View Full Version : Attn: barb experts: how do you beat godly smiter?
raffster
11-09-2005, 00:26
These questions go out to extreme barb experts: I made a very decent conc/ww barb and I can beat almost all melee barb and paladin builds except mega godly smiters/zealers (but smiters are usually a bigger problem).
1. Is it true that you cannot block smite? So basically using a shield is useless against a smiter? If so, am I better off whirlwinding with 2 weapons?
2. What is the best weapon combination against a powerful smiter? (e.g. Grief + Beast, or 2 x Grief, etc.)?
3. Does damage reduction affect smite damage? Assuming #1 is true, would switching my items so that I could get 50% DR w/o Stormshield be a good idea? (E.g. Replace Arreat's with a COA, Enigma/Fort with Leviathan)?
4. Do I have better chance of beating a smiter using Dracul's or Steelrends? (or is there a better pair of gloves?)
5. Is using battle cry a good idea before a barb vs smiter duel, assuming it is permitted?
Any advice and tips will be much appreciated. Thanks a lot.
1. if you want dual weapon use coa ber ber and verdungo for high dmg reduce
else use doom and storm
2. weapon comb: grief/doom or doom/storm
3. yes dmg reduce helps against smiters 2 choices here depening what you choose: coa ber ber and verdungo or storm and verdungo both is high enough dmg reduce to easy beat a smiter
4. use gleglaw for KB and the slow
use triangle tactic for a defensive smiter and if he is offensive you just ww away from him (so youre defensive)
and if smiter calls you lame cause you use doom and KB call him lame cause using exile and/or draculs
and then squelch him...:D
this is tactic i use against any smiter:)
Triangle ww will get you killed quicker. YOu have to take your time with a smiter. There are at least 2 other threads about this scenario in this forum, do a search.
Clip the said pally.
x = pally
/ = path of ww
. = fill in
\
.\
..\x
...\
....\
..../
.../
../x
./
/
This gives you a couple of hit checks while allowing the pally very few, most often zero hits from him. At the end of your ww, you create what seems like an opening for the pally to charge you. It can be very tempting, so if you see him charge, do a ww and you'll most likely get a a couple of free hits.
Get a higher DR%, Verdungos, Enigma, BerBer CoA.
If he comes after you, whirl away from him. If he's stupid and chases you, he'll get hit and will be unable to touch you.
After he gets wise to that [or if he starts out like this] he may just stand there and wait for you. Like the previous posters said, just clip him. Do semi-long ww's like the diagram shows, it'll most likely get more hits on him than you will take. Do NOT make the clipping too close, or else he'll just walk into your path and then it's your ***.
If he starts trying to walk into your clipping path [that would allow him to trade], you can sometimes mess around with different length WWs. Clip him, and if you think he's going to try to intercept the next one [usually he'll walk there, making it easier to spot. If he runs, he'll get owned], make a short WW and then go the opposite direction, kinda like:
1)
...................................<-- x [represents the pally moving to the left to intercept you]
..................................* [where your short WW should end]
.....................................\
.......................................\
.........................................\ [your path]
2)..................................... x............/
................................................../
............................................../
...........................................*[where your first short WW ended]
The reason I'm making the 2nd WW so wide, is because he will most likely see that you've changed directions, and possibly make his way back to the original point he was at. If he does that, and your WW is too close, he'll get some smites in. Make it wide, either you hit him and are safe, or neither of you get hit and he has to guess again. Win-win, imo.
If you get lifetapped, you can sometimes WW away because he 'may' chase you to get his life back.
And yeah, never triangle ww him. He'll get a lot of hits on you.
<- Not an expert! :)
aznbboi16
11-09-2005, 02:03
Dual wield, use CoA and verdungos for max or close to max DR. Use Grief/Beast or Grief/Doom. Doom/SS is a bad choice just because your damage would be so low you'd probably be better off with Grief/SS.
If he stands still, "polygon" whirl him. Triangle whirls either cut it too close in the middle of the "sides" of the triangle or are too wide to even have hit checks in the corners. I like to do square-pentagon whirls around still smiters. Wide triangle whirls work well too, but waste time at the corners, so I prefer more sides to the whirling path. This takes more mana than triangle whirls, but also gets you more hitchecks in a shorter time.
If he's the type that walks as you whirl, I find wide triangle or polygonal whirls are good, because he will be in your range almost the entire time.
If he runs, whirl away in a curve. If he charges I like to long whirl away on a slightly diagonal angle.
mastermind
11-09-2005, 14:14
y smiters are quite a handfull but i dont recommend the triangle whirlwind cuz i have used the same tacktic 2 but i took alot of dmg like that infact i got pwned like that :o what u have to do is ww away from him like in the first and second diagram dont whirl round him in a triangle as it will turn into a tollerance match (who can take the most hits and who has the highest life).
also what i have found to work is not just using ww but a beserk attack beacuse think about it smite never misses so if u use beserk it will drop ur defence but in this duel it would not matter cuz again smite always hits but.
what i find helps is to land a smite then change to a whirlwind and whirl away from him to leech any lost health or life.
a botd/ grief is a good combo for smiters or botd/beast but make sure u duel wield in a battle like that and have good dr cuz again shield is pointless in this battle also u need fast hit recovery 2 cuz smite stuns.
hope this helps
morotsjos
11-09-2005, 21:11
I use grief+doom+clegs. Coa isn't needed (I cant use it anyway with base str). Tgods (and in some cases Lo helm/ort kiras) vs v/t:s.
ive never lost to a smiter in a series. only time i died was lag.
very easy duel if they are pure smite, they just cant hit u unlessu make a bad ww.
if u throw in slow, they might as well drop their gold, actually they should drop their gold before eitherway cuz they cant win.
morotsjos
12-09-2005, 01:59
ive never lost to a smiter in a series. only time i died was lag.
very easy duel if they are pure smite, they just cant hit u unlessu make a bad ww.
if u throw in slow, they might as well drop their gold, actually they should drop their gold before eitherway cuz they cant win.
I've had those annoying grief-nubs charge-smite and even tele-smite me to death mid-whirling (yes, that means in the middle of a long whirl away) with botd+beast =(
Hence I always use doom to ensure win.
ArmyOfDarkkness
12-09-2005, 06:15
The only thing i use against smiters is Grief + Doom...
If they say bm, tell them to take off their life tap then :)
noob morotoj
teh duel is so ease
u make mid length ww's if they tele zzz that way u can change direction
and use leap so gg
and smiterz on east hab bugged tals so they can get dr w/o coa. omfg all u have to do is clip them so easy, i cant explain how easy it is.
if they charge, its an easier duel, but annoying if u lag or they jump u.
TheDanRathersProject
12-09-2005, 08:43
Another thing you can do if they are pure smite is grab a widowmaker and if they just stand there shift smiting you can shot them with guided arrows, then when they charge you just WW oposite direction and get a lot of free hits. This is an alternitive to the triangle ww if you can't get it off really well.
morotsjos
12-09-2005, 12:31
noob morotoj
teh duel is so ease
u make mid length ww's if they tele zzz that way u can change direction
and use leap so gg
and smiterz on east hab bugged tals so they can get dr w/o coa. omfg all u have to do is clip them so easy, i cant explain how easy it is.
if they charge, its an easier duel, but annoying if u lag or they jump u.
Cry ^^
Look, I make long-*** whirls downwards, they namelock-tele (so they appear behind me) but they STILL hit with smite (even using pb) unless I use slow.
Do I lag or am I just crappy in general? Or do you just duel crappy smiters? ^^
Leap is worthless, they either just shift-smite and wont get knocked back, or they charge you while leaping.
GIFF BETTER ADVICE.
Imbecile
12-09-2005, 23:08
I don't have a Doom Ba at the moment so I stick to the barebone, grief + beast. Against smiters I use CoA Ber+Ber, Forti, Verdungo, Angelic Set (If they are equal lvl or higher), Grief and Beast. I clip them with WW, but Im having trouble beating ( smite + foh ) palas, pure smiters are just sitting ducks. Vindicators, can only win against me if they base most of the game on Foh'ing, which I always ask them to MELEE duel, but they usually say nn. Since I use forti vs melee, doesnt it affect the speed of my ww, since enigma grants me 2+ Increased Speed and 45% rw?
A little LT wand is good too, if they just stand still and smite the air :)
dont use anglics, highlords/ravens u kill em faster cuz of ds.
morotj you dont have coa rite? get 08 ber gaze, or even p ber gaze. kk thx.
smiters r the ez duel, widowmaker isnt even needed.
to make it even easier vs pub smiters, venom buff before cuz they hab bad resist. vs good smiters it doesnt do much, but its not needed anyway.
morotj, leap is good vs the smiters that like to walk around in front of ur ww's. vs tele u need to keep ur ww's much shorter, change direction often and sometimres in random directions. try it? kk thx gd.
grief + doom = gg all smiters, end of story. put on cleg claw if u want to be really mean.
the slow smiting isnt going anywhere.
i use angelic setup cuz a good smiter will have high def.
Dennis_KoreanGuy
13-09-2005, 02:30
The only thing i use against smiters is Grief + Doom...
If they say bm, tell them to take off their life tap then :)
Life Tap isn't BM in private clan duels + etc. Doom is.
Another thing you can do if they are pure smite is grab a widowmaker and if they just stand there shift smiting you can shot them with guided arrows, then when they charge you just WW oposite direction and get a lot of free hits. This is an alternitive to the triangle ww if you can't get it off really well.
You won't find any more of those noob smiters anytime soon, the ones who just sit in place + hold shift + Smite, but I do try to run away and shoot couple GA's for my Life Tap to go on and it ends up doing some decent damage if I stack up on psn charms and run, because they can never catch my BvC.
dont use anglics, highlords/ravens u kill em faster cuz of ds.
I use Ravens + dual Angelics... my Barb can never hit >25K Def Smiters with AR under 15K which is only achievable for me with triple Angelics... Deadly Strike or not, I can't hit them... :(
ArmyOfDarkkness
13-09-2005, 02:40
Life Tap isn't BM in private clan duels + etc. Doom is.
It was my understanding that all "chance to cast" items were frowned upon...
As well as nec's bone prison.
Plz correct me if I'm wrong :)
Neurofuzzy
13-09-2005, 05:10
Well, if u dont care to be called BM, cast iron maiden from metalgrid and let them hit you... :lol:
Well, if u dont care to be called BM, cast iron maiden from metalgrid and let them hit you... :lol:
Cast Bear from Beast with IM and tele-zerk.
Cast Bear from Beast with IM and tele-zerk.
Can't Tele in beast mode. ;D
Man, all this talk about PvP, makes me want to trade off all my L stuff for NL currency and build my BvC there...
Can't Tele in beast mode. ;D
Man, all this talk about PvP, makes me want to trade off all my L stuff for NL currency and build my BvC there...
cast bear, not morph.
btw to someone who posted about ar, i hit 30k+ def smiters with 10k ar. sometimes i enchant but im too lazy, still only 13kish ar with enchant.
cast bear, not morph.
btw to someone who posted about ar, i hit 30k+ def smiters with 10k ar. sometimes i enchant but im too lazy, still only 13kish ar with enchant.
Oh <-- Stupid
The Bnet forums are weird.. I see talk about Barbs have no chance against smiters.. :confused:
morotsjos
13-09-2005, 13:41
morotj you dont have coa rite? get 08 ber gaze, or even p ber gaze. kk thx.
smiters r the ez duel, widowmaker isnt even needed.
to make it even easier vs pub smiters, venom buff before cuz they hab bad resist. vs good smiters it doesnt do much, but its not needed anyway.
morotj, leap is good vs the smiters that like to walk around in front of ur ww's. vs tele u need to keep ur ww's much shorter, change direction often and sometimres in random directions. try it? kk thx gd.
Ofc I have coa but cant use it in conjunction with doom+clegs due to base str. Hence it's either coa+grief+beast or doom+clegs+arreats.
Without doom+clegs I get tele-smited. Simple as that. I know how to ww, it's not that. I just dont know what I'm doing wrong since they can tele-smite MID-ww, perhaps I have too much increased speed lol...
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