Non-Twitch BvB Builds?

[LukeJames]

Non-Twitch BvB Builds?

Alright, twitches are starting to generally annoy me. Everyone uses them, they are the most abused item ever and while this is happening nobody takes advantages of the lovely other armors. Namely Rattlecage, Ornates, Chaos Armor, or any armor with high defence, life and FHR. These armors are just eye-catching, I remember when I first started off seeing high levels with brilliant colours and massive shields would be such a delight, they looked godly and they were amazing at BvB.

Hower, it seems everyone is addicted to the block rate of twitch toppled onto the Swordback. It's a good build, don't get me wrong however I'm tired of seeing 500 barbarians with the exact same look. There are other ways to make good barbarians than this, why is nobody realising this?

While playing around with my Martel Barbarian, I was confronted by a skimpy little BvB and lost terribly. So I went over to my charger and threw his Cold Battlehammer and a Sigon Shield onto my Martel'er. Using Rattlecage, Sigon Helm, Sigon Gloves, Sigon Belt, Sigon Shield, Angelics, Goblin Toe as well as the Cold Battlehammer I looked like a menace and was one. I met up with the punk once again and destroyed him, one whirlwind and he was down to about 100 health and he ran.

That got me thinking about this concept of not every barbarian needing the Twitch+Swordback combo. So here's where I need help.

Which of these combos would work best?
Ornate + Sigon Shield
Ornate + 30/20 *High Def* Magic Grim
Chaos Armor + Sigon Shield
Chaos Armor + 30/20 *High Def* Magic Grim
Rattlecage + Sigon Shield
Rattlecage + 30/20 *High Def* Magic Grim

Although the rattlecage would look to be the best choice, there are other factors as well such as FHR, Life, Defence and the additional damage you recieve when needing 170 Strength opposed to 100 Strength on a BvB. Does anyone have any thoughts on BvB builds without twitch or swordback?

[Zoola McCoola]

snip
Well, if i was going to make a non twitch-swordback bvb, it would defiantely be a defense bvb, in which case you would need a high def 30/20 grim, and a high defense ornate, preferably with life on it. FHR is useless in bvb, unless you got ww'ed while standing still (NEVER run/walk in bvb), but if that happened you're done for anyway.

I've collected a lot of high defense equipment, like boots and belts and helms, just incase I ever get the urge to do this, but you *may* be able to shop 100% ED equipment from Halbu in hell.

Also, I wouldn't use a battle hammer in bvb, nagas are just so much better. I doubt that the ~70 or so strength would really make a difference in bvb, maybe 10-20 damage on average after pvp penalties?

The only problem with NOT using a twitch is that you are giving up about 10%block iirc. That means you're gonna get hit (yes you are, angelics) about 10% more than the other guy.

The advantage to fighting a twitcher is that you will not need the massive ar boost from angelics most likely, well ok, you prolly won't need both rings, to be able to hit the other guy a decent percent of the time. Once again, I've not made a def bvb, so this is merely speculation.

I'm pretty sure Steve-o (theres your phonetic pronounciation) can give you more insight, because he has made atleast a couple of these before.

[fledgeling]

nearly every BvB barb on europe NL uses a duped 888 ornate, 244pr helmet and either a 246 exec or 321 pike, or dual 185 bh, or some martel

not sure about the rest

there is also a duped red shield matching the red ornate

not sure about boots/belt

once Ive seen a barb using dual gnasher, it worked vs my crappy barb (poorly made.. to low hp)

[LukeJames]

No duped items.

[fredsta54]

Well, if i was going to make a non twitch-swordback bvb, it would defiantely be a defense bvb, in which case you would need a high def 30/20 grim, and a high defense ornate, preferably with life on it. FHR is useless in bvb, unless you got ww'ed while standing still (NEVER run/walk in bvb), but if that happened you're done for anyway.

I've collected a lot of high defense equipment, like boots and belts and helms, just incase I ever get the urge to do this, but you *may* be able to shop 100% ED equipment from Halbu in hell.

Also, I wouldn't use a battle hammer in bvb, nagas are just so much better. I doubt that the ~70 or so strength would really make a difference in bvb, maybe 10-20 damage on average after pvp penalties?

The only problem with NOT using a twitch is that you are giving up about 10%block iirc. That means you're gonna get hit (yes you are, angelics) about 10% more than the other guy.

The advantage to fighting a twitcher is that you will not need the massive ar boost from angelics most likely, well ok, you prolly won't need both rings, to be able to hit the other guy a decent percent of the time. Once again, I've not made a def bvb, so this is merely speculation.

I'm pretty sure Steve-o (theres your phonetic pronounciation) can give you more insight, because he has made atleast a couple of these before.

Well to answer the orinigal question, if you are not going twitch//sback you can go with a defense bvb using the gear zoola stated. I have had a 902 defense (100ed) 30 life magic ornate :)

Or, you can go with rattlecage and a 30/20 pavise... more block, and with the lack of orn you dont need the extra def from a grim.

Wait, def bvbs get hit less than twitch//sback for sure.

They have 15% less block, 6% less with a pavise, but when you consider the *average* defense bvb has ~11k defense, they will still hit you quite a bit, but the % will not be very high, and if they are lower lvl than you you can just crush them with ease.









Fred

[Kevin William Cox]

Other than twitch, RC has to be the second greatest used armor of all time, IMO. It's just so useful. 25% CB, +200 defence, with a base of 300 something, and it's PURPLE!!! I'm a purple fan, forgive me. But, I agree, twitch is too overused. Sometimes I see an Orante being used and it's a good sight. Makes me wonder what the stats are, and I always ask the person wearing it, to show it to me. If I respect them, they normaly let me see it. And it's almost always not so great, but they've got style, and that means more to me than someone who is just like everyone else.

Only 1 of my barbs wears RC, the rest wear mediocre Orantes. I don't wear twitch, unless I'm dueling one. The highest DEF Orante I've ever found is a 902 Magical Holy Orante. The mods sucked, but the DEF was great. I still have it as a momento.

The build you suggest is very possible, but I would do it WITH Swordback. The 50% OW is what kills most. The hit and run routine is what most twitch Sback users do. Because twitch is lower in defence they can't stand toe to toe with a defence Barb. That's where Sback saves them.

A high defence Barb with good damage and Sback< twitch and Sback anyday. IMHO.

Of coarse, this is NOT takeing into account Prepatch Legits, which Zodi could only tell you about. Or dupes, which doesn't say much about a dueler to begin with.


Kev



Edit: 100th post, Fred, guess I still gotta long way to go.

[fredsta54]

One of the best bvbs on NL uses orn + sback, although i cant see it being very effective unless you have godly gear... due to only 50% block









Fred

[Zoola McCoola]

Wait, def bvbs get hit less than twitch//sback for sure.

They have 15% less block, 6% less with a pavise, but when you consider the *average* defense bvb has ~11k defense, they will still hit you quite a bit, but the % will not be very high, and if they are lower lvl than you you can just crush them with ease.


Like I said, I've not made a def bvb, and I was just assuming that the angelics would, more or less, cancel out the effect of going all out defense. However, the more I think about it, the more wrong I think I am in saying that. Wheres Steve-o when you need him?

[LukeJames]

Yeah I'd say Pavise+Rattlecage would be the gear of choice.
Decent Defence + Good block + 50% Crushing blow = Horrah.

[Zodijackyl]

Thanks to Firefox crashing, I just lost a post about a page long. I'll redo it later, but I have a lot of information in other posts. I'll write in detail about how to do a few different non twitch BvB builds later.