BvB Help!

[Sword & Shield]

Plz remember, this is gonna be my ONLY char, so dont think im this rich...

So far my US WEST NL WW BvB gear:
392% eBOTD zerk
SS + 40%ed jewel/ SS + Um
1067 Mage Enig
44/20 Steelrends
10/15 Dracs
197/6 Arreats + 39/7str Jewel
200% Gores
40/13 Verdungoes/ 33/15 Verdungoes
971 Archon CoH
Angelics
Waiting for Fortitude to come out in NL!!!

Arach
2 Fal'd Dag's on switch
2 sojs/ bks
No BO helm :(

1 3/20/20
+25 OK Assorted random x/x/x charms + vitas sc's
20/15/10 Anni
10 WC Gc's


1) Ok, i need some questions answered, first off can someone give me THE ULTIMATE BvB GEAR SETUP!

2) Can someone tell me an Elite gear setup overall statistics, that i should compare too, and try to achieve?

3) This barb isnt going to be using Enigma, therefore i would need more str. exactly how much BASE str. should i have for this barb to work with "THE ULTIMATE BvB GEAR SETUP"?

4) Also, according to the gear listed above, can someone tell me what i should sell, to achieve more 3/20/20's.

5) How much FHR do barbs need?

And on last notes, DO NOT confuse this thread with "Rate my build"'s, because it is not. I am mearly listing my gear for people to tell me what to do with it.

-thanks

[kakarot]

first of all, don't be lazy, it'll get you nowhere :xmad:

1) grief ba/fortitude/ss and the rest is standard setup drac's/gores/angelic combo/arreat/verdungo or perhaps a bit more OW on belt

2) dahmer is the man of numbers, ask him

3)don't be lazy, 'heaviest' item str req - bonuses from gear = str

4) no idea

5)imo not too much for bVb, arreat + maybe some on charms

hope this helps(i'm still drunk from last night so bear with me) :xgrin:

kakaroto

[Sword & Shield]

first of all, don't be lazy, it'll get you nowhere :xmad:

1) grief ba/fortitude/ss and the rest is standard setup drac's/gores/angelic combo/arreat/verdungo or perhaps a bit more OW on belt

2) dahmer is the man of numbers, ask him

3)don't be lazy, 'heaviest' item str req - bonuses from gear = str

4) no idea

5)imo not too much for bVb, arreat + maybe some on charms

hope this helps(i'm still drunk from last night so bear with me) :xgrin:

kakaroto
Bah, now i need to resell the BOTD i just bought...

anyways, thanks :buddies:

[Dahmer]

- ebotd zerk is more of a pvm weapon
- res is not needed in bvb & with a better weapon for bvb (beast) the ed jewel will hardly make a difference
- 1067 def enigma is way too low to try bvb (enigma is just a bad bvb armor), you'll end up dead vs any barb having 2xk ar & 15xx or higher def armor, duress is a lot better for bvb
- steelrends are +/- useless now imo for barbs
- 10/15 dracs.....hmm, nothing to add :D best gloves right now on nl
- nice arreat, nice jewel, just not right now for bvb on nl, dont unsocket, just keep it for after reset :)
- gores, same as dracs, best boots
- 33/15 if you're changing armor to duress
- why would u use coh in bvb?

1) best setups on nl :
- beast ba/duress/gores/dracs/verdungo's/arreat/ss/angelic -> 93% ow, nice def, high ar
- fury ba/eth ark/gores/dracs/verdungo's/arreat/ss/angelic -> 101% ow, high def, nice ar

choise is up to you, like def, go for fury setup, like ar, go for beast setup

2) mentioned above

3) same s kakarot

4) not right now, maybe after reset but right now the dmg on 32020s is kind of useless on the setups i mentioned, ar is still king on nl

5) with every setup i mentioned u have enough fhr on equip so dont worry about it

[Sword & Shield]

- ebotd zerk is more of a pvm weapon
- res is not needed in bvb & with a better weapon for bvb (beast) the ed jewel will hardly make a difference
- 1067 def enigma is way too low to try bvb (enigma is just a bad bvb armor), you'll end up dead vs any barb having 2xk ar & 15xx or higher def armor, duress is a lot better for bvb
- steelrends are +/- useless now imo for barbs
- 10/15 dracs.....hmm, nothing to add :D best gloves right now on nl
- nice arreat, nice jewel, just not right now for bvb on nl, dont unsocket, just keep it for after reset :)
- gores, same as dracs, best boots
- 33/15 if you're changing armor to duress
- why would u use coh in bvb?

1) best setups on nl :
- beast ba/duress/gores/dracs/verdungo's/arreat/ss/angelic -> 93% ow, nice def, high ar
- fury ba/eth ark/gores/dracs/verdungo's/arreat/ss/angelic -> 101% ow, high def, nice ar

choise is up to you, like def, go for fury setup, like ar, go for beast setup

2) mentioned above

3) same s kakarot

4) not right now, maybe after reset but right now the dmg on 32020s is kind of useless on the setups i mentioned, ar is still king on nl

5) with every setup i mentioned u have enough fhr on equip so dont worry about it-Ok, i havent socketed that jewel in my arreats.
-I was gonna use the steelrends PvM...

What happened to Greif....??? I thought it had the best average? Why fury or beast?
And fortitude, what happened to that...!?!?

Also, about this barb, i want him to fight agianst other melee characters: Fanatic Zealots, Fury, Smite, ect. And i want him to be able to solo hell. So hes like a anti-caster, pro-melee barb. I dont think i want to chase around casters...

Right now i have:
270%/36 str. Ettin Beast

-will that have to do?

Also, should i put a point in berserk/ faster r/w?

and thanks for the answers, i expected a lot less....

[Dahmer]

i didnt mention grief/fortitude since you're playing nonladder? :p
if you're on ladder or can get your hands on grief ba (35ias minimum) pretty fast u can go for ed/str socketing & grief ba + fortitude archon :D

*edit*
ettin is too slow to be of any use actually, i really doubt if that ias on fana works for ww, also only range 2

also if you plan on fighting other melee chars they shouldnt be a problem since barbs are kind of best melee class :D

& for skillplacing.....well.....1 point wont hurt, but u dont need it really & ehm, anti-caster? dont try to duel casters with that barb since you're gonna need to change gear/skills too much

[xpumafangx]

I think 1500 def armor are just a little low. I say go with 2k or more def armors. Also if you can help it go with a light low str needed armors. I dont mean to crap all over the person that said to use that amount of def but I cut right thro it.

You will not have to worry about other melee builds at all. They are not as scary as some might people make them look. But do be careful of wolfbarbs. I have done very well with my barb vs barb so far.

All I really did is work on getting my def, maxed blockrate, 50% damage redused, and attack ratting as high as I could get. Then I made shure I had a weapon that had a range of 3, enuff ias to get the last break point for ww (-35/-34), and did over 500 max damage. After that I just throw on some deadly strike openwounds and crushing blow. I tryed to work with more open wounds then deadly or crushing blow because it would help me out more with 1 hit then doing 1 really large amount of damage. because of all that I am using these items.

perfect ethy cruel bb of quickness. 2 40/15 max jewels in it. A ebotd cb would have been alot better. But the weapon I have is a gift from some one I have alot of respect for.

godly ethy achon plate pul zod.

arreats face.

anglics combo 2 rings and a amulet.

verd belt.

stormshield.

gore riders.

When I did p vs m I put on a manahealed ring so I can leech back mana.

Charms are simple anni.
fines
2 warcry gc.
1mastery gc.

I dont even worry about hitrecovery. con berserk, and whirlwind I never seen them get effected by hitrecovery or stun.

I also dont worry about cannotbefrozen because for some resson I do more hits when my movement speed is really slow.

Resists I do worry about for p vs m and yes some other melee builds and classes do use elemental damage so...... YA like I will ever see them but you know. I use a carrion wolf. If you knew what that is you still shouldn't worry about them. Werewolfs def are really low.

[Dahmer]

xpumafangx nice but strange setup :D total def/ar/life?

[Sword & Shield]

i didnt mention grief/fortitude since you're playing nonladder? :p
if you're on ladder or can get your hands on grief ba (35ias minimum) pretty fast u can go for ed/str socketing & grief ba + fortitude archon :D

*edit*
ettin is too slow to be of any use actually, i really doubt if that ias on fana works for ww, also only range 2

also if you plan on fighting other melee chars they shouldnt be a problem since barbs are kind of best melee class :D

& for skillplacing.....well.....1 point wont hurt, but u dont need it really & ehm, anti-caster? dont try to duel casters with that barb since you're gonna need to change gear/skills too much
Well i can always wait for L to finish or i can trade in some NL gear for L...

Also in your previous post you said "not right now, maybe after reset but right now the dmg on 32020s is kind of useless on the setups i mentioned, ar is still king on nl", What did you mean by that? 3/20/20's still add ar, and i could still get them...?

THE ULTIMATE BvP/B/M SETUP?:
Fortitude Archon
Greif Zerker
SS + 40 ed jewel
10/15 Dracs
200%ed Gores
197/6 + 39/7 str jewel
Duel Angelics + Ammy
33/15 Verdungoes

[39] 3/20/20's
20/15/10 Anni

Skills:
20 WW
20 BO
20 Shout
1 BC
20 Weap Mastery
1 Natural Resist
+1 Iron Skin (max last?)
1 Faster R/W
1 Berserk

Str: ~100
Dex: 222 @ clvl99
Vita: +450
Nrg: Base

Thats how i picture it...

Anything else?

[Dahmer]

thats about it i guess but ehm, the stuff i said about the 3/20/20s...
got 2 things to say about it really
1) i HATE duped charms/armory/jewels
2) you get up to 36 ar on ar/life sc's

[Sword & Shield]

thats about it i guess but ehm, the stuff i said about the 3/20/20s...
got 2 things to say about it really
1) i HATE duped charms/armory/jewels
2) you get up to 36 ar on ar/life sc's
I agree with you... I too hate dupes and hacks.

The only reason i have it is because i got a really good deal on it, and people on Bnet go crazy over it.

So, hm..

[39] 3/20/20's
Max damage +117
Life +780
AR +780

-Does +max damage off items double, as in from ed jewels and such?

[39] 36/36's
Life +1404
AR +1404

[jjashik]

beast ba is not a good option for a bvb weapon. after reading about how it is "the best weapon" for bvb, i made a barb that used this weapon with practically the exact setup dahmer listed and lvled him to lvl 90 for higher ow dmg. tested with it for a good month and gave up on it after seeing how poorly i did. fury is far better than beast IMO.

[kakarot]

beast ba is not a good option for a bvb weapon. after reading about how it is "the best weapon" for bvb, i made a barb that used this weapon with practically the exact setup dahmer listed and lvled him to lvl 90 for higher ow dmg. tested with it for a good month and gave up on it after seeing how poorly i did. fury is far better than beast IMO.

care to put your neck where your mouth is? i'm sure dahmer would be happy to oblidge!

[jjashik]

if its gg gm bvb, count me in.

west nl
bns.kurupt.

btw, have you tested it yourself? cuz experience speaks louder than some numbers on paper.

[kakarot]

if its gg gm bvb, count me in.

west nl
bns.kurupt.

btw, have you tested it yourself? cuz experience speaks louder than some numbers on paper.

oh it would be gg gm since dahmer is a nice guy! only 1 prob, we're on eu! tested in open bnet, fana rings any bells? if i remember correctly fury setup had over 100% OW, beast had 80-90% but 60% more ar from weapon!

kakaroto

[jjashik]

i do know that with beast you get a lil less ow and a good ar bonus compared to fury. so i even thought, damn this setup will be good. a lot better dmg than fury, better ar, and the other stats were similar. but the main problem i had with this setup was hit connections. even with 2k-3k more ar than normal (31k ar IIRC), i had a big problem with hitting my opponents. i tested this setup for a good month because everyone has those days when you dont duel so well and i thought it was one of those days. but it wasnt. so, on the same barb, i put on the fury setup, and i instantly notice a difference. i know in 1.1 the eth bug was fixed, but the only thing i can think of why this is so is that beast doesnt have a -25% target def mod like fury.

[kakarot]

i do know that with beast you get a lil less ow and a good ar bonus compared to fury. so i even thought, damn this setup will be good. a lot better dmg than fury, better ar, and the other stats were similar. but the main problem i had with this setup was hit connections. even with 2k-3k more ar than normal (31k ar IIRC), i had a big problem with hitting my opponents. i tested this setup for a good month because everyone has those days when you dont duel so well and i thought it was one of those days. but it wasnt. so, on the same barb, i put on the fury setup, and i instantly notice a difference. i know in 1.1 the eth bug was fixed, but the only thing i can think of why this is so is that beast doesnt have a -25% target def mod like fury.

you've tried this against same opponents with same gear setups?

[jjashik]

both setups have been tested on the same ppl. i have yet to see a good bvb barb use beast if not any bvb barb. for my fury setup, i have only dueled a select few who had the same setup as me.

[kakarot]

ok mate, lets call it even! i would always use beast over fury, and you would go the other way around. the deciding factor would be skill and other gear! grief will unite our opinions!!!!

good luck & have fun, kakaroto

[ToThePoint]

ok mate, lets call it even! i would always use beast over fury, and you would go the other way around. the deciding factor would be skill and other gear! grief will unite our opinions!!!!

good luck & have fun, kakaroto
imo, for OW lamers fury >beast but then it depends on the rest of the gear i spose.

[rikstaker]

i know in 1.1 the eth bug was fixed, but the only thing i can think of why this is so is that beast doesnt have a -25% target def mod like fury.

Actually,the -25% is -12.5% in pvp, & that too on the enhanced defense%,barbs have like 800%,the reduction is on that %,in the end it hardly makes a diference in cth.Beast barbs get 93% ow,fury gets 101%,but with beast you also get 80% ar boost from fana,they are more or less equal in terms of actual dmg output since fury packs deadly as well.But if you use plain ar charms & have very high base ar,beast is superior.Similarly,if you get your hands on an eth bugged armor,nothing beats fury,since duress isnt required.Anyway,when ladder resets & forts become available,ow will gradully fade away,grief/botd will be the mainstay.

Razgriz

[ToThePoint]

Actually,the -25% is -12.5% in pvp, & that too on the enhanced defense%,barbs have like 800%,the reduction is on that %,in the end it hardly makes a diference in cth.Beast barbs get 93% ow,fury gets 101%,but with beast you also get 80% ar boost from fana,they are more or less equal in terms of actual dmg output since fury packs deadly as well.But if you use plain ar charms & have very high base ar,beast is superior.Similarly,if you get your hands on an eth bugged armor,nothing beats fury,since duress isnt required.Anyway,when ladder resets & forts become available,ow will gradully fade away,grief/botd will be the mainstay.

Razgriz
its 12.5% from base thats why its better than the ar from beast.
The ability to swap duress for stone or other higher def armor makes it even better as gain effective ar and effective def.

[rikstaker]

its 12.5% from base thats why its better than the ar from beast.
The ability to swap duress for stone or other higher def armor makes it even better as gain effective ar and effective def.

from base,you sure? AFIR,Its on the enhanced defense%..I've said that in RTB's presence quite a few times,so I am quite certain.. :p . Anyway,I doubt -% target defense is better than ar boost regardless.

Lets assume:
a lvl 90 target
base defense: 3500
enhanced defense%:750

If reduction is on enhanced defense: (750-12.5=737.5)
Final defense:3500*737.5%=29312

If reduction is on base: (3500-3500*12.5%=3062.5)
Final defense:3062.5*750%=26031

Lets assume:
a lvl 90 attacker
base ar:3750
Ar%:Level 26 ww-125%,level 24 mastery-212%,Level 23 enchant-218%,Arreats:20%
Fury:20%(Total:595%)
Beast:80%(Total:675%)

Final ar with fury:26062

CTH if defense reduction on enhanced defense%(25812)=47%
CTH if defense reduction is on base(22968)=50%

Final ar with beast:29062

CTH(full defense of 29750):49%..

The difference is just of a percentage,if defense cut is really on base,I doubt though & even if it isnt the difference isnt huge the other way.The strength bonus(+40 to put on storm-higher life),is an edge but there isnt much to choose between the two.Fury offers more flexibility in terms of armor(101% ow without duress),fury manages more defense whereas beast can manage more life/dmg.Very little seprates the two in cth criteria.Anyway,after the above calcs I am leaning towards fury..caz I despise axes. :p

Razgriz

[jjashik]

i used beast with many 3/xx/xx's then i tried with many steel/vita. results were the same. i did better with fury.
on the other hand, when ladder resets, i think fort will make fury even better. think about 101ow with 300edmg more. the dmg bonus won't be as great as botd but more dmg with fury will be really nice. with a eth fury 4k dmg should be easily possible along with 101ow. also, i'm not to sure about grief. more damage compared to more life from botd. hard choice for me.

[ToThePoint]

Well i posted my tests in pala forum after another poster 'knew' how it worked and his tests confirmed (never showed them).

My tests matched from base (one test was 400+ hits btw) and was done properly with -100%def.
Dahmer and mcm also did basic looky-see whirl test to show its not off total %.

Also its not the fact that the -25%def beats the ar boost from beast alone - That ends up being pretty similar as you say.
Its that coupled with the higher defense of the fury user.
oh and id use a fury axe so keep on hating them :)

sec i;'ll go find test http://www.rpgforums.net/showthread.php?t=291371&page=2&pp=20

[jjashik]

the def on the armors i used with fury and with beast are around the same def. with fury, i used an eth valor 21xx. with beast, i used eth duress 22xx. as far as the -% def mod, i guess that wasn't the real reason since the numbers are really close. makes me wonder why now.

[ToThePoint]

the def on the armors i used with fury and with beast are around the same def. with fury, i used an eth valor 21xx. with beast, i used eth duress 22xx. as far as the -% def mod, i guess that wasn't the real reason since the numbers are really close. makes me wonder why now.
if you dont need OW (ie fury) then valor is nice with skills (=damage/ar/def/life) and some vit.
Duress basically only has OW, crushing i guess too but OW is the only real reason to use it.

[xpumafangx]

xpumafangx nice but strange setup total def/ar/life?

life is 2909

def is 25874

ar is 15894 with 2 anglics rings / ar is 23476 with demonlimb and 2 anglics rings

this is at level 91

233str
222dex=max block with storm at level 99
264vit

[Sword & Shield]

Although this is interesting...

im not making a duel wielder O______o

I also wanted to know what the enigma/ ebotdz setup is considered as, BvC???

I guess its since L still hasnt come in NL, but still do people know what their doing with that setup?

[rikstaker]

@TTP..gj...thanx for the link,your & Dahmers test clearly prove it.

where did the smilies go...:scratch:

Razgriz

[xpumafangx]

The plus to str on enigma per level lets you add the rest to vit. Giving you a very large amount of life. Not as much as old 1.08 valors but preatty dang close.