Brand Bow Discussion

[Wmeredith]

Few things about this new runeword:

Brand
4 Socket Missile Weapons
Jah + Lo + Mal + Gul
35% Chance to Cast Level 14 Amplify Damage When Struck
100% Chance to Cast Level 18 Bone Spear on Striking
Fires Explosive Arrows or Bolts
+332% Enhanced Damage (varies)
Ignore Target’s Defense
20% Bonus to Attack Rating
+318% Damage to Demons (varies)
20% Deadly Strike
Prevent Monster Heal
Knockback

It's pretty good by itself, however with the Synergy from Lvl 33 bone prison on Marrows, wouldn't this just whip a WF?

Keep in mind:

100% CTC Bonespear on Striking + ITD = you'll always cast it against regular monsters, right?

Well, a lvl 18 BS synergized with lvl 33 bone prison = Damage in the 530's. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't BS damage unresistable?

Unless I'm missing something, your doing 500+ unresistable damage, THAT PIERCES, on every shot. :xeek:

(Keep in mind that this isn't including what your actual arrows are doing. Not to mention the CTC Amp, Added DS, or +Damage to Demons. Holy crap.)

I want some discussion here, because this just blows me away. I can't wait to make my new BS ZON. Tell me I'm not wrong on this. :uhhuh:

[Hrus]

Bone Spear does magic damage and monsters HAVE resistances/immunities aginst that type of damage. However the immunities are pretty rare.

[Wmeredith]

I was under the impression that the only monsters with magic resistances were in Act 3. Isn't magic damage what the ridiculous Blessed Hammer does? I could be wrong though; I was wrong this one other time. :uhhuh:

Edit:

I'm starting to see some of the weaknesses now, like no ias, and its CTC Amp when struck (which is worthless for a Bowazon in my opinion), no leech, but if I put this in a fast bow on my strafe-azon w/ Marrows, could it still own a WF?

[DjSlayer]

Unless I'm totally missing something here the CTC of bonespear does not get any synergie bonuses.
Also the hammers from a hammerdin pierces imunities on demons and undead bone spells from a necro does not.

- D.J.

[Indemaijinj]

I was under the impression that the only monsters with magic resistances were in Act 3. Isn't magic damage what the ridiculous Blessed Hammer does? I could be wrong though; I was wrong this one other time. :uhhuh:

Edit:

I'm starting to see some of the weaknesses now, like no ias, and its CTC Amp when struck (which is worthless for a Bowazon in my opinion), no leech, but if I put this in a fast bow on my strafe-azon w/ Marrows, could it still own a WF?

There are more magic immunities than that. Those annoying "unraveller"-type undead are also regularily magic immune. What makes Blessed Hammer still affect them is the fact that Blessed Hammer pierces the resistances of Demons and Undead.
The Wailing beasts of act 3 you were talking about are neither, and are thus immune to Blessed Hammers.

Still, I am also a bit intrigued by the whole "Brand" deal, though the problem with IAS is significant. BTW isn't it possible to get Teeth charges on a ring?

[kryo]

Unless I'm totally missing something here the CTC of bonespear does not get any synergie bonuses.

They do, AFAIK. I've killed things in hell with the ctc on getting hit from snowclash with my bliz sorc last season. Without synergies, it wouldn't even scratch the mobs in hell.

[Wmeredith]

Ah, yes...

and doubt rears its ugly head. :xfrosty:

As far as the immunity thing goes, I think I would be doing enough damage with the actual arrows to make this a non-issue. I'd still be dealing lots of physical damage from my arrows. The 20% DS on the bow plus the Highlord's I swear by on all my bowazons (I've got 4 :xtongue: ) would give me 100% DS with just a few points in critical. Another thing to go with the immunity argument would be all the added extra Damage to Demons. Combine this with LoH and they're toast w/o any BS damage at all.

I've gotten lots of different opinions on whether CTC can be synergized. Hoping this gets cleared up soon.

Taking all this into consideration, I'm still going to make one of these. If it turns out CTC can't be synergized I'll switch out the Marrows for Travs and won't worry about the teeth ring. If it can be synergized :clap: , look out. I'll post here about the results.

Brand in Matriarchal Bow (+3)
Marrow
Highlord's
Raven Frost
Wisp (Or maybe a Rare w/ teeth charges)
CoH
LoH
Andy's w/ ias
Razortail

[darius_paul]

Brand looks like a hot bow to have. But for PvP, id rather have a Wrath:

30% Chance to Cast Level 1 Decrepify on Striking
5% chance to Cast level 10 Life Tap on Striking
+320-390% Damage to Demons (varies)
+100 to attack Rating Against Demons
+250-310% Damage to Undead (varies)
Adds 85-120 Magic Damage
Adds 41-240 Lightning Damage
20% Chance of Crushing Blow
Prevent Monster Heal
+10 to Energy
Cannot Be Frozen

And then switch to the Brand after dec or l/t hits.

Or even a Faith....

Level 12-15 Fanaticism Aura When Equipped (varies)
+1-2 to All Skills (varies)
+330% Enhanced Damage
Ignore Target’s Defense
300% Bonus to Attack Rating
+75% Damage to Undead
+50 to Attack Rating Against Undead
+120 Fire Damage
All Resistances +15
10% Reanimate as: Returned
75% Extra Gold From Monsters

[Wmeredith]

Or even a Faith....

Level 12-15 Fanaticism Aura When Equipped (varies)
+1-2 to All Skills (varies)
+330% Enhanced Damage
Ignore Target’s Defense
300% Bonus to Attack Rating
+75% Damage to Undead
+50 to Attack Rating Against Undead
+120 Fire Damage
All Resistances +15
10% Reanimate as: Returned
75% Extra Gold From Monsters

I don't really care about PvP, but Faith is totally sweet enough to make me consider an act 1 merc seriously, though. :thumbsup:

Or maybe I could have one on switch as soon as runes start falling out of the sky. Heh. :uhhuh:

[Uzziah]

Few things about this new runeword:

Brand
4 Socket Missile Weapons
Jah + Lo + Mal + Gul
35% Chance to Cast Level 14 Amplify Damage When Struck
100% Chance to Cast Level 18 Bone Spear on Striking
Fires Explosive Arrows or Bolts
+332% Enhanced Damage (varies)
Ignore Target’s Defense
20% Bonus to Attack Rating
+318% Damage to Demons (varies)
20% Deadly Strike
Prevent Monster Heal
Knockback

It's pretty good by itself, however with the Synergy from Lvl 33 bone prison on Marrows, wouldn't this just whip a WF?

Keep in mind:

100% CTC Bonespear on Striking + ITD = you'll always cast it against regular monsters, right?

Well, a lvl 18 BS synergized with lvl 33 bone prison = Damage in the 530's. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't BS damage unresistable?

Its blockable but the immunity to magic is rare. BH works against it since the immune magic appears on only undead except for 1 creature type IIRC, and that enemy is extremely rare.

And yes you will have them strike with each hit including each piercing hit, split up multishot hit strafe hit, etc. . .

Thats not all this bow offers you though, its got explosive arrows (which can be synergized by fire arrow charges on gloves. Knockback saves you from getting it on the gloves, Deadly strike to increase your physical damage greatly. You'll be doing massive damage in straight lines, adding something like hellmouth's ctc meteor would make this huge, let alone you can get 24% ctc slvl 8 chainlightning from jewelry. This is a proc setup if I ever saw one. Forget every bow skill except synergy for explosive arrows, multishot, and prereqs. The rest place in passive skills, when fighting mobs use multishot when single opponents or rows (maggots lair comes to mind) use normal shots (explosive arrows), lavagout for enchant to boost explosive damage as well.

Its a doable build and could be quite strong.

oh and slvl 18 bonespear with slvl 33 synergy is 556-589 damage.

[dirtycash]

2 things:

1. Would marrowwalks actually synergize the spears... since its not a given skill?

2. 35% ctc amp WHEN STRUCK
Thats like the ctc iron maiden that is on Doombringer? Its on ctc on attack or on hit... its when struck... hence a monster hitting you.

[Uzziah]

2 things:

1. Would marrowwalks actually synergize the spears... since its not a given skill?

2. 35% ctc amp WHEN STRUCK
Thats like the ctc iron maiden that is on Doombringer? Its on ctc on attack or on hit... its when struck... hence a monster hitting you.

1) yes, the charge synergy bug works on Skills, Oskills, other charged items, ctc items; anytime a skill is used its synergy is also accounted for, this has been tested and proven. There are reasons to wear stone armor and metalgrid together on a barb/pally.

2) its a ctc when struck so anytime your character takes a hit, this would include blocked hits (I may be backwards about blocking) and hits dealing 0 damage, but not dodged/avoided hits.

[Jek]

I'd just like to say that Brand in a mat. bow is completely and utterly insane. I were testing it in SP (gogo editor) and Brand completely blew WF out of the water. It's a perfect bow. Marrow Walks + 100% chance to cast Bone Spear is wickedly strong - I'd like to try it on a fully synergized bone necro. :)

It took me four minutes to solo River of Flames, Chaos Sanctuary and Diablo. (ALL MOBS) with brand+marrowwalk+razortail. :-P

[Wmeredith]

I'd just like to say that Brand in a mat. bow is completely and utterly insane. I were testing it in SP (gogo editor) and Brand completely blew WF out of the water. It's a perfect bow. Marrow Walks + 100% chance to cast Bone Spear is wickedly strong - I'd like to try it on a fully synergized bone necro. :)

It took me four minutes to solo River of Flames, Chaos Sanctuary and Diablo. (ALL MOBS) with brand+marrowwalk+razortail. :-P

Tell me it will work the same on the realms as in your editor. I heard someone say that it only goes off about twice per strafe volley when they made a Brand bow. If thats true it would make this bow not worth the runes compared to Faith. I want to here from someone who has actually tried it on the realms. Anyone?

[darius_paul]

...as soon as runes start falling out of the sky...

*crosses fingers*

[Jek]

Tell me it will work the same on the realms as in your editor. I heard someone say that it only goes off about twice per strafe volley when they made a Brand bow. If thats true it would make this bow not worth the runes compared to Faith. I want to here from someone who has actually tried it on the realms. Anyone?

At first I thought it was overpowered with multipleshot/strafe too, but it doesn't go off much with those two skills.

Guided Arrow and normal shots on the other hand... It's sickening.

[Wmeredith]

That sucks, is it b/c of next delay or Cast Rate? I hope its cast rate, b/c that can be delt with. Stat gurus, you out there?

:uhhuh: I want to spam synergized Bones Spears, dammit! :uhhuh:

[middleman35]

Well there seem to conflicting opinions on whether synergies work with ctc, and how often bonespear triggers. Wmeredith, if u get this bow made please post your results!

[Jek]

That sucks, is it b/c of next delay or Cast Rate? I hope its cast rate, b/c that can be delt with. Stat gurus, you out there?

:uhhuh: I want to spam synergized Bones Spears, dammit! :uhhuh:

Middelman, synergies seem to work in SP, I hardly notice PIs anymore.

@All:
In SP, Multipleshot doesn't fire off loads and loads off Spears. HOWEVER, Strafe is completely nuts. Sometimes the screen just go white, LF style. :P

[Wmeredith]

Middelman, synergies seem to work in SP, I hardly notice PIs anymore.

@All:
In SP, Multipleshot doesn't fire off loads and loads off Spears. HOWEVER, Strafe is completely nuts. Sometimes the screen just go white, LF style. :P

Good, thats what I want. I never use multi- it's for pussies. ;-)

[Rane-]

Charges on Marrowwalk definatly synergise Bone Spears. The reason why Multi doesn't work 'unstoppably' with it, is due to the fact that only the middle 4 arrows can trigger procs. Strafe is fine. Bone Spears for everyone.

[stupidgreen]

All you need is 60% IAS to get to 2 frame strafing. How about 20%/+ passive gloves, and an upgraded twitchthroe, and a Steal Skull with a IAS jewel in it. Or Twitch with a Jewel and Nosferatu's coil?

Totally sick. I don't think I have ever seen a PI/MI before either.

[EdvinMedvind]

Totally sick. I don't think I have ever seen a PI/MI before either.

You may run into some at Lost City, but other than that I haven't seen any either.

[Jek]

Charges on Marrowwalk definatly synergise Bone Spears. The reason why Multi doesn't work 'unstoppably' with it, is due to the fact that only the middle 4 arrows can trigger procs. Strafe is fine. Bone Spears for everyone.

Ah! Thanks for the information! :-) I thought it was only the "original" arrow - the spears only triggered in the middle.

I'd use 20% IAS, knockback gloves, Ias Stealskull and Ias Jewel in any armor. That way you leave open your armor and belt for Razortail + Resists or whatever you might need. Another possible solution is and Ias socketed Diadem + Gloves for 65% IAS, that way you can runeword armors - Lionheart, Fortitude, Enigma, Chains of Honor, whatever sadly you lack the dual leech of Stealskull.

This bow and faith singlehanded brought back Bowazons without making them ultra super pro max matrix elite killers like Hammerdins. :thumbsup:
COOL TO THE MAX.

[FX-Amanda]

i agree this bow is definatly a great bow .. and also the reason me going back to ladder again....

I scanned thru for synergies and you can't get teeth but however you can get Bonespirits on Amulets and Circlets lol but then again you'll need a great bit of luck getting .

regards
FX-

[Eleven]

so i guess Mat bow with +3 skills is the way to go? or something else?

[Wmeredith]

so i guess Mat bow with +3 skills is the way to go? or something else?

I would definitley say so. Matriarchal is the fastest kind of bow (-10) in the game and it gives +3 skills.

BTW all I need is a Jah rune and I'm good to go with this bow. I actually need THE BOW and a pair of Marrows, but I'm gettin' there.

[Eleven]

I have the runes and marrows ready....just need the Mat bow now!!! If anyone is kind enough to trade me one, I would greatly appreciate it! :thumbsup:

[SPIDERfrank]

What amount of IAS would you need to compliment this bow in order to reach 7?

Also, somewhat off topic but on the issue of IAS, how much would you need to reach the same but with the Faith bow?

And is Brand best used in Matron and GMB and Faith best used in Crusador/Hydra?

Thanks

[AwesomeDude]

I'm using a great bow so I can give it to other characters besides my zon like a fire ranger/pvm enchantress.

[Relativity]

Has anyone tested the viability of this build in an 8 player hell game? Or is it mostly a solo-play build... I'd be interested to know how fast this thing could kill in hell with the bonespears and physical damage (from a matri bow) with strafe.

Also, im assuming strafe would be better than multishot, since you said that only the 4 inner arrows can "cast" ctc spells?

[Eleven]

I'm using a great bow so I can give it to other characters besides my zon like a fire ranger/pvm enchantress.

how much dmg are you doing with the Great bow?

[AwesomeDude]

I meant that not as I'm currently using it, but that I will be once I can afford the the jah. It's got 1.5 points less average than a mat bow, so it won't do too much less at all, but at the highest average for a -10 non-amazon bow, it works well enough for me. So long as I get an Atma's Scarab on, with the DS on the bow and my points in critical strike, since I have no need for ias on my ammy, I can easily outdamage my WWS diamond bow, which was already killing plenty fast.

[Wmeredith]

I have a confession to make; I will not be making a Brand bow after all.

In the last few days I have been trading evrything I own to make this bow. In the course of doing so, I became weak and made a Fortitude Archon with my Lo rune. So I have now obtained the runes to make a Faith, since they are cheaper and am now hunting for a bow to put them in.

I may trade my Faith for a Brand someday, the overall damage will be slightly lower, but it will be half magic damage, which would be really nice. Plus, the idea of throwing bone Spears behind my arrows is just sick. I would like to hear how well this works in 8 player. Synergized it should be pretty powerful.

GL

*the_salmon

[mongol]

I tried this last night on single player, and its a lot of fun @ 8 frame multishot or 2 frame strafe. BS everywhere! Works really well when multishotting big packs, the guys in the back take a pounding.
Not much use in PVP though.

[Eleven]

I'm using a great bow so I can give it to other characters besides my zon like a fire ranger/pvm enchantress.

im gonna use a great bow instead also.....found out that +3 skills to strafe is nothing major with the Mat bow....and Great bow is so much cheaper.... :xsmile:

[rickcarson]

Totally sick. I don't think I have ever seen a PI/MI before either.

I have, it was way back when, on a Boss.

At the time I mistakenly thought that Magic Immune was the upgrade for Magic Resistant, and I was like: "wtf? this monster is completely unkillable!".

Now without the 50% global phys res they're a lot rarer.

[tow]

I tried this last night on single player, and its a lot of fun @ 8 frame multishot or 2 frame strafe. BS everywhere! Works really well when multishotting big packs, the guys in the back take a pounding.
Not much use in PVP though.

Doesn't that the new runeword only work on ladder? how do u tried it on SP? tell me if i miss something

[Jek]

Doesn't that the new runeword only work on ladder? how do u tried it on SP? tell me if i miss something

You can easily edit items/chars in SP to mimic the runeword stats.

[tow]

oh, ok thx for info