CoH or Enigma for a Dreamer pally

[kohlman]

I am currently using Enigma for my Dreamer and my resistances arent exactly maxed (no pally shield for dream and non-ladder dream is nearly impossible to find). I know CoH gives a stupidchunk of resistances and nigma doesnt.

the question is, does the resistances and LL of CoH outweigh the teleport, FRW, and mf of the Enigma? this is more for PvP but i do PvM enough to consider the life leech and life/KO from Enigma.

Other gear used (to help decide)
Doomz/Ebotdz
Highlords
Dream bone visage
Dream troll nest
Nosferatus Coil
Gore Riders
Laying of Hands
Dwarf Star
Ravenfrost

[mystified]

how did you use to solve IAS problem?
anyway, used CoH, fortitude (yeah ladder :) , enigma and found them to be not that much different.
I think Dreamer is just not PvP viable due to certain weakness (DR) so my char was based more on PvM
before my res charms I preferred CoH due to high res 20 str and ED to demons and undead. Then fortitude for def and res.
Then I moved to Enigma, which was best as it gave extra skills, def, frw and more mobility with tele. I had to use charms but don't really care on that part anymore. 50 res was more than enough in most cases.
As for PvP, cannot say as I don't play PvP with dreamer but I guess I am for CoH due to res and DR. At least you will end up with 23 DR.

[kohlman]

For the most part I use Highlords, LoH (might switch to Magnis, not sure yet since im trying my hand at PvP and %dmg to demons doesnt really apply there) and Nosferatus Coil.

From these items I have 50 i believe (20?+20+10)
I was wondering if 72% is all i need including the weapon or after the weapon? I figure Treachery might help and free up the belt and gloves for Verdungos and Dracs for DR and Open Wounds...

For DR both CoH and Enigma have the same low amount (how I miss my SS or Verdungos!) for a lowly 8%.

[Vegetall]

i have one comment, dream pally sheild, not trolls nest, but if thats all u gots to work with fine, but just like a good exile a elite sheild with resists... so u can get some extra help...

as for armor, i would say Fort for some added Pysh damg, but other then that COH since u are lacking resists

[niner]

Duress is sexy stats.

[kohlman]

I'm thinkind treachery or maybe duress since all i have to do is deliver the damage, not let the phys damage do the work.

I have been looking for pally dream shield for some time (hoping someone wants to make a sorc dreamer and will have a god pally dream shield) but they are impossible since they basically dont exist on non-ladder due to their unpopularity years ago...back before the last reset. man i feel old, just talking about the last reset =(

[Ouallada]

Just use charge for dreamer pvp. You will find that dreamers slaughter elemental characters as well as some sins. In pubs, you often can clear house in the first 10mins, before making a graceful exit before they sorb.

Dreamers with tgods have 95 res to lightning. WIth one piece of sorb, you can dance in traps. Conviction will never outweigh yours either. Fire sorcs are easily doable, esp if you are slightly BM and use spurs/dwarf. Even if not, you still have WW and dwarf. Cold sorcs are slightly trickier, but they die to pulses, and frozen orb can be tanked.

Use doom for zealots, bowazons and the like before they sorb you, and use cresecent moon on casters and sins. Dreamers are great pub killers. Just stay away from smiters, hdins and barbs.

Since dreamers are mainly caster killers, coh is better.

[kohlman]

I do use charge and it works great. i would have max resists with tgods but i dont have a pally shield and even tho the roll was 17 resist all, i need more. I use ravenfrost and dwarf star rings and nosferatus coil for the ias and slow (dreamers are usually considered bm anyways so why not use some slow) but i am going to need some more resist charms to make up for the lack of resistances. i have a torch and an anni which are mid-range.

I use doomz or ebotdz for both since i figure with max conviction, the -light resist wont work any further and against most sorcs and trappers resistances arent a problem, since they dont expect to get hit.

i also have a hard time gettuing past ele druids. when i go and pvp and all there is is ele druids and barbs i usually ally up with them since i cant beat them. hdins arent usually a problem as they tele aroundand that gives me time to wear them down. they do usually have good resistances until conviction hits tho. but i wait for an opening from below and charge once, then zeal away since their defense is lowered alot. i used to continue the charge but when i did that i would get hit by the hammers they cast before the first charge so it usually ended up in death =(

if they are caster killers, wouldnt faster run walk be better since the point is to not get hit or should i expect to get hit and put on the resistances?

[Ouallada]

You should use a pally shield for your dream. That is the first change you should make. Dreamers are not BM though, but if you wanna BM, use cleglaws instead.

Zeal should be a backup skill. Use charge for everything. Prebuff enchant and use ar/life charms. A single charge can kill some casters and sends the rest into fhr motion. Duel won for you.

The three weapons that a dreamer usually uses are crescent moon, doomz and ebotdz.

Use crescent moon for casters and in duels of attrition.

Use doomz when you face zons or melee characters.

Use ebotdz when you get sorbed.

Another option is ebotdpb. You do not need physical damage, and the 90ias allows you to use zeal without too many sacrifices.

Ele druids are almost impossible due to cyclone armour, but if you aura-kill their minions and catch them recasting, you have a chance. They usually have crap fhr, so every hit will punish them.

Barbs are difficult as well due to the high defense and life.

Hdins are NOT an easy duel for dreamers. Decent ones should not be tele-ing around blindly, but rather boxing you in with hammers as you cannot tele. Not a duel that a dreamer can win. Just as hard as the above two.

if they are caster killers, wouldnt faster run walk be better since the point is to not get hit or should i expect to get hit and put on the resistances?

With a 40+ res pally shield for dream and coh, your resistances are stacked way high. Back it up with some resist charms if you want. Frw is useless with charge, so do not use that.

Also, I have to stress that zeal is absolutely not the way to go. Charge is the best way a pvp dreamer should attack.

[kohlman]

I have looked and looked but ive only had one person ever join my game requesting a pally dream shield and he was asking way more than I had for it, above the trolls nest dream shield i have, which has good stats (17 resist all and 25% fhr). I only play about twice a week so when i get on i dont want to sit in games waiting on nobody to join =(

I usually use charge until i get them onto a wall because it seems like i dont have alot of time most of the time anyways.

I think I'll grab a CoH off of one of my other chars to slap onto this char and hopefully I can switch them out if necessary.

What does Crescent Moon do over the max Conviction? If the negative resistances are capped at -150%, then what does any more -res do? I think I'm missing something here because to me the extra physical damage from using an ebotdz outweighs the damage gained by the -res but I know I'm probably wrong.

I guess I'm dueling really really stupid hdins then because i dont seem to have much of a problem with them. I recognize their tele pattern, and once conviction hits them, im charging right at them at their next tele. switch to zeal after the first charge and they usually drop or tele away. rinse and repeat.

I can not beat ele druids. At least not good ones. The stupid ones are easy to recognize since they sit still and theyr cyclone armor drops in 2-3 hits. Their minions disappear as soon as I step out of the rogue encampment.

Barbs are also a class that I cannot beat without using bm by running around them and waiting for the pulse to get them or wait for them to mess up in a ww and charge and run, so I try not to duel them.

I got the doomz on my char for duelin certain characters and I must admit, I like the cold effect. It works great =)

For the most part casters drop 1-hit-KO and zons usually take 2-3, maybe 2 zeals after the charge due to the dodge, evaid, and whatever else it is. FoHdins are a joke cause with resist lightning, their FoH is almost entirely negated.

Now I need to find an ebotdpb...you think i can get one with an ebotdcb?

[Ouallada]

Charge is far superior to zeal in pvp, because zeal typically screws you over against high defense opponents, and also because you have to spare gear for zeal's ias, while making do without fanaticism.

What does Crescent Moon do over the max Conviction? If the negative resistances are capped at -150%, then what does any more -res do? I think I'm missing something here because to me the extra physical damage from using an ebotdz outweighs the damage gained by the -res but I know I'm probably wrong.

That is IF they are at 150% negative resists, which almost every character will not have. Convic itself gives -150, which means your opponents need to have 0 res in hell for crescent moon to not have any effect. More often than not, you hit hardest with crescent moon.

I guess I'm dueling really really stupid hdins then because i dont seem to have much of a problem with them. I recognize their tele pattern, and once conviction hits them, im charging right at them at their next tele. switch to zeal after the first charge and they usually drop or tele away. rinse and repeat.

Yup, the fact that they simply tele around shows a lot. Any hdin who creates a static hammer field should be punished. A good one desyncs and creates random hammer fields while boxing you in. Impossible to win.

Ebotdpb is pretty easy to get. Should be cheap too. Stats dont really matter on it, so even a low one will serve you just fine.

[kohlman]

Thanks for the advise. Ill look into getting some of that stuff. I honestly think I will be stuck with Trolls Nest Dream until someone feels like making a trade with some mule they never use anyway. I have a Crescent Moon PB on him unless I traded it for some pgems for rolling charms...I know, dont tell me.

With the ebotdpb, does it matter if its eth? Since it will have little to no physical damage and it will be used primarily for the ias and +30 stats.

I still need to know what exactly it takes to desynch, since it will be easy for me to do it charging around and all. I think ive done it a few times to a friend who would complain that i appeared from halfway across the screen and he died instantly...

[Ouallada]

Troll nest not only means less resists, but also lower ctb. Even a non-elite pally shield could be better.

PB does not have durability, so it cannot be eth. Not white ones, anyway.

Desync simply requires you to move very quickly. Charge desyncs easily. Just do it more diagonally and desyncing should be attained rather easily.

[kohlman]

I find it near impossible to find anyone with dream anything in non-ladder so ill just make games called "bring dream" and mf while i wait or something. The defense isnt really that important to me but what i really want to get is the resistances. Ill see how my resistances look after i put on the CoH and see how it looks.

Thanks of the tips for desyncin. And thanks for the tip on the PB as well, this way i wont be searchin for an eth PB =)