FB or Orb/ES

[Live]

I dont have alot of elite items for a pvper, and since most duels require teleport, I will have to go with a sorc. But I'm not quite sure what type of sorc is better for pvp pub games. Either FB or Orb/ES, I dont need to know where to put skills and stats, but it would be nice if you guys could tell me what sorc you think is better and what gear would that sorc wear. Again, I'm not very rich so dont say CoH for armor when I cant afford an Enigma. Thnx guys for your help. :thumbsup:

[Rauth]

I've never noticed any one sorc build more powerful than any other in general pvp. Pick one and go with it. They can both get away with less expensive gear and they will use similar gear so if you decide to try the other, you won't have to buy much new gear.

[Pulio]

If you are intending to go for a higher lvl sorc I would suggest a fireball sorceress. Since you'll be dueling in public games, your opponents will be worrying about other duelers and will be less likely to stack huge fire absorb gear to negate your attack. All you have to do is teleport around like made shooting fireballs at random.

For stats I would suggest asking on the sorceress forums as they know best when it comes to sorcs... I myself would suggest the lowest amount of strength and dex possible and balanced life and mana (assuming you put 1 point into energy shield).

[Diabolico x64]

I've always liked fire the most, and with a decent amount of FCR, a fireball sorc can be devastating in PvP. There should be a guide somewhere in the sorc forum or strat compendium.

Best of all, they're not very item-dependant, since ranged sorcs usually die pretty quickly whether they have good items or not. :lol:

[dkay]

something youve missed though rauth. fireball sorcs have a better chance of killing windies. or did you want to keep that a secret ? :)

[Rauth]

Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. ;)

You missed chris owning me with his fb sorc on dialup. First 4-5 duels I just got crushed and all he was doing was walking. :(

[dkay]

your letting out the secret omfg :O
problem with orb is that it wont scratch a decent windy. but you can really nail those people who dont bother to stack resist. but id still go with fireball.

[Kodachi_ysaane]

If you can break the druid's armor or run him out of mana you win with an orber.
If I encounter windies with my orber I just have a friend bring a sin and mb/wof him while I orb away his cyclone armor... after the armor breaks they die 1-2 orbs.

[dkay]

if you have a friend then that makes the duel unfair dontcha think? :P
usually if rauth is having troubles like that he can easily call chris in and own the whole pk 2 vrs 6. thing is a orber wont break a good druids cycone 1 on 1. and mana wont be an issue either. since a good druid will have 900+ mana easy.

[Rauth]

I just switch to wiz now when I need mana. Makes me hit 1.1k generally, and I've never run out with that much before.

Strategy to win for any dumbass: I'll get my friends to help me kill this 1 guy because I suck too much!!!

Good orbers can still beat a good portion of windys, just like a good windy can beat a good portion of trappers.

[Live]

But overall what sorc would be better in public games? You mentioned that pure fire sorces are good vs windys, but then again, orb/es sorces are good vs boners, so what type of sorc would have a better chance at winning in pub games?

[Kodachi_ysaane]

fb sorcs are better for pubs as they have a chance vs. anything.

Overall I say orbers are better though, even if they can't take down a good druid... if ti's pubs wait for the druid to lose his cyclone/be pre-occupied with someone else, one orb to a non-cyclone armored druid is usually death.
Then just NK the druid and take down rest of game easy.

[Kodachi_ysaane]

if you have a friend then that makes the duel unfair dontcha think? :P
usually if rauth is having troubles like that he can easily call chris in and own the whole pk 2 vrs 6. thing is a orber wont break a good druids cycone 1 on 1. and mana wont be an issue either. since a good druid will have 900+ mana easy.

I was referring to public duel games, where it would turn from a free for all to a 2v6... and a majority of the time the pubs are to stupid or arrogant to ally strangers and it becomes more like a 2vffa, which is VERY easy to win.

[dkay]

not going to argue with everything you post. you are correct about the pub game duels.. BUT this is the post i responded to:

"If I encounter windies with my orber I just have a friend bring a sin and mb/wof him while I orb away his cyclone armor... after the armor breaks they die 1-2 orbs."

doesn seem like you were talking about a 1 vrs all does it?

[Kodachi_ysaane]

Yes, that is what I said, but as I stated in my previous post, I was refering to pubs.


In a 1v1 just either run druid out of mana or ill get my ww sin to 1v1 them.

[Tor]

orb is too easily negated

use fb

my paladin stacks ressits + a snowclash(too poor for ohms)=0 damage

[Kodachi_ysaane]

Sorry it's easier to negate fb than it is orb.
Hotspurs and your sorc is done unless it's a complete noob using spurs... and if they suck that bad I woulden't be surprised if they had a dwarf as well.

to absorb cold you need stacked resists + ravenfrosts.

160 cr shield +2x ravenfrosts might lower orb damage, but a direct orb would still do about 1000-1400 (400-700 if claw block/dodge) pvp, while hotspurs alone negates fb to 300, also keeping in mind orb spams like crazy.
Perfect Orber > Perfect Fireballer in almost every way.

ALSO orbers can max e-shield and still have decent level telek... making orbers INSANE tanks.

[Zkin]

Absorb is lovely.

[Rauth]

Tor uses resist auras on his pally and a silence phase blade if I remember right(smiter?). So all he realy has to do is turn on a aura, and bam. stacked cold res.

Otherwise I agree, it is much easier to negate fire with hotspurs than it is to put on 300+ stacked cold res.

[RainofChaos220]

Tor uses resist auras on his pally and a silence phase blade if I remember right(smiter?). So all he realy has to do is turn on a aura, and bam. stacked cold res.

Otherwise I agree, it is much easier to negate fire with hotspurs than it is to put on 300+ stacked cold res.

Unless you're talking about blizzer, stacked resists are not necessary for orber. Let's assume ok orb doing 1.2k against 2xraven+snowclash

1.2K = 200 after PvP penalty
400 = after -100% after mastery

2xravens = 40% absorb = 80% reduced

400/5=80dmg per shard

then you get 15 absorb on snowclash which makes it about 50 dmg per shard.

Unless you plan to take several full orbs in the face, you should be relatively safe from orb.

Against fireballer.. 95% fire resists+2xdwarf= almost no dmg

18K Fireball (typical public fireball dmg)

3k after pvp, 150 after 95% resists, 60 after 2 dwarfes, healing after rising sun. Even 24k FB (top you can get) is 200 dmg after 95 res, 80 dmg after 2xdwarf and heals after rising sun.

[Kodachi_ysaane]

I think cold mastery can take an enemy lower than -100 resists, I will test when I get home.

Even so, orb = 1400 average PER SHARD.
that is about 233 pvp, then 466 if -100 resists, if even less than -100 it can do much more PER SHARD.

2x ravenfrosts remvoe 80% of damage so 93 damage per shard, which is still enough to slay most enemies in 1 direct orb.

If resists can be lower than -100, it would look more like this.
(Assuming standard properly equipped duelers with dupes on east)

+ 50 boots, + 20 ammulet, +20 anni, +40 hoto, +70 sanc/storm, +30 anya
that gives you a total of 230 resists,

level 41 cold mastery so -220 resists, then -15 more from facets so
-235 resists.

With 2 ravenfrosts you would still do 93 damage per shard as the enemy would have about -100 res regardless, but against a necro, where orbers are best it is more like this:

+ 20 ammy, + 20 anni, + 40 hoto, +22 UM darkforce, + 30 anya, maybe UM shako or a few 20/5 sc's. That is about 150~ so 50 resists in hell.
Then -30 for anya bug if necro dies, 20 resists in hell.
20-235= -215 resists.


233 pvp, about x3 damage that is 699 damage PER SHARD vs. a strong necro, and still about 140 pvp per shard after 2x ravenfrosts.
Even if the necro uses .08 valk and UM homun, he will do less damage not being able to break your e-shield.

MY 15/70 orber recieves 60 pvp damage per spirit/spear, and teeth does ZERO damage to her.
I Have seen legit + energy orbers achieve the same effect, often reaching 3k mana and 89% e-shield.

Orb > Fireball by far

[Rauth]

The difference between orb and fireball is, IF you stack enough cold res and only use 1 max res item, cold will do next to nothing. Fire can still have a chance against one res/absorb item, which is usually the standard for gm.

Just to clear up, you can Never go below -100 resists.

233 pvp per shard, after 85 res=35 per shard. Add in some mdr or numerical absorb(doesn't snowclash have that?)and you will be taking next to nothing. A full on orb hit will still hurt, but that doesn't happen very often vs a good dueler.

Fire after 90 res= 400 per shot with a 24k fireball.

Now, in terms of ease to resist, fire loses out badly. Any guy and his dog will have noka/spurs/infernostrides/waterwalks, while very few people have a full cold resist setup. Orb also benifits from lots of spare skill points for ES. Overall I would say they are pretty equal, since fire has Far superior range.

[dkay]

depends against the class. like against a windy an orber/blizzard...er. wont do as well as a fireball sorc.