WTH?? Death Zerks = BM???

[the boss]

I mean I was in a typical zeal duels game and then I saw a zealot(perfectly gm) with hoz/ebotdz/e-valor/coa and stuff, he doesnt use exile for tap and when he was dueling another zealot who had deathz, he called bm...I mean WTH?? wth is bm and gm when it comes to weapon?? grief bm death bm exile bm....so we should all use hoz/alma negra and ebotdz?

In my theory, only grief is bm...when using smite

Zeal(gm):
Ebotd Z
Edc Z
Grief Z
Edeath Z

Smite(bm):
Grief Z

what do you guys think about Death Zerk though? bm or gm

[Quietus]

I mean I was in a typical zeal duels game and then I saw a zealot(perfectly gm) with hoz/ebotdz/e-valor/coa and stuff, he doesnt use exile for tap and when he was dueling another zealot who had deathz, he called bm...I mean WTH?? wth is bm and gm when it comes to weapon?? grief bm death bm exile bm....so we should all use hoz/alma negra and ebotdz?

In my theory, only grief is bm...when using smite

Zeal(gm):
Ebotd Z
Edc Z
Grief Z
Edeath Z

Smite(bm):
Grief Z

what do you guys think about Death Zerk though? bm or gm



I think that 99% of the idea of gm/bm is complete and utter crap. As far as my theory on BM goes -

Don't act like a jerk
Don't steal people's pots/money unless they're acting like a jerk
Don't nk unless they're acting like a jerk
don't overabsorb to the point of stupidity

I know people who claim that hotspurs is bm... if they're using ONLY hotspurs, no dwarfs or anything, what's the problem? 24k fireballs can still kill someone with 90 resist - 400 damage pvp is still respectable! It's the idiots that need to go to 95 resist with 60 stack plus fade, with tgod and dual wisps against my trap/ww that I consider bm... but then, I consider them worthless, and the fact that they have to negate me entirely to have a chance to be a testament to my build.

Keep using your deathz. Let the pubs cry. They just wish they could afford one.

[KaythonXE]

When someone says BM, just take a moment to realise that it means bad-mannered. As an item cannot be bad-mannered, Death cannot be bm. The reason those pvp melee fags call it bm is because fury druid's fury attack is interuptable. You can totally destory any fury druid by using death. Damage isn't important, it's just that the glacial spike it casts in duels stuns them into fhr the whole match. But. Let's go over what the melee losers say is bm(I personally enjoy melee and disagree with all of this):

Grief = bm(poison damage)
Any poison damage = bm.
Smiting = bm.
Running = bm.
Charge = bm.
Any chance to cast during the match is bm, with exception to torch as they say 'it is accepted'.
Ww = bm.

In other words, when someone tells you an item is bm, or a skill is bm. Say items or skills can't be mannered, squelch, and nk. :)

[the boss]

I'd think smiting with grief is the only thing a person could actually cry about in gm melee duels, the rest anything goes

[KaythonXE]

Well. I can see that, but smiting without grief is gm. :/

[tavman]

Well. I can see that, but smiting without grief is gm. :/
i constantly duel nonladder west with my griefz smiter and have not had any complains about being bm....maybe theyre just too scared to say anything :grin:
i personally do not think grief is bm i dont see why other ppl do

[pedu]

Grief = bm(poison damage)
Any poison damage = bm.
Smiting = bm.
Running = bm.
Charge = bm.
Any chance to cast during the match is bm, with exception to torch as they say 'it is accepted'.
Ww = bm.


Ive been wondering for a long time why the grief is considered bm, and came to the answer that its because of the poison... WHY? Whats so bad about the poison thingy? Is it just some lame excuse to not use it. Why is any poison damage bad manners? I can understand why smite is considered bm, no ar needed and non blockable. So i _understand_ why they think its bm. Running is bm? Say what? Etc etc.
Basically im looking for explanations to why theyre bm. Nothing else. An explanation, not just an answer like "Because it is bm, thats why"

[the boss]

lol its only level 15 venom...unless you use trangs gloves too..lol

[KaythonXE]

Grief poison is bm because melee players, the hardcore ones who make these rules think that the 17 average damage make a difference. Also, cause melee chars have **** res because they suck(Mainly zealots and fury druids).

Running. Because those same melee players like to hold down the button, then say it's skill. When it's all building and gear.

Charge. Read above.

Whirlwind. Because it's not melee(that's what they say).

Ctc- It is elemental damage, and not melee. Cry more melee freaks.

[pedu]

Should have seen that coming. :rolleyes:

Pretty funny if you think about it. In every 1v1 fighting game (tekken and the like) theres always some guy whacking around with burning fists. :laugh: I dont see anybody crying about bm there...

Some super zealer: "LOL NEED FIRE CHARM TO WIN LAL"

ridiculous

[Valvolux]

Skills or items can't be bad mannered, choosing an item or skill has nothing to do with manners at all. Only players actions can be bad mannered, i.e. killing someone naked.

The game mechanics are the only rules when dueling, unless you agree otherwise with an opponent.

[KaythonXE]

It's sad. I was playing on a world melee ladder. And they voted me off and kicked me to the bottom of the ladder from slot 1 because I used oath. And it casted bone spirit. xD

[SicHalo]

ppl cry over alot of crap the typical one i find is using hotspurs or worst ur facing a blizz sorc and u wear no stack but 2 ravens they cry alot despite the blizz has properties of removing -260 is cold res ppl still cry about the ravens when in a fight like this stack>abs is more affective.

[KaythonXE]

Sic you're turning this into a discussion from melee bm to overall bm.

[SicHalo]

well i think i still show relevance to this topic, anyway @ the guy using death, alot of ppl in mele consider doom bm but like i say its a weapon and u use it for a certain purpose.

I even here using enchant from demonlimb is bm as well...

Also to add to the grief bm thing i think grief appear to be bm due to the raw dmg it turns out becasue of the + dmg modifyer, enabling it to keep high dmg with tighter minimum and maximum dmg ranges, giving very high average dmg compared to botd etc.

Also concering the venom grief can remove like 20-25% psn res off the target, and naturally mele has crap res as stated so this combine with crap res, and the natural penaulty that psn goes through, the psn lenght penaulty, which double the length of time ur psned so the veom goes from 0.4 sec to 0.8 secs making it double the dmg and very high as well if trang gloves are factored.

[baffle]

It's not the Venom from Grief that some people consider BM. It's because to compensate for its low damage, Smite already has the nice qualities of being uninterruptible, unblockable, and always hits. Grief screws up the balance on that skill.

Personally, I don't give a damn what people think. If I don't like the opponents, I just leave.

[KaythonXE]

Actually, Grief balances smite. Smiters were **** up until Grief.

[SicHalo]

i dont think smites balance is messed up at all to be honnest as Grief has improved alot of mele chars however smite takes the biggest improvement.

[the boss]

I really hate having to switch weapon and gear on my side just to compensate what they really expect me to use...I seriously just want to use my flexible setup and just go with it. Besides...its only clicking on another person when dueling and see who has hits anyways...whats the point of crying?

[mainaman]

no such thing as bm except poting/shrining , period
if someone relyes on exile for the lt, well then use lt wand to lt them too.
how is greif on smiter bm? just because he is doing aton of dmg? well get your BvC , ww sin ,hammerdin and go destroy that smiter, thats all.
Many ppl cry this is BM and that is BM just because they cant duel/they cant afford better gear...
Like recently some radom druid told me that using leap with a BvC was bm<---LOL.
I also have been told that enchanting is bm when using BvC ....
just ignore the pubs and beat them down to the ground till they leave

[RetroStar]

Calling a skill/item BM is just a wussy way of avoiding. Blizzard made specific items for specific purposes. Don't like it, don't duel them as someone said already.

[tavman]

i dont think skills or items are b/m just because you destroy them doesnt make you bm, i got owned by an iron maiden/bone wall lvl 30 necro on my smiter and i just laughed
way i see it the only things that are bm is potting, nking, town guarding and town hugging

[HappyAssassin]

What eveyone else said. The thing is, Diablo 2 really isnt designed as a SUPER compedative PvP game the way it is played. No one balancing a predomiantly PvP game would have created a system in which certain characters could be completely negated. So, if you are gonna play Diablo 2 PvP, you have to deal with the fact that certain attacks just plain destroy your favorite character. Other skills or items take away your advantage. The real BM is being a jerk to people by using these aspects of the game, even if they ask you to stop.

As for the Death thing, melee duelers have a very limiting set of rules. Sometimes people who play a different facet of the game seem strange or absurd to the main stream, because we don't get why they have such rules. And as a result they dont fit in. There are people on Asia who would consider most US and Europe players idiots for generally not Juving, bugging or using hacked items. Different online culture = a lot of misunderstanding, and because this is the internet, that = a lot of insults, degradation and anger.

[Stoutwood]

I've all but quit Zeal dueling because of the whining. It gets so old, and it's worse now with all of these new weapons than it ever was before.

[TheBassman]

I just got back into zeal dueling with my Manner Zealot. I don't use CTAs, Enchant, Poison Damage over 300, CTC% (other then torch =P), etc.... But when I face an Exile/Grief Zealot I just hack at him like anyother zealot would, Complaining about someones gear selection is a bad reason not to duel, If a BvC uses Doom I throw on a bit of extra IAS% Gear, Big deal. I only play manner with my zealot because that's the way I've played zealots my entire time on D2. Sure the gear has changed drastically but I'm quite happy with the .08 - .09 Zeal gear, and when I rock those zealots using their Grief/Fort/Exile they ask me how... and I just chuckle and say you have no DR% and they just go, "Dang Good Duel"

Hats off to all the other manner zealots for sticking it out against the new gear. =D

~LesC