venomancer vs bonemancer? (killing speed)

[sequoia]

i remember someone (mm i think) saying that with the right items a venomancer could surpass a hammerdin in speed. this got me thinking, which kills faster - a good venomancer or a good bonemancer?

[Pherdnut]

Venomancers are awesome against monsters. Since their attacks hit almost everything in a 360 degree radius and you can crank up Nova to kill just about anything without high resistance in one shot with a full inventory of skillers and all the best -res items, you can expect to be running pits and cows faster than any hammerdin or bonemancer could hope to. I don't they'll ever kill bosses as fast as bonemancers and hammerdins though.

[sequoia]

so its probably THE faster pitter in the game? o_O

[RetroStar]

Even in PvP venomancer surpasses both in killing speed as most duelers don't really stack psn resist.

[Rianna]

I have a Poisonmancer that dishes out over 10,000 poison damage via poison nova and has -85 poison resistence on gear.

Normal monsters take less than 1 second to kill (it seems).

I can also raise 14 skellies to kill what ever I cannot.

[HarbingersOfSkulls]

I have a Poisonmancer that dishes out over 10,000 poison damage via poison nova and has -85 poison resistence on gear.

Normal monsters take less than 1 second to kill (it seems).

I can also raise 14 skellies to kill what ever I cannot.


Can you post your complete build?

HoS

[Myrakh-2]

Doesn't sound too difficult to come up with the build...

three poison skills = 60 points
two skeleton skills = 40 points

Teeth + CE = 2 points
Clay + Mastery + Resist = 3 points
Amp + Life tap + Iron Maiden + Weaken + Terror + Decrep + Lower Resist = 7 points

That's 112 points. So you need to shave off 12 points somewhere, and that could be Skeleton Mastery --- it would be the skill to dump all remaining skillpoints into.

Assuming the best gear, he would be using Bramble as armor, TO shield and gloves, and one more TO item --- I would suggest the belt. Along with Death Web this completes the poison part.

Remaining item slots, including charms, are filled with resists or +summon stuff to bump up the number of skeletons.

Something like that :-)

[MonsterSlayer]

you've 110 skill points :)

beside what happens if you affect a monster with 10k poison nova and then a skelly mage hits the same monster with poison that does 30 damage / sec for 600 sec?

[sequoia]

you've 110 skill points :)

beside what happens if you affect a monster with 10k poison nova and then a skelly mage hits the same monster with poison that does 30 damage / sec for 600 sec?
you have 110 skill points handy :)
98 from leveling 1-99
1 den,
1 rada
2 izual
_____x3
12+98 = 110

[Mad Mantis]

you've 110 skill points :)

Indeed but Myrakh-2 assumes that you've stopped serious levelling before you went insane and reached level 99.




beside what happens if you affect a monster with 10k poison nova and then a skelly mage hits the same monster with poison that does 30 damage / sec for 600 sec?

Nothing. Only when a source of poison has a damage rate higher than the current infection will it be overridden.

[sequoia]

which is more beneficial? bramble or enigma?

[MonsterSlayer]

if you've a tele amulet, I'd go for bramble :D

[Necrochild313]

which is more beneficial? bramble or enigma?

Enigma, you'll still be able to kill monsters quickly with deaths web and 3 piece trang and you'll be able to poison monsters at a much faster rate.

[MonsterSlayer]

Oups I thought he was talking about pvp :rolleyes:

[Taishaku]

It depends. I've played both, and the Bonemancer often kills faster in PvP.

Just be a teleporting prick. Fire off IBS all day. When they die, they die fast because usually a cloud of Spirits hits them.

As Poison, you teleport and Nova all day. If they survive, you have to wait. But there's this one second that you must stand still to use Nova that they can potentially kill you.

Plus, if they get any Poison resist, you're !@#$ed. You can't cancel out Magic damage the same way.

In MvP... well, the Poisons work crowds better, but bosses go to the Bonemancers, who can hold left click and similtaneously teleport away, thus firing homing Spirits from off screen. Just wait and watch the bar drop.

[Pherdnut]

If you put enough into nova, very few things can survive a single hit from it. Spears and spirits still have to reach their targets whereas nova spreads out across 360 degrees and nearly the entire screen.

[Taishaku]

If you put enough into nova, very few things can survive a single hit from it. Spears and spirits still have to reach their targets whereas nova spreads out across 360 degrees and nearly the entire screen.

Thas Nova's greatest weakness. It only goes on the screen. Plus theres a cast delay that can be a problem. Also, the damage is not the same all around, it is drastically reduced as the effect spreads.

Bonemancer vs. Poison, the Bonemancer can teleport around a house/box/wall all day casting BS while you try to get on same side and stop me a full second to Nova.

[Pherdnut]

Have you played a decked out poisonmancer?

There is no casting delay and even if there was it would be irrelevant since spamming nova does nothing but reset the duration of the poison damage anyway.

I've never heard of or noticed the nova effect doing varying amounts of damage at different ranges. If it does, it's a pretty negligible difference.

Also, we're talking about PvM here. Your arguments are more geared towards killing players, in which case I would agree. Bone is more suited to PvP although both can be effective depending on whether your opponents have stacked all their resists to excessive degrees.

Don't get me wrong. Bonemancers are awesome and much better boss killers, but there is no way teleing around and spamming spirits and spears is going to kill as fast as simply soaking entire armies in green and watching them all die simultaneously .5-3 seconds later. Even if you were getting one shot kills from your bonespear in Hell, you couldn't kill that fast.

[Taishaku]

Have you played a decked out poisonmancer?

There is no casting delay and even if there was it would be irrelevant since spamming nova does nothing but reset the duration of the poison damage anyway.

I've never heard of or noticed the nova effect doing varying amounts of damage at different ranges. If it does, it's a pretty negligible difference.

Also, we're talking about PvM here. Your arguments are more geared towards killing players, in which case I would agree. Bone is more suited to PvP although both can be effective depending on whether your opponents have stacked all their resists to excessive degrees.

Don't get me wrong. Bonemancers are awesome and much better boss killers, but there is no way teleing around and spamming spirits and spears is going to kill as fast as simply soaking entire armies in green and watching them all die simultaneously .5-3 seconds later. Even if you were getting one shot kills from your bonespear in Hell, you couldn't kill that fast.

Errr... then I agreed... Bone is for PvP, and Poison for PvM. Bone can outdo in bosses, Poison in mobs.

I said theres a second as you cast the Nova that you can't teleport away, where there is none for BS. BS also can lock the opponent if continuously fired (And if he somehow survives long enough to take the hits). Nova damage is locked?

[Rianna]

Poison Shako 5/5 poison jewel
Trangs Gloves
Trangs Wing with 5/5 poison jewel
Trangs belt

3 Trangs give -25 poison
+29 Maras Ammy
2 BulKathos Rings
+47 Bramble
+47 2/2 Death's Web with 5/5 Poison Jewel
+2 Marrowwalk boots
+1 Anni Charm

Weapon Switch
+3 Boneflame
Arm of King Leoric

5 Poison and Bone GHS


Maxed poison skills =60

Maxed Raise skell =20

Skell Mastery =10

Have to look up the rest.

[sequoia]

wow, nice setup :thumbsup:
do you find that the skellies are a necessary addition to the build?

[Rianna]

Yes, I love my skellies.

Most of my points go into health.

Enough stn to wear my gear and all the rest into health.

I don't need block with 14 or so skellies a Might Merc, Gumby, A Heart of the Wolverine Wisp (level16) and a Valkerie. Level 21 Thorns from Bramble make my minions killing machines.

Monsters seem to always target my skellies first and they quikly kill off poison immune monsters for me.

I'm working on getting A pride Polearm for my merc, for the concentration aura.

[Poisoned one]

I have a poison necro, he owns cows and any large group of enemies, BUT, bosses take a while to kill, it just seems to go slow for me.

[Necrochild313]

I have a poison necro, he owns cows and any large group of enemies, BUT, bosses take a while to kill, it just seems to go slow for me.

Venomancer: Just add crushing blow merc.