C/C Kicker questions

[Locke07]

I am making a C/C mage killer/ diablo clone hunter on ladder I have a few questions.

1) I plan on using fury and jade talon for pvp how much extra IAS do I need to break the 7/2 fps?

2) Which claw should be my dominant claw?

3) If I use a chaos instead of Jade would i get the maximum amount of open wounds on 1 kick? Meaning do the open wounds stack for both claws in kicks?

4) what boots should I use Shadow Dancers or Uped Gores?

Any insight would be helpful, and this is all for PVP not the PVM part.

[Speederländer]

I am making a C/C mage killer/ diablo clone hunter on ladder I have a few questions.
You should make either PvP or PvM but that's your call.

1) I plan on using fury and jade talon for pvp how much extra IAS do I need to break the 7/2 fps?
7/3 is the max. Make the fury in a greater talon or runic talon. The IAS sticky is pretty clear on this. Just check the average base speed (-20) and then consult the charts.

2) Which claw should be my dominant claw?
Fury.

3) If I use a chaos instead of Jade would i get the maximum amount of open wounds on 1 kick? Meaning do the open wounds stack for both claws in kicks?
It doesn't stack. The only reason to go chaos off-hand is to have ww as an alternate attack. That's a waste. Either be a kicker or be ww, not both.

4) what boots should I use Shadow Dancers or Uped Gores?
Shadow dancers without any question at all.

[Xiamet]

hey Speeder...

Why Shadowdancers over upped Gore's?

call me curious..

-X

[longwood]

If you are planning on PVP definitely go Shadow Dancers. The penlties from the mods on Gore Riders are painfully low for pvp. If you plan on PVM I would go with up'd gores. Its really as simple as that.


Longwood

[Speederländer]

hey Speeder...

Why Shadowdancers over upped Gore's?

call me curious..

-X

Gores:
-25% Item Requirements --> Saves you some points in strength, but then your overall physical damage starts to look kind of low. If you happen to wear CoA, as I do and as many others do, you need the str anyway so the -req does nothing.
+15% Chance of Deadly Strike --> DS doesn't affect kicks.
30% Faster Run/Walk --> wash with dancers.
+15% Chance of Crushing Blow --> CB is a wash in PvP. Unless you have HIGH percentages, it doesn't matter, and to get high percentages, you lose things you need. In any event, 15% is tiny and not worth going out of your way for.
+10% Chance of Open Wounds --> Again, a very small number. I can get 66% from a fury on my kicker. That's plenty. 66% vs. 76%...no real observable difference.
+160-200% Enhanced Defense --> doesn't matter
+10 Increased Durability --> doesn't matter
+20 Stamina --> doesn't matter

Dancers:
+(70-100)% Enhanced Defense --> doesn't matter
30% Faster Run/Walk --> a wash compared to gores
30% Faster Hit Recovery --> HUGE. You MUST have the 86 FHR break as a kicker. Tanking is as much a function of good FHR as it is high life. The 30 on dancers combines perfectly with 30 on your off-hand claw and 30 on your helm or 20 on the helm and and extra 7 on a 7 fhr/9 dex jewel on the off-hand claw.
+(15-25) to Dexterity --> Very nice. It's AR that becomes an issue eventually vs. high defense pallys. This 25 dex is a nice free boost, esp. if you are spending pts. on strength anyway.
+(1-2) to Shadow Disciplines (Assassin Only) --> Again, very very nice. Shadow disciplines are where your bread and butter is. It boosts claw block, venom, fade, mindblast, and shadow master.
Requirements -20% --> As stated above regarding requirements.


Dancers are better on several levels.

[Xiamet]

Thanks for clearing that up for me...

I figured it was Dancer's over Gore's for PvP...just wanted to know the actual reasons as to why.

I'm working on another PvM Sin myself and I'm kinda torn about the whole Kicker/Traps thing, since PvM kickers have notoriously low resists, even with a jade talon. And the loss of BoS to Fade makes for one sllllooooooww Assassin...

And I'm really not liking that you lose so many of the mods on the claws when kicking.

Ah well...more SP testing to come...lol.

-X

[ROMVS]

Thanks for clearing that up for me...

I figured it was Dancer's over Gore's for PvP...just wanted to know the actual reasons as to why.

I'm working on another PvM Sin myself and I'm kinda torn about the whole Kicker/Traps thing, since PvM kickers have notoriously low resists, even with a jade talon. And the loss of BoS to Fade makes for one sllllooooooww Assassin...

And I'm really not liking that you lose so many of the mods on the claws when kicking.

Ah well...more SP testing to come...lol.

-X

Don't you wish you could up set items like nat boots? PVM wise, I love the mods on nats except eh dmg on the boots for a kicker. :(

[Xiamet]

Nat's is awesome...but the gave it a couple of sockets, some DR and that was about it...meanwhile, Tal's, Trang's and IK, which were already pretty powerful sets, were beefed up even more.

Assassins got passed over like old newspaper..

-X

[FrozenSolid]

I have a pvm kicker/trapper and shes working out grat in hell and is a hell-a-fun :)
The resists are 61/75/75/6 in hell.
I followed C-Beats guide but made some small changes, here is her setup:
Guillames 'Ral'
Lionheart great hauberk
cm cryptic sword
storimshield 'PTopaz'
Draculs
String/Verdungos
Raven - rare ring with ml/str
Maras

I used topaz and Ral for more specific res because cold is already maxed from the ring and huge cold res bonus from the shield. Ptopaz coveres all light res needed and fire is from some charms. For psn attacks I simply use antidotes.
Im thinking of switching the ss 'PT' for a ss 'um' though.

[chi987]

I don't know how rich you are, but here is some alternative gear which might be helpful

for PVP:
you mentioned that you wanted a high open wounds. while fury by itself is awesome, you might like a duress

an alternative claw is malice. while it's probably not overal as good as fury, it is very low cost and has its own attack rating bonuses.

for PVM
if you want to kill diablo clone, you want crushing blow. use anything with crushing blow.
cheap things to look for:
Duress - one of the best armours you can get
Gores
Goblin Toe - 25% crushing blow. you probably think this is stupid but i like running around with my double upgraded goblin toes :D
Orphan's helm - 35% crushing blow - a must have
Stormlash - 33%
Strength claw - 25% crushing blow - one of the best boss killer claws you'll find
crafter gloves/venom grip - 5% - not necessarily needed

[Xiamet]

Strength looks pretty good, and it's cheap. My only real concern with a kicker is resists...I don't much like Fade, as it sacrifices speed for a boost in resists...so I'm thinking of opting out of the Duress armor, and equiping Lionheart instead for the resists, stats, + ED, and equiping a Strength Claw with a Jade Talon on the off-hand. Resists should be good to go...

Helm is Guillaume's and it's a toss-up between Shadow Dancer's and upped Gore's. I mean, how much CB does a kicker need to be effective? Over 50% should be more than enough, no?

-X

[chi987]

I'm pretty sure that CB does not stack, each individual source has a chance to trigger, much like other chance to cast spell items. bigger % sources are a lot better.

resists are definately a problem for this build. you're goign to need a lot of resist charms.
the only advantage lionheart has over duress is 15% resists. it's up to you

I change my mind about the gloves. you should get dracul's grasp or if you are able to, steelrend. dracul's will solve any problems you have with staying alive

[ragnaroks]

just wondering does CB works in duels(PvP)
i have 75% CB so does it works on pvp? and what does cb actually do i've heard decrease enemy life b4 attacking?

[Xiamet]

CB does stack, if memory serves me...I'm just not sure if it stacks on claw attacks...but with Kickers, the CB on the claws should stack with the CB on armor items...and apply to kicks.

-X

[ragnaroks]

so im thinking abut less CB on my assa thats good right?

what about i use malice and bartuc claws good combo for OW in pvp?