Poison damage and monster regeneration

[Igor Potapov]

How many poison damage is enough to stop monster regeneration?
Does any poison damage stop all monster regeneration as in 1.09?
How much life does monster regenerate every second if he is Hell Act5 Possessed in /players8 game.

I know that Prevent Monster Healing or Open Wounds properties can solve any regeneration problems. I know that in 1.09 or before it we needed just any poison damage to prevent non poison immune monster from regeneration. Is it the same in 1.10?
I sought a thread here with poison & regeneration testing results. Where is it?
:scratch:

P.S.: It seems like search function doesn’t work for me. Does it? Try searching “poison and regeneration” on SPF.



Fatal error: Allowed memory size of 8388608 bytes exhausted (tried to allocate 35 bytes) in /home/rpgforums/public_html/search.php on line 951

Fatal error: Allowed memory size of 8388608 bytes exhausted (tried to allocate 0 bytes) in Unknown on line 0

[Nightfish]

Imo it's best to treat poison like regular damage as it's no better suited to stop monster healing than anything else. Calculate the damage per second and compare that to the damage you could be dealing otherwise.

For example, a 100 poison over 5 seconds damage charm does 20 damage per second. Now, how often do you attack per second? Let's take my zealot for example, he attacks at 6 frames so that's 4 times per second. Hence he deals the equivalent of 5 poison damage per attack. If I can find a charm with more than 5 average damage that is already better than the poison charm. In the case of my zealot a simple +2 damage charm would already do the trick.

Basically, the faster you hit the monster again, the more useless poison is.

If you are using something like strafe get open wounds instead of poison. It is much easier to achieve the same effect with OW. Especially if you consider that OW prevents monster heal and does damage at the same time.

[RTB]

Poison still sets the regen rate to its own rate, but then negative to cause dmg. Open Wounds tends to do much more dmg per second, but lasts only 8 seconds.

Edit:
OW btw, subtracts itself from the regen rate of monsters. If your OW isn't strong enough (very unlikely) monsters can still regenerate.

[Nightfish]

Then again, how often do you fight monsters that live longer than 8 seconds but don't get hit often enough to trigger OW again? If you've got a heavy hitter like a zerker the monster is surely dead before 8 seconds are over, if you've got a low-damage char like a strafe you'll surely hit often enough to reset...

[Igor Potapov]

OK. Any poison damage works like Prevent Monster Healing.

Lets calculate regeneration of a tough monster.



life recovery from the DamageRegen is calcuated as
recovery per frame = Max_life*DamageRegen/4096
note: Max_life must be handled the way the game stores which is with an extra 8 bits of precision (or in increments of 1/256), so the life on the screen would need to be multiplied by 256. The result will be the amount in 256ths that will be recovered per frame of game time.


He is talking about merc regeneration, but mercs and monsters are the same for the game.

Lets take for example Possessed Thorned Hulk in /players8 mode in Hell Act5.
He has DamageRegen=4.
Normal level 82 (Bloody Foothils=80 + champion=2) Thorned Hulk has around 15000 max life.
Possessed monsters has 12x life if Arreat Summit is true (it may be wrong, but I can’t find another info source).
So Possessed Thorned Hulk has 180000 life in solo game.
In /players8 game monsters has 4.5x more life IIRC.
So Possessed Thorned Hulk has 810000 life in /players8 mode.
So players8 Possessed Thorned Hulk regenerates 791 life per frame or 19775 life per second!!!

BTW normal players8 Thorned Hulk regenerates 1647 life per second.

This number looks unbelievable. Did I get something wrong?

[Nightfish]

OK. Any poison damage works like Prevent Monster Healing.

No, it doesn't. Prevent monster heal stops monsters from regenerating. Poison does damage to the monster, just like lightning, fire or physical.

[Igor Potapov]

OK. Any litle poison damage doesn’t stop regeneration forever, but it stops regeneration until the monster is poisoned.

[Nightfish]

I'm not sure you're getting this right. Or I don't understand what you're saying. Either way, poison doesn't stop regeneration any better than regular damage.

Take this one monster that regenerates 1647 life per second. How many 100 poison damage over 5 seconds charms do you need to offset just the regen? One charm does 25 damage per second, you need 1647 dps. That means you need 1647/25 = 65 of these charms.

Just for comparison, how many 1-39 lightning charms would do the trick? They are 20 damage per hit, assuming a moderate attack rate of 12 fpa you get about 2 hits per second. So you need 1647/40 = 41 charms.

[Igor Potapov]

It was tested by a user of AB forum. Any poison damage set monster regeneration to zero and then apply actual poison damage. See RTB’s post above.

I can post a link, but you know – AE will delete the link and ban me. ;)

EDIT: AE's name is edited.

[Nightfish]

Maybe it was that way in 1.09 but in 1.10 I can definetly see the green monsters regenerating.

[Quicksilver]

I can post a link, but you know – EA will delete the link and ban me. ;)

Electronic Arts moderate these forums now? What happened to AlterEgo? :lol: ;)

But yeah, from what I've gathered, poison only reduces regeneration now, it doesn't stop it (unless you have more poison than the regeneration rate).

[Randall]

See RTB’s post above.

Did you spot RTB's edit as well. It doesn't set to zero (in 1.10) anymore, but it subtracts itself from the regeneration rate.

Did the AB member tested it SP or Closed BNet. It's some time ago, but I think I have seen monster regenerate with PNova active.

Randall

[Igor Potapov]

Here is quote of The Amazon Basin thread “Does poison slow or stop monster regeneration?”:



In the new ladder season, does poison slow or stop monster regeneration? I believe at some point all you needed was the weakest poison and regen would completely stop. Does it just slow regen now? Let's say some monster was regenerating at 100 HP/s and you hit it with poison that did 20 Dmg/s. Would the monster now regen at 80 HP/s instead?




It would lose 20 HP/second, less if it has some resistance. Health regeneration is completely negated when a monster is poisoned, regardless of how strong the poison is.




AFAIK health regen is no longer stopped when a monster is poisoned. I believe this was a bug back in 1.09, not a feature, as it allowed any character to have a single source of poison and completely stop monster regen. If the poison is substantial enough to cause the monster to lose health then the monster's heal is effectively 'off'. The only abilities which stop regen are Prevent Monster Heal and Open Wounds (at least I THINK OW stop regen).




as far as i know poision stops regeneration AND does its damage per frame




I'm not 100% sure, but I am reasonably certain that in 1.09 Poison was bugged to ignore Monster regen, resulting in it having 0HP/s regen, giving it a negative health regen based on the strength/duration of the poison etc. I believe that it was fixed in 1.10, so that it was subtracted from their regeneration so that not every single source of poison would be guaranteed to halt monster regeneration and send it into the negative.




I can confirm that any little poison damage applied to a monster stops its regeneration.

Here is a proof for you.

I made a little test. Set players to 8 and sent my level 74 necro to nightmare. He does 14-19 poison damage over 3 sec (about 5/sec) and 2-17 physical damage.

Started fighting a Zombie (about 3000 hp with this setting) one on one.

First proof: my necro was able to kill the zombie (that should be enough, since with its 75% poison resist my necro should be doing about 10 physical and 1 poison damage per sec and its regeneration must be at least 30-40/sec - i think it's about 70).

Second proof: as soon as poison wore out, the monster started regenerating.

Just for the scepticals who would say I did enough physical damage. I tried that with mere fists, doing 1-3 physical and 2-7 poison damage (hit him down to half life before the test). I kept hitting it for 3 minutes, no apparent change in monster life (yes I had to keep drinking pots though). My 2 physical damage every 20-30th frame just would not be enough to negate the regeneration, nor the 0.3 poison damage per sec would balance it.


@AE: :P

[PyroStock]

:lol:
I knew this poison debate would come up again, I just did not expect it so soon.
:drink:

[DeathMaster]

I don't really have any solid test result. but from what I've seen, and what I have experience, I have few things to say.

a. did blizzard really fixed the poison bug, or it is half fixed? we all know what bliz said "fixed" but they really didn't in past.
b. I have seen a ghost boss that reg faster than my merc could damage it, the boss was unbreakable PI and the only damage could "hurt" him was the element damage from my merc and my necro's lvl1 teeth. I had tried quit few weapons on my merc, include all form of elemental damages (include poison), no matter what I did, the boss reg faster than I could damage him.
c. There was a story that a poison necor couldn't kill DC because DC reg life too fast, faster than his poison damage.
d. could someone do a test on hell ghost boss? since ghost boss is PI, and reg fast, it is perfect target.

[Igor Potapov]

As I already said, IMO the ultimate test target is Hell Possessed monsters in /players8 mode. They regenerate like crazy!

[Nightfish]

Just go and poison something with light poison damage. You'll see it regenerates. (Well, maybe hurt it a bit, too, so it actually needs to regen)

[RTB]

Did you spot RTB's edit as well. It doesn't set to zero (in 1.10) anymore, but it subtracts itself from the regeneration rate.

That's not how I edited it. :grrr:

[Igor Potapov]

I did my own tests. Quill Rat in Hell Act5 /players8 game regenerated 1/2 of life for 41 seconds. Level 80 Act5 Guest Quill Rat has 5046-6728 life in solo game. So it has 26493 (average) life in /players8 mode. Regen=(26493/2)/41=323 life/second.

DamageRegen of Act5 Quill Rat is 2. So it regenerate 26493*2/4096=13 life/frame=323.4 life/second if we use Ruvanal’s formula.

If I punch the rat with bare fist of my sorceress I do 9-77 damage without any poison damage as my screen says. Of cause I can’t stop rat’s life regeneration.
However if I add just “50 poison damage over 4 seconds” Foul Small Charm I stop rat’s regeneration completely forever if I keep it green.

Just test it yourself and post results here. I’m very curious on the results.

Just imagine – any poison damage charm stops even strong regeneration of Possessed! If I calculated it right - it is up to 20k life per second (see post #5).

[cft]

@ Nightfish

Poison definately DOES stop any and all monster regen in 1.10. If it's not, there's something odd going on. What monsters are you seeing regen when green -- and are you keeping them green all the time?

Could it be the old life bar bug, where Hell Hephesto's (and other high HP monsters) hps would go down to about 0% and then shoot up to a full bar, cause his hps "wrapped around" the bar's display? (I'm remembering this one from classic so it's probably been fixed for years)

I tested last week or so, in 1.10, vs ghoul lords in normal, Udar in normal, and Udar in NM, with only a 6 poison/3 sec charm. I was able to stop the regen of even a NM Udar.

I didn't test in Hell, cause I didn't have a character that I could afford to let Hell Udars beat on for 60+ seconds while testing.

Here's the thread with my testing:

http://80.75.65.68/showthread.php?t=257238

[BIGeyedBUG]

I have no doubt whatsoever that any amount of poison sets monster regen to zero for its duration in addition to causing regular damage. Not only has it been confirmed several times by the techies, but it's really, really obvious when dealing with monsters with sufficient regen.

[RTB]

This number looks unbelievable. Did I get something wrong?

Ya, you have to divide by 256 to get the life regen per frame. You forgot that life is kept multiplied by 256. Either that, or there's something I'm missing too.

Monsters with DamageRegen 2 should take about 45-50 seconds to regen fully.

[PyroStock]

The one time I saw poison not stopping regeneration was against a Hell Council Member boss (Durance L3 or Travical) on /players8. And no there wasn't anyone healing him. However, this could have been during the 1.10betas.

The tests I did against other monsters a few weeks ago all seemed to indicate poison was stopping regeneration.

[cft]

Hmm, there used to be a bug, where your merc could get poisoned and then chilled (or chilled and then poisoned, I forget) and somehow the merc would stay blue looking, even though he would move around at full speed...

Maybe there's a bug where a monster can look green even after the poison wears off?


OR -- RTB you said poison sets the monster regen to negative. What if you poison a monster that's already poisoned (with a "better poison" so that it will take). Does it multiply the negative regen by negative and come out positive?


(yes, it's my job to think of wierd possibilities like this: I debug code for a living...)

[factotum]

Applying a second batch of poison to a monster can only do two things:

a) If it's weaker than the existing poison, it does absolutely nothing. Nada. Zilch.

b) If it's the same strength or stronger (defined in terms of how much damage per second it does) it will "overwrite" the existing poison--e.g. the poison damage will be set to the new rate, and it will last for as long as the poison duration on the second poison batch.

Given this, I can't see any way the code could be written that would allow your scenario to happen!

[sledgez]

Hmm, there used to be a bug, where your merc could get poisoned and then chilled (or chilled and then poisoned, I forget) and somehow the merc would stay blue looking, even though he would move around at full speed...

My brother experienced that the other day... :scratch:

[Randall]

That's not how I edited it. :grrr:

Sorry if I said something wrong, I'm getting confused with this topic now.

I am curious at the outcome though. The people who test, did they make a melee attack with added poison damage or was pure skill based poison damage like Poison Nova used. When making physical hits you should factor in that any other stuff on your gear ((hidden) bonusses of some skills like CS on masteries) could get activated as well, like CB, PVM, OW.

Randall

[madmaxxam]

Hmm, there used to be a bug, where your merc could get poisoned and then chilled (or chilled and then poisoned, I forget) and somehow the merc would stay blue looking, even though he would move around at full speed...

Maybe there's a bug where a monster can look green even after the poison wears off?


Once had that happen to my merc. Turning green that is. I have a screen shot, but no host. The odd thing is, that he had died agaist Diablo, while still poisoned, and when I went to town to res him, he stayed green. When I talked to the healer, still green...

[Igor Potapov]

OK, RTB, I’ll repeat the calculations.

Recovery_per_frame = Max_life*DamageRegen/4096

Average life of Hell Act 5 Quill Rat in players8 mode is 26493. Max_life=256*26493.
Recovery_per_frame=256*26493*2/4096=3311 (integer part).
Hell Act 5 Quill Rat in players8 mode recovers 12 life per frame or 300 life per second. I have tested it.

Hell Act 5 Thorned Hulk in players8 mode regenerates around 1647 life per second.

Hell Act 5 Possessed Thorned Hulk in players8 mode regenerates around 19775 life per second!

To close the question we need to test poison damage with different poison sources.
- normal melee attack with additional poison elemental damage (tested by me in post #19);
- poison nova;
- venom (I guess it will be hard to test);
- ranged attack with additional poison elemental damage;
- Rabies;
- Plague javelin;
- All other.

May be different poison sources works differently?

[Randall]

May be different poison sources works differently?

Another thought: Could Closed BNet and SP work differently as well ?
(we have no idea what is all done with these serverside patches)

At least note with each test case if it's tested SP or Closed BNet.

Randall

[RTB]

The next time I see someone claiming another possible difference between Bnet and SP I'm gonna ask Frosty and Solo to do some very nasty things to that person's shins.

Igor Potapov: I'm still confused on how it can be that fast. But it's problably right.

[DeathMaster]

If anyone see my post in this thread, I have seen a ghost boss (hell) that reg life faster than I could damage him and poison wasn't stopping the reg.

I was thinking if someone can make a simple mod that make all hell monsters PI, I can test my barb, he can survive long enough, and punch monster (only use a small charm add 15 damage over 5 sec). If poison stops reg life, he would be able to "kill".

[Igor Potapov]

I sought your post.
Are you sure that your Baba really damage that PI ghost champion? If you damage him by half and than keep him green he still regenerates?

Any one, who knows anything about modding can make such mod for a minute. I can make it and sand it to you after I come back to home. (on PM to keep forum rules)

[DeathMaster]

I sought your post.
Are you sure that your Baba really damage that PI ghost champion? If you damage him by half and than keep him green he still regenerates?



I'm sure. if you read back, it was my HC necro (fishy), the battle was like my merc keeping jab, I stand back shoot teeth (lvl1). I changed merc weapon number of times, include +170ish lit/ +50ish fire, 15ish poison / ...

I remember the time my merc had that poison weapon, and the boss was green all (or almost all) the time, but he just reg life back faster then I could do any damage. He was unbreakable PI, that was why I had to "skip" him after many many try. I remember the battle because he was the only boss I had to park due to unbreakable PI.

My email: deathmaster@operamail.com

If you send the mod, make sure teach me how to use it, I'm noob on mod.

[madmaxxam]

Maybe I'll try some tests with my fishy. Throw some marrow walk boots on, summon some poison mages, trap a monster in hell, and then see if he can regenerate. With the bone prisons up, he can last indefinately.

[Igor Potapov]

It might be possessed ghost. All ghosts are PI and possessed monster can’t be cursed. You might damage him with the small elemental damage, however he might have elemental resistance and your crap damage just don’t heart him enough to see the damage in life bar.

I’ll send you the mod with instruction and some modded 400+ life small charms, that I use for testing, after 3-4 hours, when I’ll be at home. Barbs are much better objects for testing indeed since they have magic damage source and high life.

[jiansonz]

I have another explanation to what happened for DeathMaster.

In 1.10, Mana Burn gives a boss a form of life steal. The ghost type critters (Ghost, Wraith, Specter, Apparition and Dark Shape) have an inherent ability that reminds a lot of Mana Burn, if a bit weaker. I am quite positive I have seen them steal life, even under the effect of Prevent Monster Heal.

So I think the ghosts are a special case, not suitable for studies on poison and regeneration.

[cft]

jiansonz might have an explaination, but if so it would also have to apply to uber diablo on the realms, because of reports of his out-regenning a venomancer.

@randall. All of my tests were with a melee attack and a poison charm, not a pure skill poison attack like poison nova or poision explosion. So maybe there's a difference.

OR, since DM says his merc had the poison weapon. I've been told that Prevent Monster Heal does not work for mercs. Does poison not "work" for mercs, at least as far as preventing monster regen?

I'll try testing a merc with a poison weapon tonight. Any hints on finding some PI monsters, preferably easy ones (act 1 hell I guess) ?

[factotum]

I think your best bet would be Returned or Bone Warrior skeleton variants--both are Poison Immune in Hell.

[cft]

er thanks, I was thinking phys immunes tho, so my merc would not kill em.

I tested merc poison vs an act 1 hell monster -- the wraith/ghost type monsters from the Jail.

Test 1:
Merc was 87 Defiance merc with Kelpie Snare/eth Corpsemourn (34-74 fire dmg)/Tal rasha's HC. act 1 hell /players 1

mercs only non-physicial damage was the 34-74 fire dmg from his armor. He would hit the ghost, it would take off a thin line of hps from its bar, then hit it again and take off another. Then it would regen most of that. He was winning, very very very slowly. But it was obvious that the ghost was regen'ing as its hps would go UP at times.

Test 2:
87 definace merc with Kelpie snare/eth Corpsemourn (34-74 fire dmg)/Wormskull (79 poison/8 seconds) Act 1 hell /players 1

Same monster. I went to town and let it get back to full while I was changing merc's helmet.

This time merc hit the ghost, it turned green. Each hit it would loose a thin line of hps from its bar, like before. But it's hps did not go up. He was winning a lot quicker this time. No noticable regenerion on the ghost at all.


So it doesn't seem to be a problem with merc's using poison vs a monster.

I assume that poison doesn't help against poison-immine monsters' regen. But I also assume Nightfish and others who have noticed a monster regenning while it was poisoned are not talking about poison-immunes.

*edit* Also I just popped over to act II halls of the dead. Both the skeletons and the zombies in there are poison immunes. Neither one ever turned green when the merc hit them. Since Nightfish and the other reports were that the monster was outregenning them even while it was green, it could not have been a poison immune monster, since they don't turn green. (possible exception: champion monsters have fancy colors -- maybe it was already green?)

I don't have a venomancer to test pure-poison skill attacks with. So far all my tests have stopped the monster's regen... :scratch:

[Igor Potapov]

Thanks, cft. I hope our efforts will eventually bring clear answer to the question.

All our tests still show, that addition melee elemental poison damage stops monster regeneration. However I acknowledge the possibility of the regeneration of poisoned monsters.

It would be better if people, that have seen the regeneration of poisoned monster, posted here how we can repeat this situation and test it.

I guess one of the possibilities is Poison Nova. May be I’ll test it later today. I have level 91 bone necro. I could give him a wand with level 1 Poison Nova and test it. It will be after 7-8 hours though. I’m at work ATM. :(

[RTB]

In 1.10, Mana Burn gives a boss a form of life steal. The ghost type critters (Ghost, Wraith, Specter, Apparition and Dark Shape) have an inherent ability that reminds a lot of Mana Burn, if a bit weaker. I am quite positive I have seen them steal life, even under the effect of Prevent Monster Heal.

Similiar, but still different. The amount of mana Mana burn Bosses steal depends on the physical dmg they normally do, while the mana burn from Wraiths is fixed.

It could be that the whole mana damage routine is bugged, allowing for life gain for Wraiths and Mana Burn uniques/minions.

[jiansonz]

It could be that the whole mana damage routine is bugged, allowing for life gain for Wraiths and Mana Burn uniques/minions.

I view the life stealing as a "new feature" in 1.10.

[DeathMaster]

It might be possessed ghost. All ghosts are PI and possessed monster can’t be cursed. You might damage him with the small elemental damage, however he might have elemental resistance and your crap damage just don’t heart him enough to see the damage in life bar.

Thanks for that mod, I will try it tommorrow (can't play today at least).

Just clear something, I did see the ghost boss health bar drop by very very slim amount if I could keep firing teeth (I guess the total damage > life reg), but as long as I stopped firing teech, his life bar reg back.

Not sure what happened, but the life stealing sounds reasonable if poison really stops reg. But does monster life steal work on merc?

Edit: the boss was cursable, I use decrep on him to slow his attack speed.

[Igor Potapov]

I view the life stealing as a "new feature" in 1.10.

IIRC Vampires have been always stealing life since DII Classic 1.00 was realized. They even have the same “red splash” with character’s life leaching animation. This attack is called Life Steal Missile.
Wraiths don’t have such ability, only “Drain Mana”. I doubt they can steal life, but I don’t know it exactly of cause.

[Igor Potapov]

I tested poison damage of Poison Nova.

Enslaved in players8 Hell takes 20 Bone Spirits to kill. My level 24 bone spirit does around 1400 damage. That means that Enslaved has 28000 life. My clock showed me that he regenerate his life for 80 seconds. That means that he regenerate 350 life per second.
My level 6 Poison Nova does 106-140 poison damage over 2 seconds.
I damaged Enslaved to half life and then kept him green for two minutes. He didn’t regenerate any life. I even damaged him a bit! I guess my ~50 poison damage per second did him ~6000 damage, because he was poisoned for 120 seconds! Damn, I’m starting to love Venomancers. :)

Poison Nova has 4 seconds NextDeley value (0.16 seconds). It really interrupts Nova casting and poison keeping. I guess it is the problem of Venomancers alone with desynchronization in online playing. This is the reasons of “poison don’t stop regeneration” reports IMO.

[cft]

@Igor - Can you explain that "next delay" stuff a bit more? I'm not sure I understand you on that...

[Baboon]

Could it be the old life bar bug, where Hell Hephesto's (and other high HP monsters) hps would go down to about 0% and then shoot up to a full bar, cause his hps "wrapped around" the bar's display? (I'm remembering this one from classic so it's probably been fixed for years)

Wow, thanks, I never understood that one, the first time I killed NM Diablo with friends I thought that you needed to kill him twice (and then Hell Diablo three times).

[BIGeyedBUG]

Poison Nova has 4 [frame] NextDeley value (0.16 seconds). It really interrupts Nova casting and poison keeping. I guess it is the problem of Venomancers alone with desynchronization in online playing. This is the reasons of “poison don’t stop regeneration” reports IMO.

That makes a lot of sense, at least regarding Poison Nova and Teeth. Good thinking. :thumbsup:

For those who don't know about NextDelay, it's essentially a timer on certain missles to prevent them from damaging the same target more than once (usually). Each missle on the NextDelay list has a value in frames--25ths of a second. When a missle on the list collides with a target, it prevents any other missle on that list from affecting the same target until that many frames have passed.

Teeth and PNova both have NextDelays of 4 frames. If you're attacking a monster with teeth and then hit it with a PNova before 4 frames have passed, the Nova will have no effect on it whatsoever--no damage, no PMH, no nothing.

Those are the only two Necro skils with ND values, but in multiplayer it's even worse. All kinds of odd skills have ND values, including odd ones you wouldn't expect like War Cry and Strafe. So if you're a PNova Necro teamed with a Strafeazon, the same thing can happen.

[PyroStock]

but in multiplayer it's even worse. All kinds of odd skills have ND values, including odd ones you wouldn't expect

Is there a list somewhere of all the skills with NextDelay & their NextDelay time?

[BIGeyedBUG]

Messy, and in mpq speak, but this will give you an idea.

Missile NextDelay:

diablight 3
coldunique 3
nova 4
chainlightning 4
teeth 4
poisonnova 4
frostnova 4
diabfire 4
nova1 4
nova2 4
multipleshotarrow 4
multipleshotbolt 4
battlecry 4
lightningstrike 4
fistoftheheavensbolt 4
battlecommand 4
battleorders 4
chainlightning2 4
dragonbreath missile 4
shockwave 4
wake of destruction maker 4
wake of destruction 4
lightning charge up nova 4
chainlightningcharge up 4
baal inferno 4
baal nova 4
clawsofthunderbolt 4
clawsofthundernova 4
royalstrikechainlightning 4
royalstrikechaosice 4
baal cold maker 4
baal cold trail 4
lightningtowernova 4
viper_firecloud 4
trapnova 4
mephfrostnova 4
strafearrow 4
strafebolt 4
erruption crack 1 5
erruption crack 2 5
volcano small fire 5
warcry 6
grimwardscare 6
volcano 10
death mauler 10
baal taunt lightning 10
baal taunt lightning trail 10
shock field on ground 25
blade creeper 25
twister 25
tornado 25

[NSXdreamer]

A thought, mod a charm with 1 poison damage over maximum allowable time (10 sec?). Put on a char with no other source of damage, beat a monster to near death, and use fist punch to apply the poison, see if the health regenerates.

[cft]

@bigeyedbug

hmm tornado and twister both have 25 delay on your list; does that mean 25 frames (1sec)? And does that mean that a wind druid can only hit a monster with 1 tornado per second? Like assuming a windy had lots of fast cast and could cast a tornado in 1/5 of a second, casting 5 per second... would the first one hit and the other 4 miss?


For the poison issue, what you and Igor are suggesting is that the next delay stopped the poison from actually landing, according to the server, but the client was slightly desynced so the player sees the monster as green? (if thats not it, then I'm just lost...)

[Igor Potapov]

If a monster is hit by Tornado he is just immune to it for 25 frames. This is the reason why you cannot hit a monster with all arrows from miltishot too. Only one arrow hits because of NexDeley. :( In Hellfire there was a crossbow, that did multishot. That was “teh 1337” weapon for Rogue, because every arrow was hitting. In Diablo II 1.00 Blizzard “fixed” it.

When I did the Poison Nova test I kept casting it rather frequently. However Enslaved monster sometimes became un-poisoned. Poison Nova has 2 seconds duration. Enslaved has only 15% poison resistance. I just don’t know any other reason, that can interrupt monster poisoning other than NextDelay. Does poison length reduce in Hell? IIRC – no. But I never played a poison based character and may be wrong.

[BIGeyedBUG]

hmm tornado and twister both have 25 delay on your list; does that mean 25 frames (1sec)? And does that mean that a wind druid can only hit a monster with 1 tornado per second? Like assuming a windy had lots of fast cast and could cast a tornado in 1/5 of a second, casting 5 per second... would the first one hit and the other 4 miss?

Yes to all the above. And during that second, nobody coud affect the target with anything else on that list either.


For the poison issue, what you and Igor are suggesting is that the next delay stopped the poison from actually landing, according to the server, but the client was slightly desynced so the player sees the monster as green? (if thats not it, then I'm just lost...)

Honestly, what I was thinking was that people have bad memories about details like whether a monster was green at the exact moment they saw regen or not. As far as desync goes, I know it exists in SP, but whether it is likely to act like your suggesting or not I don't know enough to say. What I can say is possible is some sort of desync between the action and the monster's life bar. I think most of us have seen that happen at one time or another.

[DeathMaster]

Here is my latest test result.

using the all PI mod (P8), I first killed off my merc outside hell A1. Leave no other element damages other than a SC add 14 poison damage over 2 sec.

First use zerk damage a normal rat and his boss to half life. then switch to bash.

take off the SC, my barb does nothing to them, and clearly they reg life fast. with the SC, their life bar freeze (my poison damage too small to deal any real damage) as long as they stay green.

The result lead to poison does stop reg life.

Now if someone could test DC, see if poison stops his life reg.