smiter? zealot? avenger?

[fledgeling]

which one should I choose?

which one is the most effective?

what is the best aura for smiter? should I make a tesla/smite for MF + duel (or would the freeze aura be better for duels - not sure if I could MF with it)

[fredsta54]

The holy auras damage do NOT transfer to smite. Holy freeze is decent due to its slowing effect, but on a smiter fantasicm is far more effective

Is this for pvp or pvm?

If pvm, full clegs set is the best for zeal and smite

Avengers are kinda hard unless you have a good weapon, although clegs is viable... but more suited to zeal or smite







Fred

[fledgeling]

what exactly a good weapon is?


as for freeze aura - will it allow me to MF on normal and/or nightmare when maxed just like maxed lightning aura? (basically running to andy with mf gear without touching anything/or diablo/mef etc)

[Nirlem]

i am having lot of fun with my avenger, and the sorces in CS love my conviction aura.
if i solo im using zeal alot for mana leech! :)
but then im only using civerbs weapon.

[fledgeling]

hmm, Ive started a smiter :/
what is the best shield for them?
what type of shield? (I know it should have +2 and res..)

because now I cant afford a +2 res shield - what should I use:
sigon
the unique +1 shield
a +1 shield with -20% req (ward type)
swordback

what aura should I choose? I could make an MF smiter - by changing gear I would have a tesla or ice-din. but will ice-aura be sufficient to MF or not?

or maybe I should put points in the defense aura? and get myself an ornate + HIGH defense shield, so I would have millions of defense? but wont ww barbs still hit me? what about magic? does it always hit? or does it use defense to calculate the chance of hitting?



but I think I will level up the avenger next week :D
what equip should he use?
gs? +2 shield? weapon with high damage? (so a sword? battlehammer? or maybe a maul?)
how many points in dex? or maybe culven sword?


the problem is that Ive started so many chars recently that I dont have time to level them up and dont have items for them...

[LukeJames]

Here are the best shields for smiter in order of damage
1. Barbed Shield
2. Spiked Shield

And that's all. Seriously, there is nothing else you should be using. For cheap methods you have three options; 1) Shop a 30/20 Magic Barbed Sheld 2) Make a 2 Perfect Diamond Barbed Shield 3) Use Swordback

I recommend making a 2 Perfect Diamond Barbed shield, gives you the high damage of barbed shield and 38 Resistance which is basically a weak ward.

[fredsta54]

Here are the best shields for smiter in order of damage
1. Barbed Shield
2. Spiked Shield

And that's all. Seriously, there is nothing else you should be using. For cheap methods you have three options; 1) Shop a 30/20 Magic Barbed Sheld 2) Make a 2 Perfect Diamond Barbed Shield 3) Use Swordback

I recommend making a 2 Perfect Diamond Barbed shield, gives you the high damage of barbed shield and 38 Resistance which is basically a weak ward.

shield damage really is not important for pvm

Is this a pvm smiter or a pvp smiter?

Best gear for pvm smiter (as in +2 pris barbed shield doesnt compare to this in terms of damage)

Full clegs
Twitch
Deaths sash
gob toe
Itharas helm or fhr life res
2X fr lr rings
+pal pris ammy


For pvp you want a +2 pris barbed along with a blood cresent, the diff in smite dmg between a small shield and a barbed shield is about 200 dmg. The 35% addiitonal crushing blow + fastest smite speed available with fanat easily makes up for it, crushing blow is uber for smite


This setup kills bosses in ~6 seconds.

With just 25% cb from gtoe, and "godly" rares, you will kill much slower and the whole setup will cost you a few wasted sojs













Fred

[Scooch]

What skills are used in the "avenger" and "smiter" type set up?

[LukeJames]

I actually made a level 12 Cleglaw charger a few seasons back, even with level 1 smite and low might he managed to tear through other LLD smiters. Although, from what I recall smite range is based on the weapon's range (Like a flail smiter has range 3, etc).

[fledgeling]

do I need fanatism if I would use deaths set and twitchtroe?

I would have 50%ias
Im thinking of using a gnasher and a +1/+2 barbed shield +goblins

do + minimal damage rings work with smite?

does the gnasher open wound and crushing blow stack with smite? Im not sure :/

[LukeJames]

You always use fantacism on a smiter.

[fledgeling]

do I need any IAS items then?

because I could only use deaths belt for cannot be frozen
and for example broc's gloves for dual leech

do I need twitch with max fanatism? because I could use a goldskin for res then

[Beltyn]

Couple of quick questions:

Does IM work against smite/vengenace?

Know it wont affect elemental damage on vengeance, but does base physical damage come back at you?

If smite damage does refelect back, can open wounds/ crushing blow come back with it?

Does slow effect from Cleg's gloves work with smite?

How best to deal with no way of mana leech? just use redemption/meditation as if a hammerdin or is there better way?

[LukeJames]

Mana leech is incredibly easy to get for any melee character.
Name me any build that can't get it without staying amazing and I'll give you a blue dog.

[Beltyn]

According to arreat summit, smite doesn't work with steal items.

[fredsta54]

do I need fanatism if I would use deaths set and twitchtroe?

I would have 50%ias
Im thinking of using a gnasher and a +1/+2 barbed shield +goblins

do + minimal damage rings work with smite?

does the gnasher open wound and crushing blow stack with smite? Im not sure :/


cb + ow work w/ smite

You want 6 fpa attack smite

Fantasicm is always maxed

Gnasher is kinda slow (base speed 0 + no ias on wepn i think)

+ min doesnt work w/ smite


Full clegs will kill far faster than gnasher//gob toe// +2 pris barbed shield... for pvm at least

But.. yah that setup would work









Fred

[dougolasjr]

Yea I do believe smite does not leech mana or life. Hence people who pvp with smite use life tap from items.

[LukeJames]

Not to mention that Cleglaws is much easier and cheaper to use at an early level all the way through.

[purplelocust]

Yea I do believe smite does not leech mana or life. Hence people who pvp with smite use life tap from items.
Life tap from items would be in LoD. In Classic, Redemption is a good way of getting life and mana in PvM.

[fledgeling]

actually at the moment it was easier for me to get a gnasher somehow (wtf wtf wtf!! :DDD) than a cleglaw..

the gnasher is soooo cool, Im thinking of giving it to my barb.. think about dual gnashers.. or gnasher + swordback combo
(actually Im thinking of building a barb which would use swordback and the 80% open wounds exec-like unique sword)



actually Im building both an avenger and a smiter now.. which leads me to lack of items: what is the best weapon for an avenger? naga? knout? tan-do-liga? bh?
basically I need a one-handed weapon with highest dmg possible - what would it be? bh?

[LukeJames]

The Cutter-Barbarian involves;
Ripsaw
Swordback
Twitch
Death combo
Duskdeep/Lifehelm
Goblintoe/Treads

Using the stun attack he holds the enemy in place while draining their health to one then finishing them off with a single whack. Used only for LLD reasons obviously.

[fredsta54]

basically I need a one-handed weapon with highest dmg possible - what would it be? bh?

A bh would be a very poor choice. With the lack of fanat on an avenger, you need to use a -10 base speed weapon.. preferably with ias on it.


Full clegaws set works, but dream weapon for an avenger would be a high dmg ias knout, divine scepter, rune sword, basically anything with nice damage, -10 base speed, and ability to reach your desired breakpoint











Fred

[fledgeling]

what is my desired breakpoint?
Id like not to use twitch

how exactly the damage is calculated in venegance?

character weapon (x some sort of strenght bonus - how does it work) x 4 (1physical + 1 light +1 fire +1ice)?

sometimes I think that cold dmg does not trigger

[fredsta54]

what is my desired breakpoint?
Id like not to use twitch

how exactly the damage is calculated in venegance?

character weapon (x some sort of strenght bonus - how does it work) x 4 (1physical + 1 light +1 fire +1ice)?

sometimes I think that cold dmg does not trigger


You want a 10 fpa vengeance, ideally 9 fpa but we can dream

The damage is your weapons damage multiplied by w/e +% elemental dmg you have from vengeance... essentially doubled through conviction


basic skill layout-

1 vengeance
few hs
20 convict
Rest to resist auras//salvation

Vengeances synergys provide the same amount of damage as just maxing vengance + partially synergized, you get +10% max res all, and the main reason is less mana cost








Fred

[fledgeling]

o! I didnt know that
so I will put 1 in venegance

but what about strenght - for example what will be the damage difference if I have 100str and 200str - because Ive no idea how it is calculated

Im thinking of using a hawkmail (not enough goldskins...) - could I (in theory) get 100% ice res with it? because you say I get +10% max res from skill and +15% from hawkmail OO



but dont I want to kill everything with 1 hit (if this is possible) than 2fast ones?

[purplelocust]

Im thinking of using a hawkmail (not enough goldskins...) - could I (in theory) get 100% ice res with it? because you say I get +10% max res from skill and +15% from hawkmail

The maximum resistance you can get is 95%, so the added "+% max resist" beyond 95% is wasted.

[WarlockCC]

A bh would be a very poor choice. With the lack of fanat on an avenger, you need to use a -10 base speed weapon.. preferably with ias on it.


Full clegaws set works, but dream weapon for an avenger would be a high dmg ias knout, divine scepter, rune sword, basically anything with nice damage, -10 base speed, and ability to reach your desired breakpoint
Fred
Weee, that is what I chose to do with my +2 pala 100+ runesword, good to know I am not entirely daft, just partially.

Say, what other items should I stick on him ? I would like to use him in CS if that is feasable. I'll prolly need some resists. I was thinking about Iratha's, cause that would help me onto the 11 (so-so) breakpoint and then complimented with a hawk and mebbe a ward should get me res inc. tm. ltd.
Bootswise, gobs I guess ?

Otherwise I do have a +2 pala amy with 7 to min available to me even though it is rather in use on another of my chars atm. This other char only 'uses' the +2 from the amu so it's a bit of a waste there. But then, no Iratha's, so my entire plan is out the window. :)
The passive gains from the single res aura's should get me 5 res max of those three at least, but I would have liked to have the +10 res all max from Iratha's.

Any thoughts ?

Recap. Avail :
- Runesword, 10x damage, +2 pala
- Amulet +2 pala +7 min damage

Let's play another round of "Name the rest of the gear for a nice d2c CS avenger" !


---===---
Reading trough it a bit more, I think I will just go for Twitch, deaths combi, although with sig gloves, helm, twitch and goldwrap, I could get the 9frames breakpoint. :)
But then my cbf would have to come from for instance a jade, which would suck, cause then I wouldn't have any shield. So I would prefer to have a shield rather then cbf.
Interesting sidenote, I have seen physical immunes bleed. If you hit them with bezerk while having OW items on.
Could have imagined it though, but please do carry out some tests.

Shieldwise, I think I will either use a 3D or a rezzy +2, mebbe with 30/20.


Any idea btw, if 30/20 is needed when you have max Holy shield ?
Or if it even has any use ?

[WarlockCC]

hmmm, TDL pointed out the 30IAS on a angelic sabre [-10] when wearing the full set yesterday.
Meaning that full angelics combined with death sash/gloves, would have a seriously low requirement to reach that 7 frames smite breakpoint
Both low level and low str req that is. Add a swordback, gobs and perhaps a biggins to that and you should have a nice smitersetup. Although, to save statpoints, you might want to use Face of horror, because the gobs have a rather hefty str req compared to the rest of the items. If you are only using 1 Angelic ring you could put on a manald for it's mana regeneration. take the lowest manaleech manald you have, because it will not leech with smite. the possible 8 regenerate on a manald could also be nice. Or, use a 5 str ring so you don't have to put any points in str to use the gobs and can go all vita.
The Face of horror might have that monster flee, but which monster would flee while stunned ? :)
Although you could also just use a 3 sock mask and stick 3 perfect Ame in there, I rather like the 10 res all given by the face. Anybody know if the +50% damage to undead also works trough smite ?

You would need 43 skillpoints to get max holy shield and max smite with their prereqs.
That leaves you quite a lot of skillpoints free to use on whichever aura you choose. You could make a rather good supporting char with that.

In Hell you will have 50/0/0/0 so you may wish to trade that manald for a rezzy ring. Since angelics gives 8 mana regen, you could just forget about the manald and go for that extra 50 MF in a second angelic ring.

Your aura's are free, so you could also choose to use maxed salvation, which would also benifit your party quite a bit.

Any thoughts on this ?

[WarlockCC]

For my smiter I went against all the usual rules and took a def-smiter.
With his -30 req cutlass he should still be able to whack with the best of them.
currently filling up Zeal, after that I will fill up defiance. Should have a nice bit of def with his 99ED -20 req Ornate.

If they made a movie about smiting, say "Smiter Kid". What would Mr Myago say to Daniol ?
"Whack on, Whack off, Daniol-son"

[WarlockCC]

I tell you this thread is cursed. Every time I post in this thread I get a server error and it won't show that there is a new reply in it.
And now, it even made me double post (this is a edit of that double post)

This way I'll never get any advise or overly harch kritique on my dubious builds. :(

[WarlockCC]

My avenger is level 48 atm, I have yet to stick statpoints in to use the runesword, because I don't yet know the final gear and thus the final bonusses.
Should I go for exact match or full reqs ?
With exact match I would have more life, but more chance that I wouldn't be able to pick up my gear in one go, which would be slightly risky.

If you go to another game, you can only take one of your corpses with you. And you don't even get a choice which. The corpse with the highest gold value in items will come with you to the next game. So if you die with your good gear, then equip some socketed items full of perfect gems (3D, 6sock 1h weapon, 3sock helm) that gear might just be worth more then your proper gear.
If you then die again(I know, that is a lot of if's) and realise you won't be able to retrieve your corpse, you will probably lose your good gear.
So, if you die, no friends on, no possability of running another instance of Diablo (Unless you have 2 PC's, isn't this cheating aswell, since you are using a program to deceive Diablo ?), you should just exit the game and rejoin to get your good gear back. Will cost you some XP because you didn't retrieve your corpse, but so be it. XP can be taken back by force when you still have your good gear.

Am I totally wrong with the above, or partially ?

[fledgeling]

when I will have some time I will level up my avenger (currently ~level 24, he is quite good vs normal chars, not best tho, but often it is 2hit kill)

as for my smiter I dont have anyone to help me in hell difficulty + 0 hell cs games on europe recently :/

(and if there is one, it occurs that my level 60hammerdin everyone seems to consider sucky, is much better than the level 80 idiots who cant kill anything fast)

[fredsta54]

Weee, that is what I chose to do with my +2 pala 100+ runesword, good to know I am not entirely daft, just partially.

Say, what other items should I stick on him ? I would like to use him in CS if that is feasable. I'll prolly need some resists. I was thinking about Iratha's, cause that would help me onto the 11 (so-so) breakpoint and then complimented with a hawk and mebbe a ward should get me res inc. tm. ltd.
Bootswise, gobs I guess ?

Otherwise I do have a +2 pala amy with 7 to min available to me even though it is rather in use on another of my chars atm. This other char only 'uses' the +2 from the amu so it's a bit of a waste there. But then, no Iratha's, so my entire plan is out the window. :)
The passive gains from the single res aura's should get me 5 res max of those three at least, but I would have liked to have the +10 res all max from Iratha's.

Any thoughts ?

Recap. Avail :
- Runesword, 10x damage, +2 pala
- Amulet +2 pala +7 min damage

Let's play another round of "Name the rest of the gear for a nice d2c CS avenger" !


---===---
Reading trough it a bit more, I think I will just go for Twitch, deaths combi, although with sig gloves, helm, twitch and goldwrap, I could get the 9frames breakpoint. :)
But then my cbf would have to come from for instance a jade, which would suck, cause then I wouldn't have any shield. So I would prefer to have a shield rather then cbf.
Interesting sidenote, I have seen physical immunes bleed. If you hit them with bezerk while having OW items on.
Could have imagined it though, but please do carry out some tests.

Shieldwise, I think I will either use a 3D or a rezzy +2, mebbe with 30/20.


Any idea btw, if 30/20 is needed when you have max Holy shield ?
Or if it even has any use ?


Well for starters + skills on avengers really dont make a big diffirence. The best weapon option (apart from a godly devine scepter... but lets not dream) is an ias 100+ dmg knout... same speed, more range. I also dont think crushing blow is important with such a low rate of attack (and poor cth) WIth itharas use r/w res boots so you really tank + run fsat ;)

Assuming your shield has half decent block (50+) Its usually not worth it to pay extra for 30/20. It wont reach a new frame of fbr, and if you walk your block will remain the same

Just go for a 10 frame attack with survival as opposed to 9 frame with lack of cbf/akward ias gear


Angelic set sucks for a smiter, and with fanat, only 40 ias is needed with a -10 base speed weapon to hit a 6 frame smite. I might be making a full clegs pvm smiter on east soon... just to prove to people how it will kill faster than using rares//Barbed shield (and i also find the char a lot of fun to play)




Fred

[JEstevam]

umm, isn't the cutter-barb a little too high level for LLD??? ripsaw has high lvl req!

[battleroyale]

after
max smite
max fanat

do i max holy shield too?
what other skills are good for pvm/pvp