View Full Version : Getting quest drops repeatedly
Hey everyone
I was just wondering if someone could refresh my memory. I seem to remember a method for being able to get quest drops from bosses over and over. I dont remember what it was but i do remember doing it on andy for a while. I stopped playing for about a year and i forgot it over this period.
Any help is appreciated,
mkdsctt
only andariel does quest drop after you kill her first time, no nother bosses.
read this thread: http://forums.diabloii.net/showthread.php?t=449699
VisMaior
10-05-2006, 18:32
If you have not made the quest yet and the quest description says "you cannot complete this quest in this game" (ergo the game was created by somebody already havin g the quest), you stil get a firstdrop is you kill the boss. Rinse, repeat.
godofgods
10-05-2006, 18:41
baal does it too, start game with char that needs the quest get them into the worldstone chamber then leave and get another char for the kill, quest drop accomplished
baal does it too, start game with char that needs the quest get them into the worldstone chamber then leave and get another char for the kill, quest drop accomplished
Ah, so spawning the Boss (I assume any will work) with the char that needs the quest is enough?
Normally repeated questdrops are accomplished by creating the game with a char that has the quest, then killing the Boss with a char that still needs the quest (but cannot complete in that game).
thegiantturtle
11-05-2006, 03:32
baal does it too, start game with char that needs the quest get them into the worldstone chamber then leave and get another char for the kill, quest drop accomplished
baal does it too, start game with char that needs the quest get them into the worldstone chamber then leave and get another char for the kill, quest drop accomplishedAh, so spawning the Boss (I assume any will work) with the char that needs the quest is enough?
Normally repeated questdrops are accomplished by creating the game with a char that has the quest, then killing the Boss with a char that still needs the quest (but cannot complete in that game).godofgods has it backwards. Game must be started by someone that has completed the quest. Final blow on the monster must be from someone who has not yet completed the quest.
When killing an Act boss, the game checks whether or not the killing character has completed the quest, decides what to drop based on that information, and THEN tries to close the quest.
so it would seem this will only temporarily work for act bosses unless you are content to have the killing character never move past that particular act? There's no way to move to the next act without completing the quest correct?
In practice does this mean a character can only be able to do this to at most one act boss per game, and must wait at least 5 minutes after another character can make a game before she can begin another game? Being limited to one act boss per game with a forced 5 minute idle time sounds kinda ineffecient. I suppose typically the character that makes the game is themselves an MF character that can spend 5 minutes hitting some later act monsters and then the joining character just hits the act boss she never completed the quest for before you switch back to the original character and rinse and repeat?
Also, how are quest drops affected by MF? is it the same as with any other monster kill? In other words are quest drops always at least as good of drop odds as non quest drops?
Stompwampa
11-05-2006, 06:43
AFAIK, Andariel is the only boss with a bugged quest drop that you can force out of her. See the link in post #2 for that thread.
AFAIK, Andariel is the only boss with a bugged quest drop that you can force out of her. See the link in post #2 for that thread.
if i understand that right it seems like you almost have to "force" andy to *not* have a bugged quest drop since so long as you don't quit the game after killing andy the first time you will almost inevitably end up with andy being permanently bugged in all of that characters future games. I suppose someone might linger indefinately in act1 after killing andy the first time, but surely 99% of the time the natural thing to do is to talk to warren before leaving the game?
Stompwampa
11-05-2006, 06:54
if i understand that right it seems like you almost have to "force" andy to *not* have a bugged quest drop since so long as you don't quit the game after killing andy the first time you will almost inevitably end up with andy being permanently bugged in all of that characters future games. I suppose someone might linger indefinately in act1 after killing andy the first time, but surely 99% of the time the natural thing to do is to talk to warren before leaving the game?
Yes, that would be the natural thing to do. In fact, I don't know if you can get to act 2 without talking to Warriv, whether it be in that game or a following game. I've never actually tried to quit w/o talking to him.
And I don't think it matters how long you wait before you talk to him, so long as you do it in the same game that you kill Andy for the first time.
ButI think all this is covered in the Andariel Bug Drop thread listed above...
Im in fact pretty sure that if a game is made by someone who hasnt done the quests, the bosses will all questdrop, even if the person isnt getting quest credit. Ill test this more, but Im pretty sure this is the case.
Im in fact pretty sure that if a game is made by someone who hasnt done the quests, the bosses will all questdrop, even if the person isnt getting quest credit. Ill test this more, but Im pretty sure this is the case.
i want to believe that but that would just be too easy to exploit so the cynic in me says that it doesnt work. Anyway, I've started games with unquested characters on many occasions and then completely mopped up all the bosses in that game with a high level character I joined to the game later and it's hard for me to believe that I would have overlooked all those act bosses giving quest drops.
Stompwampa
11-05-2006, 07:18
Im in fact pretty sure that if a game is made by someone who hasnt done the quests, the bosses will all questdrop, even if the person isnt getting quest credit. Ill test this more, but Im pretty sure this is the case.
this also just seems like such an obvious exploit the Blizzard would have made sure that players couldn't do it. I'm pretty sure that it all depends on the person who actually kills the boss that determined whether or not it is a quest drop...just as thegiantturtle said.
Im in fact pretty sure that if a game is made by someone who hasnt done the quests, the bosses will all questdrop, even if the person isnt getting quest credit. Ill test this more, but Im pretty sure this is the case.
Question: do bosses drop healing pots and gold when you rush someone? They always do for me -> no questdrop, even though people in my party got the quest and were in the same area.
Case closed.
AFAIK - it's like thegiantturtle said. If the killing character has not completed the quest, it will get quest drop. So rushing character (who already has completed quest) can't get a quest drop.
TheJarulf
11-05-2006, 09:50
AFAIK - it's like thegiantturtle said. If the killing character has not completed the quest, it will get quest drop. So rushing character (who already has completed quest) can't get a quest drop.
Yes, this is correct, all item creation, including check for picking normal TC or quest TC is done at moment of killing and involves checking based on the killer (or the killer's owner in case of minions, hirelings and such).
Stompwampa
11-05-2006, 17:32
Yes, this is correct, all item creation, including check for picking normal TC or quest TC is done at moment of killing and involves checking based on the killer (or the killer's owner in case of minions, hirelings and such).
Exactly. Can you imagine how much work it would take the servers to determine what every singe monster was going to drop as soon as it spawned? Ridiculous :tongue: We'd be in a constant state of lag.
TheJarulf
11-05-2006, 22:51
Exactly. Can you imagine how much work it would take the servers to determine what every singe monster was going to drop as soon as it spawned? Ridiculous :tongue: We'd be in a constant state of lag.
Technically though it would actually not be any extra stress to the servers or lag in the game. For the creator of the game, just keep info on who created the game (which I believe it allready keep track of). As for all drops determined at game start, that was actually how Diablo 1 worked. In addition, I believe it is in part true for chests, racks and such in Diablo 2. it involves seting the seed for item droping when the monetsr is used (that would be 4 extra bytes of data) and store it with the monster as oposed to use a running seed that is fetched when the monster is killed. It do have its own problems and drawback doing it that way though :)
Stompwampa
11-05-2006, 23:14
Technically though it would actually not be any extra stress to the servers or lag in the game. For the creator of the game, just keep info on who created the game (which I believe it allready keep track of). As for all drops determined at game start, that was actually how Diablo 1 worked. In addition, I believe it is in part true for chests, racks and such in Diablo 2. it involves seting the seed for item droping when the monetsr is used (that would be 4 extra bytes of data) and store it with the monster as oposed to use a running seed that is fetched when the monster is killed. It do have its own problems and drawback doing it that way though :)
but diablo 1 was a way smaller game....
can you imagine doing this accross every single game going on on battle.net?
Like you said, it's probably possible, however it would require a few more servers than we have right now :rolleyes:
TheJarulf
12-05-2006, 11:27
but diablo 1 was a way smaller game....
can you imagine doing this accross every single game going on on battle.net?
Like you said, it's probably possible, however it would require a few more servers than we have right now :rolleyes:
Not sure what you mean by smaller, or how it would matter for this case, the size of the game would have no influence on the order of when you determine whatitem to drop.
In addition, I can perfectly imagine doing it for every game. Actually, it is allready done, after all, we do create items now, the difference would only be doing the initialization in a different order, that is a bit earlier.
It would by the way not require a single extra server at all.
As I mentioned before, the only extra thing really, would be storing 4 extra bytes for each monster when it is created, holding the seed used for creating the item. This would be fecthed upon monster creation, and require what, a few extra cpu instructions, drowning in what else is done creating a monster. So no extra server stress or work. In addition, we would not need to fect the seed when the monster die later to create the item, since we allready have it, so if one really want to look at performance, there would be a few instructions extra for each monster created, but never killed and 4 extra bytes in storage for each monster existing in a game, and we allready store hundreds of bytes for each monster. That is ALL the difference in having the item decided at monster creation as oposed to monster death. So no, it would not affect the number of games a server can handle and hence there would be no need for extra servers.
Stompwampa
12-05-2006, 23:00
I understand what your saying. I'm just looking at it from a slightly different angle.
As is now, the item drop picks are made when you kill the monster, not when the monster spawns. Generally, we're only killing a few monsters at a time, if that.
If the game were to do the pick when the monster spawned, it would seem to take extra effort on part of the servers since several dozen monsters can spawn at once. Multiply this by every singe game accross battle.net that has a monster spawning that instant along with the extr 4 bytes of information, it become a very large task.
But it really doesn't matter...lol...I don't even remember how we got onto this discussion... :wink3:
To answer the original question - I've done tests on this specifically, testing Baal in hell. I ran a level 95 Patriarch'ed pally and had friends of various levels help me out making games or making the kill to test. I ran about 10-15 runs each way, checking the durability of every item that dropped.
First version - friends make the game, so the baal quest is still available. We run up there, I kick some monsters around. When we defeat the Minions, my friends unparty and go to town. I head into the Worldstone Chamber, lay a facial beating into Baal, and get typical baal run drops from him - less, actually, because we don't have a full game.
Second version - I made the game. Baal quest is not available, my friends accompany me, and as a group we kick the snot out of minions. When Baal is down to a sliver I backed off, letting my friends (who hadn't been patted/matted yet) make the kill. Five items every time, and comparing total number of attempted set/unique drops, we had about 2x-2.5x as many sets/uniques attempt to drop.
So, final conclusion - First drop is obtained by having a character who needs the quest given by a particular act boss (or presumably any good-dropping monster who gives a quest, this I didn't test) make the killing blow. If you are in a game where that quest isn't available, you still get the increased quality 'first drop', and thus better items, but you wont' get credit for the quest - and so can abuse this by getting 'first drop' many times.
thegiantturtle
13-05-2006, 18:11
So, final conclusion - First drop is obtained by having a character who needs the quest given by a particular act boss (or presumably any good-dropping monster who gives a quest, this I didn't test) make the killing blow. If you are in a game where that quest isn't available, you still get the increased quality 'first drop', and thus better items, but you wont' get credit for the quest - and so can abuse this by getting 'first drop' many times. That's a good writeup quietus. To clarify your one question, quest drops only exist for act bosses.
TheJarulf
14-05-2006, 23:09
If the game were to do the pick when the monster spawned, it would seem to take extra effort on part of the servers since several dozen monsters can spawn at once. Multiply this by every singe game accross battle.net that has a monster spawning that instant along with the extr 4 bytes of information, it become a very large task.
But it really doesn't matter...lol...I don't even remember how we got onto this discussion... :wink3:
Hmm, beats me too :)
As a side not, 4 bytes storage is like a drop in the ocean compared to all other data stored and all code processed for a monster when spawned, so for all practical reasons, it can be neglectable ffor the performance of a server.
I see much larger problems though. The number of people for "no drop" needs to be taken as the value upon spawn, no biggie since thegame allready do so for life and such. But what about the MF? Which one to use) (the one that created the game? The one that casued the monster to spawn?) And how to avoid cheesy tactics due to *when" you take the MF. If we want to changes we have to fix ther MFG upon creation and we can then have people change items when monsters have spawned from high MF to no MF, or have some high MF person run arround spawning monsters and such. Such problems are much more problematic. It woulod of course also make it pointless in most cases to give MF gear to hirelings. Ahh, much better to spawn items upon death I think....... :)
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