OMG BvC Guide?!

[eA-Zaku]

Well, it is plainly obvious that the BvC is quite a popular build. However, as many have discussed, most search options turn up random BvC chit-chat and the extensive guides are lost in the archives (locked due to poster conflicts).

Having said that, I think it would be cool if there would be a BvC guide. This is my first kind of guide for anything. I'm actually quite nervous, but I'll try to do best job of covering the awesome class known as BvC.

This guide will list possible builds based on experience from my own (horrible) BvC and that of advice gleaned from the pro's on this board. Most of the credit goes to mcm, phyrexial, dkay, luis, as well as others for their wisdom and expertise. And of course blobs, because I based my BvC on his barb. If I left you out, sorry. Please forgive this undeserving user. :)

Barbarian BvC (Barbarian versus Casters) for Diablo II: LoD v1.1

This guide is meant to be just that: a guide, nothing is concrete, blah blah blah you know the drill.

Stat point distribution:
Strength - None. Seriously. Maybe a sprinkling if you want some higher defense Enigmas.
Dexterity - None. Seriously. Maybe a bit to wear a Widowmaker (preferrably with Hel rune in it) Your AR won't be an issue
Vitality - Every single point, or if you needed to spend a tiny bit in strength and dexterity then MOST of your points.
Energy - None. Insert wise crack at the uselessness of energy here.

Skill point distrubtion:

*REMEMBER* For all variable skills, remember to take account of your Battle Command skill. It will add +1 skill for quite a while (4 minutes and up).

Axe Mastery - 20. Yep. Max axe mastery. Unlike some guides, you won't be given the luxury to wield whatever weapons you think look cool.
Battle Orders - 20. This is a must for most PvP barbs. I think you know why.
Whirlwind - 20. While this skill isn't perfect, it's pretty close. The only time this will fail you is when you need to call on Berserk or Guided Arrow.

Leap - This skill has seen a lot of debate. The amount you need will vary. I suggest reaching AT LEAST level 19 with gear that has the lowest amount of +skills. It's ok if you get insanely high leap when wearing Arreats instead of CoA, etc. In fact some people enjoy maxing leap. That's fine, too. There is no diminishing returns, so if you enjoy blasting people that are offscreen, put more points in this skill.
Natural Resistance - Personally, I found 1 point was nice. It was uniform and gave around 50 resist all. If you have low +skills from your standard gear, you may want to put a few more. You may even dump all your spare points in here, but I recommend using them in Leap instead.
Increased Speed - You'll need more than 1 point in here, I'm guessing. My barb (as well as blobs, I believe) put enough to get the skill to 40% increased run/walk speed with your lowest +skills items. The reason you need more than just 1 point here is because you probably won't have enough +skills to reach the 40% mark, and the general consensus says a bit of IncSpeed is good. It is said to desynch your whirlwinds to your advantage, as well.

Battle Command - 1. Why not? It boosts a lot of skills, unlike only boosting Battle Orders like it did in 1.09
Berserk - 0-1. This is probably the best swinging skill for the barb. It can be used in PvM as well, and is better than Concentrate in my opinion because of the higher damage and attack rating. Throw in the fact that it's pretty much un-negatable, and this should be the choice as your secondary attack. You can use conc if you prefer, although you don't lose more than you gain from that 1 skill point saved.
Shout - 1-20. You can leave this at 1, as some do. But I found I had enough skill points at lvl 88 to have a decent (around lvl 22) leap, as well as reach 40% faster run/walk and hit 50 resist all from Increased Speed and Natural Resist. So, I maxed Shout. If you don't care about helping teammates or boosting your own defense for some on-the-side melee dueling, you can leave it lower and use points to max leap and pump up Natural Resist.

[eA-Zaku]

Items and Equipment:

There will be lots of different items to use, but most people can agree on a grey area of items, which I will cover. Some items grant a significant advantage for you, but blobs has called them a "crutch" and rightfully so. If you can rely on your own skills rather than absorb and resist stacking, you will only become that much of a better dueler. For noobs with bad comps like me, I tossed some absorb items in my stash.

Helm - Crown of Ages/Arreats. CoA seems to be the main helm of choice, but seeing as how I duel mainly casters in my clan, and come across mainly casters in pubbies, I use Arreats. CoA should be socketed with two Ber runes (why else would you use it? :rolleyes: ) and Arreats should be socketed with a +% ED/+% IAS (max possible is 40/15) jewel. No matter which one you choose to use most of the time, be sure to keep the other one in your stash. Keep in mind the dual Ber's are essential, while you can survive well enough without the jewel in the Arreats.
Jewelry - Ravenfrost/Ravenfrost/Highlord's Wrath. This SHOULD be your main set-up. But if you are in the "lower-upper class" of the D2 economy, you may not be able to afford godly charms that have attack rating tagged on. If so, you might want to use the Angelic set amulet + rings as your main jewelry. That's what I do and I've done well enough. You can combine Raven/FCR ring with the Angelic too if that floats your boat. Bottom line is the jewelry you need in your barb's possession are 2x Ravenfrost, Highlord's Wrath, 2x Angelic rings, Angelic Amulet, and 2x FCR rings. I found two legit FCR rings with godly stats (+str, +high mana, some life and resist, etc.) so scrounge around for some just in case. If you can't find any good ones, don't bother buying expensive ones. You only need it versus the godliest caster opponents. Everything besides the 10% FCR is gravy, anyways.

You can use Wisp Projectors to absorb if you wish. Ravenfrosts absorb cold as well, but that's an unfortunate coincidence for the sorc ;)

Weapons: Grief/Beast berserker axes will be your weapons of choice. Ethereal Breath of the Dying berserker axes will work fine, but if you can get your hands on Grief, go for it. I prefer eBotD because I can afford them, they are pretty much the 2nd best, no repair, and are better for PvM. They also have tons of crazy mods Grief does not. However, Grief has crazy damage. One drawback of Grief is that the Venom may upset you if you use poison small charms. Note that Grief's damage is invisible, so don't be upset that your character screen says you hit like a pansy, because you will slaughter most people you fight. Beast is a no-brainer as well as something you pretty must much wear at all times.

On switch is where much of the debate and ideas come. I prefer dual Doom axes, as blobs did. They give +4 to warcrying, which is only +2 off, and they have a handy Holy Frost aura. With the cumulative -enemy cold resist, you can zap people quite easily, as well as lock up some chars like Smiters and amazons.
Another choice is the regular dual Heart of the Oak or Echoing weapons. These give generic +6 to warcries, and not much else.
One good thing to have is a Widowmaker in switch. It will be very helpful in tagging those Hammerdins and some other chars that play very defensively and that you cannot approach without taking damage if you are unskilled. However the Widowmaker is unnecessary if you are very skilled. It is indeed a "crutch" to rely on it too much.
I am sure some others will/have come up with brilliant ideas for switch weapons but that's all I can think of right now. I recommend dual Doom berserker axes. You can prebuff with echoing/HotO if you wish, but its cool to be able to BO without fear using Dooms and kill anyone trying to get an ezpk on you while you are warcrying.

Dual Wizardspike's are nice with Um runes for high Open Wounds. Your attack rating will be horribly low, though.

I also carry a cheap 4x PTopaz Monarch and Stormshield in my stash for FoHers and other chars that give me a hard time, but I haven't had much success with them. I think that if you suck, you'll die either way, and if you're good you won't need these items. Just in case you were wondering. A good item may be a 6 socket Berserker Axe socketed with 6x Lightning Resist jewels. The perfect example would be Superior Berserker Axe with +15% ED and +180 Lightning Resist. Expensive, yes, but at least it doesn't affect your dual-wielding whirlwinds. I do not take credit for this idea.

Armor - Enigma hands down. With Hellfire Torch and Annihilus, you can equip Mage Plate, Breast Plate, and I believe Dusk Shroud (with the aid of Dracul's Grasp) without putting any points in strength. If you're going to put any points in a non-vitality stat, I suggest dex for Widowmaker. Don't waste any points on strength unless you insist on wearing that Enigma Archon Plate.

Belt - Arachnid's Mesh. The only other belt to even consider is Thunder-God's Vigor for some absorb and very minor life/damage, or if you're poor and don't have BerBer CoA, you can use Verdungo's Hearty Cord. I don't recommend that last one, though.

Gloves - Dracul's Grasp. The Open Wounds alone probably puts this option above those of crafted gloves and Steelrends. Throw in the (very occasionally useful) Life Tap and +Strength and these should be your gloves of choice. Other STASH options may be Bloodfist, but you should use FHR charms instead.

Boots - Top choice would be a rare that includes +% Faster Hit Recovery and massive resists. The godliest possible combination can support FRW, FHR, +stats, and +resists. Good luck on finding/gambling one of these. Poorer folks like me prefer Gore Riders. Gore Riders are definitely good enough, but if you want to eek out that damage/life with small charms, you'll need top-notch rares.

Charms: Hellfire Torch with Barbarian skills and Annihilus small charm. The higher the +stats are, the less likely you will have to waste points in strength and dexterity. High resist would be nice too. I get by with a low Annihilus and low Necromancer hellfire (trying to get barb) the rest should be small charms that add damage, attack rating and life. The AR and life are probably the most important part. Thus, I would be perfectly happy with +1 max damage/+20 attack rating/+20 life (if this is possible) small charms. The maximum values you can get on a small charm is +3 max damage, +20 attack rating, and +20 life. You can use plain 20 life small charms if you are poorer, like me. I personally use 18-20 life small charms, as well as multiple 5% FHR small charms to reach 90% FHR. You need 86% to hit the breakpoint. With that much, you will do very well. You can survive with less FHR but 86 will make your life much easier. Some people use resistance sc's and such. I think as long as you have decent life and the Hellfire/Annihilus you are set with any sc's you choose.

Unfortunately, I am not experienced enough to give advice for PvP. However, this guide should stop the flow of 'Rate my BvC' that I see, as well as the 'use search function/look at stickies' comments that inspired me to write this in the first place.

Here are my only two words of advice: look up other members' works (such as blobs guide or mcm's videos) for excellent strategies, and practice. No, seriously. With half a brain you will figure out the best way to kill certain characters.

For example, with enough practice you can time a Hammerdin's blessed hammer gaps so that you can go in and out and get hits without getting hurt yourself. Although the pro's would undulate their hammer field, thus getting 100% coverage, you can just pull out Widowmaker :) At that point they might get aggressive and you can just WW easily without their hammer fields.

Another one is blizzard sorcs. The basic advice is don't get hit by the blizzard. Some blizzards can kill you quickly even if you stack and absorb. You could try very long whirlwinds to desynch, as well as random long whirlwinds and hope they somehow teleport into the path of your ww.

I know most of you who read the guide all the way through are going, "What? That's common sense! What a waste of time!" Sorry, but since there really IS no stickied guide I thought I'd write this. It's not very professional, and it's far from perfect or even satisfactory, but it's based on the collective works and experience on some of the (IMO and generally regarded as) best duelers in the history of diabloii.net

Once again I take no credit for information contained in this guide. If for some strange reason you wish to use it as a reference or whatever, go ahead and take it. I'd be honored. But most likely that won't be the case. I'm not naive enough to think that the way most authors seem to, but I hope this guide has at least helped somebody. And should this guide somehow get stickied for some crazy reason, I will be the happiest noob on earth. :thumbsup:

[Mehatesmaphackx]

Good work. But one advice lol. Don't mention 3.20.20s duped rare boots or caster rings in your guide. Instead prentend that they are 3/xx/xx max/ar/life scs and legit rings and boots or you guide will probably never get stickied.

By the way there's already a pretty good guide written by mojortrostos on d2.jsp but he didn't seem to update it to 1.11.

Also phxerial and dkay aren't even barb players the only time they played barbs were on my account and my other friend's barb. Luis only started playing bvc recently and he pretty much copied mcm's build.

Blobs and mcm did most of the work, me and maniac contributed some, and most everyone else didn't even give a crap about non bvb barbs until we proved them wrong.

[eA-Zaku]

Thanks for the advice and feedback! If I get even a comment similar to "good job" from even one poster, I feel as if it was worth the effort :D

[Freezing Rain]

Good job! *Bookmarks*

[RetroStar]

I can cover the PvP strats. for builds blob didnt cover. Though i dunno if i have time to do it cause of work and stuff.

Overall pretty detailed guides. Needs way better layout though.

Belt: Tgods if needed
Armour: Duress/Fort depending on realm if needed.
Prebuff: Hoto + +3 CTA has a higher BO than 2x Hoto.

Including your setup and stats would be nice.

Edit: Also you may want to include cheaper BvC equip for the middle class? Or is this strictly for rich pvp scene.

[sheepe2004]

Pretty much the standerd bvc guide but it would be nice to finally have one sticked so gj

Also i think blob's guide should be linked to since it contains some other information and some explenations for this even if he didnt put it in a nice way....

here it is:http://forums.diabloii.net/showthread.php?t=346428

ill delete it if you dont want it here though.

[Neurofuzzy]

Good job! I hope this one at least gets stickied. Would be nice to add some strategy advice!

RetroStar: I'm not sure u can wear Duress or Fortitude with this build, due to low STR. Besides, the build relies on teleport, so enigma seems the only choise for a BvC (except maybe if u use it for BvB and general mellee).

[Halciet]

Giving it the one-week stick before moving it to the guide thread.

-Hal

[De4dEyE]

Uh, weird [and nitpicky] request. Do you mind if I go over your guide and fix whatever grammatical/spelling errors that may be there? The people I tutor don't need any essays looked over, and I'm getting bored.


Yeah I know, I should go and kill myself. But my request still stands. =]

[Jerion]

Semi-Budget Choice for helms if you can't afford a berber coa. Just use a ber'd coa with treachery prebuff.

[mcm]

Here's an idea: DON'T move this thread to the guides thread. Why? People are lazy *** mother ****ers. How do I know? Essentially all of the information presented in this thread is already in a thread within the guides thread. Shocking.

[eA-Zaku]

Wow, I feel like I have accomplished something worthwhile in my life.

But, yeah, the guide is nothing spectacular and lol at mcm.

Feel free to add whatever you want and I'll try to edit or add it in if possible. It is far from complete, accurate, or comprehensive.

De4dEyE, go ahead. If it is still possible to edit I will gladly accomodate suggestions and changes and give credit.

My computer is buggy and was down for the whole weekend (it seemed like eternity) so yeah. Thanks for all the replies!!! :D

[Zigot_HD]

Semi-Budget Choice for helms if you can't afford a berber coa. Just use a ber'd coa with treachery prebuff.

Treachery prebuff - what do u mean by that?

**Treachery runeword :

5% Chance To Cast Level 15 Fade When Struck
25% Chance To Cast level 15 Venom On Striking
+2 To Assassin Skills
+45% Increased Attack Speed
+20% Faster Hit Recovery
Cold Resist +30%
50% Extra Gold From Monsters

Z

[Herald of Doom]

Put treachery on. Run around until a monster triggers the 5% ctc Fade, switch back to normal armor. lvl 15 Fade lasts like 20 minutes or something, so as long as you don't die you get resist+dmg reduce.

HoD

[luis19]

yeah chris i did start bvc after all of you guys and i did copy mcm's build :P
but i am godlier at dueling hammerdin.

heres my input:

equipment:
drop the 4 socketed rresist shields. used kiras with ort or thul or a good resist jewel. that way u can still dual wield.

drop the angelics, ive never had to use them so i sold them to charsi. use the room for 2x wisp or something.

widowmaker is very useful. you make it seem as though it is a crutch to use them in every situation. vs hammerdins who are mass defense and dont stand still, you need widowmaker or you'll have a 25 min duel. it helps alot vs v/ts and mages, in some cases it can be the decisive factor in the duel. also on east nl, sorcs have like 5k mana and on top of that play mass defense -- widowmaker is ur friend here unless you wanna completely sorb them but i dont carry that much sorb and rarely use any eitherway (cept ravens).

base stre/dex leaves you with no flexiblity. the build i copied off mcm was liek 64/56 stre/dex or something, allowing me to take off engima and use hel'd widowmaker. with a torch now you can put less points in. switching in fort/duress and widowmaker helps alot vs some builds -- desync hdins, v/ts, mages, few others.

drop the ss, not needed.

verdungos = add. vs pure smiters and zealots u can slap on to give you more margin of error.

cheap alternative to coa, ber'ed 08 gaze or even p 09 gaze.

another belt to add:
after seeing mcm's OW belt i made my own and it works very good vs: mass defensive casters (widowmaker + ow belt), hdins, smiters, zealots.
mods you want are: 8+ OW, fhr, life, +stre, resist. (imo +stre/life are the most important).
what u need: cube+tal rune+any jewel+any magic belt/mesh/mithril belt + pruby. get the magic belt in hell to get more mods.

dueling strat i'd like to add:
tele zerking.
tele/unsummon on right click, zerk on left.
you can just straight up tele on someone then zerk or namelock with left click zerk then tele zerk, or namelock with unsummon then tele zerk.

once u tele, press shift and zerk them, move your cursor to the middle of the screen the second you tele.

although ww is superior to zerk in almost every situation, your opponents are human they will make a mistake. when they do, and they will sooner or later, telezerk them. zerk will pk them faster than ww if you get it off right, so if you see an opening go for it, otherwise ww.

i wont add dueling strats for specific classes for now, most of them are common sense and hdins/necs which most people seem to need the most help on take too long to explain. maybe later.

[sheepe2004]

drop the angelics, ive never had to use them so i sold them to charsi. use the room for 2x wisp or something.

If you dont have an inventory full of charms with ar you will still need angelics to hit good paladins who like to walk everywhere.

[De4dEyE]

i wont add dueling strats for specific classes for now, most of them are common sense and hdins/necs which most people seem to need the most help on take too long to explain. maybe later.

Explain! D=

And if you're playing ultra defensive casters, since you have an OW belt, you're playing with 20%FCR, is that enough? Or you might have 0% if you don't use FCR rings..

[luis19]

Explain! D=

And if you're playing ultra defensive casters, since you have an OW belt, you're playing with 20%FCR, is that enough? Or you might have 0% if you don't use FCR rings..

i said the ow belt + widowmaker

u dont need fcr you bow them to death.
they will get close then u can ww.
if u cant then lock them with unsummon then tele ww, u wont need fcr since they probably wont expect an attack.

[Mehatesmaphackx]

yeah chris i did start bvc after all of you guys and i did copy mcm's build :P
but i am godlier at dueling hammerdin.



why should i waste my time chipping life away from hammerdins who party each other and spam hammerfield on top of each other and praying that htey dont' heal before they die when i can just use windy,nec,zon, or any casters they can't absorb and pwn their newb buts.

and necs aren't that hard espeically with grief.

[luis19]

why should i waste my time chipping life away from hammerdins who party each other and spam hammerfield on top of each other and praying that htey dont' heal before they die when i can just use windy,nec,zon, or any casters they can't absorb and pwn their newb buts.

and necs aren't that hard espeically with grief.

necs arent hard, but the best on your realm should have the best chance to beat you than any other class.

[Mehatesmaphackx]

necs arent hard, but the best on your realm should have the best chance to beat you than any other class.

actually hammer trash are harder unless you consider them losers from the start. the hammers in west pubs all rejuv, 5on1, run non stop and heal non stop. Ur an idiot if u think barb owns them. they are hard to hit with all their bugged def items and charms.

[RetroStar]

Everything is hard to kill if they juv like that.

[Mehatesmaphackx]

Everything is hard to kill if they juv like that.

not really most casters and zons go down so fast it won't matter besides they'll be stuck in ww stun/block lock. also it's mostly the hammerdins that do that because it works most effectively with them.