone just list all the optimal gear/stash gear for a bvc? price is not an issue, i can afford pretty much anything i could possibly want. (you can leave out charms, i already know the deal with which charms to use)
Off the top of my head: hsarus belt+boots, coa, tgods, widowmaker, fort, demonlimb (I never use mine), sorb + stack items, angelic rings and ammy, stuff like that
also, which fhr bp should i go for, 4 or 5 frames?[/QUOTE]
-The 46 fhr bp
excellent, thank you for the help. exactly what i was looking for.
just one question...
why is it ok for barb to be frozen? isn't being frozen an incredibly negative thing in a duel? you move and attack much slower don't you? is there some reason why being frozen isn't that bad?
also, why dual raven? why not raven/good rare or bk? just wondering. ty for the help thus far.
excellent, thank you for the help. exactly what i was looking for.
just one question...
why is it ok for barb to be frozen? isn't being frozen an incredibly negative thing in a duel? you move and attack much slower don't you? is there some reason why being frozen isn't that bad?
That's why it's not ok to be frozen. Some people just think it does not matter, but it does.
also, why dual raven? why not raven/good rare or bk? just wondering. ty for the help thus far.
Bk is trash, it's +life is not boable and the +skill means nothing. As for rares, there is no such a rare that could surpass a ravenfrost. Give me a rare with +280 AR, +20 dexterity, 20% Cold Absorb, CBF and +mana. Oh yes, you cannot.
if i want to use dracs, is it viable to use a arach's and 2x fcr rings to hit my 40fcr bp? granted, i would lose the cbf from raven, but if i cham my arreats, would that be a viable alternative?
You will only want to use fcr rings versus non-cold based opponents that are low-defense casters.
but that aside, do most people just use a 20fcr glove+arachs and forget about it? if thats the case, do they use dual ravens or ravens/bk or ravens/something else (for general purpose, not for sorb/special scenarios).
mcm uses Trang gloves + fcr rings or trangs + arachnid + ravenfrosts. And most people seem to be favoring trang + ravenfrosts. And yes, it is good.
also, is it very important to have 40fcr over 20? ty.
40% is necessary only versus bonemancers and sorcs. Even so, the increase in the capabilities and killing speed of your barbarian are a lot faster with 40% FCR than with 20%.
1.) highlords or maras?
Highlord's. Mara's is totally trash. It adds useless skills, useless stats and useless resistances.
2.) dracs or rends?
Trang-Oul gloves or Dracul's.
3.) gores or treks?
Triple resistance boots.
4.) in sorb gear, is it ok to forget about fcr?
Don't use sorb, it's not needed.
also, which fhr bp should i go for, 4 or 5 frames?
48 FHR at all times.
As for gear and charms, here's a bit to read:
Pub Gear:
CoA 'BerBer'
Enigma
GriefZ 34/xxx
BeastZ xxx%/+>=36
Arachnid's Mesh
2x Ravenfrosts with 18-20 dex and 240-250 ar
Draculs with 15 str
Triple or double resistance boots with frw and str or dex. In case of double resistances, these resistances should be Fire and Lightning. With Triple Fire, Lightning and Cold.
Highlord's Wrath
2x Dooms
Stash gear:
Fortitude
Widowmaker 'Hel'
2x Angelic rings
1x Angelic amulet
2x fcr rings with >60 mana
Demonlimb
Kiras
Lightning Stack (4 ort armor, 19-20/1x's)
TGod's
Life Tap Wand
Treachery
Hotspurs
Trang Gloves
Arreat's 'ed/ias'
Charms:
Charms can either make or break the BvC. It means, if you have good charms, you can succeed, but without good charms you will not succeed. There are several different charm setups with their good and bad sides, and I will try to examine all of them by my best ability and knowledge.
The Classic setup:
33* max/ar/life small charms (SCs)
4* FHR small charms
Annihilus
Hellfire Torch
This setup is the most common among all BvCs. It's also the oldest one. It's a decent setup as it reaches high amounts of damage (if the small charms all have +3 max damage, it will add total +108 average PvP damage), high AR and it will also hit teh 48% FHR breakpoint. However, the only places that it can get mana from would be the small charms, which is bad, as you will want to get resistances from your small charms. Also, this setup lacks any flexibility between battles, as it doesn't offer too much resistances. It's just a plain old damage setup. It works fine, but it's not the best or the worst setup.
The adapted versions of the Classic setup: The mana version and my own version:
The mana version:
3-5* life/mana small charms
28-30* max/ar/life small charms
4* FHR small charms
Annihilus
Hellfire Torch
Now, this setup is already a lot better than the Classic setup, as it offers you quite some mana depending from the amount of +mana on your charms. The additional mana will allow you to triwhirl people for longer and it will also help you last longer it duels due to needing less manapots over a certain period of time. This setup is not so common but some people actually use it. I would recommend this setup for the wealthy people as it's clearly better than the Classical setup. Let's compare:
+16 average PvP damage and 585 AR for this 203 mana. That's clearly worth it. 500 AR makes barely any difference in your chance to it and the added 16 average damage is useless in anything less than 10 hits. You will kill most of your opponents in less than 10 whirls anyways so it doesn't matter. The extra mana helps you use Trang Gloves with your pubsetup as you now can have 10k AR, 40% FCR, ~700 mana, all in 1 package. That's what I would call godly.
My own version of the Classic setup:
12* ar/life small charms
11* max/ar/life small charms
5* life/resistance small charms
5* life/mana small charms
Annihilus
Hellfire Torch
This setup might look quite ugly at first look. It loses "lots" of damage and "lots" of AR for "little" resistances and mana. However, it's actually like the ugly duckling that ended up being a beatiful swan. The setup will give you high enough mana to play with your pubsetup versus any opponents (again, ~700 mana). But also, it will give you a bit of all resistances or lots to a single resistance. This is THE setup for dueling versus fohers or T/Vs or V/Ts, as it will allow you to have, for example, +110% to lightning resistance from the 10 SCs alone. Now if you got 4x fhr/11% lightning resistance scs, you will end up with a whopping +154% Lightning resistance. This will help your stacking by quite a lot. Also, in public games, this setup will make sure that you will not depend on the Anya quests for your resistances. Also, it will add approximately the same amount of AR as the Classical setup will. The only downside is the loss of a little bit of damage. To be honest, the amount of lost damage is ~72, which means nothing until you hit multiple times. This might be new to some people and old to some people. However, I've never seen people suggest this setup, so I will present it. I haven't had the time to experiment this setup on Open, but it should and most likely will work just as fine or even better than the other setups.
Now, let's get down to the setups for people who are on a budget. This is something I've never seen in any other guides. All the other guides simply list the Classic setup as your only choice, which is by far an incorrect assumption, and I'm a living proof of that.
The Poor version of the Classic setup:
33* Life small charms with ~20 AR on each
4* FHR small charms
Annihilus
Hellfire Torch
This setup will give you just as much AR as the classic setup. However, you will not have +damage, unless of course you can have those. If you think about buying small charms, you should value them life>AR>damage. This way is the best possible as you will want to have as high AR as possible while retaining a good amount of AR for Grief to do it's massive damage. The +damage is not as necessary with Grief as it would be with Ethereal Breath of the Dying, as you already have a godly amount of damage. Remember that the +damage has to be +maximum and not +minimum. This charms setup is overall pretty fine, as it will give you lots of AR (you will be looking at ~10-11 000's of AR), high life (6200-6300), and you will also hit the necessary breakpoints.
The Grand Charm version of the Classic setup:
3* AR/life Gran Charms with ~130 AR and ~30 life each
24* life small charms with possible additional mods (mana>resistances)
4* FHR small charms
Annihilus
Hellfire Torch
This is the setup that I use on my BvC. It works really great and he has exactly 9377 AR with his pubsetup. However, he has a few other charms with +AR (such as a 20/33 life/AR small charm, a 5/15 FHR/AR small charm, a 1/12/5 max/AR/FHR small charm). This setup let's the BvC have godly AR with a small sacrifice on their life. When buying the charms, remember to make sure that you have at least 6000 life on lvl 90. If you get 3* 132/40 Grand Charms (highly unlikely though), you can just do 3 more levels and have the same amount of life as a BvC with 33* 20life small charms would have on lvl 90. I plan to base my BvC on this assumption and try to get him 132/40 Grand Charms with a ~40/~50 life/mana Grand Charm to give me ~650 mana with Pubsetup.
If you have mana problems on either of the setups, replace three (3) small charms with a life/mana GC that's as close to 45/59 as possible. This will give you ~600 mana with your pubsetup. If you now decide to wear Trang-Oul's Gloves (which is for the best), you can use your pubsetup in TvTs and versus ANYTHING due to having enough FCR and mana to effectively chase Bonemancers and Sorceresses.
About Hellfire Torch, Annihilus and your Stats:
If you want the best effect on the BvC, you should go for +20 stats and +20% all resistances on both your Hellfire Torch and your Annihilus. However, if you cannot afford this, you should go with plain +20 stats on both. This is top priority. For example, if your BvC has +19 stats Hellfire Torch and +20 Annihilus, he will lose ~19 life. This might not look too bad, but when you multiply that by 10, it IS bad. So Stats>Resistances. Go for highest possible +stats and after that go after +resistances. For the flexibility setup, you should assign your stats as pointed in the start of this guide, where "- stats from Annihilus" and "- stats from Hellfire Torch" are the numbers of +stats you gain from them. For example, with +15 stats on your Torch and +20 stats on your Annihilus, you should have base stats of 68/62, assuming +20 Dexterity from 1 Ravenfrost. This setup has ~96 less life than a BvC with +20 stats from Hellfire Torch and +20 stats from Annihilus would have. This can turn into trouble, especially with the Poor charm setups.
olba! ty so much for consolidating all the relevant information i could ever want into this thread. no more hunting around.
just a few more questions!
if i cant find good tri-res boots (these are quite hard to come by with frw on my realm) should i go with gores?
also, im thinking about using arachs + dracs + dual ravens.
but i will switch the ravens out for 2x fcr rings when i need it against bone necs and fast sorcs. will that do?
id really rather not use a 20fcr glove because it seems like.. well such a waste of a glove slot for just 20 fcr (and cr in trangs case).
id really rather use dracs.
again, ty for the help.
if i cant find good tri-res boots (these are quite hard to come by with frw on my realm) should i go with gores?
You should only use Goreriders if you can supply your character with life/resistance charms to compensate for the loss.
also, im thinking about using arachs + dracs + dual ravens.
but i will switch the ravens out for 2x fcr rings when i need it against bone necs and fast sorcs. will that do?
It will do for anything except Cold sorcs. You will NEED Trangs for those.
id really rather not use a 20fcr glove because it seems like.. well such a waste of a glove slot for just 20 fcr (and cr in trangs case).
It's not a waste, the OW is not that wonderous if you are offensive and the +str is again not needed if you use Enigma, stripping Dracul's of its two greatest factors.
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