View Full Version : lvl 49 zerker Barb Wins~~~Check it out
Hi gents. I make a level 49 zerker barb and won my first duel.
I dueled a level 77 Sorceress using fireball. I simply teleport-berserked her once and she died. It was pretty sweet.
Heres two pictures:
http://img88.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img88&image=Screenshot121.jpg
http://img88.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img88&image=Screenshot122.jpg
Nice sip you gotta show me your gear when i get on in.....3...2...1...:)
ZounceHC
02-09-2004, 04:59
Nice kill sip. Would you mind listing your Life/Damage (with might too) and the gear you didn't mention in your other post?
ok...lets see. I am using:
Arreats face with ias/AR jewel
Jewelers gothic plate of 75 life with with 62 max damage and 15% cold resist
"Passion" runeworded highland blade. about 280 1 handed :/
Lance guard "eld" runed
magic amulet with teleport charges
Ik gloves+belt
Gore riders
19+20 ravenfrosts
+3 cry weps, +3 cry amulet, Silks of the victor on merc/switch.
A good number of max damage charms
Merc uses: ethereal pierre tombale partizan.
I got about 2k life (Still room for charms) and my damage is 4.1k without might and 4.6k with might. That means my max pvp damage with might is just over 1.5k. zerk speed is 10 fpa.
ZounceHC
02-09-2004, 05:12
Nice Set up. I hope you hide your tele ammy from the scanners. Nothing beats the element of surprise especially when it's followed by a 4k Zerk!!
Do those damage figures include DS or not?
I'm debating whether to be lame and use my BO barb to BO myself or just use his gear on my own barb, and invest those extra ~23 points into BO and avoid the hassle/cheese factor of using a seperate BO barb... thoughts?
And yeah, nice kill.
-Matt
ZounceHC
02-09-2004, 05:27
Once you hit 2k life i'd put the rest into zerk synergies. Seems like a good combo of Dmg/Life.
Those figures must be before DS if his max PvP is over 1.5K.
shertown
02-09-2004, 06:23
thats a bit low on life, my 48 barb had 3.9k and he needed it.
ZounceHC
02-09-2004, 06:30
My 83 pvp Barb had 4k Life and I did fine. Damage takes priority over life in some situations.
To be honest i'd occasionally get bo from a friend and have about 6k life but i'd still duel with my own Bo.
shertown
02-09-2004, 06:34
I had level 40 bo and 5.1 ww damage so it worked out fine for mld-hld.
ZounceHC
02-09-2004, 06:44
Yeah my Barb didn't even have WW. Stopped using it when chicken became popular in .09. I made a titan lvl 98 08 Valor barb which was sooo much fun. Then last season I made a synergised Zerker doing about 3-3.5 PvP damage which wasn't as fun due to lack of duels/chicken hack. I mean using chicken is one thing but when they set it at 95% of their hp it's just pathetic.
Vizjerei
02-09-2004, 09:17
sweet kill.. did the sorc even hit you??
btw. could you post full stats of your amu?
Mephistho
02-09-2004, 10:55
so what is that (L1) saying behind the ear's name huh?? CHEATS !!
so what is that (L1) saying behind the ear's name huh?? CHEATS !!
Yeah next time you might want to disable MH for the screenshots.
Relativity
02-09-2004, 11:34
I represent the Players Against Cruelty to Mercenaries (PACM) association. We demand that you treat Kasim better! Any non-compliance with this demand will be met by the revoking of your Player Killers Association (PKA) membership.
You have been warned!
stevethatsmyname
02-09-2004, 13:26
thats a bit low on life, my 48 barb had 3.9k and he needed it.
2-hand barbs generally need more life though.
Yeah next time you might want to disable MH for the screenshots.
The subject has been beaten to death over and over, he uses it its no secret so let it go already
Mephistho
02-09-2004, 15:42
The subject has been beaten to death over and over, he uses it its no secret so let it go already
He cheats.. so why are people congratulating him on his kill? just because he got 750+ posts?
It has been beaten to death over and over, because people don't seem to understand some people are not waiting for a cheater to come over and brag about his kills...
He cheats.. so why are people congratulating him on his kill? just because he got 750+ posts?
It has been beaten to death over and over, because people don't seem to understand some people are not waiting for a cheater to come over and brag about his kills...
Yes he cheats, yes that sucks, yes we all know. we cant do anything about it neither can you, so why on earth bring it up?
people congratulates him because its still a nice kill.
Mephistho
02-09-2004, 16:26
we cant do anything about it
of course we can.. as a start we could stop tolerating it. people like you only make it worse..
of course we can.. as a start we could stop tolerating it. people like you only make it worse..
We have no choice but tolerate it. The forums rules doesnt say anything about cheaters should be banned. And dont think I tolerate it, I have just been here long enough that I know we cant do anything about it.
And if you look through the rules of the forums, I am 100% sure that trolling isnt allowed and that is pretty much what you are doing by posting useless crap.
Honestly people, stop *****ing about it. There are much worse things to worry about.
Mephistho
02-09-2004, 17:54
We have no choice but tolerate it....And dont think I tolerate it...I have just been here long enough that I know we cant do anything about it.
You have no choice but to tolerate it but you do not tolerate it? way to go...
And you are basically saying "We can't do anything about it so why would we care"
You start tolerating as soon as you stop caring about it happening, and there are many others with you... all saying "owww I dont tolerate it, but I don't care that it happens!"
You have no choice but to tolerate it but you do not tolerate it? way to go...
And you are basically saying "We can't do anything about it so why would we care"
You start tolerating as soon as you stop caring about it happening, and there are many others with you... all saying "owww I dont tolerate it, but I don't care that it happens!"
agree my first sentence is kinda miss-showing.
point being that from the forum rules there is nothing we can do about it so we have no choice but to tolerate it as we cant flame or post crap like you do, if we had a strickter mod you would be banned.....
But i dont like cheats.
and no i am not saying "We can't do anything about it so why would we care"
what i am saying is we cant do anything about it, so we cant do anything about it, get it?
LuckyDwarf
02-09-2004, 18:33
The forum is tolerating it.. that's why they aren't blowing up every time they see one of Sip's screenshots. They commend him on his battle skills, not his morals. Frankly, I enjoy reading all of his PvP endeavors and I could give a crap that he uses maphack, he's still on my friends list. I don't care if people cheat as long as they are good people who are fun to play with and Sip fits that category.
Please look up tolerance in the dictionary. Or, since you're on your computer, try this url: Tolerate (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=8&q=tolerate). You're the one who isn't tolerating it... probably because you don't believe it should, and you're right. Hacks should not be used, but they will be regardless of what you say, so you might as suck it up and move on.
Now that I have that out of my system. . . great kill Pis! My first PvP project is going to be a 29 Werebear to break the ice a little. I am hesitant about jumping right into an expensive character, so I'm going to fool around a little bit. I should be on in the next couple of days, if not tonight. By the way, do you have any 15 maxs or sharp charms left over I could trade for? If not I'll just search the channels. I mean, I have 13 and 14 max jewels with resists for secks, but I want this character to rock. Werebear are teh ubar.
Edit: Maddox Moment. This is for you Mephy (http://www.westburypharmacy.com/Merchant2/mivagraphics/bergen/243345.jpg).
Lucky
Mephistho
02-09-2004, 19:29
agree my first sentence is kinda miss-showing.
point being that from the forum rules there is nothing we can do about it so we have no choice but to tolerate it as we cant flame or post crap like you do, if we had a strickter mod you would be banned.....
But i dont like cheats.
I doubt any mod would ban me for calling someone a cheater while it's proven he does cheat...
Have you even used the report button against me ?? ...
I doubt any mod would ban me for calling someone a cheater while it's proven he does cheat...
Have you even used the report button against me ?? ...
off course i havent used the report button, since i agree with your stand point, but with your comments you have 100% ruined Sip thread, a thread that had nothing to do with cheating. and sip had his right to create the thread as you can see alot of people like his stories. me included, even though i lost alot of respect for him when i learned he used mh. but that doest have anything to do with this thread...
Vizjerei
02-09-2004, 19:43
Damn.. All the "cheating" post's ruined this topic :/ could a MOD please delete all of them??
The Real Siggik
02-09-2004, 20:05
hehe, nice 1 sip, ... now if i could find some stuff with my sorc to start my own barb that would be great ;)
Damn.. All the "cheating" post's ruined this topic :/ could a MOD please delete all of them??
I think he is preparing for another hurricane right now. We might have to take matters into our own hands , just hit "ignore user" and all the cheater posts disapear
The Real Siggik
02-09-2004, 21:27
i think i was meaning all the ppl who were saying he cheats
i think i was meaning all the ppl who were saying he cheats
Well for me all the posts were made by one user , the rest were telling him to knock it off.
I think he (Mephisto) might be a spy from the Druid forum trying to start another spam fest like the last Sip thread. Maybe we can all pitch in and get Cy a generator so she can post whilst the hurricane unleashes havoc on her
BTW Cy my wife made a bunch of cookies for me to send off your way should i address them to the plywood shack on the left or right of the street? Good luck Cy and stay safe
All this aching about cheating in a freakin' video game makes me wonder if some people take their video games too seriously. First, there's single player where you won't encounter any hackers. Second, maybe you should concern yourself with more important issues...like your real life. Yea, TPPK'ers and botters make me wanna quit, but really all I want is some entertainment from a game. I'm not claiming that people who whine about cheaters don't have lives, but just that maybe they could focus their anger and use it to do something more productive in real life?!
Yea, getting tppk'd sucks, I can sympathize because I was only a few weeks ago. Yes, it sure sucks when you realize that those botters will always have better items than you. Yea, hacks are rampant in most multiplayer games...live with it.
Mephistho
03-09-2004, 11:14
All this aching about cheating in a freakin' video game makes me wonder if some people take their video games too seriously. First, there's single player where you won't encounter any hackers. Second, maybe you should concern yourself with more important issues...like your real life. Yea, TPPK'ers and botters make me wanna quit, but really all I want is some entertainment from a game. I'm not claiming that people who whine about cheaters don't have lives, but just that maybe they could focus their anger and use it to do something more productive in real life?!
Maybe you should realize that cheating is a real life problem. Cheating isn't part of a video game, it's part of (real life) society.
Yeah, the other day i was walking down this busy sidewalk. And all the sudden outta nowhere this guy whips out a bow and starts shooting arrows everywhere. I was like, wtf mate? Then all the sudden he disappears outta nowhere, i hear this gong sound and some chick drops to the ground.
She's all like "nub, that life took me 32 years to make"
And he says "you have been owned by BMPK, ..|.."
hc_ugajeremy
03-09-2004, 16:13
Yeah, the other day i was walking down this busy sidewalk. And all the sudden outta nowhere this guy whips out a bow and starts shooting arrows everywhere. I was like, wtf mate? Then all the sudden he disappears outta nowhere, i hear this gong sound and some chick drops to the ground.
She's all like "nub, that life took me 32 years to make"
And he says "you have been owned by BMPK, ..|.."
She should have seen it coming.. all she had to do was scan his clothes.
Yeah but i think he had the bow on weapon switch. He was holding a cell phone, then all the sudden a bow appeared out of thin air.
Maybe you should realize that cheating is a real life problem. Cheating isn't part of a video game, it's part of (real life) society.
Yes it is a real life problem...but video games aren't real.
LuckyDwarf
03-09-2004, 23:31
Yes it is a real life problem...but video games aren't real.
People playing them are real, however. Decisions made that affect others, even though they are through a game, can still cause real life problems.
Lucky
She should have seen it coming.. all she had to do was scan his clothes.
LOL
I'm tired but what the heck :D
laughingtiger
04-09-2004, 01:22
Maybe you should realize that cheating is a real life problem. Cheating isn't part of a video game, it's part of (real life) society.
Mephistho, I understand where you're coming from as well as your frustrations. However, what one chooses to do does not necessarily and solely define one's personality. Sip has shared knowledge and added to the wealth of information that can be found in these forums. He's also shown himself to be a respectable and intelligent member of these forums and as such is a valued member of these forums.
As has been said before, this is one horse that has been beat to death. It caused one of the longest running flamewars and thread hijacks known to man. :innocent:
Please let it go. Live and let live. Keep an open mind and balance your judgements with an open heart, if judge you must.
Here, have a cookie... *hands cookie to meph*
Regards :drink:
rpgforumsnet
04-09-2004, 01:51
Yeah but i think he had the bow on weapon switch. He was holding a cell phone, then all the sudden a bow appeared out of thin air.
:lol: man you really have to check yourself up.
If only I could find a dozen hot chicks with zon / sin outfits walking around my house I can stand the heat of tppk threats :drool:
you people call the few sip threads a flame war and thread hijack longest ever remembered? Its good that my memory serves me better than yours. This aint NOTHING compared to the old PK debates, and this flamewar is small and insignificant. Its a tad boring. aye, but thats about it.
Sip, well, he uses MH so I wont congratulate him on the kill. I'd love to see him banned from the forum, and I dunno if he has any trade threads up but I'll discuss it with the trade mods if he does. Its not that I dislike Sip, far from it, but he cheats. cheating=dumbass. get it? But since Sip most likely will not get banned I see no point in flaming him. Its a waste of my time.
too late, you already called him a dumbass in the same thread you weren't gonna flame him ;p
NEURO_CKY
04-09-2004, 06:48
Yeah, the other day i was walking down this busy sidewalk. And all the sudden outta nowhere this guy whips out a bow and starts shooting arrows everywhere. I was like, wtf mate? Then all the sudden he disappears outta nowhere, i hear this gong sound and some chick drops to the ground.
She's all like "nub, that life took me 32 years to make"
And he says "you have been owned by BMPK, ..|.."
this is by far the funniest and most creative post i have seen all day.....truly is hillarious in so many ways...thx for making work less repititive cougar......and ur stock is definately rising my friend!!!!! cheers :drink:
laughingtiger
04-09-2004, 11:28
you people call the few sip threads a flame war and thread hijack longest ever remembered? Its good that my memory serves me better than yours. This aint NOTHING compared to the old PK debates, and this flamewar is small and insignificant. Its a tad boring. aye, but thats about it.
Sip, well, he uses MH so I wont congratulate him on the kill. I'd love to see him banned from the forum, and I dunno if he has any trade threads up but I'll discuss it with the trade mods if he does. Its not that I dislike Sip, far from it, but he cheats. cheating=dumbass. get it? But since Sip most likely will not get banned I see no point in flaming him. Its a waste of my time.
Hi Barry, here.... have a cookie... *hands polar bear a seal chip cookie* and then have another.... It was meant as more of a jest... notice I said "known to man" and the little "innocent" smiley beside it. I remember those PK debates quite well.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I don't dispute nor approve of Sip's use of MH but, he's his own person and hopefully he'll get the message eventually.
Warm regards,
Tig :drink:
xxsteelxx
06-09-2004, 22:25
wow...u guys all seem so damn perfect.
NightShade
06-09-2004, 23:07
Silence! The lot of you...
Don't make me go next door and get GreyGuardian to post....No sir-ee-jim.
get him. at least he had some form of style.
sip, you cheat. no respect.
Blah blah you are holier than me.
The Barb is Dead, i quit for now.
oooooo no respect, im sure he's devastated.
Mephistho
07-09-2004, 00:23
wow...u guys all seem so damn perfect.
legit people don't claim to be perfect. Imperfect people can play without cheats too. It's only the sad ones who have to cheat.
Mephistho
07-09-2004, 00:32
oooooo no respect, im sure he's devastated.
I'd be devastated too when a friend is trying to defend me like this :surprise:
Blah blah you are holier than me.
The Barb is Dead, i quit for now.
no im not. but i dont cheat, so my kills are legit. by MY standards your kills are pointless. I'm not imposing my standards on you, I am telling you my opinion, as is my right. I'm not saying my opinion is the one and only. And my name aint St Barry either.
@ cougar
whatever. I dont care.
legit people don't claim to be perfect. Imperfect people can play without cheats too. It's only the sad ones who have to cheat.
Thank you :D
Sip, how did he die? Looted?
cyradis2003
07-09-2004, 07:38
BTW Cy my wife made a bunch of cookies for me to send off your way should i address them to the plywood shack on the left or right of the street? Good luck Cy and stay safe
*huggles wife of Stimm*
*looks for her cookies*
Made it through with all but my sanity intact ... But can't really complain about that as I went into the hurricane about half off my rocker to start with. :surprise:
I think when Ivan hits (and according to early predictions it is gonna hit) the last little scrap of coherant thought process will be blown away and then I will be the perfect airhead! :lady:
All hail me and my vacous bubblebrain!!! :clap:
Im not accusing Sip of being a chicken hacker and I Havent conducted a poll to see if this number is right, Im just going on personnal experience in making this statement.
95%+ of the MH population uses chicken also.
67% of statistics are made up on the spot
67% of statistics are made up on the spot
Please everyone knows it's 72% :cheesy:
only 55% of people know that
rpgforumsnet
07-09-2004, 21:15
omg lmao troll troll!
I'm sure that the 45% of people who don't know that assume 95%+ of the MH population use chicken
cyradis2003
08-09-2004, 07:12
omg lmao troll troll!
I'm sure that the 45% of people who don't know that assume 95%+ of the MH population use chicken
No, only about 75% of the 45% think that it is 95%. The other 25% of the 45% think it is 96.4%. :jig:
No, only about 75% of the 45% think that it is 95%. The other 25% of the 45% think it is 96.4%. :jig:
ow ow ow my brain ow mental cramp ow
I fail to see what these congratulatory kill threads are about.
He's able to kill high level people with a mid-level character because he spent time equipping that character with gear generally 10 times better than even the people he's killing, not even to mention cheating (maphack).
This is not a anti-maphack post, frankly I couldn't care less. Last time I played D2 I used MH and if I played again i'd use it again. But the fact remains he's still using it while he kills people then comes on here and makes post looking for praise like he accomplished something.
They commend him on his battle skills, not his morals.
This post actually made me laugh out loud when I read it. Can you explain to me exactly what sort of battle skills it takes to right-click teleport next to a character higher than you and 1-hit kill them? You win "duels" because of your gear, nothing else. So basically you want a cookie and a pat on the back because you spent a lot of time and MF running to equip your pvp char with the ultimate set of gear.
Tell you what, go equip a 49 barb in store-bought gear and go kill a 77 sorc, then you'll have proven a degree of "skill".
Obviously written by someone who has never tried any sort of PvP ever. Level 77 sorceress can use about any item she wants to in the game. Has more life then someone 28 levels lower and has more skills and damage of someone 28 levels lower. For a level 49 to kill a cahrqacter that high is quite an accomplishment minus the mh part.
PvP takes a ton of skill to do and be succesful at it , takes forever to accumulate the gear to build (minus Baranor :thumbsup: ) and is even harder to find a target with the prevalance of chicken on hostile users. Try it and you ll sing a differant tune i guarantee
edit: If you see his gear it is far from godly. Silks of the victor , Arreates , IK belt gloves , goreriders, probably raven frost or 2 and a rare teleport amulet or +2 warcries.
Obviously written by someone who knows nothing about me and therefore shouldn't judge me.
I was PvPing in D2 back before you ever even bought this game more than likely. Sure I had my pvp stage, in 1.03 and 1.04. It was midly fun until I realized that this game was never balanced for PvP and you are as strong as your gear is, nothing else.
Sure you equip your amulet of teleport and right-click next to sorc, 1hit and she dies, i'm sure that required a whole host of skills i'll never have.
7 patches and nothing has changed. Boy do i feel schooled now. The game isnt even the same as it was 3 months ago much less 7 patches ago , go back to your hole
You obviously never played the game as it was when it came out or probably even pre-xpac. It's the same ****ing game, at the ground-level nothing has changed. PvP builds are different and the gear used for them is different, but it's still the same pvp.
I wouldn't expect you to understand this, but try going and playing a game where pvp is actually based on how well you understand the game, react, and perform under pressure, not how long you farmed to get your gear. Then maybe you'll understand.
If anything, xpac characters are now more gear dependent than classic chars were 4 years ago.
take a player who never duelled in his playing time and put him up against a known dueller, give them the same exact gear, and see who win.
my bet is that the known dueller will win. due to what?? his "skillz" as a dueller, no matter how you define skill, it still has something to do with the duel. fast clicking and reading a sorcs teleport pattern is a SKILL. you have to practice to master it. get it?
my guess when i read your first post was the exact same as stimm, and it still is, unless you just define skill as something specific which i dont agree with.
you diss stimm for making a wrong assumtion on you, and the you go ahead and make a completely reasonless one about him, he based his on something, you just based it on your bighead who think he knows everything.
This however is an incorrect statement.
Has more life then someone 28 levels lower
A well equipped 49 barb with BO will have much more life than a well equiped 77 Sorc w/o BO.
cyradis2003
08-09-2004, 20:21
Blah Blah Blah ... Rant Rant Rant ...
Can't we all just get along? You people have finally driven me to it ... I warned you in previous threads but did anyone listen????
Nooooooo!!!!
So here it is!!!! Your punishment for all this pointless bickering ....
*sings Kumbaya*
kum ba yah, my lord, kum ba yah
kum ba yah, my lord, kum ba yah
kum ba yah, my lord, kum ba yah
oh lord kum ba yah
hear me crying, lord, kum ba yah
hear me crying, lord, kum ba yah
hear me crying, lord, kum ba yah
oh lord kum ba yah
hear me singing, lord, kum ba yah
hear me singing, lord, kum ba yah
hear me singing, lord, kum ba yah
oh lord kum ba yah
hear me praying, lord, kum ba yah
hear me praying, lord, kum ba yah
hear me praying, lord, kum ba yah
oh lord kum ba yah
oh i need you, lord, kum ba yah
oh i need you, lord, kum ba yah
oh i need you, lord, kum ba yah
oh lord kum ba yah
Now, NEVER MAKE ME DO THIS AGAIN!!!!
skunkbelly
08-09-2004, 20:34
Cy, can we make smores? Can we? Please? I think the fire is hot enough. Pleeeeeease, can we?
Please?
You obviously never played the game as it was when it came out or probably even pre-xpac. It's the same ****ing game, at the ground-level nothing has changed. PvP builds are different and the gear used for them is different, but it's still the same pvp.
I wouldn't expect you to understand this, but try going and playing a game where pvp is actually based on how well you understand the game, react, and perform under pressure, not how long you farmed to get your gear. Then maybe you'll understand.
yeah youre obviously superior to all of us. judging from your posts you never achieved a good insight in dii PvP. so, before you embarrass yourself any further, I suggest you leave.
ZounceHC
09-09-2004, 01:48
He's able to kill high level people with a mid-level character because he spent time equipping that character with gear generally 10 times better than even the people he's killing, not even to mention cheating (maphack).
This post actually made me laugh out loud when I read it. Can you explain to me exactly what sort of battle skills it takes to right-click teleport next to a character higher than you and 1-hit kill them? You win "duels" because of your gear, nothing else. So basically you want a cookie and a pat on the back because you spent a lot of time and MF running to equip your pvp char with the ultimate set of gear.
Tell you what, go equip a 49 barb in store-bought gear and go kill a 77 sorc, then you'll have proven a degree of "skill".
Do you think that the sorc just sat there and let him tele on top of her?? I'm not sure if you realise but it actually does take skill to zerk a sorc with 63 fcr who is teleing like a mad man. I'm not sure if you've done much dueling recently but sorcs duel VERY defensively. Their number one goal is to not get hit. Landing a fireball comes secondary to this. If you think that it takes no skill to tele/zerk a high level sork then you obviously haven't learnt much in your many years playing the game. How sad. I've met people that have been playing the game for less than a year that have more insight than you.
Ultimate gear? Far from it. Maybe if he had a 4001h damage weapon with 40ias, a 120/60ias armor with life, a 90/45ias Atod, 10 war cry gcs and 10 10max gcs with life you may have a point but he doesn't. He had standard gear for a 48 barb dueler with the only hard thing to get being the 4socket eth highland blade. I know for a fact that sip doesn't back down from a duel if he thinks his opponent has better gear. Anyway we know that having good gear plays an important role in a good character but saying that it's 100% dependent on gear makes you look stupid.
Obviously written by someone who knows nothing about me and therefore shouldn't judge me.
How can you say we know nothing about you? Anyone with half a brain knows that hc dueling requires skill and puts you under pressure which you seem to disagree with. Posting something that goes against common belief is plenty reason to judge you, and i'm sorry but from your post it seems as though you've had your a55 handed to you my people with better gear and have a grudge against them. It also seems that you don't know squat about dueling.
Obviously written by someone who has never tried any sort of PvP ever.
This is exactly what I was thinking when I read your post.
Go away pls Troll. Or get whatevers stuck up you removed.
hes saying a dueler killing non dueler or untwink characters doesn't take skill and doesn't mean anything while you use cheat to achive it.
a non dueler build sor around level 70 is not going to kill a 40-50 barb with his dueling gear like 2x raven frost or 2x dwarf star tgods etc
imo it doesnt' take skill to kill a sor if the barb tele berzerk after all the sor cant' even scrath you if she is not build to duel. its all about knowdge and fast mouse clicking. good gear and fast connection is 100x better than your so call skills
how many people can say a well build level 9 pker sacadin pking in sewers take skills? i have one and i kill dozens from level 9-24 and i dare to say it doesnt' take any skill just go click or smite them til you get that amfply off
ZounceHC
09-09-2004, 03:01
its all about knowdge and fast mouse clicking
Are these not skills? There's a big difference between a duel and pking. Pking does actually take skills though.
Not including chicken, which sip doesn't use, how does maphack help you achieve a kill?
Actually i've killed mid level duel barbs with my non-duel fireball sorc before. A knowledgeable player using an average PvMer can actually kill duelers.
Also, a lvl 77 sorc can use most gears in the game. Believe it or not some pvm chars actually do good damage. Characters may not be built to duel but they can still do well in pvp.
edit: Looking at Sips gear how much resist does he have? 30 from arreats and he doesn't use dwarf star? Saying that a sorc can't even scratch him isn't quite accurate.
so your saying clicking the mouse faster= skills? shift click = skills?
i maybe a bit vague about a sor not scratching a 40-50 level barb but with bo he should have around 2.5k life average how can you expect a pvm sor to take our such a char?
also take into note that most duelers/pkers have more experience in the pvp aspect than pvmers.
so having all these advantages over some pvm char and killing them with your dueling/pking gear + maphack.(i don't know if he uses it or not just following the thread here) is what you call skills
maphack allows you to see everything how does that not help?
any decent build barb would have enough resistance up to nightmare. if his barb have been hell rushed it is even more. 30% from anya quest 30% from arreats + whatever skill of natural resistance he have
thats exactly what im saying. you can kill the barb dueler with your pvm sor because you have a bit of knowndge about the game but does that mean your a skill sor pkker? no.
you see alot of people duel on sc which they claim they have uber/leet skills etc. but its all about the gear they have and the time they invested in.
i agree with that guy just my opinion
ZounceHC
09-09-2004, 05:51
so your saying clicking the mouse faster= skills? shift click = skills?
i maybe a bit vague about a sor not scratching a 40-50 level barb but with bo he should have around 2.5k life average how can you expect a pvm sor to take our such a char?
also take into note that most duelers/pkers have more experience in the pvp aspect than pvmers.
so having all these advantages over some pvm char and killing them with your dueling/pking gear + maphack.(i don't know if he uses it or not just following the thread here) is what you call skills
maphack allows you to see everything how does that not help?
any decent build barb would have enough resistance up to nightmare. if his barb have been hell rushed it is even more. 30% from anya quest 30% from arreats + whatever skill of natural resistance he have
thats exactly what im saying. you can kill the barb dueler with your pvm sor because you have a bit of knowndge about the game but does that mean your a skill sor pkker? no.
you see alot of people duel on sc which they claim they have uber/leet skills etc. but its all about the gear they have and the time they invested in.
i agree with that guy just my opinion
It's not just fast clicking. It's clicking in the right place at the right time.
How can I expect a PvM sorc to take out 2.5k life? Very easily if they don't have absorb. Do you think that all PvMers have crap gear or something? Even the gear that I had was not superior. I was using 105% fcr, a few -5% fire facets and managed to kill the barb in 2-3 fireballs. So I don't see why you think that PvM characters are so weak.
What you say about pvp experience isn't quite accurate either. All people with pvp characters have pvm characters to support their dueling so why wouldn't some pvm characters have duelers/pkers too? I dueled with my pvm sork and had 3-5 pvp characters at that time. So I had just as much experience as the barb I was dueling if not more considering I have dueled with most classes since .09. How do you know the sorc he killed isn't in the same situation? :scratch:
So being able to see everything gives you an advantage? All you have to do is run around the blood moor once and you have the map for that game. I agree that scanning gear gives you an advantage as you can know what to expect, but saying that being able to see the map gives you an advantage in a close quarter duel is kinda lame and inaccurate.
Basically you say that Sip has no skill for killing a PvM character, then I tell you that pvm characters aren't all crap and that I have killed a duel barb with my pvm sorc and you say that I have no skill:
you can kill the barb dueler with your pvm sor because you have a bit of knowndge about the game but does that mean your a skill sor pkker? no.
Isn't this contradicting yourself?
Let me get this straight:
Sip killing a pvm sorc = no skill
Me, a PvM sorc killing a duel barb = no skill
Such a strong argument :)
i agree with that guy just my opinion
Opinions are like a-holes everyone has one.
did i say you got skills because you can kill some barb dueler with your pvm sor?
i said you were knowledgable
thats exactly what im saying. you can kill the barb dueler with your pvm sor because you have a bit of knowndge about the game but does that mean your a skill sor pkker? no. <<<<<< where did i say you got skills? are you having problems with your eyes? brains? mind?
maphack don't give you advantage? then why you agree with me.
this is what i said.
maphack allows you to see everything how does that not help? <<<<
everything includes scanning your gear are you blind?
>>>but saying that being able to see the map gives you an advantage in a close quarter duel is kinda lame and inaccurate.<<<
you just make that up your self, i never said it being able to see the hole map gives you advantage . i said maphack allows you to see everything not my fault if you have a narrow mind and just stating your opinions as same as me.
>>>>Basically you say that Sip has no skill for killing a PvM character, then I tell you that pvm characters aren't all crap and that I have killed a duel barb with my pvm sorc and you say that I have no skill:<<<<
again you make stuff up. did i cleary said he got no skills? dont' make stuff up. i said dueler against pvms takes no skill doesn't matter who.
so you say you got skills by killing a barb dueler with your pvm sor is skill?
maybe he is new at dueling more unexperience than you and more stupid than you ever think of that?
so your so call skills is basically that. but what if you lag then? who got the skills?
if a hammerdin pker goes in a game with all combat/life charms vita scs engima + wf vs a bunch of pvmers. yes your pvm gear is crap.
>>>Opinions are like a-holes everyone has one.<<<
yeah and you posted yours so? i don't really care what you said.
you need to reread that post from omgmir
go pk with a level 9 untwink char or goto hell duels with your crap gear on show me your skills?
play a naked hammerdin with max synergy against a engima necro show me your skills? with out gear your skills = nothing
Obviously written by someone who has never tried any sort of PvP ever. Level 77 sorceress can use about any item she wants to in the game. Has more life then someone 28 levels lower and has more skills and damage of someone 28 levels lower. For a level 49 to kill a cahrqacter that high is quite an accomplishment minus the mh part.
PvP takes a ton of skill to do and be succesful at it , takes forever to accumulate the gear to build (minus Baranor :thumbsup: ) and is even harder to find a target with the prevalance of chicken on hostile users. Try it and you ll sing a differant tune i guarantee
edit: If you see his gear it is far from godly. Silks of the victor , Arreates , IK belt gloves , goreriders, probably raven frost or 2 and a rare teleport amulet or +2 warcries.
he uses berzerk. tell me what kind of gear can a level 77 pvm sor use to reduce magic damage. let say the sor have 1k hp at that level which is decent for pvm but 1 or 2 click of his berzerk still can kill the sor not counting in deadly strike even.
and no pvm sor gonna cube that stupid magic % reduce safety shield or stack up 40x 20 vita scs just for pkers
pvp takes 1% of skill withour your accumulated gear show me your skills please.
no matter how you suggar coat it this game doesn't need skills. if there was its your skill to click the mouse faster than the other person and more knowledgable experience.
I agree.. this game is heavily laden on gear.
ZounceHC
09-09-2004, 07:13
Where did I say that you said I have skills? I didn't. I said that you said I have no skills. Are you having problems with your reading skills?
i agree with that guy just my opinion ........ did i cleary said he got no skills?
Firstly I didn't claim that you said Sip has no skills. If you "agree with that guy" then yes you are clearly saying that "Sip has no skill for killing a PvM character" which is what I ACTUALLY said that you were saying. You don't have to "clearly" say something and I didn't say that you did, but agreeing with omgmir says that you agree with his views and his view is that Sip has no skill for that kill. So actually i'm not making stuff up if you look a bit harder but we've already established that you have trouble reading my posts so I guess I can forgive you for that. Maybe you need to re-re-read my post so that you don't misquote? Or maybe use the reply function so that you don't stuff it up.
In regards to maphack I made an incorrect assumption that you were refering to the map. I apolpogise. Be a bit more descriptive. It's more effective. Maphack doesn't help in the actual duel itself and even if he did scan gear he would have still dueled as most people know that Sip isn't intimidated by good gear.
so you say you got skills by killing a barb dueler with your pvm sor is skill? Where did I say that I had skill? Quote please. I was just trying to get across that your views on each kill were contradictory.
yeah and you posted yours so? Of course I posted mine everyone has one so why not? I was just trying to make the whole argument a bit light hearted and i'm sorry you took it the wrong way.
play a naked hammerdin with max synergy against a engima necro show me your skills? with out gear your skills = nothing
I thought when we were talking about gear playing an important role in the success/failure of a dueler we were refering to the difference between mediocre and "leet" gear. Not a naked charcter. That example is lost on me sorry.
If you think i'm narrowminded maybe you should re-read your own post.
i said dueler against pvms takes no skill doesn't matter who
Do you really agree with this??
Can you please elaborate on your last few points. They didn't make sense to me at all unless you are saying that i'm not skilled unless I a) duel in hell with crap gear. Or b) kill an enigma necro with a naked hammerdin. If this is what you're saying then I guess your definition of skill is a lot different to most people.
Don't worry, be happy. Doo Doo Do Do de Do de Do Do Do de Do, Do de Do do. :buddies:
ZounceHC
09-09-2004, 07:20
pvp takes 1% of skill withour your accumulated gear show me your skills please.
no matter how you suggar coat it this game doesn't need skills. if there was its your skill to click the mouse faster than the other person and more knowledgable experience.
So "this game dosn't need skills" yet you need "skill to click the mouse faster"?
Knowledgeable experience = more strategy = skill. No?
How does the first line in my quote make sense? I don't know what you're trying to say.
Are these not skills? There's a big difference between a duel and pking. Pking does actually take skills though.
Not including chicken, which sip doesn't use, how does maphack help you achieve a kill?
Actually i've killed mid level duel barbs with my non-duel fireball sorc before. A knowledgeable player using an average PvMer can actually kill duelers.
Also, a lvl 77 sorc can use most gears in the game. Believe it or not some pvm chars actually do good damage. Characters may not be built to duel but they can still do well in pvp.
edit: Looking at Sips gear how much resist does he have? 30 from arreats and he doesn't use dwarf star? Saying that a sorc can't even scratch him isn't quite accurate.
How can maphack help you acheive a kill? I'll tell you
First of all, lets see.. the maphacker scans your gear, and can do minor twinkage, you have a better light radius so shades do not affect you, and above all you can SCROLL LOCK, Sip scrolled the map when i fought him and because of that he dragon flight'd my paladin while he was a screen and a half away, without Maphack you have to actually be ON the screen because you cannot click on a person that you can't see. There you go, thats how maphack helps you. Heck their may even be more
Fighting a 77 sorceress is really not that big of a deal, ive fought people 50 levels higher then me without battle orders and WITHOUT knowing what gear they use and survived and even killed a few, while if the kill is legit it should be congratulated but twinking out a character 27 levels lower the odds are hardly stacked against you (also keep in mind a 49 barb would have more life)
ZounceHC
09-09-2004, 07:37
So you can see things not on your screen. So you press scroll lock key and it locks on to players or something? OK I take back what I said about maphack not helping to achieve a kill, I didn't think about it like that. In this situation I don't think the scroll thing would really help though but I see what you mean about checking what they use and then tweaking your gear. I just thought maphack = see map and couldn't really see how it would help. As senji said I guess I was narrowminded. I'd heard about scroll lock before but didn't really know how it works.
bleh its usless aruging with you two is like that sc vs hc dueling thread.
i agree with omgmir on how this game takes no skills to kill read this cleary and i mean very clearly. WITH OUT YOUR ITEMS YOUR SKILL = NOTHING
go duel with a naked sor if you think you got your so call skills if you can do that and win. i acknownledge you indeed got skills
your saying strategy is skill. strategy = thought out plans step by step action that is not skill its strategy. by playing the game for so long everyone have some kind of strategy at pvp/dueling/pking that is not skill its just your experience.
a player more knowledge and more experience doesn't mean you are more skillfull than a new player. it just means you are more experience nothing else.
How can maphack help you acheive a kill? I'll tell you
First of all, lets see.. the maphacker scans your gear, and can do minor twinkage, you have a better light radius so shades do not affect you, and above all you can SCROLL LOCK, Sip scrolled the map when i fought him and because of that he dragon flight'd my paladin while he was a screen and a half away, without Maphack you have to actually be ON the screen because you cannot click on a person that you can't see. There you go, thats how maphack helps you. Heck their may even be more
Fighting a 77 sorceress is really not that big of a deal, ive fought people 50 levels higher then me without battle orders and WITHOUT knowing what gear they use and survived and even killed a few, while if the kill is legit it should be congratulated but twinking out a character 27 levels lower the odds are hardly stacked against you (also keep in mind a 49 barb would have more life)
Exactly. glad someone who knows what they are talking about
So you can see things not on your screen. So you press scroll lock key and it locks on to players or something? OK I take back what I said about maphack not helping to achieve a kill, I didn't think about it like that. In this situation I don't think the scroll thing would really help though but I see what you mean about checking what they use and then tweaking your gear. I just thought maphack = see map and couldn't really see how it would help. As senji said I guess I was narrowminded. I'd heard about scroll lock before but didn't really know how it works.
you think scroll lock doesn't help? scroll locking gives you the biggest advantage.you can
shoot guided arrows from 2-3 screens away and guide arrows go invinsible
teleport for way more distance than you could normally
cast whatever spell you have 2-3 screens away
scroll locking with a bonespirit necro = dangerous can pk you so far away
ZounceHC
09-09-2004, 08:00
bleh its usless aruging with you two is like that sc vs hc dueling thread.
i agree with omgmir on how this game takes no skills to kill read this cleary and i mean very clearly. WITH OUT YOUR ITEMS YOUR SKILL = NOTHING
go duel with a naked sor if you think you got your so call skills if you can do that and win. i acknownledge you indeed got skills
your saying strategy is skill. strategy = thought out plans step by step action that is not skill its strategy. by playing the game for so long everyone have some kind of strategy at pvp/dueling/pking that is not skill its just your experience.
a player more knowledge and more experience doesn't mean you are more skillfull than a new player. it just means you are more experience nothing else.
Well, it's pointless arguing with you because you don't make sense and contradict yourself. First you say:
no matter how you suggar coat it this game doesn't need skills
And then you say:
WITH OUT YOUR ITEMS YOUR SKILL = NOTHING
This implies that you have skills but they don't mean anything if you're not wearing any items. So this game does need skills? Make up your mind.
Also this is the main reason for my original post.
You win "duels" because of your gear, nothing else
I don't see how anyone can agree with this, including you. I'm not trying to say that items aren't very important in determining a winner for a duel. I'm saying that skill does play a role, even if it is a very minor one, in duels. What about luck doesn't that factor in somewhere? You have a min and max damage isn't it just random whereabouts on the spectrum your hit is going to be?
Ok strategy doesn't = skill directly but having a good strategy does take skill.
What if there are 2 people dueling, they have both been playing for equal amounts of time and have equal dueling experience and both have the same gear. Luck aside, won't the more skilled person win?
ZounceHC
09-09-2004, 08:01
you think scroll lock doesn't help? scroll locking gives you the biggest advantage.you can
shoot guided arrows from 2-3 screens away and guide arrows go invinsible
teleport for way more distance than you could normally
cast whatever spell you have 2-3 screens away
scroll locking with a bonespirit necro = dangerous can pk you so far away
Read my whole post please. Twice if you have to. Where did I say that scroll lock doesn't help? Are you making stuff up or not reading properly?
Read my whole post please. Twice if you have to. Where did I say that scroll lock doesn't help? Are you making stuff up or not reading properly?
So you can see things not on your screen. So you press scroll lock key and it locks on to players or something? OK I take back what I said about maphack not helping to achieve a kill, I didn't think about it like that. In this situation I don't think the scroll thing would really help though but I see what you mean about checking what they use and then tweaking your gear. I just thought maphack = see map and couldn't really see how it would help. As senji said I guess I was narrowminded. I'd heard about scroll lock before but didn't really know how it works.
>>In this situation I don't think the scroll thing would really help <<
you seriously need to get your eyes check. i don't want to argue anymore you may waste more of your time by posting. its like arguing hc vs sc duels. where sc duelers are so narrowminded they think stuff like slow engima is bm in duels.
you tried arguing with out knowing what is scroll lock that is enough for me not to argue with you anymore.
get this stamp on your brain somewhere this game goes like this.
gear>connection fast computer>skill
ok try this. use a hybrid sor like max lightning max fireball firemastery etc... go vs a engima hammerdin all twink out show me your skill ok?
or go play a untwink naked sor see how your skills can last with out gear.
you fail to see how this game is so 100% item depandant that you all think is about skills go play naked chars through hell mode in 8 player games show me your skill than
ZounceHC
09-09-2004, 10:34
you fail to see how this game is so 100% item depandant ....
Firstly it seems that you think that I dispute that gear is the most important factor in deciding the outcome of a duel, which I don't.
.... get this stamp on your brain somewhere this game goes like this.
gear>connection fast computer>skill
Secondly you think that I disagree with this statement, which I don't.
The only reason I posted is that I didn't agree with this:
You win "duels" because of your gear, nothing else
Don't you agree that there is some skill, even if it is a small amount, that contributes to the outcome of a duel?
Cleglaw_Himself
09-09-2004, 11:14
I'll join the argument:
Gear has the most to do with winning duels.
e.g. cowkings boots vs any other low lvl boots; max dmg vs life gear.
Experience has a lot to do with winning duels. (practice) This may include, knowing to 'hide' behind a gap in the blood moor so you can't get charged, or going to a corner, etc, or knowing when to weapon switch to your max max dmg weapon and 1 hit the opponent.
Fast connection I don't think matters so much (I used to duel with 56k modem without too much problem)
Skill is last (for hardcore duels) - meaning for example a charge pally - set charge left click, might right click, then press left button or Shift left button until ear drops.
HC duels is about max dmg, rather than much skill, unfortunately, but I still love it.
That's why it takes me so long to make duelers - accumulating gear such as 9max jewels, ethereal weapons, etc.
while its true that gear > skill, you cant say that skill has nothing to do with it. if you really think that you should get your head checked because thats just stupid.
Mephistho
09-09-2004, 11:39
I was going to make a similiar post to cleglaw but he covered it already.
Without good gear, you're character is weak, but you also need knowledge about the game to know what you are up against and how to use terrain in your advantage, but there's a bit of skill needed as well. it's mostly the longer you play the game, the better items you will find/trade (gear) the more you will understand it (knowledge) and the better you will be controlling your character (skill).
Phyrexial
09-09-2004, 18:10
How can maphack help you acheive a kill? I'll tell you
First of all, lets see.. the maphacker scans your gear, and can do minor twinkage, you have a better light radius so shades do not affect you, and above all you can SCROLL LOCK, Sip scrolled the map when i fought him and because of that he dragon flight'd my paladin while he was a screen and a half away, without Maphack you have to actually be ON the screen because you cannot click on a person that you can't see. There you go, thats how maphack helps you. Heck their may even be more
Fighting a 77 sorceress is really not that big of a deal, ive fought people 50 levels higher then me without battle orders and WITHOUT knowing what gear they use and survived and even killed a few, while if the kill is legit it should be congratulated but twinking out a character 27 levels lower the odds are hardly stacked against you (also keep in mind a 49 barb would have more life)
You're inability to make a decent argument astounds me. Have you played a Sin with DF before? Are you aware that you can shift+click it? Are you aware that it's range is infact limited though so scrolling would not let DF exceed its normal range?
I've done some testing with DF and after knocking my target way offscreen but maintaining namelock then switching to DF, I've found that it does have a range that cannot be exceeded. Sometimes you'll get a slightly longer range if you hit DF while they are within range then move out of it mid DF. This is what happens with namelock tele sometimes. Unless you use MH yourself or you've somehow done a more extensive study, shut up and learn about what you are talking about.
As for this whole gear/connection > skill, that is only to a certain extent. Of course a naked necro will not kill a fully geared up Enigma necro, that's ludicrous. However, I've killed tons upon tons of necros that are far richer than me. I've got a measly 1.8k life and 4.7k damage, and I've killed plenty of 3k life 6k damage necros. Why? Because they don't have skill. Skill and gear discrepancies work both ways. If the gear difference is ridiculously unbalanced then the richer person will win in 95% of the duels. However, if the gear is even remotely close then skill takes over. Take someone that isn't terribly good at dueling and match them up with an opposing character of the same type with just enough gear to hit some decent breakpoints, lets say a necro for this example. I could have half the life/damage of my opponent, but if I've got 125% fcr and Enigma I'm confident I can take a poor dueler with the utmost best gear.
(1,000)(gear) + (50)(skill) > (1,000)*(skill) + (0)(gear)
but
(1000)(gear) + (50)(skill) > (500)*(skill) + (300)(gear)
That math isn't meant to be numerically accurate or anything, but I hope you understand what I'm trying to get across.
Your resident SC dueler with his 2 cents,
Phyre
Mephistho
09-09-2004, 18:42
You're inability to make a decent argument astounds me.
could you people please stop using this sentences every post you make? ...
Phyrexial
09-09-2004, 21:04
could you people please stop using this sentences every post you make? ...
I thought it added to the condescending tone of my post quite nicely.
You're inability to make a decent argument astounds me. Have you played a Sin with DF before? Are you aware that you can shift+click it? Are you aware that it's range is infact limited though so scrolling would not let DF exceed its normal range?
I've done some testing with DF and after knocking my target way offscreen but maintaining namelock then switching to DF, I've found that it does have a range that cannot be exceeded. Sometimes you'll get a slightly longer range if you hit DF while they are within range then move out of it mid DF. This is what happens with namelock tele sometimes. Unless you use MH yourself or you've somehow done a more extensive study, shut up and learn about what you are talking about.
As for this whole gear/connection > skill, that is only to a certain extent. Of course a naked necro will not kill a fully geared up Enigma necro, that's ludicrous. However, I've killed tons upon tons of necros that are far richer than me. I've got a measly 1.8k life and 4.7k damage, and I've killed plenty of 3k life 6k damage necros. Why? Because they don't have skill. Skill and gear discrepancies work both ways. If the gear difference is ridiculously unbalanced then the richer person will win in 95% of the duels. However, if the gear is even remotely close then skill takes over. Take someone that isn't terribly good at dueling and match them up with an opposing character of the same type with just enough gear to hit some decent breakpoints, lets say a necro for this example. I could have half the life/damage of my opponent, but if I've got 125% fcr and Enigma I'm confident I can take a poor dueler with the utmost best gear.
(1,000)(gear) + (50)(skill) > (1,000)*(skill) + (0)(gear)
but
(1000)(gear) + (50)(skill) > (500)*(skill) + (300)(gear)
That math isn't meant to be numerically accurate or anything, but I hope you understand what I'm trying to get across.
Your resident SC dueler with his 2 cents,
Phyre
you can't really compare sc vs hc dueling/pking
sc = limited, duel by rules etc which is stupid your just limiting the game to a play style that you sc duelers prefer . see dueling clans and their rules
hc= anything goes
yep it takes alot of skill to tele on top of someone with a engima necro and spam bonespear by clicking the mouse a few times. even if you die there is no worry you can just get back your corpse and go on dueling with your skills aka clicking the mouse
you can't really compare sc vs hc dueling/pking
sc = limited, duel by rules etc which is stupid your just limiting the game to a play style that you sc duelers prefer . see dueling clans and their rules
hc= anything goes
yep it takes alot of skill to tele on top of someone with a engima necro and spam bonespear by clicking the mouse a few times. even if you die there is no worry you can just get back your corpse and go on dueling with your skills aka clicking the mouse
never fought the really good sc duellers did you?
Anyway this is a stupid argument as "skill"=knowledge.
and yes senji i can kill people with a cracked sash. just takes a little more time :flip:
reflex, fast reaction, knowledge and experience is some sort of skill, it factors in who wins the duel.
never fought the really good sc duellers did you?
Anyway this is a stupid argument as "skill"=knowledge.
and yes senji i can kill people with a cracked sash. just takes a little more time :flip:
you mean you can kill stupid people who don't know how to play
reflex, fast reaction, knowledge and experience is some sort of skill, it factors in who wins the duel.
yeah i agree there skill is a factor which is 1% 99% are the items your using with out those items your skills can take you no where
if you really think you got skills play a char untwink level up to 9 use your crack sash crack helmet crack short sword etc..
then go pk with him if you manage to get any kills from level 18+ then i would say you really got skills otherwise.. your skill is just cover up by your pking/dueling gear.
i have no more intention of replying to this thread now. if anyone thinks you really need skills to pk do it with out gear and show your skills. if you use gear that means you are gear dependant and not your skills. your pking ability skill is backup by your gear.
i meat no offensive to anyone who have replied. just saying the truth
You're inability to make a decent argument astounds me. Have you played a Sin with DF before? Are you aware that you can shift+click it? Are you aware that it's range is infact limited though so scrolling would not let DF exceed its normal range?
I've done some testing with DF and after knocking my target way offscreen but maintaining namelock then switching to DF, I've found that it does have a range that cannot be exceeded. Sometimes you'll get a slightly longer range if you hit DF while they are within range then move out of it mid DF. This is what happens with namelock tele sometimes. Unless you use MH yourself or you've somehow done a more extensive study, shut up and learn about what you are talking about.
As for this whole gear/connection > skill, that is only to a certain extent. Of course a naked necro will not kill a fully geared up Enigma necro, that's ludicrous. However, I've killed tons upon tons of necros that are far richer than me. I've got a measly 1.8k life and 4.7k damage, and I've killed plenty of 3k life 6k damage necros. Why? Because they don't have skill. Skill and gear discrepancies work both ways. If the gear difference is ridiculously unbalanced then the richer person will win in 95% of the duels. However, if the gear is even remotely close then skill takes over. Take someone that isn't terribly good at dueling and match them up with an opposing character of the same type with just enough gear to hit some decent breakpoints, lets say a necro for this example. I could have half the life/damage of my opponent, but if I've got 125% fcr and Enigma I'm confident I can take a poor dueler with the utmost best gear.
(1,000)(gear) + (50)(skill) > (1,000)*(skill) + (0)(gear)
but
(1000)(gear) + (50)(skill) > (500)*(skill) + (300)(gear)
That math isn't meant to be numerically accurate or anything, but I hope you understand what I'm trying to get across.
Your resident SC dueler with his 2 cents,
Phyre
Wow what a hostile person, why do you even post on the hardcore forum? Well ill just lay your top half of your argument to waste, before you start ranting about necromancers or 125% fcr or whatever you are going on about.
You are basically saying that once im on his screen he could have name locked me then switched to DF? Well.. YES, but guess what? I never was ON his screen, i had not seen his asassin yet, i was getting ready to shift charge in then shift charge onto him, so his asassin was not YET ever on my screen once while outside, he was at Akara when i went out so there is NO way he could have name locked me then switched to DF.. OOPS there goes your whole argument!
Maybe you should take your own advice and
"shut up and learn about what you're talking about"
if you really think you got skills play a char untwink level up to 9 use your crack sash crack helmet crack short sword etc..
then go pk with him if you manage to get any kills from level 18+ then i would say you really got skills otherwise.. your skill is just cover up by your pking/dueling gear.
i have no more intention of replying to this thread now. if anyone thinks you really need skills to pk do it with out gear and show your skills. if you use gear that means you are gear dependant and not your skills. your pking ability skill is backup by your gear.
i meat no offensive to anyone who have replied. just saying the truth
*giggles*
like I said, silly argument. indeed making the kill requires little skill, getting the kill is a different matter altogether. anyway, im off making a level 13 necromancer pk now.
ZounceHC
10-09-2004, 02:32
you fail to see how this game is so 100% item depandant ...... yeah i agree there skill is a factor which is 1% 99% are the items your using with out those items your skills can take you no where
I'm glad that you have at least acknowledged that skill does play SOME part in this game. I still think that you're being a bit pessimistic saying that skill is 1% of what decides a duel. Why are you telling us to take naked characters and kill fully decked out enigma characters? What does this prove? When is this ever going to happen? Why don't you give an example that might actually occur? Instead of some fantastic scenario that you've made up.
Basically the better items you have the less skill plays a role in determining the outcome of a duel. But this only goes so far. Sure if your items are 10x better than your opponents items are 99% of the equation. But if you're items are indentical to your opponents and neither of you has an advantage over the other, in regard to this then the amount that skill plays changes. It comes down to who has built their character better (a skill), who has more knowledge/experience dueling and who has faster reflexes better micro managing (another skill).
So: The superiority in gear of one player over the other decides how much of a role that skill plays in determining the outcome of a duel. If one player has far superior gear skill will have a small role. If players have very even gear then skill will have a much greater role.
So you were wrong saying that "this game is so 100% item depandant".
Skills and Gear aside did you ever consider that this game also depends on luck? Most characters have a Min-Max damage and as far as I know it is completely random whereabouts on the spectrum your hit will lie. Luck can also be factored in when considering deadly strike. So when you consider the chance for maximum damage and the chance for deadly strike, luck begins to emerge as an important aspect which has been overlooked thus far.
Considering all these points I don't see how you can back up your claim that this game is "so 100% item dependent". Even when you corrected yourself, saying that items were 99% and skill was 1%, it still doesn't ring true.
yeah i agree there skill is a factor which is 1% 99% are the items your using with out those items your skills can take you no where
67% of statistics are made up on the spot
:surprise:
ZounceHC
10-09-2004, 05:05
No, only about 75% of the 45% think that it is 95%. The other 25% of the 45% think it is 96.4%. :jig:
I think we need kumby-ya singing, hi-jacking dancing turtle to save this thread. Where are you? Please save us from insanity.
Look there he is! All hail the Boogie turtle. (he's singing kumby-yah) :yep:
Mcsaladshaker
10-09-2004, 05:36
--- The End ---
Phyrexial
10-09-2004, 06:34
Wow what a hostile person, why do you even post on the hardcore forum? Well ill just lay your top half of your argument to waste, before you start ranting about necromancers or 125% fcr or whatever you are going on about.
You are basically saying that once im on his screen he could have name locked me then switched to DF? Well.. YES, but guess what? I never was ON his screen, i had not seen his asassin yet, i was getting ready to shift charge in then shift charge onto him, so his asassin was not YET ever on my screen once while outside, he was at Akara when i went out so there is NO way he could have name locked me then switched to DF.. OOPS there goes your whole argument!
Maybe you should take your own advice and
"shut up and learn about what you're talking about"
Make an assassin. Get DF. Now, find a target and get it just off the edge of your screen (read: you can't see it) then hold shift and DF in that general direction. See what happens.
...
What the... did that assassin just... no... It just DFed to a target offscreen! Oh my! Do some testing before you claim to refute my argument.
I reiterate my "shut up and learn about what you're talking about."
EDIT: I just re-read your post and I realized that you didn't understand what I was saying. I stated that you CANNOT DF far offscreen via maintaining namelock. If you mindblast someone offscreen then switch (while holding down the key thus maintaining namelock) you still won't be able to DF to them if they are outside the normal DF range. This is why you cannot abuse DF + Scrolling, because DF has a set range. This kind of abuse does work with tele though. Chances are you got Shift+DFed.
P.S: I post on the HC forum now and then when its a discussion involving D2 play that is universal to HC and SC. I read the HC forum because I enjoy the stories people like Sip tell.
cyradis2003
10-09-2004, 07:32
I think we need kumby-ya singing, hi-jacking dancing turtle to save this thread. Where are you? Please save us from insanity.
Look there he is! All hail the Boogie turtle. (he's singing kumby-yah) :yep:
meh - I gave up on this thread ... not really worth the effor of hijacking.
Althooooough I do have a quick party snck "recipe" I can share ...
OK - these are easy and really nummy!
you get some cresent roll dough (like 2 cans) from your grocer's dairy case and also from said dairy case you get a couple kinds of flavored cream cheese (I like the salmon best)
You pop open the cans and unroll the dough.
It comes in 2 squares that are kinda divided into triagles - ignore the triangles.
Smear cream cheese on the 2 squares of dough and roll them each up into jelly roll looking things.
refrigerate
slaice the rolls into 3/4ish inch slaices and lay them flat on a cookie sheet
bake per directions on the dough can (keep an eye on them though they get brown fast)
and there you go... easiestsnacky thing ever and really good .... very bad for you though.
RECEIPE HIJACK :scared:
Here we go!
What We Ate Last Night...
Homegrown cherry tomatos (oh, the flavor, YUMM), home grown lettuce, some SPAM, aye, Spam, though here I believe its called Smac from Unox, and then 2 soft boiled eggs, still hot, ya, and some kouskous. Its some sort of grain-thnigie, kouskous, originally from morocco or thereabouts.
S, make nice size pieces of lettuce (though ours was small enopugh to be eaten whole by the leaf ^_^), chop cherry tomatos in halves, make about .5-1cm dices out of smac. Then, take the steaming hot soft-boiled eggs, smack em in a cup of some sort and mash em up witha fork, mixing that lovely liquid yellow with the hard white. Add to salad, and boil new water for kouskous. kouskous takes a single minute to finish once the water boils (add once water boils) so its done fairly quickly. Drain kouskous, add in salad, voila, luke-warm kouskous salad. Add a pinch of salt and pepper to your own liking, and if you feel like it sprinkle with a gentle vignarette of balsalmico and not-so-strong olive oil.
Yummmmmmmmmmm! an cheap too :buddies:
My point was made, it had nothing to do with what half of the arguments going on in this thread are. I am not interested in a flame war or any other type of forum drama, hence my lack of posts on this topic for the last couple pages once people started throwing insults my way instead of trying to make a point.
But I will state my point one more time, and it's still completely valid and I maintain it.
Obviously rough estimation here as exact percentages would be impossible to acquire, but D2 PvP is at best dependant on 80% gear, 19% class build, and 1% "skill" however you define that word. This alone makes his "accomplishment" amount to not much. Add on the fact he's using maphack and who can know for sure what else, and his kill is worth nothing.
Yes this is my opinion and after many of these multi-page threads created to garner praise for his kills, I figured i'd give it. Giving him congratulations is laughable, he hasn't done anything special and he's definitely not the only one doing it. Yet people still continue praising him for it, I don't understand why.
i agree with the fact that killing someone isnt really that much, however i dislike your tone, attitude and posting pattern.
cyradis2003
10-09-2004, 14:55
i agree with the fact that killing someone isnt really that much, however i dislike your tone, attitude and posting pattern.
Yah well ... I don't like his avatar ....
:D
meh - I gave up on this thread ... not really worth the effor of hijacking.
Althooooough I do have a quick party snck "recipe" I can share ...
OK - these are easy and really nummy!
you get some cresent roll dough (like 2 cans) from your grocer's dairy case and also from said dairy case you get a couple kinds of flavored cream cheese (I like the salmon best)
You pop open the cans and unroll the dough.
It comes in 2 squares that are kinda divided into triagles - ignore the triangles.
Smear cream cheese on the 2 squares of dough and roll them each up into jelly roll looking things.
refrigerate
slaice the rolls into 3/4ish inch slaices and lay them flat on a cookie sheet
bake per directions on the dough can (keep an eye on them though they get brown fast)
and there you go... easiestsnacky thing ever and really good .... very bad for you though.
Do I see rolling????
Do I see pinching????
then....
it can only...
be time...
for some VIA-STYLE :surprise:
:drool:
ring me when it's time to spit, pinch and roll BABY!!!! :clap:
Phyrexial
10-09-2004, 18:57
My point was made, it had nothing to do with what half of the arguments going on in this thread are. I am not interested in a flame war or any other type of forum drama, hence my lack of posts on this topic for the last couple pages once people started throwing insults my way instead of trying to make a point.
But I will state my point one more time, and it's still completely valid and I maintain it.
Obviously rough estimation here as exact percentages would be impossible to acquire, but D2 PvP is at best dependant on 80% gear, 19% class build, and 1% "skill" however you define that word. This alone makes his "accomplishment" amount to not much. Add on the fact he's using maphack and who can know for sure what else, and his kill is worth nothing.
Yes this is my opinion and after many of these multi-page threads created to garner praise for his kills, I figured i'd give it. Giving him congratulations is laughable, he hasn't done anything special and he's definitely not the only one doing it. Yet people still continue praising him for it, I don't understand why.
I wouldn't say 1%, but whatever. One thing I would like to point out though is that when the gear of both players is very close then the gear factor is practically removed. This vastly increases the amount of skill required to win. Then consider that certain matchups are inherently much harder and do infact require a good deal of skill to win. I'll agree that skill is a very small factor if the gear difference is huge, but when the gear is similar I strongly feel skill does infact take over, most prevalently in tele/range duels.
To be quite honest, I'd imagine (read: haven't tried yet) that hitting a 105% fcr sorc with a tele zerk would be rather hard and would infact, take a good amount of skill. Sure it is doable via namelock then Zerk, but any decent sorc probably would be able to tele away before they get Zerked. I know my Enigma necro very rarely gets hit by Hammerdins and they have way more fcr and hammers come out faster than zerk.
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